Anyone else feels sad when they succeed?

[Riv3rW0lf]

So... This week I secured three new contracts for my business start-up. I am doing much better than I even thought possible when I opened my company last year. I had given me at least 5 years to reach what I have secured so far, and we are only in March...! 

But... got an email yesterday confirming I had won yet another request for proposals... I first felt incredibly stressed, so I did a yoga pranayama to calm myself... And low and behold, underneath the initial fear/stress of not meeting my client's expectations (normal reaction), was sadness.

Sadness.

I mean... Really?

Now wondering if this is hormonal or BPD mother related. How I will never be able to share this success with her. We are still no contact. It freed so much energy for me to focus on building my life. But it's like those successes remind me just how she will never be happy for me. How she would seem happy, but then use it against me, talking behind my back, like she did with my entrepreneur father.

It still stings not to have a loving, proud mother at times.

Anyone else?

[zachira]

You are not alone in feeling sad that you do not have a mother you can safely share your successes with. One of the most eye opening moments with my disordered family members was when a relative came to a family gathering and announced that a friend of his had shared at his party how I had helped her when she had an accident on a country road. This relative was furious about hearing good things about me, and treated me like dirt the whole night, including refusing to hug me at the end of the night when he did so with everybody else. Nobody came to my defense and they all looked pretty distressed hearing  that I had done something good for somebody else. This whole incident brought up memories of how other scapegoats in my family have been treated when they did something good or suceeded at anything. I particularly remember two occasions in which my aunt came to my parents' rescue when they were out of town, and helped take care of my siblings and me in emergency situations. My parents were full of contempt for my aunt and furious that they would have to thank her.
I do believe that having a mother with BPD and other disordered family members is a lifetime sorrow, and one of the biggest sorrows is instead of the disordered family members feeling genuinely happy for us when we succeed at something, they feel threatened and put down our success in some really hurtful ways.
Who are you sharing your successes with and who is genuinely happy for you? You have tremendous courage in becoming your own person in your own right, with little support from your family of origin. Congratulations on your successes in business and creating a loving supportive family environment for your children and husband ! You have so much to be proud of.

[Outdorenthusiast]

Riverwolf - yes.  I have never been fantastic at recognizing the weaker feelings (typically breed out of guys) - but I do recognize them now and I can say yes - sadness is a part that I feel even when happy.

I feel good and overall balanced and healthy most of the time now same as it seems you do.  Some days I have great successes and joy in my accomplishments, but behind is a small sadness knowing my wife will never be able to empathize with my joy and share in my happiness since she is so self consumed and depressed most of the time.  My joy would be twisted to sadness and herself and her issues.  So I revel in my happiness/success and joy and celebrate as appropriate- but in the corner is also the sadness.

Other days I am sad/angry and process these feelings with friends and feel great relief and happiness in the end. (Healed?) But… lurking in the shadows is always the sadness of knowing I cannot process these feelings with my wife because she can’t manage them because she already has too much negativity on her plate, and will somehow turn my feelings around to invalidate them or self blame.

BPD has complicated implications, and feeling sadness I have come to recognize will always be a part, it is ok, it needs to be felt, recognized for what it is, but it doesn’t define me or hold me back.

- Keep your chin up…

[Methuen]

When I read the title of the thread, I wondered if it meant you weren't able to allow yourself to enjoy your own success.  Of course as soon as I read your post, I knew that wasn't it at all.  The sadness you are referring to isn't actually about not being able to celebrate your own success, but is about "processing" that your mom is not able to celebrate your success with you. She can't be proud of you, or feel joy at your accomplishment.  

Zachira's line about "lifelong sorrow" fits well here, as does Outdoorenthusiast's line about the sadness that comes with not being able to share the personal accomplishments with PD partner.

Is it also "regret" and "grief" that you feel because your mom isn't capable of feeling joy at your success?  I've accepted that it's a life long grief.  And we keep getting reminded of it during certain milestones, and events such as the upcoming "mother's day".  It's ironic and very sad how a day celebrated genuinely by so many, is silently suffered by others for what "was never had".  I also think it's sad that the only ones who know this, are the ones who suffer silently, and thus completely alone on such a widely celebrated day.

My husband and I shared the same career.  Decades ago, just after we were married, we used to share occasional stories and experiences with my mom and dad related to our work. Dad was always interested. One day mom told us she didn't want to hear any more about our work ever again.  We were shocked and didn't understand it at the time. Now we understand that part of the problem was that it meant the conversation wasn't about her.  Another problem was that she found hearing about our work invalidating.  She couldn't handle hearing about the joy we got from our career.  At the time we were too busy with life and starting a family to think about it, although we thought it was strange (and not very nice) that a mother would say this.  Now that we understand BPD, it makes perfect sense to us.

I think as we forge our own paths and grow as humans, we just have to keep processing this loss we feel (which remains a constant in our life), but still focus on the positives, which are our successes, and growth and adventures and making new memories all while building resilience from life's curve balls and  our own set backs.

I'm so happy for you that you are finding yourself in a place years earlier than you anticipated for your small businsess growth plan.  Congratulations on your successes!  This is amazing, and comes with talent and hard work, so good for you!  I hope you have a few ways planned to celebrate!  

[Couscous]

I just wanted to pop by to say congratulations!  The fact that you aren’t self-sabotaging and able to achieve success is major accomplishment in and of itself, so well done!

Personally, I cannot even imagine what it would even be like to have a mother who isn’t jealous of my success — it seems so alien, but yes, also very sad.

Sending a virtual hug to little RW. 

[NarcsEverywhere]

Hey Riv3rW0lf,

You deserve success, and I've felt the same way many times, success is a huge change, if you're not used to it, so it can be scary, but on top of that, it's like, you don't have the parent to be proud of to. Lately, I feel proud of what I've accomplished in terms of sticking up for myself, my beliefs, and my values, and even when it positively affects him (many times it was about him, so it didn't always), it took boldness and courage, and he gaslit it away. I told him straight up that if he really cared about my success, he wouldn't constantly compete with me.

Anyways, it really sucks to not have that. I am lucky that my codependent mother really did want my success, so when I am especially down about it, I can think of her and be reminded of how proud she'd be of how far I've come, and how many things I've learned. Do you have anyone you can think of like that?

[Notwendy]

Congratulations - that's fantastic.

For my BPD mother, family members' achievement is a source of her self image. There was some pressure to do well, probably about the same as most parents - we want our kids to do their best in school for their own future so the usual "do your homework, get good grades" message. I did the same with my own kids but with some adjustment for their individual strength's and interests- realizing they might like some subjects in school more than others, but still do your best effort, for their benefit. There was some of this from my father but for my BPD mother, her actual interest in me personally seemed remote but achievements seemed to validate her.

My self esteem as a young adult was low and I know the feeling of "imposter syndrome". I did not advance in my career as I took time off to raise children,  and this impacted my self esteem as well and going back to work after they got older helped. I know my self worth is not dependent on a job or career but it's better with the outside validation of a job. Self esteem is improved after working on co-dependency in 12 step groups.

Which comes back to why would it feel sad when there's a job success? I think it comes down to wanting validation and approval from parents who couldn't give it. For me, there's the sense that approval is contingent on my doing things for BPD mother and also the sense that what we do isn't enough for her. For me, school and career and friends were a main source of validation but it's not the same as feeling unconditionally loved and a job can't do that. Still - achieving at work or school is a huge positive for many reasons- and important- for validation, for income, for stability. It's  a good thing- but maybe there's that feeling of sadness too as it's different from parental validation.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Thank you all for you words of encouragement and celebrating those achievements with me ! It's been hard to find the time to write an answer, I feel like I am struggling to find a balanced mind since I won those proposals. There is a lot to do for one person. My martial art is quite literally the only place where I can truly disconnect right now; it allows me to find my more centered self. Hopefully I will get used to this new persona and stress will decrease.

Zacchira, yes I remember this story... You were scapegoated for being a compassionate human being; do you think they felt threatened because this is not something they can be? I do have people in my close circle to celebrate with... My H, of course; also my best friend and business partner; my father too has given me a lot of parental validation and love. I feel very grateful that we were able to repair our relationship. Cutting ties with my mother is ironically what made it possible. I am closer than I ever been with my stepmother too, and she also celebrates with me who I am becoming. I am grateful for them and their loving and respectful presence. They feel so very safe.

Outdoorenthusiast, yes, it is quite clear now that sadness might just always be a part of who I am. I wonder if this is the case for everyone at times... I mean... It has to be? And the toxicity seems to appear when people cannot deal with it, when they cannot face and love their own vulnerability. I realize now though that the sadness seems a bit sweeter than before... I don't feel this immense loneliness creeping at the back of my heart like I used to.

Methuen, while we had planned it prior to winning those proposals, we do have a massage and sauna planned for next Friday. I am counting the nights, it will feel so very good. Just gotta keep this small voice at the back of my head in check. You know, the one who wants me to exhaust myself out of fears of not making it? But I will. It's ok. One day at a time. Lots of wisdom in what you wrote what keeps coming back for me is the need for balance.

Thank you Couscous ! I will take the hug.

Hey NarcsEverywhere, thank you, I do hope things are better for you these days. 

Notwendy, yes I've also been almost out of my field for four years, only working part time initially, then I did a master thesis to be able to stay with my son for his first 2 years, like I did with my daughter. So it's a huge come back for me, and it plays on my stress level right now to be sure. Still, my daughter goes to preschool, but comes for lunch every day, and finished at 3, and I take my son on Tuesdays and Thursdays afternoon, else I pick him up right after his naps, so he is in a home daycare part-time ish and I make up for it when they sleep in the evenings. I chose to open a business to make sure I could be there for them while they are young. We need to develop professionally, I agree, but I see a lot of value in being there for my children as well...Again, the word that keeps coming up is balance for me right now... I didn't expect work to pick up this quick and it is very easy to get conpletely swamped in my field... The projects tend to come in waves.

But yeah... I think now is the time for me to experience what it is to oscillate from one extreme to the next, and over time, gain the wisdom to truly hold in the center.

 

[HappyChappy]

Hi Riv3rW0lf,

Going back to your original post, firstly well done on doing so well with your new biz. Secondly, I've spent my entire career working with business owners, or running my own business and your reactions sounds similar to a lot of entrepreneurs I've worked with.

Those good at getting rapid often are the types to get overwhelmed, that stress then turns to depression. So you need good systems in place to control the grown. Forward business planning worked for me so you can plan your work life balance (e.g. cashflow forecasting, biz plans). I also ensured I got someone in early who could run the business in my absence, so you can take breaks when you need them. It gets easier as you grow, as you can get pickier over which clients you take on, and have more staff (or subcontractor's) to spread the load.

Most true entrepreneurs tend to be good problem solves and good at reading people (i.e. avoiding bias) so I always find solution focused counselling best when anxious or just chatting to other business owners. Plus Opera W, R Brandon have good tips. Neurodiversity is hugely over-represented in the self employed, due to it's super powers - but also in bpd family dynamics. As is depression (self employment can be lonely) so you might want to check that out.  Sending you hugs x

[Riv3rW0lf]

Hi HappyChappy!

Thank you for the ressources, I will look them up.

From what I read about neurodiversity, I don't think I would qualify for it. We all have traits of one or another of those conditions, I think; I definitely have OCD traits, and having a BPD mother definitely made me more attuned to the emotional responses of people around me. With all the work I did this past year or two, I stopped taking it personally and it seems I can now make it work to my advantage. I definitely have traits of a HSP, but again, nothing extreme.

As an INT-J though I am definitely more neurotic than most people. I was always a fast learner and would end up either overexploit or completely bored when working for someone else. My social anxiety definitely came from my upbringing though, and not from autism or any other conditions, as martial arts really showed me. I am very comfortable in the world now...

I guess, all this to say, that I think I ended up an entrepreneur mostly because of my father's example and sums of happy coincidences and good luck.

I currently have no way to hire anyone, and am the sub other firms want to spread to load to (I am in Canada and we have a lot of problems right now, people are retiring and we simply don't have enough younger individual to replace them, so everyone is spread thin)... My business partner is only working part-time and we don't have the same field of expertise, so I cannot spread my load to her either.

I just started a follow-up classification to supply another company who is looking to use my expertise to get work in specific fields; I had already agreed to it in January, before getting all those other requests. I think this is what's hard to balance right now... When I started looking for work, I just reached out and sent my resume to a bunch of companies, network, and potential clients... Going back on my word is not a precedent I want to set. The thing is I honestly underestimated the value and expertise people would see in my resume. I think I have major impostor syndrom, . The response was huge. Plus I was still gauging the market, and entered on some bid lower than I likely should have, but then, the prices in my field are crazy high right now, they are reaping people off, it's honestly completely crazy...

I think I might need to network with other entrepreneurs, maybe find a mentor in my field... Because I do think if things keep going at the pace they are going right now, I will be overwhelmed..

On top of it, my H is leaving for three months this summer... I will make it through but man, I cannot think about it too much.

[HappyChappy]

Hi Riverwolf,

It does sound like you've got a lot on there. Is there a chance of using the Associate model, i.e. where professionals cover for each other ? It needs trust but I'm part of several professional bodies that insist on that (so we don't leave customers waiting). Or re-negotiating timeline on your projects ?

I get your point about "neurodiversity" but technically we're all neurodiverse, unless we find two brains with exactly the same neural pattern, which is unlikely. INT-J and BPD aren't considered very accurate labels these days, observing someone's behaviour (in tasks) or asking the right questions is much better when recruiting.

btw France is currently demonstrating/rioting about putting up the state pension age from 62 to 64 to get more back into the workplace. The UK put it up to 68 so maybe Canada will have to follow suit ?

Take care of yourself, sending you hugs x