Venting never hurt

[M604V]

Not sure what I want or expect to happen from this post, but it’s nice to know that I’m venting in a space comprised of understanding people.

I feel my marriage of 12 years is coming to an end. It’s been an absolute rollercoaster from day 1. I suspect that my wife has BPD; she certainly exhibits most or all of the traits (as far as I can tell as a layperson). She’s never been diagnosed, and I doubt she would accept the diagnosis if there were one, or even put herself in a position where she would risk having anyone diagnose her.

She finally got (and has stayed) sober about 3 1/2 years ago, an accomplishment of which I am immensely proud and impressed. It is no small feat and I couldn’t be more amazed. Her journey into sobriety was no easy one, and it revealed a lot of my own unhealthy and dysfunctional nonsense as well. In short: I realized that I was just as sick as she was.

So I dropped her off at rehab and made a conscious and committed effort to joining her in the journey, the journey to healing and recovery. The journey to understanding, learning and growing. The journey to own my own PLEASE READ, to apologize when necessary, to let go, to make room for her to live her very human, sometimes messy life. The journey to finally understand and accept that I well and truly CANNOT live someone else’s life for them, and to realize and believe that I deserve things, that I’ve earned things, and that my time and presence on this planet is precious and should never be abused or taken advantage of.

I thought I had finally cracked the code, unlocked the door to a respectful, loving, cooperative partnership in which we could see and hear each other and have each others backs. Where we could hold each other accountable while still respecting each others messiness and humanity. That’s what I thought anyway. I mean, she’s not poisoning her soul with alcohol, I’m beating back my codependency, my low self-esteem, finally doing things for myself and trying to live with my chin up and my shoulders back. Good place to start, no?

Maybe not. Turns out that substance abuse, in my opinion, isn’t really the issue. I think substance abuse is just the form that the issue takes, it’s the visible 10% of the iceberg. I fear that the real issue is BPD, or some similar malady that has made my wife almost completely incapable or unwilling to engage in any lasting, consistent, cooperative, adult way.

She denies my feelings, quite literally. She tells me that I don’t feel the way I do. She moves the goalposts whenever she wants, whenever “my truth” forces her to acknowledge her faults or misdeeds. Recently we had a seemingly peaceful, non-threatening discussion about the state of our marriage and what I wanted to do going forward. I expressed my love for her and our family, how I was tired and frustrated but still willing to do the work. Except I would only do the work that she wanted to do too. No point in fixing a problem that she doesn’t see as a problem, or pursuing a solution that she doesn’t want. Perfect? Maybe not. But damn, a good place to start I think. Instead she literally walked away from that conversation. No response, nothing. The next morning she came downstairs and was literally red  with rage. Lips trembling. Hands shaking as she told me how disgusted she was with me and what I had to say.

She recently insinuated that I was having an affair. Demanded to know what I was doing, where I was, where I was the night prior (30 min late because I had to stop for dog food). Except I wasn’t 30 min late for a five course meal and romance until dawn. I was 30 min late for her in an already grumpy mood, no dinner plans, children not attended to and an otherwise sour and cold attitude. So, what was I supposed to be in a rush for? It’s like she wants me all to herself, and simultaneously doesn’t want me around at all.

So the next day she peppers me with phone calls and texts about my apparent infidelity. I’ve seen this game before. The old me would have caved, done whatever I could to prove my devotion and assuage her concerns. Except I know (or suspect, anyway) that these accusations really aren’t about me. If anything, it’s just a way of keeping things in a near-constant state of chaos, unrest and uncertainty. So I stood my ground, told her that she was out of line and I didn’t appreciate it. Mere hours later she’s texting me racy pictures of herself in a bathing suit, and the roller coaster keeps going.

That’s just a sample of the back-and-forth roller coaster that my life has become, one of which I’m completely tired, d frustrated, confused and fed up. I love and honor her and our children but I’m learning that that love and honor really doesn’t mean anything if the object of those feelings denies my right to express them, or denies that they even exist. Not sure what I’m supposed to do while maintaining a shred of dignity and not breaking my children’s hearts.

[M604V]

(Continued) I think I’m just exhausted of having to constantly apply for the job of husband and partner. It’s like she can just fire me whenever she wants, for cause or just because. And then I have to try and claw my way back to zero, just to get back to where I started. Because the bad times, the “firings” are so painful, it’s like I’m trying to erase them. I’m trying to get rid of the hurtful words, the days and days of silent teatement, the threats, the accusations. It’s like I’m fighting for my own survival, my self esteem, my sense of value.

[Augustine]

Oh Lord, can I ever relate…

If not for the alcohol, and her “medicinal” marijuana, it’s unlikely that we’d have lasted as long as we did.

A stock phrase of mine was, “Can I top-off your wine glass for you?” as the quantity consumed was directly correlated to having a relaxing evening….usually.

[M604V]

Yea sometimes I actually miss her drinking sometimes. The lows were bad, but the highs were much better

[BigEasyHeart]

By the way, this line struck home for me:

She denies my feelings, quite literally. She tells me that I don’t feel the way I do.

What you are describing here is a form of gaslighting. Would you be willing to share more detail and/or context and what she actually says when she does this?

I'm so sorry to hear you are going through this.

[Juantelamela]

Parts of your post I can absolutely relate to so much. Especially with the substance abuse. I was already on the line between casual drinking and alcohol abuse before I met my ex. Then when we started dating we just drank all the time together. It got to a point where we had spent more time with eachother drunk or high than we ever did sober. I finally talked with her. Told her I wasn't sure how she felt, but that I was acknowledging my drinking problem and needed to make changes.

She agreed but never took steps to try and cut back. I tried setting boundaries with her: Please don't drink around me. Please don't smell or taste like alcohol if you're trying to be intimate. Please don't bring up sensitive or intense topics while you are drinking(that last part because once something like that comes up, something ends up triggering an insecurity of hers in some way which leads to either an argument or she's put in a negative mood the remainder of the night). But she would push and test those boundaries constantly instead of being supportive in my struggle to cut back drinking. She'd loudly crack open beer near me before leaving to drink in the next room, or she'd get buzzed and start sloppily trying to be sexy and turn me on for sex. Just no support at all.

The relationship was an absolute Rollercoaster of emotions happening so quickly. I remember one specific fight in the morning where she was feeling insecure because we hadn't had sex in a few days. The conversation turned to insinuating I was cheating on her "my friend said if my man ain't getting it from me than he's getting it from someone else". After a heated exchange of words and trying to once again defend my position in the relationship, her anger and suspicion left and she was just suddenly happy while I was left in a really sensitive and confused emotional state. I started to leave for work and she got upset because she was expecting me to hug and kiss her goodbye like I normally would. Let me tell you in that emotional state, the last thing I wanted to do was give her any kind of affection. Her emotion had flipped back to anger and being upset at me. She didn't understand. She couldn't understand how she left me feeling. It was heartbreaking.

What bothered me most about this is that besides work, we spent every waking moment together and had an almost fixed routine for our day to day. I was getting home the same time every day, hell, she was even tracking me with Snapchats location thing. There was absolutely nothing she could actually use to backup any ideas of me cheating on her, yet she constantly made passive aggressive comments or would be constantly looking over at me any time I pulled my phone out and asking me who I'm texting, even if I'm not actually texting or socializing at all.

Like you. I'm also glad I found this place. The resources and support found here has helped me feel less alone on my journey to recovering from that relationship that has left me feeling hallow and confused. It's hard to talk about how I'm left feeling to the people in my life. They seem to believe the next relationship will be a better one or that maybe my ex and I could possibly rekindle if we talked things out. They don't understand how vulnerable and scared I am at this point to even consider opening myself up to another person anytime soon.

[M604V]

By the way, this line struck home for me:

What you are describing here is a form of gaslighting. Would you be willing to share more detail and/or context and what she actually says when she does this?

I'm so sorry to hear you are going through this.

Oh gosh, where to begin. She denies that I ever said what I said. She’ll reply “you’re not _________, you’re just feeling defensive.”  “Defensiveness” is a big one. I love that. It’s like she’ll accuse me of any number of things and if I defend myself I’m being “defensive”.

She minimizes the source or cause of my emotions. “You did ________ and it makes me feel _______” She’ll reply that whatever the cause of the feeling, it was a long time ago, or it wasn’t that bad, I’m exaggerating.

Or she’ll just try and work herself into a tie with me. As far as she’s concerned if I have hurt feeling and she does too, then we’re apparently “tied” in the “Hurt Feelings Game” and she’s then free from any accountability. That’s a big one, the need to get whatever dirt she can on me so that I never get a leg up. She’s even done it retroactively. We were on a cruise once, everything was fine. Having a great time but of course alcohol was involved. Seemingly without provocation she went off on me, one of the worst tirades I can recall. I mean cut me right down to the quick. Months later she decided that I was having an affair with a *100% platonic, mutual friend of ours*, and then said that she knew all along we were sleeping together that’s why she called me those vile things months prior.

Or she just walks away. Like walks away mid sentence. I guess when all else fails if she doesn’t hear what I say, then I guess I never said it?

[once removed]

venting might hurt - or it might not help, if you are still married and looking for direction.

Detaching is a board for people deep into the grieving process that are committed to moving on. the only thing that venting here will accomplish is commiseration (not to downplay the importance of that, but its available on every board) at best, and polarization of the conflict in your marriage at worst.

what do you want to see happen? theres a path for you, whatever it is.

[BigEasyHeart]

Oh gosh, where to begin. She denies that I ever said what I said. She’ll reply “you’re not _________, you’re just feeling defensive.”  “Defensiveness” is a big one. I love that. It’s like she’ll accuse me of any number of things and if I defend myself I’m being “defensive”.

She minimizes the source or cause of my emotions. “You did ________ and it makes me feel _______” She’ll reply that whatever the cause of the feeling, it was a long time ago, or it wasn’t that bad, I’m exaggerating.

Or she’ll just try and work herself into a tie with me. As far as she’s concerned if I have hurt feeling and she does too, then we’re apparently “tied” in the “Hurt Feelings Game” and she’s then free from any accountability. That’s a big one, the need to get whatever dirt she can on me so that I never get a leg up. She’s even done it retroactively. We were on a cruise once, everything was fine. Having a great time but of course alcohol was involved. Seemingly without provocation she went off on me, one of the worst tirades I can recall. I mean cut me right down to the quick. Months later she decided that I was having an affair with a *100% platonic, mutual friend of ours*, and then said that she knew all along we were sleeping together that’s why she called me those vile things months prior.

Or she just walks away. Like walks away mid sentence. I guess when all else fails if she doesn’t hear what I say, then I guess I never said it?

There is a lot I (and most of us) can relate to there. It really sucks to be treated like that and can make you question your own sense of reality. I'm so sorry you have to deal with this.

[Augustine]

Whew, it’s hard not to get dragged into this.

-The alcoholism, with the arguments that followed
-Whenever you look at your phone, it actually means that you’re communicating with your fille de joie.
-The turning and walking away mid-sentence
-The complete absence of care
-etc

I truly shake my head in wonder at the utter absurdity of it all.

There’s nothing about that continuous BS that I miss, and I thank god that I ended it.