My DIL has just decided to not let us see our granddaughter

[Our abuse recovery guide]

Hello,

We have been dealing with my son's SO since October of 2016, when they started dating.  She has been very aggressive and angry to us and for many years we weren't able to communicate with our son.  He married her even with some trepidation.  We were not invited to the wedding and then blamed for not attending.  She has pulled us into their life then out, it's exhausting.  She always finds a reason, usually our fault, for pulling out.  Most recently she has been looking for a reason to pull out again, and has and has decided that we cannot see our granddaughter who is 16 months old.  We gave up our summer to help them care for her since she was 6 months old.  We were blindsided, and now I'm sick and sad.  IDK what to do, I don't know how to deal with this anymore.  My son is quiet and I know its because he doesn't want to upset the apple cart especially now that he has a child to consider.  It's just all so sad, she did this to us over Christmas and says it's all our fault.  She turns everything around to make us the bad guys, after.... we gave them thousands of dollars to get them out of debt because the baby was in the hospital with RSV at the age of 4 months and sick continuously so I kept her till her immune system strengthened.  And this is how she repays me.  We know we are not bad people, she has to look pretty hard to find something that is truly our fault.    I believed she is BPD, she fits the profile and my son has no idea.  I know he is miserable, I can see it in his eyes. His only joy now is his daughter.  Anyway, just where I am at the moment.  Glad to share with someone who may get it?

[irunforwine]

Hello,

We have been dealing with my son's SO since October of 2016, when they started dating.  She has been very aggressive and angry to us and for many years we weren't able to communicate with our son.  He married her even with some trepidation.  We were not invited to the wedding and then blamed for not attending.  She has pulled us into their life then out, it's exhausting.  She always finds a reason, usually our fault, for pulling out.  Most recently she has been looking for a reason to pull out again, and has and has decided that we cannot see our granddaughter who is 16 months old.  We gave up our summer to help them care for her since she was 6 months old.  We were blindsided, and now I'm sick and sad.  IDK what to do, I don't know how to deal with this anymore.  My son is quiet and I know its because he doesn't want to upset the apple cart especially now that he has a child to consider.  It's just all so sad, she did this to us over Christmas and says it's all our fault.  She turns everything around to make us the bad guys, after.... we gave them thousands of dollars to get them out of debt because the baby was in the hospital with RSV at the age of 4 months and sick continuously so I kept her till her immune system strengthened.  And this is how she repays me.  We know we are not bad people, she has to look pretty hard to find something that is truly our fault.    I believed she is BPD, she fits the profile and my son has no idea.  I know he is miserable, I can see it in his eyes. His only joy now is his daughter.  Anyway, just where I am at the moment.  Glad to share with someone who may get it?

[Pook075]

Hello and thanks so much for sharing.  Many of us have been through this exact situation and in some ways, it's more difficult when it's outside of the direct family.  My mother in law, soon to be ex-wife, and daughter are three generations of BPD, plus my wife's two brothers have it (undiagnosed) as well.

Your post reminded me of several times I tried to do the "right thing" with family and have it blow up spectacularly in my face, often without any direct input from me at all.  I'd just be informed that "so and so is furious with you" and I'd be at a loss for words, until I started to really understand how BPD works.  So let me give you the crash course for now, and you can read the sticky threads along the top of the page to get some skills to better deal with these situations. 

They're invaluable since this is not a learned behavior on your part....you have to be proactive.

A person with BPD is constantly looking for any sign of rejection or abandonment in all their relationships, and when they spot it their fight or flight reflex goes off the charts in defense mode. 

I remember one time my brother in law wanted to give my daughter a car...very nice thing of him to do...but my kid had three wrecks on her license and the insurance would be a minimum of $650/month.  I couldn't afford it and politely declined, which led to an explosion of over-reactions of how I was such a horrible person and a dead-beat dad.  So I called him and explained the situation; I just didn't have the extra money each month, and I thought he understood.  Mind you, this was maybe a $1500 car I'd have to spend $650/month for her to drive...it made zero sense.  But he avoided me for almost 5 years because he was so upset over it.

In this situation, like your situation, I had to be the bigger person and go out of my way to show my brother-in-law that I loved him and cared about him.  Because any little thing I did that could be perceived as a slight would turn him against me all over again.  So he was always the first person I greeted when I walked in the room, I always spent a little extra time shopping for his Christmas presents, I always invited him to go on vacation with us...even though I knew he couldn't go.  It took a conscious effort to always make sure that he knew how much I liked him.  And eventually, things were good between us.

For someone with BPD, once they expect someone is against them...and it doesn't matter if it's real or perceived...the relationship can fall apart rather quickly since everything you do towards them is viewed under a microscope of suspicion.  It makes building a relationship so challenging because you're being judged on things you may know nothing about, all the while they take a "guilty until proven innocent" type of stance. 

That's where your son's at- he loves his parents, but his wife is saying that they're hurting her.  Who does he believe?  What does he do?  You may think he should be defending you but that only makes things so much worse at home since the suspicion and judgement passes to him as well.  That's why these relationships fail so frequently...nobody gets to just talk things out and move on from them.

The answer here is for you to communicate to your step-daughter directly and rebuild a relationship that you have no idea how you broke.  Again, the sticky threads along the top of the page are communication techniques and they're so essential in these types of situations. 

This situation is not fair and it's not your fault, but you're also the only one that can fix it.  It may help to know that your daughter in law is sick and has jaded viewpoints to protect herself, so it's not exactly her fault either.  The problem here is mental illness and knowing how to communicate to someone with BPD.  I hope that helps and good luck!

[livednlearned]

She has been very aggressive and angry to us and for many years we weren't able to communicate with our son.

How did things thaw the last time?

Splitting is pretty common for people who struggle with BPD.

I know it's tough to ride out these episodes, and having a grandchild in the mix only makes it more excruciating, since they grow so fast. There's some hope here, though, that she can recover from a split -- not all splitting episodes work like that. Something is working, even though that doesn't change how painful it can be.

My stepdaughter (26) has an internalizing type of BPD personality and she splits family members quite frequently. I suspect one of the reasons she splits often is because, as an internalizer, she isn't raging at people so there is less of an emotional cycle getting played out. Sometimes we don't even realize a split occurred, although having grown up in a family where it paid to be hypervigilant, I probably notice her splitting more than other family members.

Similar to what Pook075 described in his example, with SD26, the external response to her splitting is muted so she has less of a hill to climb to get back to baseline. It's almost like she looked around and noticed 1) no one seems to be freaking out that I just did _______; and 2) I like the feeling of normalcy they seem capable of -- makes it easier for me to regulate.

Whereas in my marriage to a BPDx, when he split, he split hard and it stuck hard.

Are you able to communicate with your son?

[irunforwine]

Pook075  Hello your response was very validating.  As much as we do want to talk to our daughter in law it is impossible.  The number one reason is because she refuses to  "talk, speak" she will only communicate via text messages.  Which I HATE.  Everything gets misconstrued, and I never know what I am saying that will set  her off. The reason she is angry now is because, without much backtrack.... my youngest was supposed to be the best man at their wedding  but didn't go. We were not invited and the stress and ugliness that ensued prior to the wedding put my youngest in a state of depression and he was unable to make it, he called his big brother and spoke to him about it and they had an understanding.  (He sought counseling as did I and both our respective therapists, independently, described her as being possibly BPD.)  Fast forward, on the 21 our granddaughter had a "play" at her preschool and the night before she texted me and asked that my youngest not attend.  I thought it was odd and asked if there wasn't enough seating or whatever.  I told my husband and he said, no way, he IS going.  He said, and i agree, if they don't want him there it is their place to tell him not to come not ours.  So we all three went.  That afternoon she sent a text and called my son a piece of sh** and not ever going to be an uncle to their child and was worthless and a horrible brother and brought up the wedding.  this blew us away, because we thought that we had all moved on passed that according to my oldest, apparently she holds on to things.   She accused us of being disrespectful to them and their feelings, she includes my son in her decisions, and therefore we're awful people. 

To answer the question from livednlearned, the thaw was the birth of our granddaughter.  The DIL wanted us to be  a part of her life and we did the best we could.  there was also a thaw that came later this past April for my son and his sister, that occurred when they both lost their beloved grandfather. 

 My husband and I decided the best course was to just not respond to her most recent text.  She was so hurtful and said such ugly things about my youngest son, that I was afraid I'd respond the wrong way.  The worst part of this whole situation is that she is using our granddaughter as a pawn.  I don't want her to suffer for her mother's sickness, so I will back off and out if it gives our granddaughter a better life.  I do not think my son should defend us, and we feel that way because we know it would  only make his situation at home more difficult. 

I hear, from both of you,  that the only way for this relationship to work is to acquiesce to her world and allow her to manipulate each situation for her benefit and to prevent further disruptions.  Pook075, your post gave me such clarity and validation, that I wasn't seeing things in a skewed way, that it was indeed as I and my husband have seen it.

FYI, my husband and I are able to text and communicate with my son, and both my boys text often and seeing them at the event was wonderful.  They were laughing and joking and enjoying each other then 2 hours later we are devastated by her text.  She is always the one that makes the decision to exclude us.  Blames us for not being there for our granddaughters first Christmas, when in fact we tried but were told numerous times they were too busy.  But that is our fault.     I am just tired of the hurt, this has gone on for 7 years.  This response is all over the place, I apologize.  IDK what or how to handle this anymore.

[Notwendy]

I hope to add a supportive comment to your decision. I am a middle age daughter of an elderly widowed mother who has BPD. The Karman triangle dynamics helped me to see the overall pattern in this behavior. While there was sadness a my mother's ability to interfere with familial bonds with my father, it helped me to not see this as personally.  I initually perceived my father as a victim of my mother's behavior- but he was an adult- capable of making his own decisions, and even if reluctantly- went along with her wishes. He was a part of this too.

The victim-rescuer bond is strong. Two people are aligned together against a common "perscutor". It's a way to stablize their own relationship and be aligned, rather than looking at their own issues. Somehow this opportunity seemed irresistable to my father- similar to an addiction. It is co-dependent behavior, enabling- and this has been described as an addiction and also there are 12 step groups for this. People may pay a high emotional cost for their addiction, but they also seem to be unable to resist it.

For some reasons, closest family members, especially female ones, are seen somehow as a threat to BPD mother, so she rallied my father to her side. This isn't rational. It's a feeling and feelings feel like facts in the moment to someone with BPD.

There's also the double bind. It seems that no matter what I do to try to assist my BPD mother, she will somehow find some way to blame me for something I did or didn't do. However, if her issues were taken care of, she could not be in "victim" position so attempts to solve them for her don't change her perception.

Why victim? Victims are blameless. Taking accountability can result in feelings of shame. PwBPD can not manage that- so they will see things in victim position and blame other people.

For me personally, I would not reach out and try to appease your DIL. It is unlikely to work for long because you are not the cause of the problem and so, it's not in your ability to change how your DIL thinks.

Reacting with hostility is also playing right into her "victim" scenario. A counselor advised me to aim for neutral- don't go to either end. If you regularly do something like send Christmas and birthday cards/gifts- just keep the routine ( but don't spend a lot of money on them, they may end up in the trash. If you communicate by text, then do that but keep things short, to the point, polite and without emotion. Without conflict and emotion, there's less drama. I would not be sending them money or enabling them.

If you are not in counseling, I would advise it, for your own self care. This is a lot to deal with. You can also turn the focus to your own family and goals. Take that vacation you wanted.

I know you love your son but if you attempt to "rescue" him - a posisble response is that the two of them will be bonded like super glue "against" you. This is a difficult relationship - but he chose it and he's the one who would need to decide otherwise, if that were to be possible.

As to the baby, if at any time, you feel that baby is not safe with these two- call CPS. Also there is hope. Babies are cute and cuddly. Older kids- they tend to have their own ideas and thoughts and they may conflict with their BPD mother. Teens certainly do. So while my father's parents may not have seen us a lot when we were babies, BPD mother agreed to have us stay with his family on school breaks. It was easier for her and we had a great time with them. Stay neutral, be cordial, do not react and keep that door open as I hope for you that there will be opportunities for you to spend time with that grandbaby in the future.

[Pook075]

I hear, from both of you,  that the only way for this relationship to work is to acquiesce to her world and allow her to manipulate each situation for her benefit and to prevent further disruptions.  Pook075, your post gave me such clarity and validation, that I wasn't seeing things in a skewed way, that it was indeed as I and my husband have seen it.

You are seeing things correctly and yes, this is pure manipulation out of fear of not being in control.  With that said, however, her fears are stemming from an unhealthy, likely untrue viewpoint that your family is against her and it hurting her relationship with your son and grandkids.

I've been living this scenario most of my adult life since I was married at 25 and I can tell you firsthand that I did not react appropriately most of the time.  Early on in my marriage, I'd bring righteous anger when my wife disappeared or didn't support me...and that led to blowout fights.  Later on, I ignored my wife's destructive behaviors to avoid conflict...and we never fought.  But I wasn't in a "marriage" either since I was alone most of the time.  This was also a mistake because as my wife grew distant and I didn't fight to "reel her back in", she became depressed.

The way to solve my marriage problems would have been to keep my wife accountable through loving interaction, to build trust and open communication without judgement.  I just had no idea what I was dealing with so I failed.

With my BPD daughter, it tore us apart as a family because I was the "tough parent" while my wife was the absent parent.  No matter what happened, she'd say, "Ask your father" and I'd deal with my kid alone...without support.  With my kid I was tough and loving...rarely both at the same time...which most here can relate to since my daughter was a pure terror.  But I made very strong boundaries and I ultimately had a great relationship with my daughter. 

The key was making my intentions and values so well known that my kid wouldn't even see the point in challenging them.  Also, I finally figured out that arguing was senseless...let her rant and go do her thing...then love her once she got past the tantrum.  I was far from perfect in this relationship but I mostly got it right.

For your situation, if you just ignore your daughter in law, it confirms her suspicions that you don't care about her.  If you confront her directly and argue, it also confirms her suspicions that you don't care about her.  So it feels like a lose/lose situation but there is a third option here....just accepting that she's sick and loving her as much as you're allowed.

For just about every single person who's ever posted here, if they could have sat down and had a truly honest conversation...without any ego or blame...they could have moved past the dysfunction and just got back to loving each other.  Most give up before they get the chance since they made real effort and it failed.  I absolutely did with my wife and for awhile, I saw myself as a victim.  That's not true though, I wasn't a victim, I just didn't know that I should have communicated with my wife the same way I talked to my daughter.

To "fix" the relationship with your daughter in law, I'm not saying to go along with her narratives or allow her to control every little detail in your life.  If you do that, it's enabling and only makes her more confident in her delusions.  What I'm saying is to forgive her, wipe the slate clean, and just reinforce that you love her and want what's best for her family.  Every time she gets off on a tangent over something, tell her you love her and you're there to help.  She's powerless to fight that and eventually, she'll see you in a different light.  You'll never get there though if you're fighting over holiday plans or random things that don't matter in life.

For instance, if she were to say that she wanted this, this, and that for a family gathering, your response should be, "I can understand why you'd feel that way, but I wouldn't be comfortable attending without my son.  How can we work past this so everyone is together for the holidays?"  Then you let her find the compromise without arguing or invalidating her emotions.

As I said earlier, it's not fair and it's not "normal".  But that's mental illness and it requires a different approach to create healthy boundaries while also showing love, compassion, and empathy.  The good news is that once you get past the initial dysfunction and regain her trust, it's not a lifelong battle that you're doing this every week.  Getting there can feel impossible though and that's why this forum exists...most of us got it wrong or simply gave up.

I have succeeded with my daughter, my wife, my mother in law, and both of her sons...I'm no longer painted black and I can have a productive conversation.  I make it very clear that I love them though and I'm always here for them, which is something I had to say dozens of times in some cases before it was actually heard.  That's become sort of my signature phrase in life to everyone around me now, as I say goodbye, I'll throw in, "Hey, I'm always here if you ever need anything.  Don't hesitate to reach out."  I mean it though because that's how I build relationships.

I wish you luck with this going forward and hopefully you picked up a little wisdom here.  It's so hard sometimes but in your situation, it is worth the effort since it involves your son and grandchild.

[Notwendy]

Although I admit I am not as tolerant as Pook is with my BPD mother, bu this may also be reflective of the relationship- child is different than spouse or parent.  I think our main responses are similar in that- we need to be consistent in how we relate to them. They can vaiver up and down. We don't. The key to being non reactive to their moods is not to go in either direction- one being ignore, the other, placate and enable. Find middle ground and be consistent.

My BPD mother was angry at me at the time my father passed away. I could have stopped contact with her at that point. But she's elderly, it didn't feel like the right thing to do. A wise person suggested I call her, on a schedule. If she called in between times, I could answer or not. I would call on the same day. If she didn't want to talk to me then, that is her choice, and if she did, she could. I didn't change the schedule of the calls regardless of her behavior.

However, I also don't tolerate abusive behavior. If she got verbally abusive on the phone, I found a way to end the conversation. I didn't respond back at her, just politely said "I need to go now, talk to you next week" and left it at that.

My mother did not like my father's family and I don't think they liked her. However, they didn't get into it with her. They included her in any invitations. They didn't discuss her with us kids. The only time they did was after my father passed away and I was an adult. They treated her kindly- probably most for my father and for us kids.

My mother's family can tend to be invalidating but with her in her later years, they seemed to praise her a lot for even little things. It was puzzling to me however, I think they knew that this is what she needs. That is, if you can do it sincerely and honestly. My BPD mother craves admiration and affirmation. Yes, she is manipulative and I don't suggest playing games with your DIL, but what I found is that my BPD mother responds to compliments and so if I can do it, I try to keep that in mind.

You can not discuss anything my mother did or hold her accountable. It's like p*ssing in the wind. It comes back at you tenfold in her anger and she doesn't learn from it. She can do something hurtful and later, for her, it's gone. It didn't happen and you don't dare bring it up. Yes, it's not fair to not be able to resolve an issue. It's not that it's wrong to wish for that, it just doesn't work. If I did this, I'd feel worse for trying. Her sense of denial and projection makes it so it doesn't register with her. That is her mental illness.

So for whatever you have done with your son and DIL, be consistent. If you invite them for holidays, invite them. She can decide to come or not. If you send gifts at birthdays and Christmas, send them ( not costly ones). When you have the chance to speak to them again, act as if nothing happened. You don't have to tolerate being treated poorly- just don't react and get yourself out of the conversation, politely. You are paying the long game here- for your son ,and your grandbaby- as much as you can handle. If it's too abusive for you to interact with them at all- that is your choice too. Take care of yourself first- and then just do the best you can with this situation.

[irunforwine]

Good Morning,

There is so much to take in and ponder on, and it all makes perfect sense.  Words that jump out are manipulation,  victim, control and love.  I was thinking the other day about this, I wake up every morning sad and feeling the loss of my granddaughter, and I felt like my DIL may be anxious and feel that because my granddaughter knows me, she reaches for me and allows me to hold her more than her other grandmother, (I cared for her for 6 months) she may feel that she has to break that relationship because of a fear that my granddaughter would leave her for  me?  I know that sounds crazy but maybe my DIL knows that her behavior may in time, obviously when my granddaughter is grown, force my granddaughter to leave.  To seek somewhere normal, somewhere safe?  Does my DIL worry that her own child would abandon her?  Is her mind set is that if she breaks that connection now I am no longer a threat?  We have always felt that for some reason I am a threat to her.  Our DIL's mother offers no help in caring for their granddaughter which has disappointed my DIL so very much, I also think it doesn't set right with her that we are so willing to keep her.  My son knows us, he knows we will always be there, and I think that us being there is a weird concept to her.

She has accused me of controlling my son's life.  I never see him, haven't for 7 years until his child was born.  How can I be controlling him when I am not even a part of his life??   

My son and I were at one point very close.  In fact we have been very close to all our children.  We were a more, for lack of a better word, normal family.  We treated each other with love, respect and kindness.  She spoke of her family when we first met her as very different.  Their dynamic was so garish? IDK if that is the correct word, but directly the opposite of her family.  But then again, they way their family works is how they  have adjusted to her BPD, which I see now.  I do want to reach out to her parents to see if there is a way, without being manipulated, to find out how to reach her?   You speak of loving her.  I want to, we all do,  but the only part of her that I have seen is the ugly part of her.  Whenever she speaks to us she gets in some condescending digs, and just so very disrespectful.  We have tried to show love and concern, it is very difficult.  We have, from the beginning, tried to build a relationship with her but she has thwarted that at every turn. She even at one time compared herself to myself.  Saying, "We are both strong women."  I don't know if I am strong, but I am a 59 yo woman who is confident in herself and obviously a threat to her. Which is what my husband, and youngest son have said multiple times.

When we have reached out it becomes an argument so we don't want to push them further away.  I do notice, and I may be wrong, but... it seems like she gets a little "off" around pms.  Is that possible? My son said she was very angry during the pregnancy.  I can see how her rants and explosive anger is getting to him.  He just looks so tired.

I am planning on going to  my son's office this week to drop off some Christmas gifts they never came to claim.  We are holding back the monetary part of it, just giving them the gifts, which were items she specifically asked for.  Any thoughts on that?  I did return some expensive gifts because I felt in my heart that she would just throw them in the trash because they were from us. When I did the returns it really broke my heart and I almost cried at the counter. 

One other detail.  She professes to be a Christian, and said that she and my son "prayed and prayed and prayed to God to help them find strength to forgive your family for the BS we have put us through.. ." (we haven't, we have just tried to keep our relationship with our son)  I believe God would have given her another solution and not for them to rip our granddaughter out of our lives. 

Everyone has been so helpful in helping me, us, deal with this.   Everything said, makes sense.  Most of it has been our response at times.    I need to stop, I keep having thoughts and want to keep putting them down because I have so many questions! How can I be controlling?  how can I be disrespectful?

[Notwendy]

For someone with BPD who sees themselves in victim mode, often what they accuse other people of says more about themselves than the other person. This is projection and not fact. Also if feelings are facts to them and your DIL "feels" you are a threat or controlling your son, it feels true to her. Your part is to not believe it or take it as real or personal.

I like the analogy of calling you a pink elephant. If she called you that you wouldn't even consider the possibility. You know it's not true and her saying it won't make it true. It's sad and difficult to deal with and you know it's not true. Your son knows it's not true either but he's in the position of having to suspend his own reality to keep the peace with his wife. That is difficult for him but- he's an adult and chose this and it's up to him to do something about it if he chooses to.

As to religion- and for me, religion is a positive thing. But we humans are not capable of full perception and knowing like God is. Also, our relationship with God is a personal one. If BPD affects all relationships to some extent, it also affects that relationship. Your DIL also can project her feelings with God. If pwBPD have a poor sense of self, they can grasp on to certain identities and being a Christian is, in western cultures, considered to be a positive one- a good person. She may be a Christian in terms of her beliefs. But whatever she believes, she has a mental illness too and this influences her behaviors. Again, consider that what she says reflects her feelings, her beliefs, but BPD influences them.

[zachira]

It is so heartbreaking and sad not being able to see your granddaughter. I have many disordered family members, and was raised by a mother with BPD. From my perspective, there are two strategies that work with disordered people until suddenly out of the blue they don't work any more or they don't work for the time being. First is doing everything to make the disordered person feel valued, until one day he/she gets angry for no reason and blames you for how he/she is feeling inside. The other is to set boundaries for self care which are tested and violated by the disordered person until you have to put in place more boundaries. Be open to possible changes which will allow you at times to be in your granddaughter's life. Mothers with BPD are overwhelmed by taking care of children, getting things done, and working at a regular job, so you may find your DIL reaching out to you for help when she is overwhelmed by having to take care of her child. The terrible twos are extremely difficult for mothers with BPD to cope with, as the mother often feels rejected and abandoned by her child.

[Pook075]

Does my DIL worry that her own child would abandon her?  Is her mind set is that if she breaks that connection now I am no longer a threat? 

She has accused me of controlling my son's life.  I never see him, haven't for 7 years until his child was born.  How can I be controlling him when I am not even a part of his life??

First off, welcome back and Happy New Year!

That could be part of what's in play, but if I had to guess then I'd say it's bigger than that...it's about your son.  If he's getting your input...or living off the morals that you taught him growing up...that challenges her belief system and ultimately her control in the relationship.  You're the enemy by default because her parents didn't seem to support her (more on that in a minute) and parents are just meddling annoyances. 

That's why I said earlier that you have to change that narrative- you're there to help.  Everything else comes after that.

She spoke of her family when we first met her as very different. 

My BPD daughter told everyone that I was satan as she was growing up, simply because I didn't draw the lines between right and wrong.  Everyone else had a sliding scale for appropriate behavior...she did something shocking and dangerous, but because she's "special" they let her get away with it.  Not me, actions have consequences and both my daughters were punished the same way for their behaviors.  The difference is that one learned right from wrong, the other didn't.

My BPD wife also talked about how strict and unfair her parents were, and had very heavy resentment built up when we got married.

What's this mean for your situation?  Her parents and family probably were not monsters, she just sees them that way and blames her own bad behavior on them.  It's like a child throwing a temper tantrum...most of us learn that doesn't work.  She didn't though and it made more sense for her to cut them out of her life and badmouth them.  Now she's doing the same thing with you because parents can't be good people, can they?  It's a learned behavior that's incredibly destructive.

When we have reached out it becomes an argument so we don't want to push them further away.  I do notice, and I may be wrong, but... it seems like she gets a little "off" around pms.  Is that possible?

Why does it become an argument?  It takes two people to argue and I refuse to argue with my BPD wife or my BPD daughter.  Here's how you do it.  When you sense their energy is shifting...they're getting angry or sad or dysregulated in any direction, you bring the energy way down as you focus on them.  If they jump from a 3 to an 8 in intensity, you go from a 3 to a 2.  Stay calm, nurturing, and remind them that "you're on their side and there to help."  If they're at an 8, you'll probably have to do a good bit of listening and repeat that several times at first.  But you don't lose it just because they're losing it and not giving an inch.

Once they begin to calm down, now you can lightly broach the topic they're freaking out about.  You don't say, "this is how we're going to do it..." because in her mind, that's invalidating her and the drama goes right back up.  You can speak your viewpoint though, "I personally want this, you want that, so how can we compromise so it works for everyone?"  The key is that you have to do it without judgement, without blame, and you have to stay calm and supportive.

I've said this many times before, but this isn't fair at all.  It's like debating a 5 year old throwing a temper tantrum.  But it's the same process, you can't scream at a little kid and expect them to calm down.  You have to love and nurture to show that you're not the enemy.  And in time, if you get better at reacting this way, the temper tantrums drop way down because they know your intentions are to help (instead of hurt).

I am planning on going to  my son's office this week to drop off some Christmas gifts they never came to claim.  We are holding back the monetary part of it, just giving them the gifts, which were items she specifically asked for.  Any thoughts on that? 

This is a personal choice, but I've decided that if I want to give something to my wife or daughter, I give it to them with no expectation in return.  I'm a giving person and I love to give, so I'm not changing who I am because a relative isn't the same.

An alternate way to say that is I'm not changing my morals over your morals.  I'm going to be me regardless.  So if you want to give, then give.  If you don't, then that's okay too.  There's no wrong answer here.

One other detail.  She professes to be a Christian, and said that she and my son "prayed and prayed and prayed to God to help them find strength to forgive your family for the BS we have put us through...

Oh gosh, I have to tread carefully here because when my marriage fell apart, I got back in church and God has completely changed my life.  So I'll just go to a snippet of the Lord's prayer here, "...and forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us...."

If you're not forgiving, then you're not being forgiven by God.  You're holding onto bitterness and it separates you from God.  I'm not saying you can't be a Christian in that situation, but it makes it pretty darn tough.  So your daughter in law "praying for the strength to forgive", that's a good thing.  Maybe instead of blaming God here though (among everyone else she blames), she should ask why her prayers aren't being answered.

Christianity is about repentance and serving by walking like Jesus walked.  Jesus forgave and he loved unconditionally, even to the worst of the worst.  That's how we're all called to live.  That's why I said you have to forgive her, just like I forgave my daughter and my wife.  Because forgiveness is for me, to get that dark stuff and all the emotions it creates off my heart.  I don't want to be angry at someone or carry a grudge because it hurts me. 

So I forgive, regardless whether or not I'm forgiven, because it brings me closer to God.

The pleasant side effect of that, once I forgave my kid and my wife, is that we were able to start building a relationship once again.  What I was telling you to do earlier, to support your daughter in law, is much easier once you truly forgive because the judgement goes away.  They can feel that and the relationship magically changes.

Your one goal here, the only goal, is to get your daughter to stop focusing on the past.  It's the same goal for every person on this site that can't understand why a BPD in their life just walked away in a fury or why their relationship is so fractured.  The only way to do that is forgiving and letting go of past traumas to live in the present.

For my BPD kid, I forgave her and she was able to do the same...and our relationship changed instantly.  For my wife, I forgave her and we started talking more often, but she never could forgive me (mainly because she rejects the BPD diagnosis and can't imagine that she's potentially done anything wrong).  The marriage is over and I accept that without regret, but we have become friends once again. 

Forgiveness and compassion is the path forward for all of us, and it starts with us doing the forgiving.

[Notwendy]

Why someone has BPD is complicated. There's a genetic component but it's not predictable- in my immediate family, only BPD mother has BPD. Environment plays a part- sometimes there's a history of abuse or emotional trauma but not necessarily.

What is known is that family dynamics can be inherited as learned behaviors. With your DIL, it's possible that her own FOO could be disordered and also other family members with BPD. How a child grows up is their sense of "normal".

I have spent time in ACA groups- which extend beyond alcohol to also include dysfunction as family patterns are similar. The focus is to look at the family behaviors we have learned and "unlearn" them- replace them with more functional ones.

I found it interesting that a section of the ACA "Red Book" discusses religion. Children aren't able to have abstract concepts until they are older and so this includes a concept of God. Parents are a large influence on their God concept. If the parents are overly judgmental and punitive, the child will also attribute that to God. If the parents use religion as discipline or abuse, the child will also attribute that to their God concept. Part of this exercise is to examine our own God concepts and reframe them as adults.

With what your DIL said about praying to forgive you for her (false accusation) - I wonder how much of her ideas were formed in her possibly disordered family.

Forgiveness can also be abstract and difficult to grasp- and may vary according to how someone experiences their religion in their family. I found it easier to consider the idea of letting go of resentments as discussed in these 12 step groups because there's a method for examining them and seeing how they aren't doing us any good to hold on to them. Once seeing them this way, it makes sense and becomes more possible and then forgiveness becomes more possible.

Letting go of past resentments doesn't mean accepting current behavior. I still need boundaries with her current behavior. While some of her behavior isn't acceptable, I can accept that she is who she is due to her mental illness.

It also doesn't mean your feelings are wrong- feelings are what they are. It's understandable that you are hurt, angry, and also resentful for the situation your DIL has introduced to your family. And also sad and angry that your son is in this situation. You may not be in an emotional place to be forgiving at the moment but with self care, it may be possible to arrive at that place. We can feel what we feel- and use our own judgment as to whether to act on our feelings. Anger, resentment, - these are our signs we need to take care of ourselves- take a time out, talk to someone- do what we need to do to take that care.