Did you ever try to tell him/her that their love/hate cycle is only due to BPD?

[French_Touch]

My soon to be ex-wife with BPD is this WE with her new girlfriend she met on a sex chat couple of months ago. We’ve been married 14 years, together for 22 years. 5 years ago she did the same and left me to live during 1 year with another woman before going back. Badly at this time I did not know about BPD.

So getting to the point: so in 5 years she went through totally messing up her life (moving out, 1st step of divorce, pain linked to our son in the middle of that) 3 times: to leave me 5 years ago and take an apartment and start divorce procedure (#1), to come back with me (#2) when we actually expat from France to US and now leaving me and back to France (#3). So now I know this is the BPD cycle and anyhow who can fall in love so intensely to wipe out his/her previous life 3 times in 5 years!

So is anybody tried to explain his/her pwBPD that all that is due to the sickness and let’s try to just skip one episode and get back to me without having to send all your furniture back to France and file divorce ? … all the more as this time when she will try to come back (& I’m pretty convinced she will), my door will be closed

[MindfulJavaJoe]

I think that this approach is fundamentaly flawed

Because couples counseling is based on the premise that both individuals are willing to discuss the issues and that both are willing to make changes.

When one person has BPD though, they aren't able to accept any blame. They aren't able to do any self evaluation. They don't have the skills to be compassionate or offer empathy, since they are so often in self defense mode that they can't take their eyes off their own internal pain. When a MC tries to work on communication skills, which they believe to be at the root of the couples problems, they miss the elephant in the room - the BPD sufferer's inability to accept any blame or responsibility. If the pwBPD can't see the need for change or accept their part in things, then how will change occur? It won't. It can't.


Why marriage counseling so often fails with BPD sufferers


Have a read through the comment made by Randi Kreger regarding higher functioning pwBPD:

1.   They strongly disavow having any problems, even tiny ones. Relationship difficulties, they say, are everyone else’s fault. If family members suggest they may have BPD, they almost always accuse the other person of having it instead.

2.   They refuse to seek help unless someone threatens to end the relationship. If they do go to counseling, they usually don’t intend to work on their own issues. In couples therapy, their goal is often to convince the therapist that they are being victimized.

3.   They cope with their pain by raging outward, blaming and accusing family members for real or imagined problems.

4.   They hide their low self-¬esteem behind a brash, confident pose that masks their inner turmoil. They usually function quite well at work and only display aggressive behavior toward those close to them. Family members say these people bring to mind Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.

5.   If they also have other mental disorders, they’re ones that also allow for high functioning, such as narcissistic personality disorder (NPD).


Workshop - BPD: What is it? How can I tell?

[beyondbelief]

I don't think telling her she has BPD or that her actions are driven by BPD would be a good idea.  She either will not believe you or will not care. 

I know you posted many times on the legal board.  Are you working with a L yet?

[MaybeSo]

I have been honest with my ex that I felt he had some combination of BPD/NPD. I v

Never discussed this in a name calling way, but with concern and sometimes with a normalized stance, the same as when we talk about his depression and anxiety. When I

was split white he was at times receptive and could see the pattern, when I was Split black, he hated me for it, this is used now to show how I persecuted him and if anything he takes the stance that I'm the crazy one, I am controlling and codep.  I started bringing it up when I felt certain this is what he suffered from and when I felt I had nothing to loose ... .I put it out there in the hope that one day if he has the label, and talks to the right therapist, he might get the right treatment. It's out of my hands now.

[newlife3]

 She may also be sorting out her sexual orientation issues: ie: is she gay & finding it difficult to accept herself, due to society's predjuices about this

Has she been formally diagnosed BPD?

As other's have noted on this thread, denial is a symptom of the illness. Blaming others, accusing the other partner of having BPD, inability to have empathy for the partner, not taking responsibility for problems and refusal to go to treatment is quite common.

Most skillful marital therapists over a period of time can spot a BPD's patterns and will often then recommend individual therapy.

As its a very difficult, complex diagnosis to make it takes time to observe the person.  Therapists can be fooled by a high functioning BPD.

Marsha Linehan the founder of DBT therapy for BPD, only just disclosed she was diagnosed in her teens. She's been in life long therapy...

[william3693]

About 1 year into our relationship things were still going well but some small things were starting to change.

She asked about that and I said that after a while the initial infatuation fades and then the couple has to start working

on the relationship.She said I DO NOT THINK I CAN DO THAT at that point if I would have known what I know

now I would have left the relationship.She said she had been  in counseling for two years after her 2nd husband left her for another woman.She said that what she had learned was that she should not be a people pleaser  and should worry about having her own needs met.She interpeted that as she should always get her own way

Most of her relationships have been at least 8 years  except the one that left her which lasted 4 years that one was

the "love of her life" which she has never recovered from. After she split she said She thought her other relationships would work out

also but they all turned out to be abusive.I said do really think I have ever been or would be emotionally abusive?She said no

I talked about a relationship having to have passion,commitment,and intimacy to survive. she said she thought she had that with me

 but now was confused whether she wanted to be with her x or myself.I said I had no question as to what I wanted and asked

if in her previous relationships she entered them a strong commitment to make them work.She called later and no she had not.

She said also she did not have that with either myself or her x and that working on a relationship was too hard.

At that point I knew at AN INTELLECTUAL LEVEl the relationship was over.who knows how long it takes to know it in your heart.

I guess the point I am making is the even when the relationship was still where she appeared to really want it to work and thought

she really loved me.Counseling was too hard.It was something that she did not think she could do.and even if she did want to do

it she did not have time or was worrying about some crisis and did not have time to even think about it.From what I have read they seem to only go into counseling when they get dumped and go into severe depression or have some kind spectular religous conversion

[Munch]

Allo Hi!

You can almost be certain she will try and come back again.  You are her safe haven!  Be careful FT, she knows how to manipulate.  My h is trying very hard to come back.   I am not receptive.  I told him that the only itty bitty chance he would have would be to see a T, get a diagnosis and come back in good shape.  I really don't think that can happen.  I have never said to him I think he has a mental illness.  I chose rather to tell him that he has issues that I can't deal with.  If you tell her she is BPD,  she will probably tell you that you are the one with BPD.  It just becomes another stupid argument.  You have to set up your boundaries and stick to them.   

You make the rules FT,  if she can't comply well then - these are the consequences. 

Bonne chance!  C'est pas dans le facile!

Munchxo

[2010]

So is anybody tried to explain his/her pwBPD that all that is due to the sickness and let’s try to just skip one episode and get back to me without having to send all your furniture back to France and file divorce ?

Your Wife is involved in BDSM, and you allow her the freedom to explore this lifestyle.  Is she submissive or dominant? If she is submissive, and she has been pulled in the direction of a dominant other than you- then you'll probably fear losing her to this Woman- but for the most part, the fantasy is short lived due to the yearning being eliminated.  Given time, the fantasy of submission becomes too much of a common reality of everyday life and the pull toward the fantasy and her ability to be valued loses its lustre.  I think you've seen this happen before and your Wife came through it after a feverish time. Borderline subjugation fantasies are internal and need to be re-worked in the physical sense so this "need" isn't going to go away if the other women goes away.  If your Wife is the dominant, then you are not dealing with BPD and are in NPD territory instead.

[MindfulJavaJoe]

I suspect but you would know.

If you want this recycling to stop will you need to set some new boundaries?

How would you set about doing this?

[Beach_Babe]

Ill take "No contact" for $400 Alex... .

[gettingoverit]

I did tell my ex that I thought she had BPD. I have to admit I was a schmuck about it. Our relationship had been over for about 4 weeks at this point, and I had just started to discover that she had 8-10 symptoms for BPD. I started reading this board and discovered that our story was errily similiar to other people's relationships. They confirmed what I had suspected. Well my ex was being this nasty b*tch to me one day and continued to lie to me on a daily basis. She made some comment about how she had no longer had any attachment to what I thought or felt, and I told her that of course she didn't because most people with BPD don't. Well of course in BPD fashion she accused me of having the illness. I told her that that was exactly what they said she would do. That shut her up pretty fast. To be honest, I regret doing it that way. I still loved her at that time and was just really hurt. I also don't think she took me seriously anyway, but I should not have done it that way. Poor judgement on my part.  :'(