Have you ever thought you may have BPD too?

[Depression = 72% of members]

As this long breakup drags out and we both go back and forth between NC and then sudden short burst of passion and then sudden NC... .all the hurtful things that are said on both ends, I can't help but wonder... .do I also suffer from this disorder?

I feel totally addicted to her, and it scares me practically to death.  I can't find one reason anymore that I should want her in my life.  She feels the same way about me.  And yet we're totally codependent and its very sad.  We are wasting eachother's lives. I don't truly believe I have BPD, but I am not making healthy or logical decisions and I feel totally out of control. 

[JohnThorn]

As this long breakup drags out and we both go back and forth between NC and then sudden short burst of passion and then sudden NC... .all the hurtful things that are said on both ends, I can't help but wonder... .do I also suffer from this disorder?

I feel totally addicted to her, and it scares me practically to death.  I can't find one reason anymore that I should want her in my life.  She feels the same way about me.  And yet we're totally codependent and its very sad.  We are wasting eachother's lives. I don't truly believe I have BPD, but I am not making healthy or logical decisions and I feel totally out of control. 

[Blimblam]

john,

seems like you have been self reflecting. Self reflecting doesn't seem very BPD like.  I for a while questioned if I was BPD myself.  I realize I was stuck in the fog and I was acting in ways I never had before in my life because I had tumbled down the rabbit hole into the wonderland that is the disorder and got lost.  Ruminating over these things can be very stressfull.  It is highly likely that you were in an abusive relationship and internalized a lot of the shaming and blaming projected upon you. You were most likely conditioned to believe you were the problem. I know I was.

I am sorry you are going through this experience. With time things become clearer.

Blim

[Tibbles]

So glad to read your question. I've been wondering the same thing myself. It was nice to read some one else asking themselves this scary question. The crazy choices I have been making to keep the relationship alive etc. As the whole process drags on I feel I've become more manipulative, less caring, mean. Very little I feel proud off. When I asked my adult children if I was becoming like their Dad they laughed and made it very clear I am nothing like him. It helped a lot. I guess I'm just running on empty and maybe you are too. 

[Lolster]

I think you just become so entrenched in 'reacting' to their behaviour that you do begin to question your own mind.  Once you remove yourself you can indeed reflect on that and see how you contributed to the cycle, but do remember that you had probably never before had the 'need' to react to such volatile behaviours.

Don't forget they tend to isolate you, and it then becomes more difficult to discuss the incidents rationally with a detached 3rd party.

I now keep friends involved in any new relationships so I have someone I consider sane & trustworthy to run things by, just in case I start to wonder "IS it me?"

[nolisan]

I think us "nons" starting to feel that we have BPD ourselves is normal.

What I have realized (almost 2 years NC than God) is that many of my shadow parts emerged - parts of me that I had repressed - both good and bad. My bright shadows: joyous and playful when things were good in the r/s and my darker shadows, fears of abandonment and rage, when they were bad.

Today I am grateful for her and the r/s - I have learned so much about myself.

Noles

[Loveofhislife]

I too have had these thoughts and agree with all posts in this thread. A fancy term I heard from T is transference and counter transference--I guess it's "boundary" training for therapists so they don't start taking on all the baggage patients bring to their door. My T will not work with pwBPD, as she has had bad experiences and is now an older lady with serious heart problems. In couples therapy, she said pwBPD are splitters and often go after the therapists themselves --the types of abuse we know so well. I also agree with the strategy of staying connected and reconnecting with friends and family--they are my only workable boundaries until I strengthen them through therapy and get stable myself. I'm having a very hard time emotionally and thought I too must have BPD. Instead, while I was transferring "the good" that I thought was helping him, he was projecting "the bad" he felt about himself I to me. Sadly, he was the better communicator, because I began to believe that I was an unlovable, unattractive, selfish, mean, and manipulative person. I'm not.

[Aussie JJ]

Been there done that... .

I spent 6 weeks trying to convince my psycologist that I had everything from BPD to NPD to ASPD and then went on to try and convince him I had a PD but unspecified.  There was that much I decided was wrong with me. 

Not many people with these disorders come forward and 'accept' the problem as being theirs.  It is shocking.  Mine when I confronted her said with evil eyes, "don't blame me I know I got all my problems from you!"  Then started listing the basic behaviours of BPD. 

I said so you got this through counter transferance?  She stopped dead and then went off at me.  I validated her for a bit before stopping and telling her she was an amazing person and I could understand how she felt, engulfed, suffocated and overwhelmed.  She then disassosiated like crazy and just starred at me. 

Then the sad little oppressed girl came out.  Instantly from angry ago crazy to persecuted victim. 

If you can say you feel this way and your trying to figure it out.  Its often because of counter transferance that you have taken these facets on.  You have been isolated, made essentially a gimp on a chain for that person to entertain them and now your set free back into the 'normal' world. 

You haven't lived in normal land for a long time and it all feels very weird. 

My P told me about an old patient he had with BPD that he spent 2 years getting to accept all the different parts and modifying their behaviours such as cutting and drink driving.  All the bad stuff he worked through with them and he thought they were ready to be told about BPD and start more intensive therapy.   He prepped this patient, got them to walk through the symptoms and basically say yes I do all of those things, think that way etc.  He then asked them if they wanted to work more on all of it because all of those things together were a very complex issue and asked if they would want to meet with another psycologist who specialised in that area, they could still see him once a week and meet with a group twice a week to work on these feelings.  They were really keen and the next week rocked up and went through it all again and then the patient said, look I have got a lot of problems from the psycologist,  he has BPD but thinks its me, I've been helping him.  This after 2 years they thought it was all the other person. 

Thing is, if you are aware of all of this stuff and can look at past relationships etc and say wow that didn't exist that time around.  It probably isn't you mate. 

Sorry to hurt you but you do t ha e BPD! 

[Popcorn71]

A year after the breakup I still question whether or not I am the one with BPD.  I know I don't have the problem, it was definately my xBPDh that caused the problems and displayed textbook BPD behaviour.  However, there remains a nagging little doubt.  I sometimes did things I'm not proud of and behaved unreasonably but much of this was a reaction to how I was being treated.

Reading these posts helps to remind me that I am not the 'problem person' I sometimes think I am.

Thanks

[Tausk]

When I asked my T if he though I had BPD he laughed at me.  But there's a very real NPD - BPD link for many of us.  

As opposed to a lack of self, I find that I have too much of a sense of a "false self" that I have cultivated over time.  

As I'm growing, the best way for me to look at myself and my recovery is from the perspective of a closet/vulnerable narcissist.  Again it is a wide spectrum, and am I sociopathic.  I no that I am not.  Do I try and take responsibility for my actions and try to make amends.  At least I try.  But I do realize that there's a lot of work for me.  The worst term to describe myself is "non" cuz I'm not a "non" in any sense of the word.  I was an active and voluntary partner in the destruction.

don't mean to hijack the thread.  I'll probably repost in inventory board when I get my thought a bit better organized.

Suggest the following articles:

www.blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/2013/08/26/23-signs-youre-secretly-a-narcissist-masquerading-as-a-sensitive-introvert/

or from  :)r. Drew at:

www.oprah.com/relationships/The-Narcissistic-Personality-Inventory-Dr-Drew-Pinsky/5


If this is the case, you may have a personality style that James F. Masterson calls the closet narcissist and Elsa Ronningstam identifies as the shy narcissist. Narcissists who fit this profile may actually be very focused on other people, but have difficulty giving others' feelings the same importance as their own. This kind of narcissist is very sensitive to criticism or slights from others and will respond with harsh self-criticism. They may seem humble or unassuming and avoid being the center of attention. They may also feel guilt or shame for their ambitions or accomplishments, although they may relentlessly pursue them without genuine regard for others. They may also hide their strivings or accomplishments for fear of triggering envy in others. Closet narcissists know envy well; they suffer intensely from it, even as they fiercely disavow it. They can be difficult to identify, because they're not arrogant and openly aggressive, but may manifest their narcissistic traits with overattentiveness and exceeding vulnerability. Nevertheless, such narcissists suffer from a lack of self-esteem and a deep sense of shame; their attentiveness should not be taken for empathy, as it's as difficult for them to connect emotionally as it is for the classic narcissist.

[BorisAcusio]

When I asked my T if he though I had BPD he laughed at me.  But there's a very real NPD - BPD link for many of us.  

As opposed to a lack of self, I find that I have too much of a sense of a "false self" that I have cultivated over time.  

As I'm growing, the best way for me to look at myself and my recovery is from the perspective of a closet/vulnerable narcissist.  Again it is a wide spectrum, and am I sociopathic.  I no that I am not.  :)o I try and take responsibility for my actions and try to make amends.  At least I try.  But I do realize that there's a lot of work for me.  The worst term to describe myself is "non" cuz I'm not a "non" in any sense of the word.  I was an active and voluntary partner in the destruction.

don't mean to hijack the thread.  I'll probably repost in inventory board when I get my thought a bit better organized.

Suggest the following articles:

www.blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/2013/08/26/23-signs-youre-secretly-a-narcissist-masquerading-as-a-sensitive-introvert/

or from  :)r. Drew at:

www.oprah.com/relationships/The-Narcissistic-Personality-Inventory-Dr-Drew-Pinsky/5


If this is the case, you may have a personality style that James F. Masterson calls the closet narcissist and Elsa Ronningstam identifies as the shy narcissist. Narcissists who fit this profile may actually be very focused on other people, but have difficulty giving others' feelings the same importance as their own. This kind of narcissist is very sensitive to criticism or slights from others and will respond with harsh self-criticism. They may seem humble or unassuming and avoid being the center of attention. They may also feel guilt or shame for their ambitions or accomplishments, although they may relentlessly pursue them without genuine regard for others. They may also hide their strivings or accomplishments for fear of triggering envy in others. Closet narcissists know envy well; they suffer intensely from it, even as they fiercely disavow it. They can be difficult to identify, because they're not arrogant and openly aggressive, but may manifest their narcissistic traits with overattentiveness and exceeding vulnerability. Nevertheless, such narcissists suffer from a lack of self-esteem and a deep sense of shame; their attentiveness should not be taken for empathy, as it's as difficult for them to connect emotionally as it is for the classic narcissist.

It was suggested recently that the vulnerable narcissism would be classified as a subtype of Borderline Personality Disorder while completely eliminating the NPD as a separate diagnosis.

Vulnerable narcissism, a construct that has received the least empirical attention of this group, manifested a (Miller, Dir, Gentile, et al.) nomological network that was nearly identical to BPD’s ‘‘net.’’ The similarity scores for vulnerable narcissism and BPD across the correlates was .93, suggesting nearly identical patterns of correlates between these two VDT constructs and important criterion variables.

The two seem to diverge primarily on the degree of impulse control problems and environmental injury (both higher in BPD); possibly as a result of these differences, vulnerable narcissism is not as strongly linked to the externalizing behaviors often associated with BPD (e.g., substance use, aggression). The overlap between these constructs has been noted previously (e.g., Pincus et al., 2009), and some have suggested that shame and guilt play a primary role in both (e.g., Hendin & Cheek,

1997; Rusch et al., 2007). In the current study, both constructs displayed a significant relation with the trait self-consciousness, which is related to shame and embarrassment (Costa & McCrae, 1992), although vulnerable narcissism manifested a significantly stronger correlation. Given the high degree of overlap between these two constructs, it is not entirely clear whether vulnerable narcissism warrants its own place as a fully independent PD construct (or subtype of NPD), as has been argued elsewhere (i.e., Miller & Campbell, 2008; PDM Task Force, 2006), or whether it should be seen as a part of the BPD construct.

www.medscape.com/viewarticle/776854_2

In the first drafts of the Chapter on Personality Disorders, narcissistic personality disorder had not been retained among the specific personality disorder types to be included in DSM-5

... .

On the basis of a review of the pertinent literature of the last 12 years, Alarcón and Sarabia[14] take a different stance from the preceding author. According to these authors, narcissistic personality disorder is rare when compared with other personality disorders, clinical descriptions of the condition vary within a wide range of descriptors, and comorbidity with many Axes I and II conditions is frequent. They conclude that narcissistic personality disorder shows nosological inconsistency and that it should be considered as a trait domain instead of as a type or disorder.

A similar position has been taken by Karteruda.[15] The results of a study involving 2277 patients, 80% of whom had a personality disorder, have led the authors to challenge the notion of narcissistic personality disorder as a distinct diagnostic category. They conclude that their data justify the deletion of narcissistic personality disorder as a distinct category from DSM-5.

There are huge changes on the way.

[woofhound]

"Was it you?

Was it me?

Did I watch too much TV?

Is that a hint of accusation in your eye?

What have we done?

Maggie, what have we done?

Should we shout?

Should we scream?

What happened to our post war dream?

Oh, Maggie, Maggie what have we done?"

These lyrics by Pink Floyd jumped into my head.

I too have questioned if I may have BPD. In fact, during the last 3 or 4 months of the relationship my ex uBPD began to tell me she thought I had BPD. Projection? Possibly... .Truth? Could be.

In response to these accusations I began to explore what a typical pwBPD's response might be to being accused. After extensive research I began to realize that, perhaps, she had a problem. Further still into my research, I began to understand that I have been self aware throughout most of my life about my own shortcomings and have always been a progressive person. In other words, whenever I identify a problem within myself (emotional or spiritual) I always intuitively begin seeking answers as to why it exists an how to correct the problem with hopes of improving myself. Therein lies the difference in a BPD and a NON.

When presented with a problem a normal person will begin to explore the depths of his mind and consciously seek out solutions within HIMSELF. A BPD, from my understanding and experience with a suspected BPD ex, will seek to but blame solely on someone else. I found myself at fault for every emotional disturbance throughout our time together... .I have always been hard on myself, often blaming myself for things that were undeserved, but on the other hand, I too have blamed others for my actions. It is in understanding our mistakes and gaining a true grasp on the reality of the situation that we can allow ourselves to progress emotionally mentally so as not to make the same mistakes again.

[myself]

There was so much projecting going on in so many of these relationships, it's no wonder some of us have felt we relate to/take on aspects of their disorder. Lost in FOG. They said it was us, not them, didn't they?

Asking the question is one thing. Seeking real answers is another. We do have choices, and it's up to us to make the best of them.

How to figure this out? Look within. Work on yourself. Whatever's in there, it's most likely not BPD, but is something you can reach a better understanding of. Focusing on not doubting ourselves is really key here.

[Loveofhislife]

So to dumb this down a bit--helps me to wrap my head around this: I'm going to over simplify. We are different sides of the same coin: the bfBPD and I. We suffered similar childhoods, but we made different choices and have utilized different coping skills. All of the emotions I deemed as "bad" I severed from myself. I am freakin Snow White by most people's standards. Altruistic? Absolutely! All of the feelings I severed from myself, bfBPD manifests verbally and behaviorally every minute we are together. I am bored and empty and lethargic without BPD/NPD in my life. I've heard this called "inverted narcissism." This makes a lot of sense to me. I can't feel alive without them, and they can't feel alive without us. But I feel and I hurt for others; I am very self reflective; I am hyper vigilant about the feelings of others. I am a compulsive people pleaser. I am a co-dependent who has spent the last year enabling and rescuing a person who delights in making me miserable. It truly has been a dance maccabre.

[camuse]

Yes I have wondered but loveofhislife explains it perfectly!  When we split she actually admitted she was happiest when I was in turmoil and she hated herself for it. I'm damaged in a very similar way but I'm also the opposite of her - what a loaded bond!

[Tausk]

When I asked my T if he though I had BPD he laughed at me.  But there's a very real NPD - BPD link for many of us.  

As opposed to a lack of self, I find that I have too much of a sense of a "false self" that I have cultivated over time.  

As I'm growing, the best way for me to look at myself and my recovery is from the perspective of a closet/vulnerable narcissist.  Again it is a wide spectrum, and am I sociopathic.  I no that I am not.  :)o I try and take responsibility for my actions and try to make amends.  At least I try.  But I do realize that there's a lot of work for me.  The worst term to describe myself is "non" cuz I'm not a "non" in any sense of the word.  I was an active and voluntary partner in the destruction.

don't mean to hijack the thread.  I'll probably repost in inventory board when I get my thought a bit better organized.

Suggest the following articles:

www.blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/2013/08/26/23-signs-youre-secretly-a-narcissist-masquerading-as-a-sensitive-introvert/

or from  :)r. Drew at:

www.oprah.com/relationships/The-Narcissistic-Personality-Inventory-Dr-Drew-Pinsky/5


If this is the case, you may have a personality style that James F. Masterson calls the closet narcissist and Elsa Ronningstam identifies as the shy narcissist. Narcissists who fit this profile may actually be very focused on other people, but have difficulty giving others' feelings the same importance as their own. This kind of narcissist is very sensitive to criticism or slights from others and will respond with harsh self-criticism. They may seem humble or unassuming and avoid being the center of attention. They may also feel guilt or shame for their ambitions or accomplishments, although they may relentlessly pursue them without genuine regard for others. They may also hide their strivings or accomplishments for fear of triggering envy in others. Closet narcissists know envy well; they suffer intensely from it, even as they fiercely disavow it. They can be difficult to identify, because they're not arrogant and openly aggressive, but may manifest their narcissistic traits with overattentiveness and exceeding vulnerability. Nevertheless, such narcissists suffer from a lack of self-esteem and a deep sense of shame; their attentiveness should not be taken for empathy, as it's as difficult for them to connect emotionally as it is for the classic narcissist.

It was suggested recently that the vulnerable narcissism would be classified as a subtype of Borderline Personality Disorder while completely eliminating the NPD as a separate diagnosis.

Vulnerable narcissism, a construct that has received the least empirical attention of this group, manifested a (Miller, Dir, Gentile, et al.) nomological network that was nearly identical to BPD’s ‘‘net.’’ The similarity scores for vulnerable narcissism and BPD across the correlates was .93, suggesting nearly identical patterns of correlates between these two VDT constructs and important criterion variables.

The two seem to diverge primarily on the degree of impulse control problems and environmental injury (both higher in BPD); possibly as a result of these differences, vulnerable narcissism is not as strongly linked to the externalizing behaviors often associated with BPD (e.g., substance use, aggression). The overlap between these constructs has been noted previously (e.g., Pincus et al., 2009), and some have suggested that shame and guilt play a primary role in both (e.g., Hendin & Cheek,

1997; Rusch et al., 2007). In the current study, both constructs displayed a significant relation with the trait self-consciousness, which is related to shame and embarrassment (Costa & McCrae, 1992), although vulnerable narcissism manifested a significantly stronger correlation. Given the high degree of overlap between these two constructs, it is not entirely clear whether vulnerable narcissism warrants its own place as a fully independent PD construct (or subtype of NPD), as has been argued elsewhere (i.e., Miller & Campbell, 2008; PDM Task Force, 2006), or whether it should be seen as a part of the BPD construct.

www.medscape.com/viewarticle/776854_2

In the first drafts of the Chapter on Personality Disorders, narcissistic personality disorder had not been retained among the specific personality disorder types to be included in DSM-5

... .

On the basis of a review of the pertinent literature of the last 12 years, Alarcón and Sarabia[14] take a different stance from the preceding author. According to these authors, narcissistic personality disorder is rare when compared with other personality disorders, clinical descriptions of the condition vary within a wide range of descriptors, and comorbidity with many Axes I and II conditions is frequent. They conclude that narcissistic personality disorder shows nosological inconsistency and that it should be considered as a trait domain instead of as a type or disorder.

A similar position has been taken by Karteruda.[15] The results of a study involving 2277 patients, 80% of whom had a personality disorder, have led the authors to challenge the notion of narcissistic personality disorder as a distinct diagnostic category. They conclude that their data justify the deletion of narcissistic personality disorder as a distinct category from DSM-5.

There are huge changes on the way.

I don't understand.  :)SM-5 included NPD primarily because clinicians objected to its removal. So, if huge changes are on the way, they are at least are a decade away then.  There a many articles that go back and forth, I can cite dozens of commentaries that objected to the proposed removal of NPD.  And yes, there's academic and clinical differences in the identification of the Disorders, but all I can use in my practice are the ICD and DSM codes that are currently available.

But regardless, I'm not understanding how this helps me detach.  Are you saying that NPD and BPD are the same.  There's one school of thought that states this, but it's considered a minority.  And the proposed removal of NPD was not because NPD and BPD are considered the same, it's because there are so many comorbid symptoms that classifications were considered too narrow. 

IMHO.  NPD versus BPD... .It's the difference between a child who gets the spoon pick-ed up for him endless versus the child who never gets the spoon pick-ed up for him.  Or the one who is breast fed until they are seven versus the one who is never breast fed and often goes hungry.  Or the child who is held whenever he cries versus the once that is never held and comforted even when sick.

Yes, the behaviors can be similar in adults because they are shame based but the root source of the shame is different.  

I don't see any pwBPD actually changing. I'm definitely on the spectrum of closet NPD.  And I know I've changed.  There's one school of thought that believes that NPD can be treated but BPD cannot.  I'm kinda in this corner.

But even if NPD/BPD are the same, I'm not sure how acceptance of this concept can help me to depersonalize and detach from the interaction?  

Can you elaborate Boris?  

[Aussie JJ]

Hmmmm,

I am not an academic, I have only started looking into this in depth because of finding out about my issues.  Some patterns I can see between the two women in my life that have played a part in getting me here. 

My mother (closet NPD)

I love you means, you do what I say, obey my commands. 

work / direction decisions.  VERY straight and narrow.  She chooses a field where she can be better than everyone else, people move on from around her and if they don't meet her standard they are incompetent.  She will work in a place where she is the best, even when a temp worker and people around her are constantly telling her how good she is and how she makes the place run. 

Personal life.  CONTROLLING CONTROLLING CONTROLLING.  Only gives up control to shoot the other person down. 

My exGF (high functioning BPD)

I love you means, my emotional means are met, I'm in a happy place. 

work / directions, decisions.  VERY temperamental.  She will choose something new and shinny and run with it, always something acting as a caretaker.  Child care worker, Research into sexual assault, psychologist, Speech pathologist.  ALWAYS a care taker. 

Personal life, we all know about that. 




They may be similar, and I have a very narrow point of view.  Different things hurt them as well in different ways.  NPD, their view isn't acceptable to you, they are correct every time.  BPD, it builds up, its all good then snap, all bad. 

[Blimblam]

After more contemplation I realize I probably have closet and altruistic narcisistic tendencies. 

[Aussie JJ]

BB,

All of us have a little BP/NP/HP/ASP/SP bloody everything in us.  It's if it dictates our live's.  I am very narcissistic in my defence of myself when I am put in my place, particularly everything all at once like my exBPD did.  I was just going, no I didn't do that (and I didn't, she did) but getting very uppish about it telling her what I did do and how it was the correct thing to do. 

I also shutdown a bit and lack empathy when placed in those situations.  I can see that, it isn't healthy.  So, I'm changing it, does it make me a narc, well, the fact that I'm questioning myself probably indicates that I am not a narc.  The fact I recognise these problems and I can look back after doing something wrong and feel back for it indicates I am not a narc.  I do have that defence mechanism inbuilt in me from my mother though.  It's a survival mechanism that was taught to me by my mother.  Now I'm changing it. 

I am standing by the fact that I can't label myself any more, I pay my P to do that and he says apart from GAD and some symptoms of PTSD, he is 50/50 on that one I am normal.  Very passive with communication but healthy/regular/standard person personality wise. 

[JohnLove]

BB,

All of us have a little BP/NP/HP/ASP/SP bloody everything in us.  It's if it dictates our live's.  I am very narcissistic in my defence of myself when I am put in my place, particularly everything all at once like my exBPD did.  I was just going, no I didn't do that (and I didn't, she did) but getting very uppish about it telling her what I did do and how it was the correct thing to do.  

I also shutdown a bit and lack empathy when placed in those situations.  I can see that, it isn't healthy.  So, I'm changing it, does it make me a narc, well, the fact that I'm questioning myself probably indicates that I am not a narc.  The fact I recognise these problems and I can look back after doing something wrong and feel back for it indicates I am not a narc.  I do have that defence mechanism inbuilt in me from my mother though.  It's a survival mechanism that was taught to me by my mother.  Now I'm changing it.  

I am standing by the fact that I can't label myself any more, I pay my P to do that and he says apart from GAD and some symptoms of PTSD, he is 50/50 on that one I am normal.  Very passive with communication but healthy/regular/standard person personality wise.  

Hi Aussie JJ. I am in Australia and my nickname (real) is the same as yours. I can relate VERY closely to your post. I have had thoughts I might have BPD but I reckon just having the ability to ask yourself that question precludes you. Are you me?.

Seriously though when are personality quirks and character going to be classified as a personality disorder?... .as long as they are not negative in the sense they are harmful or too self limiting or impact others, then what th'?. What the heck is the definition of "normal" anyway... .I've never seen it or had someone define it.

It's what makes life and people interesting. Although I am all for self improvement I wonder if the mental health "experts" want everyone to model the exact same behaviour... .like clones?.

How is that ever going to work?.

[Aussie JJ]

The classic BPD book for all of us.  SWOE... .

If we break it down that every single human being on earth is a egg.  That is us as a object, their are free range, cage and even quail eggs.  :)ifferent shapes and sizes just as people.  

When looking at us all as eggs that exterior shell is our make up that we get from our parents, our life so far.  It is our defense mechanism that is built up to protect our personality, our very core being.  Inside behind those shells their are many different yolks etc.  Healthy people have solid shells with well developed yolks.  

People with PD's particulary cluster B from what I read have a very very thin shell.  Their defence mechanisms are not built up and behind those defence mechanisms their personality, their emotional growth is stunted.  They act out more, their shells cracks a lot quicker exposing that immature emotionally stunted child.  

They attach to someone with a strong shell, they take on that shell as their own to provide protection from their own emotions, their own flaws.  Over time however they pull it down, bit by bit ripping apart all of your defence mechanisms until they no longer work.  They never did work as BPDs don't relate on that level, all that happened earlier on was they suppressed their emotions so they were not rejected.  

Now they have torn your defence mechanisms down  they tear you apart.  :)estroy you to justify their own emotions that they are expressing freely now that your defence mechanisms are down.  

See all people, when objectified as eggs are much the same.  Its just a good egg or a bad egg.  BPD's are some pretty messed up eggs, so messed up they cant relate to other eggs ^^

[woofhound]

That's a pretty good analogy.

Unfortunately, some eggs go through life trying to crack other eggs... .They only care about maintaining their own thin shell, so the hurt other people so they can feel in control. Their shells often seem strong, but if you shine your light through it to see inside to the yolk... .You can tell they've turned green. The crazy thing is, as I got closer to seeing my exuBPD the more intensely mean, disrespectful, hateful, etc she became.

[Rescuseme]

Wow fantastic loveofhislife I couldn't have written it better! The more I think back to my own relationship and why I can't get over it is because not only did I lose my partner but literarily I lost half of myself.  My shadow.  Apart from both having low self-esteem on every issue she was the opposite of me.  But these opposites meant that I came alive in away that I have never felt before. Suddenly I seemed to have a full set of emotions that I was never allowed as a child. I felt joy, excitement and real deep pain.  But now I only have a small range of emotions to full back upon.  But because I am capable of self-reflection (I do this too much) change is possible so I can grow and become more authentic and whole as a person.