Found out tonight she's with someone else

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Yup.

And I can think it what a heartless sl*t.

She's turning 35 in June. He's 27.

I say what the hell is that cause she was always telling me how she's ready for a child and to build a life.

I feel some anger tonight. But also think in the end it helps me move on.

Just a bit dazed from the news which I found out through checking her email.

[fakename]

Yup.

And I can think it what a heartless sl*t.

She's turning 35 in June. He's 27.

I say what the hell is that cause she was always telling me how she's ready for a child and to build a life.

I feel some anger tonight. But also think in the end it helps me move on.

Just a bit dazed from the news which I found out through checking her email.

[Clearmind]

Sorry to hear that FN – we could read a lot into it but its fairly simple – she needs someone to mirror and whether he’s 27 or 72 this is his purpose.

I can understand your anger – you are most likely extremely hurt and the anger is masking it right now. Cry – let it out!

My partner found a new special someone the night after he moved out. Its common.

Where to from here FN?

[daze]

Hey, Fakename,

I'm sorry for your pain.  Like you say, this might be what it takes to help you move on.  Still it's a bitter pill.

Keep posting.

Daze

[recoil]

I'm sorry man.  I feel mine has moved on as well but it's unconfirmed at this point.  Let's accept it and move along.  Let's hope they are happier next go round -- and let's hope we are too.

[doubleAries]

Sorry for your pain, fakename. I know how it feels. It's awful.

Here's an article that helped me a lot with this issue. Maybe not quite yet for you, but hold onto it--in a few days it could be REALLY useful What are the ten anger styles?

Clearmind has asked the appropriate question... .  where to from here? You don't have to make up your mind this instant, obviously. But like someone important to me once said "anger is a mask for fear". It's true. While the anger feels safer, a good defense, the pain is still there, and will continue to be there until you express it. Might as well get to it sooner rather than later.

I'm sorry you are enduring this.

doubleAries

[findingmyselfagain]

FN,

Sorry to hear that. Rebounding seems to be very common. PwBPDs fear being alone, but they also fear intimacy... .  which accounts for the stormy r/s's. We deserve much better, don't we? I was deeply in love with mine, but have to face that she wasn't healthy for me, and I wasn't for her either.

[fakename]

hey guys, thanks for the support. it helps

i figure she chose 27 cause he'd be easier to manipulate and make herself out to be a victim... .  

it's not like i'm boiling angry, or really sad... .  i guess it's maybe numbness i feel right now.

cause i told myself that there have already been more than enough guys, i think around 5-6 since she met me, i have to have respect for myself and not take her back if she does come. so i guess the fact that "it's finally over" is sinking in?

i dont know.


i think its agitating and annoying. i know my nerves may be a bit uneasy in the coming days, as they are now at least... .  annoyed... .  

but it serves as a good reminder of what i was to her and the type of person she is.

and i cant help but think of her as a heartless b*tch

it also bothers me cause i was being hopeful. hope is such a powerful thing.  i think i need to be more choosy in who i put my faith and hope in eh?

ahhhh god d@mnit.

[fakename]

i'm really disappointed.

but, i'm glad i worked out today. i have that to feel good about. and tomorrow i'm going rock climbing with a friend.

the support you guys give is really helpful, and i appreciate it. if i didn't find this site a week ago, i dont know where or how i would be feeling today.  to those of you i've shared threads with, i've learned a lot from you guys. and i'm grateful.

gonna watch a movie and go to sleep, thinking about how i should be relieved that i'm trying to learn to stand up for my boundaries and what i will and won't accept.

thank you

[doubleAries]

hey, I hear ya.

Only you can decide if this is something you are willing to forgive or not. And I think it's probably safe to say that she isn't doing to you. It's about herself.

And I understand the numbness. After 18 years with a bipolar husband who has ASPD and NPD as well, I can hardly tell what I feel anymore. Not a good sign... .  

We are currently seperated but own a business together and have to work together every day. About the time I think "that's it, I've had enough" he does something that shows he does care about me. Then when I start thinking "well, maybe... .  " he does something to show me that he's pretty much wrapped up in his own world of mental illness. I start thinking "why am I trying to have an intimate relationship with someone with a serious mental illness?" And that's where this thing just keeps leading back to. Myself. And my values and boundaries. And what I should or shouldn't do when they are violated.

So welcome aboard. We're here for you, and we really do understand. None of us are glad others are going through this, but it IS good to know we aren't alone, and that there are people who truly understand that we can reach out to. You don't have to deal with this completely alone.  

[daze]

Agitated and annoyed are other words to describe anger - so my T tells me because I have a hard time naming emotions.

Of course, you are angry. You have put a lot of time and effort into the relationship. You have loved her and put up with a lot.  Plus, for some people (myself included) it's easier to feel and express anger than to express sadness, hurt, and fear, which make us feel vulnerable.

Anyway, experience your feelings. I find that naming them helps me. You have talked in other threads about what you want in life, your values, and everything.  Remember your values.

[arabella]

aw, I hear you fakename! That just sucks. I've been in that situation myself and it's horrid. 

Perhaps you're in a bit of shock still? I always get the numbing out first and then the anger, fear, hurt, and crying follow a little later on (they sort of cycle for me). Please keep us updated so you have support as you sort through this new phase - whatever you chose to do.

Glad to hear you are taking care of yourself and have plans with friends. We're here for you too!

[fakename]

I think I'm really hurt. Woke up at 2am thinking of her and 1.5 hours later still doing the same. Thinking about the things they may do together.

They also already signed up for 10 classes of crossfit together. They met last Wednesday. She emailed me on Thursday - I wonder if that was her way of saying one chance before I go out and do whatever. I don't understand how she can do that.

I wish she tried harder with me.

I keep trying to tell myself she doesn't allow herself to be happy so they're gonna have the same problems we had. But then I see how she's keeping active and productive and maybe he's good for her.

I hate that I even still consider taking her back. No, we're not together but I'm not going around sleeping with anyone so soon. I think the thing that bothers me most is that she'll go and do whatever and then still contact me in time. It'd be better if she just let me move on. That's what bothers me - when's the next time she's gonna reach out after being intimate with others

[wanttoknowmore]

Fakename, I understand what you are feeling as hundreds on this board have faced this type of nightmare with a pwBPD. The feelings you are having are usual and legitimate as you have been hurt badly and your trust was shattered to pieces. She is contacting you to see if she still has control over you. She is not about love,she is about control. It is the nature of her illness.

This type of behavior... .  dropping one and immediately,picking another ,is not

uncommon in pwBPD. As intimacy grows with the new man, most likely,he is go through tha same pain you are going through. These cycles repeat until the pwBPD finally,fets understanding,insight and therapy .

With experience of others who faced it, I know that this pain will get better each day,though it will go in abbs and flow(up and down) Please read these boards and ask questions to experiences pwBPD victims who were able to overcome through various tecniques and tools and are finally,at a peaceful and calmer place. Best wishes.

[slimmiller]

Sorry to hear man!

As some here mentioned, her behaviour is all too familiar to many of us here... .  Keep active as you have, and move forward as well as you can, one day at a time. For me it was one hour at a time at times.

As for it being a younger guy, try not to get too bummed out about it. In my case I was 39, she was 32 and 'he' was 25. Her latest is I believe 22 or 23 foreign exchange student. Yeah sick huh.

Remember, its not about you. The relationship never was. It was all about her all along. Always was and always will be. They have almost zero capability of feeling anything real or having empathy. If it does creep into their life through you, they will attack you for it

[arabella]

They also already signed up for 10 classes of crossfit together. They met last Wednesday. She emailed me on Thursday - I wonder if that was her way of saying one chance before I go out and do whatever. I don't understand how she can do that.

... .  

I keep trying to tell myself she doesn't allow herself to be happy so they're gonna have the same problems we had. But then I see how she's keeping active and productive and maybe he's good for her.

She's just mirroring him. She isn't "active and productive" on her own, she's just tagging along on someone else's life for as long as this one lasts. She's desperate for approval. YOU, on the other hand, have your OWN life to lead and the reason you don't just jump right into the next r/s (or overlap them as so many psBPD do) is because you are mentally healthy and you know you need to time to adjust. You're right, she is going to take the exact same problems into this next r/s. It's a sad, and ultimately very lonely, way to live.

[fakename]

thank you all for writing.

so, i really, really wanted to cancel going rock climbing with my friend and just stay home, but i know that isn't productive behavior and i'll get some good out of it, so i'm going to force myself to go.

i was checking her facebook today and she's been posting stuff from eckhart tolle's stillness speaks, (today about emotional pain-the need to be right and wrong) and i guess that bothers me cause it makes me think maybe she finally got her act together... .  

it also bothers me that she switched her facebook pic and her match.com pics to a picture that i had taken. dont get why you would do that. so manipulative.

i dont know... today, i'm hating that girl

[Vindi]

i feel for you, She is just recycling and will soon find out the honeymoon with this guys will be over, in a matter of time, and then she has to deal w/the relationship. She probably likes the newness, but she is certainly just running from her issues.Remember Karma, it will bite her back somehow someway in time.

Pls keep busy doing things, even if you don't feel like doing anything, just do something, you will still need time to feel the pain and it will take time, maybe "hide" her from your facebook so you don't see any posts or even better delete her from your friends.

Giving you support on this new path that you are on.

[fakename]

so i kept on with my plans to go rock climbing even though i didn't want to. but i'm glad i went.

in the beginning it was a little rough, i was in a daze, and i was right off thinking if its hard for me to be around others, i dont get how she can so easily do so. let alone be intimate with someone else.

however, i enjoyed my climbing, and didn't care how she was spending her time, rather than usually obsessing over that.

still feel numb/angry/hatred, but its subdued. i want to move on, and am doing so, but still know that i would be vulnerable if she came back., even though she doesnt offer me what i want, or what i think i deserve. and i dont want to have an unhappy r/s for the rest of my life.

[RedCandle]

Fakename, if you go LOOKING for pain... .  you are surely going to find it... .  

And you did.

I would STRONGLY encourage you to STOP checking her email and STOP looking at her Facebook.

For one thing... .  should she find out you are accessing her email, that can bring some serious consequences over privacy issues. For another... .  this is only going to seriously hamper and delay YOUR healing.

For YOU... .  I hope you will stop looking through her electronic life.

[fakename]

Red candle,

You raise good points. I'll stop stalking her beginning tonight.

[doubleAries]

This is an interesting site I came across recently. www.ehow.com/how_8119881_overcome-love-obsessions.html    There was a time in my life this was definitley an issue--it isn't right now. But the opening to this article is still worth memorizing: Before you can overcome a love obsession you first have to recognize that you are indeed obsessed with the person who you believe you love. Love is engaging and gratifying, while obsession is overwhelming and draining. Love allows you to be seen for who you are and still be accepted, obsession causes you to see character traits that are not there and makes you think you have found perfection. Love allows a relationship to grow and strengthen, obsession creates an intense feeling to form a premature commitment. When you love you become a lover, when you obsess you can become a stalker.

That said, I don't think you should try to eliminate your anger completely. Anger is a useful tool. It is a signal that all is not well. It is proof that you have self respect and minimum standards of treatment (boundaries/values). But it shouldn't control you. You want to resolve the problem, not just simply express your anger. And often believing we are out of line for feeling anger at all is what leads us to banish our boundaries/values and minimum standards of treatment for ourselves.

You SHOULD be angry at being treated so callously. But it's still about the problem--not just the anger. Your anger is not going to change your S/O. She has a mental illness. You are angry at her for not "overcoming" it for your sake. I know--I'm in the same boat. My husband has bipolar, and ASPD/NPD. I have spent 18 years crushed and resentful that he is incapable of the genuine and sincere emotional interaction required in an intimate relationship. Let me tell you how much good that has done---ZERO. All my hurt and anger STILL hasn't caused him to be capable.

What it HAS done is forced me to finally look at myself and ask myself honestly why I am looking for validation of myself from someone incapable of giving it. Apparently I'm not as capable of the same exact thing as I thought I was. Seriously, why don't I just head down to the nursing home and pick out an old man who has had numerous strokes and is incapable of even speaking and try to have an intimate relationship with him? And sing woe-is-me because he won't communicate on a meaningful level? Hasn't my adoration and sacrifice been enough? How could he be so selfish?   I'm only partly joking here. You can't pour milk out of an orange juice bottle. And being frustrated by it doesn't change it one bit.

You either have to leave and find someone capable of what you say you are looking for in a relationship, or accept the person you are with and adapt in a way that doesn't compromise your self worth, values, and boundaries. If you are secure in your own emotions, she can't yank the rug out from under you. And there is nothing at all wrong with minimum standards of treatment. There is nothing wrong with saying "here is what I cannot/will not tolerate, and if you cross that line, this is what the consequence will be" and then sticking to it.

If she has badly hurt you (and I understand completely why--infidelity is unacceptable), why are you vulnerable to taking her back? This isn't about her anymore--now it's about you. Why is this so painful, yet apparently acceptable?

[fakename]

hey doublearies.

what you wrote is interesting, and i'm just going to reply with the first thoughts in my mind. i think thats the only way i can, rather than always trying to rationalize things or look at things from her perspective or trying to understand... .  i'd like someone to understand me for once

i dont know if i agree with the love/obsession quote you pointed out entirely... .  

i know i am acting obsessed right now, but i did love that girl and did accept her for all her flaws. i tried to allow the relationship to grow and strengthen by always forgiving her and working to make things better. so why am i stalking and obsessing right now? i dont know. maybe cause i want to know what she's up to, to see if she's going to come back any time soon and so i know how to respond. i believe in research.

i know my anger won't change my ex... .  and i know she has a mental illness, but how is it that she didn't cheat on her previous bf, but she cheats on me, the guy who stuck through all the bad times with her. she knows what she wants and she knows who she wants to use. i'm angry that she didnt put in a stronger effort. how hard is it to not lie or cheat when its something we talked about so many times, and when i've forgiven her for so many bad things, and told her to just be open with me so we can figure things out.

your 4th paragraph makes perfect sense. but common, there can't be a balance? like, sure berate me, blame me for everything, and yell at me whenever you want, and we can do whatever you want, you can make most the choices. thats all fine. but you can't just balance it out by not lying and cheating? i cant even get that much?

the reason we broke up, is because i'm finally sticking up for myself when i always say i cant deal with any more lying or cheating.  and now we're in the position that we're in... .  havent talked since feb 4th, except an email she sent me on the 21st about taking chantix (no mention of her being wrong for lying and going on a date)... .  and during our period of NC, she has gotten rejected by 3 different guys (which makes me feel like she will be contacting me sometime soon (but she's watching her sister's kids this weekend, and next weekend if going away for a meditation retreat so i'm sure she's thinking that she at least has her weekends occupied to not contact me, but the weekdays are painful for her to be alone)


i dont know why i am vulnerable to taking her back... .  i just really dont know. maybe cause i dont want to give up. maybe cause i do believe that there is more to her than this disorder... .  maybe i'm just horny for her.

i dont know

[doubleAries]

fakename, I read your reply 3 times. Something stands out strongly to me--like, sure berate me, blame me for everything, and yell at me whenever you want, and we can do whatever you want, you can make most the choices. thats all fine. but you can't just balance it out by not lying and cheating? i cant even get that much?

I know typing changes things--the tone and context get lost. I'm not trying to be harsh on you at all. Because I commiserate, I really do. But seriously, this doesn't sound healthy. Being treated this way is NOT fine. Here are a couple of articles that can help start you on a new way of viewing yorself Co-dependency: When Our Emotional Issues Affect Our True Availability and Boundaries Tools of Respect

What also stands out is that you say you understand she has a mental illness, then you go one to enumerate the things that PROVE that point but are baffling you as to why she would act this way. Those ARE the mental illness symptoms. And that was my point before--is this behavior really "fine" with you? It doesn't sound like it. And it shouldn't be.

Just because she has a mental illness doesn't mean you therefore must erase all your self respect, self value, and boundaries. That's not what "compromise" means. It doesn't mean turning yourself into a doormat and then being surprised when you are treated like a doormat.

Again, I'm not trying to critisize you--this is an important lesson I myself am learning. I need to hear at as much as you or anybody else. For 18 years, I have expected my mentally ill husband to be grateful because I have allowed him to treat me any shoddy way he would like to, that i have made myself into his whipping post, the one person he can always count on to take all his frustartions out on. It hasn't worked out very well for me. And it doesn't sound like it's worked out real well for you either.

This doesn't mean we should become cruel dictators. Passive-aggressive behavior isn't the answer. Learning to become healthy and assertive IS. And it starts with enumerating our values, and then erecting boundaries of protection around those values. And caring enough about ourselves to stick to the consequences we have attached to those boundaries.

I KNOW it's hard. It's not like I'm filled with self hatred--no, I'm not important enough for that! Not even worthy of my own hatred. I'm filled with self-apathy. That's why it's OK for others to heap their hatred on me. Here's a question I've asked myself: Why do I value suffering? Consciously I don't think I do value suffering. But apparently unconsciously I do. Because if I'm honest with myself, I see that I persue it, prolong it, and tolerate it endlessly. Why? Because I don't value myself. And if I don't value myself, I have no need of boundaries to protect myself. I'll just eat anything someone else dishes out. As long as it's cruel. Because people that don't value themselves don't seek out people that treat them with respect.

Just something to think about... .  

doubleAries

[Spinning1227]

This thread has resonated with me.  FN I've been going through a very similar situation and a very similar prolonged relationship.  My wife is having an affair with a younger man (very undesireable by just about anyone's standards).  She's been walking out on a regular basis on me and the kids.  But she keeps coming back.  Not for me, she doesn't want to be married anymore, but because our lifestyle dictates that she has to be here at times for the kids.  Generally when I'm home she picks up and leaves.  The absolute callousness seems to be the hardest thing for me to deal with.  How can a person be causing so much pain in the lives of her family and not even seem to care?  It's tough, really tough.  I think I've gotten to the point where I'm beginning to accept that there is no future for our marriage.  But I feel trapped by our lifestyle. I feel trapped because I refuse to leave me kids in an environment dominated by her.  I worry what kind of influence she might bring around them.  So I'm at the point where I feel it's time to move on but that circumstances won't let me.  It sucks, I have to continue to go out and take care of all my responsibilities, support the family and even her while she spends all her free time shacked up with some degenerate.

One thing was brought up early in the thread about mirroring behavior. Can anybody provide me with a little more information about this?

Anyway FN, just thought I'd let you know that I understand what you're going through. 

[doubleAries]

spinning--here's an article about mirroring BPD BEHAVIORS:Mirroring

[fakename]

Doublearies and spinning

Thanks for writing and sharing your insights

I don't know where my mind is tonight. Gonna have to think about it all tomorrow.

Can I ask though , before you guys were married did you notice some of these things in ther behavior?

Did the BPD get worse or stay the same?

What was it like in the beginning?

[doubleAries]

Boy, that's actually a tough question, fakename. I'll have to think about that. But I would say right now that I think he did act like this to some degree at the beginning. And i chose to ignore it, because I was swept up in the parts I liked. I think he also was "on his best behavior" which he couldn't maintain. It got worse as I allowed it to get worse, as I became more and more willing to put up with anything and everything. Like the proverbial frog in the boiling water.

[Spinning1227]

In the beginning it was absolutely captivating.  There was such an intense emotional connection.  My wife was seperated from her husband at the time.  She filled me up with all the horrible things he had done to her and how she was such a victim.  She revealed things about her troubled past that you don't share with someone so new.  But I ate it up.  It was because we had "such a deep emotional connection." I'm realizing now that it's certain aspects of my own personality that made me so vulnerable.  She was living with me in less than a month.  But then things started to change and at first I couldn't quite put my finger on it. She was still enamored with me but it just wasn't the same. And before long I reached the stage where I was everything that was wrong in her life.  I read an article on here about how a relationship with a pwBPD develops and I thought I was reading the story of my marriage.  If you haven't already you should check it out.  

Anyway, I've been riding this rollercoaster for about 10 years, 8 of it in marriage.  It's amazing that we made it this far.  It hasn't been all bad.  We've had some really beautiful moments together over the years.  We've had some periods of relative calm and what seemed like connectedness.  But all in all it's been really exhausting.  I'm starting to realize my role in all of that over the years.  And even when things were going good, I was always waiting for the next crises.  I'm really tired.

And Aries thanks for the link about mirroring.

[doubleAries]

spinning, make sure to scroll down on the mirroring link to Skip's post--it's very informative.

And here's the link for the article you are referring to How a Borderline Personality Disorder Love Relationship Evolves

I think I gave it to fakename on his new member thread, but if I didn't, here it is--for anyone else that wants to also say "WHOA! They wrote this about ME!" 

[fakename]

i think i'm still in a funk today... .  

i'm gonna force myself to go cycling to get some endorphins released... .  

1stly, doublearies, i didn't take anything you said as criticism, but rather input i need to help me figure things out.

i'm not a sensitive person and prefer constructive criticism over sugar-coating things... .  

i think i'm just upset at stupid things. i know i dont want to be with her cause it'll just be the same thing, and that nothing was real to begin with, and that its just too much work for me to still be unhappy as a result... but it hurts knowing she's already moved on... .  

i still stalk her, which i need to stop one of these days.

today i see how she's putting in effort for the new guy to try to find him a modelling job, and even researches stuff about WWII (he was in the military)... .  not only do i see it all as retarded, but it hurts that she puts in so much effort for others, and put in half the effort with me.

i think she sees it has her latest project, and does whatever she can to lure her next victim in... .  

but also i guess it hurts cause it seems like she's better without me, being more productive and taking care of herself, etc. it looks like she's trying to go on the right path, and thats good for her, just hurts that she didnt do it with me i guess... .  

i guess it also hurts that she only reached out to me when she was lonely or hurt and needed someone to console her, and now that she's getting that elsewhere, i serve no purpose.  but i guess thats what all relationships are like.

i dont know. some moments are good, some are bad. and my mind is still confused, going back and forth.

i'm also thinking that part of it is that i was too boring for her to mirror and for it to last.  (that's not a pity statement, i do consider myself pretty boring, i'm a simple man, and that makes me content)

i also see how i made it pretty ideal for her to think of me as someone just to use and i am very indifferent and would really just let her have whatever she wanted.


i also can see how i haven't valued myself, not just with her, but with other things in life (like my abuse of cigarettes and drinking... i quit drinking but still smoke)  i need to change some things about myself.  i never tolerated other people male or female who have treated me with a lack of respect, but i tolerated it with my ex for so long. it's pathetic of me.

spinning, thank you for sharing your story. it's rough. i've heard similar stories from others on these boards, and i wonder if because of the way i am acting and tolerating things, worry if i am headed towards the same path.  that is not something i want. (not meant to be insulting, but i'm sure you can understand why)

the beginning of my r/s was the same as yours spinning. (my ex was also divorced, and at the time was with the guy she was having a 3 year affair with on her husband)... i ate it all up, how she was such a victim and everyone treated her poorly and i thought i'm gonna be the one to treat this lady well. she deserves it.  i'm not gonna make the same mistakes as the other guys.  now i see that much of what she orchestrated was a master's manipulation. i can also see she doesnt contact me any more, because the past couple months i stopped tolerating things and called her out on her lies. i guess if she can't get away with stuff, and i dont play as her pawn, she has no use for me... .  

you said she was living with you in less than a month and thing started to change... .  do you remember what things specifically? 

you said you're starting to see your role in all of it over the years... can you elaborate please?

i know what you mean by even when things were going well, waiting for the next crises... .  being with my ex was always tiring and even as soon as one day after our last breakup, because i wasn't consumed with hurt and instead realized that for whatever reason it was hopeless trying to be with her, that my life is so much more peaceful and happy without her... .  even though i miss her and still wish i was with her sometimes... .  

i read the codependent article, and i dont really think that is me.  i just really believe in trying to do things to please to your special lady, even if you have to make some sacrifices.  i want to treat my girl well.  ... .  i dont know