Positive Psychology, and other ways to focus

[Themis]

Hi,

I was looking for like-minded people that have an interest in positive psychology, Law of Atrraction, or Abraham-Hicks talks.

I found that like most philosophies/beliefs there are good and bad points. Take what you need and throw the rest away.

I could talk all day about how Abraham-Hicks for example is rubbish, or I could take useful points/motivation from some of their talks, discard the bits I don't need and stick with that.

(so in other words if it's not your cup of tea I don't need to know that, on angry days I go to skeptic websites where I shout all about how it doesn't work)

My point being that I'd love to connect with other people that love someone with BPD, and may want to consider other options besides trying to beat the BPD out of them with medications and therapy.

There are good tools here that focus more on ourselves, which I think is great, as we can't point at the other person and say: "I don't like how you are because it makes me feel bad! Co-operate darn you!" Without doing any self-work on ourselves.


And there's a question that is hard for me to answer. Do we want the pwBPD to change because their behaviour hurts and annoys US (so for our benefit) or do we want them to change so that THEY are truly happy whether or not that involves us or not?

I ask this because I truly want him to be happy, but notice I have the selfish motives as well. That I don't like how he acts towards me, so I want him to change for me. But really I need to change myself for myself.

That is hard to accept but it is important.

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Rockylove]

My point being that I'd love to connect with other people that love someone with BPD, and may want to consider other options besides trying to beat the BPD out of them with medications and therapy... .  

And there's a question that is hard for me to answer. Do we want the pwBPD to change because their behaviour hurts and annoys US (so for our benefit) or do we want them to change so that THEY are truly happy whether or not that involves us or not?

I ask this because I truly want him to be happy, but notice I have the selfish motives as well. That I don't like how he acts towards me, so I want him to change for me. But really I need to change myself for myself.

That is hard to accept but it is important.

Let's begin at the beginning.  I don't think anyone here in this forum wants to beat their BPD into submission, so you've come to the right place!  You'll find support and encouragement here for YOU.  It's not about changing someone else's behavior, but your reaction to their behavior can result in a shift in theirs.

"You Are a Creator of Thoughtways on Your Unique Path of Joy" (Abraham Hicks)  We are all our own source of enlightenment or lack thereof.  Ahhh, to be so enlightened that I would want my BPDbf to change completely and solely for his own sake~~but alas... .  I'm not.  I am, however enlightened enough to understand that I can make changes within that will keep me from being sucked into the dark abyss of mental illness. 

[rollercoaster24]

Here Here!

I feel I have always known I wanted BP to change so he could be happy in himself... that he has caused me so much pain and grief is only a part of it...

I know here we use 'Radical Acceptance' about the way we wish it could be, but it doesn't take the sadness away any less, when you realise all the wonderful feelings and experiences they are missing out on... .  

And how much easier they could progress through their own lives, having everything they desired, (practically!) if only they changed their thinking...

The biggest burden I have, is trying to keep on that positive track myself, and create all those wishes come true...

(the Christmas list I call it). I struggle at times not to get sucked down into that abyss with him...

These last two explosions, (after this last month together) really took their toll. I retaliated back... such was the anger from yet another public humiliation, and extreme verbal abuse...

So much so, I grabbed his little amount of things in my car, and gently threw them out the window at him, and told him he was the only 'scammer' around here, and drove off... in a fit of rage... .  

Driving around for an hour usually helps me to calm down, but this time, it took so much longer to offload the anger and pain... I went home, got a newish box of Zoloft, (that I had ironically started and then later stopped taking), grabbed the beautiful Valentines cards he had given me, and mine to him, grabbed a precious ex-library book he had gotten that day for 50 cents, and others he had on my back seat, and proceeded to throw them out the window onto the side of the road, as I drove along in the dark... pathetic, I know... but my anger needed a voice... and I was tired of him taking my rights away... .  he cared more about the stupid book than his relationship...

This comes after a million discussions with him about changing the cycle of abuse in our relationship... I told him both of us have to commit to it, not just one... and that he has to stop creating distance and starting fights if we are to build trust in each other, and feel at peace about our relationship... I told him as long as he makes no change to the way he goes about handling his emotions, he will never feel at peace... I added that he is not going to steal mine...

I also told him, that I have rights not to be subjected to daily denigrations about people we know (and are related to), along with my having my own limits when it comes to listening to his opinions etc... I have told him that it is not OK to ignore my rights and keep ranting on aggressively in my presence... and that if I stand up to it, it should not have to be 20 times of repeating myself, and it should not end in his verbally abusing me because he cannot get his own way... I told him if he needs to rant, he can find a counsellor, because I am not it...

It is like his memory only lasts for ten seconds sometimes I swear... .  

[Themis]

Hey thanks guys! 

I felt pretty nervous about sticking this post up, but I felt that there were people on the board that would be secretly hoping someone else was thinking like this too.

Then when it is appropriate we can come here, swap ideas, and support each other.

Let's begin at the beginning.  I don't think anyone here in this forum wants to beat their BPD into submission, so you've come to the right place!  You'll find support and encouragement here for YOU.  It's not about changing someone else's behavior, but your reaction to their behavior can result in a shift in theirs.

"You Are a Creator of Thoughtways on Your Unique Path of Joy" (Abraham Hicks)  We are all our own source of enlightenment or lack thereof.  Ahhh, to be so enlightened that I would want my BPDbf to change completely and solely for his own sake~~but alas... .  I'm not.  I am, however enlightened enough to understand that I can make changes within that will keep me from being sucked into the dark abyss of mental illness. 

Thank you for this Rocky! I've read all the tools here, but now I'm confused and going to ask about this elsewhere... .  he's mostly doing a silent treatment... .  so there's not much to react to!

I have some success if you're interested, if not skip this part between the hearts 

I have noticed that by reducing my anger at his silent treatment (emotionally, and being cal around the house and facial expression) that it has shifted the tone of his silence 

What I mean is before I was crying and so hurt that he went and vented to others, found another friend to share our hobbies with, and verbally abused me before going silent on me.

I felt the injustice, the hurt, the rage.

Since I vented my anger (wrote out an angry letter never sent) spoke to family members, vented on this board, got a little happier knowing if I must I can make another close friend, takes hard work but it is possible.

After doing all that self-work I felt a little better and resigned to accept his "painting black" and well at least the rage died down. I still had pangs of heart-break and also a strange pressure to go out, make a tonne of new friends just to deal with that rejection and look fine.

Once I got over that, and let myself relax, HIS silence changed a little. It was weird! 

Maybe it was just the passing of a few days, but when I calmed down---he continued to do the silent treatment---but tonned down a lot.

At first he'd yell when I got even a metre near him or even dared to look at him: "Yes?" he'd scream. Like I was going to give him a terrible disease.

Now I've decided to react calmly, let him be silent, stop occasionally protesting that it isn't fair... .  

He stopped recoiling when I go near him, he tonned down the facial expressions. He stopped trying to rub things in my face.

I just remained calm and nice. I even offered to make dinner. It got abruptly rejected, but I was expecting that so I didn't flinch. I calmy said "ok, let me know if you need me and I'll be happy to talk to you."

That is a huge shift from "fine! I don't want to talk to you either! /This isn't fair"

It is slowly shifting him. At some points instead of looks of disgust, I think my unwavering kindness got to him. Maybe it was my imagination, but at one point I think I saw him blinking back tears.

I just let him know I was sorry HE was in so much stress and depression. He denied it, and said he just wanted to be left alone. He hinted heavily that he didn't even want me in the same room.

So I back off calmly, and that gets a better response over getting upset.

So all I'm doing is not adding gasoline to the fire, trying not to take it personally.



Rollercoaster24- I could relate to nearly every word you said! I have also told him similar things.

This is what started the silent treatment--an extinction burst. When I finally stopped crying at insults, or yelling back.

I walked away and said "I don't have time for these games" and ended the conversation on him. He usually ends the conversation on me. He controls if and when we speak. So it didn't go down well.

I usually fall into the trap of my own loneliness, but I knew I had to be strong, no matter how much I wanted interaction with him---any interaction, I have to hold out for positive interaction.

That was hard for me, but I did it.

[Tigerabbit]

This definitely resonates with me! And it makes sense that you'd find more people who feel the same way on the staying board, as we obviously still have positive feelings for our pwBPD.

I have been very selfish throughout my relationship at times, and had myself convinced for the longest time that I was a selfless giver and a saint for putting up with what he subjected me to. The truth is, he has suffered just as much at my hands (though in different ways) as I have at his. We have just fed off of each others' problems and fueled one another's fires. Even now, I'm still struggling with controlling my selfish urges and giving him the space he needs to heal, but this is because I am highly codependent and "addicted" to him in a sense. This, however, is not to say that I don't genuinely, deep down want him to get better for him. Whether or not he and I end up working things out and being together, I want him to be happy and be with someone (me or otherwise) who will be a healthy complement to him. His well being is of utmost importance to me, and I am really trying to learn to control myself as to not be a detriment to his healing anymore.

[rollercoaster24]

Hey guys,

I find I am addicted, yes for sure... Very much so, as is the nature of these types of relationships...

What I do notice, is that I can handle us having a lot of space, for me, it does not lessen my feelings for him, but I know for him, that absence definately doesn't make the heart grow fonder, it grows colder, or cycles from hot to cold...

I get anxious and upset, when he starts talking about our life and relationship in a negative way, just because he is having a bad day... So, if we are apart say, (often even because BP has something better to do, or more important) and we talk on the phone during the day, BP will cycle in and out of love and hate and back again many times during a day through our phone calls.

I always know the signs. It will be the manner in which he speaks, the tone, the topics... as soon as I hear a certain name or certain thing, I think, "OH no, here we go again... Groundhog Day".

Then there can easily be another 4 or 5 phone calls, and depending on whether I can cope listening for too long, or not, if he senses that I would like to end the phone call when he gets really aggressive and upset, he then goes into the old abandonment routine, and I just know that any second, I will likely be abused again, or dumped, or hung up on...

This is all very exhausting for me, and greatly affects how much I achieve in my own life each day... I find it saps all my energy, and I lose motivation to complete tasks at home or at work...

I feel like a counsellor several times per day... except that most counsellors don't have to see the same client 4 times or more a day... or talk to them on the phone...

On the other hand, if BP has just been paid his unemployment payment from the Government, he is often only calling once or twice at a stretch per day... If he is off in his favourite nearby city, hanging at the beach, and sleeping overnight in his car, I hardly hear from him... if I try ringing in the middle of the night, like when he used to fanatically check up on me, (including going through my rubbish bins, mail, car, etc and following me around at nights, doing drive bys) I can never magically get hold of him, despite him saying that if he sleeps in his car, he does not sleep well, due to being on guard... .  

So yes, I feel like my status goes from a 'friend with benefits', to a partner, depending on whether he needs anything from me at that moment... such as company etc... money, a place to sleep etc...

He throws these terms around when it suits, hot and cold... ho hum... .  

I have often asked him, that knowing how he sees himself as quite a positive easy going person, has he ever considered that his thoughts about things and people may not be right? and that perhaps if he changed his thoughts about things, did he ever consider he might actually feel better?

Lost... .  

[yeeter]

Now I've decided to react calmly, let him be silent, stop occasionally protesting that it isn't fair... .  

He stopped recoiling when I go near him, he tonned down the facial expressions. He stopped trying to rub things in my face.

I just remained calm and nice. I even offered to make dinner. It got abruptly rejected, but I was expecting that so I didn't flinch. I calmy said "ok, let me know if you need me and I'll be happy to talk to you."

That is a huge shift from "fine! I don't want to talk to you either! /This isn't fair"

It is slowly shifting him. At some points instead of looks of disgust, I think my unwavering kindness got to him. Maybe it was my imagination, but at one point I think I saw him blinking back tears.

I just let him know I was sorry HE was in so much stress and depression. He denied it, and said he just wanted to be left alone. He hinted heavily that he didn't even want me in the same room.

So I back off calmly, and that gets a better response over getting upset.

So all I'm doing is not adding gasoline to the fire, trying not to take it personally.

Welcome Themis!



This is a great observation, and exactly what we mean when we say that change starts with US.  Changing our behavior, and how we interact can definitely change the dynamics of the relationship.  Not only the initial 'stop making things worse' phase, but in the long term.

Well done.

[Themis]

Thank you!