In real need of perspective on this please...

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

So I'll keep it short as I can . My BPD GF left me a month ago. We lasted for 13 months, the first 8 were wonderfull, the last 5 not so much as I got in a situation that had me not be the best I usually am.

My (ex) GF : beautiful, smart, KIND! not at all the overthetop raging type of person. She did flip on me

a couple of times but it was nothing compared to what I had lived through with previous ''normal'' relationships. She told me early on about her condition because our relationship was precious to her eyes. she is diagnosed, therapy and medication. Unstable at many levels though (professional, friends, familly, where she lives)

Me: very self confident, independant and professional, I usually have no problem attracting women. Yet, some events in my life I was not able to deal with properly let her see a weaker side of me in the last 4-5 months. Yes I have the knight in shinning armor issue but I try to keep it under check.

The relationship:  for the long term, we were making plans, she wanted a ring, she would often happilly wave her ring finger at me, we would picture a future together often. we were compatible at so many levels that it was almost a joke. we did not get to live together though.

The Situation : I could feel the break up coming. The last months, an awckward distance was settling in, both in communication and intimacy and I know she felt it too. I often tried to initiate conversations about that multiple times but always failed to arrive to any sort of conclusion because she would get too emotional during them. I'm also sure I let some insecurity regarding this transpire in our time together. Both the situation I was dealing with + the degrading intimacy and relationship issues we were having got the best of my self control.

Essentially, my last attempt at talking about our issues resulted in her telling me how maybe she was not ready for a relationship

and that things were really mixed up inside of her. She had therapy the next day.

After her therapy she told me that maybe what she needed was a bit less contact, less frequent meetups, like one call a day

and maybe seeing each other eery 4 days (coming from the closest relationship I have ever had it of course punched a hole

in my stocmach) and I said that I would try to do that.

A day after that (yup) I tried to negociate maybe a few more texts to make it a bit more easy on me (error on my end)... . and it hit the fan. She

hung up.

She called me a few days later asking me to come

Instead of letting her speak first I talked first and said  that I was puting the blame on myself and told her

that yeah, maybe I have been worrying a bit much about you and us and that I should not have let that affect her and us, and

thatI was going to try and make an effort to make things easy for us. She exploded in a rage, and asked me to take my stuff and leave,

and I remember her saying in the middle of it all that if we were meant to be together we would end up together, she mentioned a 2-3 months

period of NC. This happened on May 8th.

Since then:

I wrote her a letter after 15 days, In wich I took some of the blame on my shoulder and I also described to her all that I loved about her, and she replied 5 days later saying that my letter was really moving, but that she still felt the reasons for the breackup and that she needed time to settle to figure out what she wants. As beautifull as the letter was, it probably was not a good move on my end to send it, I'm sure some of you will agree... .

Last sunday I ran into her in a bar, i came in with some friends, she was there with some friends. we saw each other, both surprised, slowly she stood up as I was slowly approaching, we went to each other, I took in my arms and she did the same, held each others hands as words were slowly coming out, nothing dramatic or serious, asked her how she was, if she was able to breathe, briefly talked about the breakup, taking a bit of the blame on each other, held each other in our arms again, told her how amazing she looked, she said i looked great as well... . said i was happy to see her and she said the same... . I told her that I had made it clear where my heart stood, and that I could handle her decision, positive or negative (error on my end I believe) then let her go back to her friends, went to finish my drink with mine and as we were leaving I waved her goodbye with a smile and gave her a blowkiss as she was smilling back too.

Now the problem is : I know she's dating other dudes. I know of an old ex... . and I know of another dude I met while we were together. I don't know how far it went but from what I hear she might be infatuated with the new guy.

I'm not at all bugged by that but I wonder about what to do now... . is keeping my distance still a valid option? should I pro-actively try to do something to get closer? I love her still, whatever she does right now doesn't phase me one bit. The idea of us being completely over does though. I think about casually sending her texts, just to maintain friendly communication, no pressure... . just to get her to not forget to quickly about us.

any insight on your end is welcome... .

thnx

[JamesD]

So I'll keep it short as I can . My BPD GF left me a month ago. We lasted for 13 months, the first 8 were wonderfull, the last 5 not so much as I got in a situation that had me not be the best I usually am.

My (ex) GF : beautiful, smart, KIND! not at all the overthetop raging type of person. She did flip on me

a couple of times but it was nothing compared to what I had lived through with previous ''normal'' relationships. She told me early on about her condition because our relationship was precious to her eyes. she is diagnosed, therapy and medication. Unstable at many levels though (professional, friends, familly, where she lives)

Me: very self confident, independant and professional, I usually have no problem attracting women. Yet, some events in my life I was not able to deal with properly let her see a weaker side of me in the last 4-5 months. Yes I have the knight in shinning armor issue but I try to keep it under check.

The relationship:  for the long term, we were making plans, she wanted a ring, she would often happilly wave her ring finger at me, we would picture a future together often. we were compatible at so many levels that it was almost a joke. we did not get to live together though.

The Situation : I could feel the break up coming. The last months, an awckward distance was settling in, both in communication and intimacy and I know she felt it too. I often tried to initiate conversations about that multiple times but always failed to arrive to any sort of conclusion because she would get too emotional during them. I'm also sure I let some insecurity regarding this transpire in our time together. Both the situation I was dealing with + the degrading intimacy and relationship issues we were having got the best of my self control.

Essentially, my last attempt at talking about our issues resulted in her telling me how maybe she was not ready for a relationship

and that things were really mixed up inside of her. She had therapy the next day.

After her therapy she told me that maybe what she needed was a bit less contact, less frequent meetups, like one call a day

and maybe seeing each other eery 4 days (coming from the closest relationship I have ever had it of course punched a hole

in my stocmach) and I said that I would try to do that.

A day after that (yup) I tried to negociate maybe a few more texts to make it a bit more easy on me (error on my end)... . and it hit the fan. She

hung up.

She called me a few days later asking me to come

Instead of letting her speak first I talked first and said  that I was puting the blame on myself and told her

that yeah, maybe I have been worrying a bit much about you and us and that I should not have let that affect her and us, and

thatI was going to try and make an effort to make things easy for us. She exploded in a rage, and asked me to take my stuff and leave,

and I remember her saying in the middle of it all that if we were meant to be together we would end up together, she mentioned a 2-3 months

period of NC. This happened on May 8th.

Since then:

I wrote her a letter after 15 days, In wich I took some of the blame on my shoulder and I also described to her all that I loved about her, and she replied 5 days later saying that my letter was really moving, but that she still felt the reasons for the breackup and that she needed time to settle to figure out what she wants. As beautifull as the letter was, it probably was not a good move on my end to send it, I'm sure some of you will agree... .

Last sunday I ran into her in a bar, i came in with some friends, she was there with some friends. we saw each other, both surprised, slowly she stood up as I was slowly approaching, we went to each other, I took in my arms and she did the same, held each others hands as words were slowly coming out, nothing dramatic or serious, asked her how she was, if she was able to breathe, briefly talked about the breakup, taking a bit of the blame on each other, held each other in our arms again, told her how amazing she looked, she said i looked great as well... . said i was happy to see her and she said the same... . I told her that I had made it clear where my heart stood, and that I could handle her decision, positive or negative (error on my end I believe) then let her go back to her friends, went to finish my drink with mine and as we were leaving I waved her goodbye with a smile and gave her a blowkiss as she was smilling back too.

Now the problem is : I know she's dating other dudes. I know of an old ex... . and I know of another dude I met while we were together. I don't know how far it went but from what I hear she might be infatuated with the new guy.

I'm not at all bugged by that but I wonder about what to do now... . is keeping my distance still a valid option? should I pro-actively try to do something to get closer? I love her still, whatever she does right now doesn't phase me one bit. The idea of us being completely over does though. I think about casually sending her texts, just to maintain friendly communication, no pressure... . just to get her to not forget to quickly about us.

any insight on your end is welcome... .

thnx

[seeking balance]

You outlined the BPD dance quite well... . intimacy is just too intense, as such the push/ pull dynamic is the coping tool of choice.

This is who she is, as such... . if you are going to be with her, this is it.  If you love her, let go of any expectation of the relationship you want with her.   Cry, grieve... . let go.

One thing that helped me was reading the staying board and all the work required for these relationships to be a version of successful.  It is self-less and don't expect your needs to come first, ever.

Focus on healing you would be my 2 cents.

Peace,

SB

[JamesD]

Thnx for you reply. I guess my undying optimistic nature lets me believe that if we could both walk the relationship with eyes wide opened (wich would mean for her to LEARN and ACCEPT and DEAL with her patterns and emotions) then we could have a normal relationship. This past month all I've been doing is take care of myself. And I'm hurt still of course, but FAR from being miserable or non-functioning, au contraire. I think that what I'm looking for is some kind of definitive YES or NO as far as ''can we make it baby, are you willing''

Does it make sense?

[seeking balance]

Thnx for you reply. I guess my undying optimistic nature lets me believe that if we could both walk the relationship with eyes wide opened (wich would mean for her to LEARN and ACCEPT and DEAL with her patterns and emotions) then we could have a normal relationship. This past month all I've been doing is take care of myself. And I'm hurt still of course, but FAR from being miserable or non-functioning, au contraire. I think that what I'm looking for is some kind of definitive YES or NO as far as ''can we make it baby, are you willing''

Does it make sense?

It makes sense rationally, absolutely!

But JamesD... . BPD is a serious mental illness that requires the sufferer to want to change herself.  As an illness, the core coping tools tend to exist only to deny itself.   What this means is that your ex prefers to cope by leaving... . it is not about you, but it is because of her fears surrounding intimacy and you are now one of her triggers.  Is it fair? No.  It is mental illness, very serious and the kindest thing you can do is let go and let her find her own way and you find yours.

Have you had a chance to read article 9?  The 10 false beliefs that keep us stuck?  Right now, these may really help you get a reality check on perspective.

Again, logically you make sense... . but this is BPD and mental illness, not rational or logical a lot of the time.

Peace,

SB

[JamesD]

[/quote]
It makes sense rationally, absolutely!

But JamesD... . BPD is a serious mental illness that requires the sufferer to want to change herself.  [/quote]
Since she is undergoing therapy twice (2 times!) a week, I assume she wishes to change herself. but the therapy has been

going on for three years now... .

I'm gonna go through article 9 as suggested

[JamesD]

so I went through the 10 misconceptions while disengaing (or being forced to disengage by the ex). Pretty scary stuff. Yet I can't get out of my memory what happened last week. Although, since then, she has not reached out or showed any sign of life. So it does go along the misconceptions that they just don't live the moments the same way you do.  But if she sees me as a trigger, why was she so calm and gave me an embrace as strong as I gave one to her?   this is very difficult to understand for my heart.

[papawapa]

James

I spent thirteen years with one of these sick women. It in ended in something straight out of a Jerry Springer episode. As hard as it is you have to forget about her and move on. Life is too short. Save yourself the pain and suffering that some of who tried to make it work for a long time have had to endure.

[JamesD]

you're probably right.

[eniale]

You say what you are looking for is a definitive yes or no.  Based on my own experience, you will get yes and no, yes and no, yes and no -- but not a definitive yes or no.  That is the push/pull.  You seem to want a normal relationship, but BPD is a mental disorder.  Sounds like you think she lives in the same reality you do.  She does not.  She does not think as you do.  That is one of the hardest things to accept.  Everyone has to decide what is right for them.  I decided NC and have stuck to it for 4 months.  Although in the beginning he was sending emails every day and even came to my house, I know he finally got the message.  Every day is getting easier for me.  I do miss some things, but know the price I paid was way too high.

[JamesD]

You say what you are looking for is a definitive yes or no.  Based on my own experience, you will get yes and no, yes and no, yes and no -- but not a definitive yes or no.  That is the push/pull.  You seem to want a normal relationship, but BPD is a mental disorder.  Sounds like you think she lives in the same reality you do.  She does not.  She does not think as you do.  That is one of the hardest things to accept.  Everyone has to decide what is right for them.  I decided NC and have stuck to it for 4 months.  Although in the beginning he was sending emails every day and even came to my house, I know he finally got the message.  Every day is getting easier for me.  I do miss some things, but know the price I paid was way too high.

I can understand that. However when the NC is pulled on you by the quiet BPD it reaaaally throws someone off.

I have found this article about the perpective of many things of a quiet borderline BY a quiet borderline.

www.mdjunction.com/forums/borderline-personality-discussions/introductions-personal-stories/10500794-quiet-borderline

and a passage particularly revealing on love and breakups when ignitiated by the BPD sufferer:

Love is terrifying to me. When I first started dating, I needed to be adored, worshiped and put on a pedestal because I didn't have that inside myself and I needed external validation. Nowadays, I just warn people away from falling in love with me because I know I’m bad news. The relationship may be just fine, for the most part, but it always ends badly. Throughout the relationship, I’ll sometimes pick fights over nothing because I'm irritable or I’ll cry inexplicably and get mad at them for not knowing how to comfort me, or I’ll cling to them and beg them never to leave me because I’m feeling insecure and I love them SO much.

Then one day, I won’t love them anymore. It probably doesn't actually happen overnight, but it feels like it. I’ll wake up and I just… don’t want them in my life. And the fact they still love me will actually disgust me. I will be repulsed by the fact that they can’t just “get over” me the way I’m already over them. And I’ll hurt and I’ll feel bad because I hurt them and I’ll cry because I feel bad. But I won’t really care, I’ll walk away and it will be as though I never truly loved them and I won’t know why. I’ll say “he just wasn't right for me” and I’ll feel bad because I don’t believe there’s anyone out there who IS right for me and maybe that last one was the only chance I’ll ever get to not die alone. And I’ll tell myself I’m OK with dying alone because at least that way I can’t hurt anyone else- including myself. But then I always crave love again…

regardless of it being a window to the matrix, the heart (mine for example) can't figure it out right now... . in time maybe.

[seeking balance]

This recovery process seems to be 2 sided on our parts.

First... . the logic.  Rather than focus on what is rational to me, I found it helpful to really understand the facts of BPD.  Clinically, the facts, behaviors, treatments... . kind of a ridiculous amount, but I needed to understand.

The other part is our emotions.  These relationships really get into the depths of our soul, as such, when they seemingly irrationally end... . it hurts tremendously.  Radical acceptance is a term used in BPD recovery and it really can be applied to our recovery also.  We must accept the facts, as such, we literally have to grieve the person we thought we loved.  This takes time.

Keep focusing on the facts, on your own emotions and give yourself the time needed to truly grieve.

Peace,

SB

[JamesD]

Ok... . I'm cured. And I mean I'm completely over this as of a couple of days ago. I'm not proud of the manner I did it but I believe that extremely painfull, sudden, and traumatizing breakups such as the ones with pwBPD's require some extreme ways and tools... .

All I can say is it really worked for me, and yet I loved her like there was no tomorrow. Today I don't even think of getting her back for a second.

I'm just not sure I should share this on the board as I don't want to be responsible for any wrongdoing, but I'll gladly answer any pm.