What does it take for them to get help?

[papawapa]

I am currently separated from the BPD mother of my children. She is already off in another relationship. I have managed to get our two children and at least for now have full custody. I know that her little fantasy she is living is going to implode at some point in the future and I do not think she will do anything constructive until she splits and paints the new BF black.

I am working on myself in therapy and getting sober. She will have no parenting time until she cooperates with the current order of the judge in our custody case.

Can I be certain she will attempt to recycle?

Is not seeing her kids and grandkids enough incentive for her to desire to make changes?

Is it ethical to do things to make her reach her rock bottom?

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[Rockylove]

Is it ethical to do things to make her reach her rock bottom?

Ethics aside, you cannot make someone hit rock bottom.  That just happens.  Some people never go down far enough~~always lingering on the edge of the cliff because they're tied to someone that will keep them from falling.  It may not be you, but someone. 

I believe I'd be more inclined to focus on what you can do to keep yourself mentally, physically and spiritually healthy so you can be the rock for your children/grand children.

[papawapa]

It is so hard to concentrate on doing for myself when all I can think about is her.

I know that I can't make her hit bottom, she has to come to the realization that it is time to get help on her own. But there are some things I can do to make things more difficult for her to keep going on with this fantasy she is living.

[Vindi]

she probably needs to hit rock bottom, so to speak... . and yes, she can keep recycling, and this will not help her, it enables her. Maybe the day she has "no one" to rescue her, no one to care for her, she may realize that. Again, she needs to make the choice herself to get help. There is nothing you or anyone can do.

And yes, keep the focus on you, on staying healthy and caring for your wonderful children

[Chosen]

Hi papawapa,

I understand you want to focus on her and helping her to see she needs help.  However, telling her outright or manipulating the situation will not help her- if anything, she will blame you even more. 

I second the need to focus on yourself first.  When you change you, and by the "change" I mean changing the way to respond to her, how you communicate and put things across, she will be forced to change her responses.  You do not necessarily need to change your point of view, just the means to communicate a point. 

At the end of the day, if she wants to live in the fantasy, she will, and there is nothing that can change her mindset.  However, when she realises that living her fantasy is not that ideal (due to your changed patterns), she *may* or *may not* choose to look at herself and reflect if she has caused the problems.

Take care.

[bruceli]

I am currently separated from the BPD mother of my children. She is already off in another relationship. I have managed to get our two children and at least for now have full custody. I know that her little fantasy she is living is going to implode at some point in the future and I do not think she will do anything constructive until she splits and paints the new BF black.

I am working on myself in therapy and getting sober. She will have no parenting time until she cooperates with the current order of the judge in our custody case.

Can I be certain she will attempt to recycle?

Is not seeing her kids and grandkids enough incentive for her to desire to make changes?

Is it ethical to do things to make her reach her rock bottom?

Hmmm... . interesting question... . Do no harm comes to mind, however i can see what you may be saying in that she is doing harm to you and the family.  An ethcal dilema indeed.  Can you make them hit bottom?  Should you?

[bruceli]

she probably needs to hit rock bottom, so to speak... . and yes, she can keep recycling, and this will not help her, it enables her. Maybe the day she has "no one" to rescue her, no one to care for her, she may realize that. Again, she needs to make the choice herself to get help. There is nothing you or anyone can do.

And yes, keep the focus on you, on staying healthy and caring for your wonderful children

Very well put... . hard to see someone self destruct... .

[waverider]

Rock bottom needs to be clearly their own doing, and they need to know it. They will try to blame others so the odds of it backfiring if your meddling is suspected is real.