Tell Me You Appreciate Me, Now Let Me Devalue You

[Gueneviere]

Just another example of how heartbreakingly frustrating it can be to have a BPD spouse:

We returned home from a camping trip on Saturday, and for the rest of the day while he napped and watched TV I did all our laundry and washed and put away camping gear before joining him in his nap. Sunday I spent cleaning the house. As it was getting close to dinnertime I joined him on the couch where he was cuddly and affectionate for a few minutes. Then he talked about making dinner (he makes dinner for us most nights as I work and he is unemployed and home most days, plus he is admittedly the better cook). He sort of pointed to his cheek like he wanted me to kiss it, and sort of sarcastically asked me to thank him for making my dinner. I was still playing along at this point, so I did as he asked and told him quite seriously that I appreciated the dinners he made. I then in a similarly joking voice as he had used, said something like "and you can thank me for doing all the laundry and cleaning the house", at which point he turned off the playfulness and said in a very serious tone to me,"well those things you do, you do them for yourself". When I asked what he meant by this he said he didn't need me to do those things, he'd clean the house when he felt it was dirty and do his laundry when he got around to it. I asked him, "so you don't think I do much of anything around here?" to which he replied, "I didn't say you don't do anything. I said that the things you do are only because you want to do them."

What the heck. Thanks for making me feel totally unappreciated yet again... .    

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[Chosen]

Oh Gueneviere,

How I related to your post!  As I always say around here, any little thing H does it A BIG THING, which should be appreciated.  Anything I do is EXPECTED, or worse still, I do it worse than him.  And after I did something he takes credit for it, so in his mind I never did anything at all.  Sometimes he'll be completely mad and let's say I've just done the dishes, he will tell me to thank him for doing the dishes (I swear it has actually happened!). 

They desperately want others to praise them (to build up their self worth), and they misunderstood that by devaluing somebody else it raises their own value... . it's sad.  It's like the bullies who think that just because people are scared of them, it means they are powerful.

Sorry I'm not really giving advise as I don't know how to turn that around... . I just want to let you know I experience this too and I feel totally unappreciated most of the time 

[SweetCharlotte]

Don't forget, you bring home the bacon, he only fries it up in a pan.

Oh no, if you said that the steam would start coming out of his ears.

Yes, I have been there with my uBPDh.

There is no way you can ask for parity or equal time. It becomes an attempt on their sense of self. My h has me trained well, but he stills finds other things to get exasperated about. If I master one "event" in the BPD spousal Olympics, there is always a new one for which I'm unprepared.

[MichiganGirl]

Ha.  I have had that exact same problem for years.  I do chores for me; he does Amazing Deeds of Altruism.  Frustrating as all get out.  Here's the only thing I've found that works for me.  I have decided that I do chores for me.  I like having a clean house, I like having the dishes done.  So I clean the house and do the dishes.  I don't passive-aggresively stop doing anything to get him to notice (he doesn't), and I also don't do more than I normally would to get a thank you.  When he does something, I try to thank him immediately (because that's polite), and go on with my business.  Not a whole lot has changed over time except my attitude about it, but that seems to have helped.  If I have in my head, "I'm doing this for myself," or even, "I'm doing this for myself and because I like being kind to my h," then I'm not bitter (in fact I don't even care) whether he expresses appreciation or not.  Don't know if that helps or not... . and I'm not always perfect about it either.

[maryy16]

What I can't stand also is when my H is joking around (like yours was) and if I start joking around also (like you did), suddenly it's not funny anymore!  Somehow it is a joke is he says it, but if I do the same thing he'll tell me that "I really meant it" and that I was not joking and the raging will start.

I guess it's just part of the BPD... . they can't take ANYTHING that could be perceived in any way to be negative... . but they can sure dish it out. So frustrating!

[Chosen]

What I can't stand also is when my H is joking around (like yours was) and if I start joking around also (like you did), suddenly it's not funny anymore!  Somehow it is a joke is he says it, but if I do the same thing he'll tell me that "I really meant it" and that I was not joking and the raging will start.

I have learnt the hard way that I cannot joke with H.  H can joke, and sometimes I swear he disguises insults to me within his jokes (like telling other people "yeah I have no say at home.  My wife is the boss.  Hehee.".  But if I remotely do that I'd be in for ragefest.  It would mean I'm trying to belittle him in front of others.  Trying to make him look bad.  There were a few times I was saying something at home, just between us, in the exact same joking manner as he is, and he suddenly got all serious.  So I just said "Oh, I have to remember never to joke with you again."  He will argue that it's not a joke and anything else I say will be JADEing. 

So nope... . we can never win.

[SweetCharlotte]

Oh yes, that's another event in the BPD Spousal Olympics, the I-can-joke-about-your-foibles-but-if-you-dare-joke-about-mine-the-evening-is-ruined.

[Chosen]

He will also never accept the fact that you were joking.  In his mind, you are attacking him and as we all know, HOW THEY FEEL IS FINAL. 

On the issue of housework, work and finances, you know what my H says?  We don't have kids now and he always tells me I'll be a terrible mum, that he's much better at all sorts of housework than I am, that if I have kids they will be so poorly brought up.

If that's the case, I wonder why he only does housework when he feels like it- and that means even when I'm ill I'll be doing stuff unless he wants to do it on that day.  And of course when he does housework (which by the way he does, you just can't expect it from him), he becomes the epitome of the perfect husband, and when I do housework, I do it poorly anyway so I deserve to be mocked.

[Suzn]

I then in a similarly joking voice as he had used, said something like "and you can thank me for doing all the laundry and cleaning the house", at which point he turned off the playfulness and said in a very serious tone to me,"well those things you do, you do them for yourself". When I asked what he meant by this he said he didn't need me to do those things, he'd clean the house when he felt it was dirty and do his laundry when he got around to it.

His tone changed, this just turned into a crucial conversation.

S- I'm sorry my comment seemed like an attack/slight/insult/add in what might work for the situation.

E- I can see how you might see it that way.

T- I want to feel appreciated too. (where's my kiss?)

I asked him, "so you don't think I do much of anything around here?" to which he replied, "I didn't say you don't do anything. I said that the things you do are only because you want to do them."

I'm a little confused too on where you got he thought you did nothing. He may have felt a little guilty for laying around while you did all the work, this may very well be what he told himself. On the other hand, were you feeling some resentment that you were doing all the clean up from your trip? Did you take what he said personally? Why did you do all the clean up? He may very well think you do things because you want to do them. (when you want to do them, meaning time wise... he chose to take a nap, you chose to clean at that time)

[Theo41]

Interesting. There are a lot of things at play here potentially. My uBPDw focuses so much on herself and what she is doing that she frequently accuses me of doing nothing when in fact Ido 80% of the chores including taking care of the dog (her dog) and all the cooking. Not to mention unloading dishwasher and folding clothes. As soon as she has to do something she gets annoyed and then attacks me. When she is working I better get busy or she will end up raging. In your case the husband is sensitive about not being the breadwinner. He is comforted by knowing that he takes care of all the housework (the other half) . When you did some housework he may have had two negative reactions, consciously or sub-consciously:

1. She doesn't think I'm doing my job.

2. I am no longer holding up my end. She's bringing home the bacon and doing parts of my job too.

"Be a man"  and get allergic to all housework:)) THEO

[Gueneviere]

Thanks all. I guess I really just wanted to vent. Suzn and Theo, yes I probably was feeling some resentment... . I do most of the clean up because he's content with letting the house go unless there is family coming to visit. Unless there is family coming over (namely his mother) he doesn't bother with housework except for cooking. Which I do appreciate, and thank him for it all the time. Some days are just harder than others, since I don't get thanked for spending every day at my job while everything I make goes to pay the bills for a house he owned before I met him and our savings just keeps going down while he makes half-assed attempts to find work here and there and sees that as sufficient.

Later that evening we argued over something dumb, no full-on blowup; the next day he didn't return my phone calls when I was trying to ask him something completely unrelated... . when I came home and asked why he wasn't calling me back he pitched a fit, called me every name in the book for "bhiting" at him and has been in silent mode since then (Monday).

I am simply exhausted from working full time to come home to a dirty house... . it needs so much work done to it, first and foremost a roof as we have rain coming through the ceiling in two rooms... . but no money to pay for any of it. I make a pretty decent salary for one person, but after paying the mortgage and bills and our regular expenses there is nothing left. To come home and see him sitting on the couch every day is just breaking my heart. We'll have been married a year in September, and this is how it's been the entire time. To be called a b**ch and a "stupid c**t" and given the silent treatment while trying to deal with this is no easy task. I resolved that I would not buy into his crap this time and have been using the evenings to do my own little projects and actually watch what I want to on TV, which has been a nice break actually. I guess he is just angry at himself... .

[allibaba]

I am simply exhausted from working full time to come home to a dirty house... .

What are you going to do to take care of yourself?  Without recharged batteries, its impossible to deal with the emotional ups and downs of BPDs!

To come home and see him sitting on the couch every day is just breaking my heart. We'll have been married a year in September, and this is how it's been the entire time. To be called a b**ch and a "stupid c**t" and given the silent treatment while trying to deal with this is no easy task. I resolved that I would not buy into his crap this time and have been using the evenings to do my own little projects and actually watch what I want to on TV, which has been a nice break actually. I guess he is just angry at himself... .

Yes, its very understandable that you feel resentful in this situation.  A lot of us are in the same boat!  

First off, are you comfortable with the name calling?  I wasn't... . it was eating away at me... . but I didn't see a way to stop it.  Are you comfortable being in a marriage where you work to support him, do most of the work around the house and then he is verbally abusive?  Are you ready to stop this behavior?

[Gueneviere]

Thanks to everyone for the advice.

I've often wondered how they would justify doing so little. The answer for now seems to be by lying about it. I know for a fact that his parents think he is working based on all the embellishments he tells them about his little side endeavors that never really seem to take off. They think he's pulling a salary, when the reality is if and when he's able to earn a bit of cash, he just uses it for his pocket money and I don't really see it. I'm starting to think his family's on to him, although I'm not sure anyone would ever confront him about it.

[Gueneviere]

Regarding SET, I don't tend to go that route because my H is triggered by words like "discussion" or the thought of talking about our relationship. He also doesn't respond well to my telling him how things make me feel, usually it leaves the door open for him to tell me he doesn't care how I feel. Yeah, I know... . support, empathy and truth are all things he isn't very capable of.

Sometimes I write something that just makes me stop and think "why the hell am I still here?" That was one of them.


If they only knew how much we must love them in order to endure them.

[allibaba]

Gueneviere,

Sometimes we have to smash a few eggs to make an omelet.

Its very easy for me to fall into a pattern with my husband where I don't tell him anything and I withdraw because I am trying to avoid landmines.  When I found this site, I realized that for years I have actually been telling my husbands that its ok for me to do everything, its ok for him to be abusive, and its ok to expect me to pacify him when he hurts.  I didn't say these words outright but letting him be the ruler of our kingdom (with no consequences) he learned these behaviors were ok.

Now I think that its ok to step on the landmines (if I don't give him a reason to get upset then he'll make one up!  there is going to be conflict regardless)... . so why not at least have a good reason to step on them (being a mature, loving spouse who cares!).  Are you happy with the existing dynamic?  Has your relationship always been this way?  How long have you been together?

[Gueneviere]

Allibaba,

No, I'm not happy with the dynamic. I can't say the relationship was always the way it is now, but I can't say I didn't know it was "different" from the beginning, even before I knew about BPD. We've been together a little over three years, married a year this September. The tendencies were always there, for sure. But that was before we were married, before living together, before sharing finances... . with those things came more and more triggers it seems. He hasn't had steady employment since I've known him... . he worked a few months here, a few months there, but he was also able to collect unemployment back then which he isn't eligible for anymore. I can tell he isn't proud that I am supporting us, and I have the feeling that's what's behind a lot of the current turmoil. He has an extremely difficult time humbling himself, if that's the right word -- to me or anyone else. His way of dealing with those kinds of feelings is generally with anger/hate.

[briefcase]

And your way of dealing with abusive anger/hate is boundaries.  Your way of dealing with non-abusive anger/hate is validition.