How Many Times did you Recycle?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

Hi Guys,

 As I am sitting at my desk (ah the calm around me) I am reading these boards and just got curious.

How long were you with your BPD and how many times did he/she pull you into a recycle?

I was thinking about this past year. I was with my ex since last July (2012). Our first breakup was a few days, the second, a few days and the third was about a week. The fourth, she left me to see her ex girlfriend three states away to "give it a go" (mind you this ex had dumped her previously and she considered her "the one that got away". THIS was her best friend she talked about me to the whole first part of our relationship. Ironically, on her drive home from Minnesota she called me frantically. This completely blindsided her ex when she returned home and got back with me yet again. In the process she lost her "best friend" (which should have been me but whatever  

And now the last breakup came this Wednesday. I was very upset about a personal matter the weekend before the Halloween holiday and she was stressed over a friend of a friend who passed. She was angry at me all week grieving this person she had never even met-which I found strange. (I invited her to dinner Monday and she said, "I'm not really into a forgive and forget dinner". She was fine with me Weds via text and then calmly came over to my house and promptly dumped me with: I feel we would make best friends over lovers. It's over.

I was devestated.  I do not want to be her friend so this isn't going to work. I told her I refuse to replace her ex. She then started from calmly wanting to be my friend to completely painting me black. She threw out all our pictures (which she never did before) as well as gifts. She blocked her number and stated she was trying to give me closure but it wasn't working.

So bazaar that the week before I am the love of her life to this isn't working because of stress. Every break has been when something big is affecting her like her Mother's stroke or when I need comfort. I got called a self absorbed a hole as well as other things.

So hurtful. This was very different than past recycles. Actually lovely with the exception of her outbursts that I was not around enough for her. After awhile I needed to escape, .

So I am at 5 breaks in a year. Anyone hedging she comes back? Anyone have the same FINALITY that they wanted to be friends and were no longer attracted and came back?

[Pretty Woman]

Hi Guys,

 As I am sitting at my desk (ah the calm around me) I am reading these boards and just got curious.

How long were you with your BPD and how many times did he/she pull you into a recycle?

I was thinking about this past year. I was with my ex since last July (2012). Our first breakup was a few days, the second, a few days and the third was about a week. The fourth, she left me to see her ex girlfriend three states away to "give it a go" (mind you this ex had dumped her previously and she considered her "the one that got away". THIS was her best friend she talked about me to the whole first part of our relationship. Ironically, on her drive home from Minnesota she called me frantically. This completely blindsided her ex when she returned home and got back with me yet again. In the process she lost her "best friend" (which should have been me but whatever  

And now the last breakup came this Wednesday. I was very upset about a personal matter the weekend before the Halloween holiday and she was stressed over a friend of a friend who passed. She was angry at me all week grieving this person she had never even met-which I found strange. (I invited her to dinner Monday and she said, "I'm not really into a forgive and forget dinner". She was fine with me Weds via text and then calmly came over to my house and promptly dumped me with: I feel we would make best friends over lovers. It's over.

I was devestated.  I do not want to be her friend so this isn't going to work. I told her I refuse to replace her ex. She then started from calmly wanting to be my friend to completely painting me black. She threw out all our pictures (which she never did before) as well as gifts. She blocked her number and stated she was trying to give me closure but it wasn't working.

So bazaar that the week before I am the love of her life to this isn't working because of stress. Every break has been when something big is affecting her like her Mother's stroke or when I need comfort. I got called a self absorbed a hole as well as other things.

So hurtful. This was very different than past recycles. Actually lovely with the exception of her outbursts that I was not around enough for her. After awhile I needed to escape, .

So I am at 5 breaks in a year. Anyone hedging she comes back? Anyone have the same FINALITY that they wanted to be friends and were no longer attracted and came back?

[GreenMango]

Relationship recycling is a two way street.  Most relationships don't end on the first breakup.  It's when it gets to be the norm - making up and breaking up.

Here's a workshop on recycling with some good questions to ask yourself as to why you might have wanted to try again

Relationship Recycling

What is it?

This workshop is about "break-up/make-up" cycles and when and how it can become toxic and what we should do.  

When is this unhealthy?  

Let's break this down.  Sixty-two (62%) of relationships do not end at the first break-up.  For a wife to have second thoughts about a divorce is normal. Sometimes our own self doubt makes us want to try one more time.  Sometimes one partner promises to change something.   To reconnect with a person after a break-up 1-2 times is really not all that unusual.  

When there are more than 4, 5, 6 "break-up/make-up" cycles in a relationship there is something seriously wrong. And when this happens, the conventional relationship expectations are pretty much out the window.

Why do we get caught up in cycles?

These are the questions we need to answer if we ever want the break-up/make-up cycle to end.  Are we returning to this person because we are in love with them and the relationship has a chance, or are we returning to this person because they feel safe?

• Are we afraid to be alone?  

• Do we have our own abandonment issues?  

• Are we fearful that we cannot find someone as good as them again?  

• Are we fearful of the next step (dating, financial issues, etc.)  

Why do our "BPD" partners recycle?

It is hard for us to understand why our partner is expressing an interest after they left in a torrent of bad behavior (e.g., cheating, raging and telling us that we are a horrible people).  "If they don't love me, why this?"  The answer is much of the same reasons as we have... .plus a few others that are related to the disorder.

• Inability to deal with acute loneliness

• Severe insecurity / needing validation (from someone that highly values them)

• Shame / wanting to prove they are a good person (to us or themselves)

• Immaturity/Manipulation/Control - the break-up was just a way to get their way.

If You Want to Stay in the Relationship: The ability to end break-up/make-up cycles and stay in a relationship takes a deep commitment by both partners.  This often means structured rehabilitation (counseling, workshops, classes, self-help programs, etc.).

If you are both open to restarting the relationship, remember the problem isn't going to go away without work. Hope is not enough (on both sides).

You may believe that your partner has changed, will change, is sincere this time, will get into treatment if only you come back. They may believe that the you changed.  But unless there is specific work on some serious level is going on - don't count on it.

If You Want to Leave the Relationship: The power to end the relationship and end the toxic break-up/make-up cycles lies with you... .not your partner.  Moreover, it doesn't help us to blame it on your partner - that tends to make us think that they have a power over us.  Besides, if you both repeatedly recycled you have condition this behavior as "normal" in the relationship - just look at these numbers of break-up/make-up cycles in a recent bpdfamily poll

Number of break-up/make-up cycles (L-3 Leavers)

-------------------------- None 1-2 (not unusual) 3-5 (unhealthy)     6 - 10 (very unhealthy)     10 or more (wow)     We haven't broken up     Other

------- (12.8%) (14.9%) (38.3%) (8.5%) (23.4%) (0%) (2.1%)

<click here>

If you are truly done with the relationship, if you have expressed this to the ex and he/she continues to contact you, it is best to go to reduce your frequency, timing, and the personal nature of your communications (controlled contact) - possibly all the way to ending them (limited or no contact).  They are contacting you to engage you... .if you stop engaging the other person will usually move on.  

Is he/she sincere or is this just more toxic recycling?

Many non's spend much time trying to figure out if the attempted "re-engagement" is sincere. For this reason, it's important to understand the emotional make-up of someone with BPD.  They are not crazy/insane - their behaviors are often predictable - especially if we understand the disorder and their history with us.  So it is wise to accept that the person with BPD is probably very sincere in wanting to reconnect.

It is important to consider that pwBPD can be highly impulsive and those impulses can change quickly.

So sincerity is not the issue.   The issue is whether the person with BPD (as well as you) can follow through with an emotional commitment.[/list]

[Turkish]

Mine was once, after about a year together. Started having problems 4-5 months after I moved in with her. They got worse over the remainder of the year. I triggered by resenting her in a passive sense... .my resentment may have probably had more to do with being mad at myself for letting her cross the usual BPD boundaries. That represented my emotional immaturity at the time. She broke up with me. So I said "ok!". Thought we were fine. I was even open to being "Friends" after that. But then I got the text... ."how can you give up so easily, like you don't even care!" Funny, I though we had agreed in person that it was over. Wow. I was so foolish!

I went away for the weekend. We started texting after I was gone for a day. Talked when I came back. We agreed to start again (I was still living with her, but I was ready to run to a strip hotel until I could get a place... .was already planning it in my head and I had the financial wherewithal to do it).

Instead, I "came back". On her terms.

Of course, I was the bad communicator. So I found a couples communication class, told her about it. She said, "good luck with that." Seeing the look on my face and when I said, "it's a couples' class," she calmed down and agreed to go with me. It was a good class and she liked it a lot. So did I.

But we fell into similar patterns afterwards. Too much work on both of our sides. We got better with each other. Then I stupidly let her talk me into trying for a kid (now S3). Then D1 even though due to her emotional stability, I didn't want to.

After this break up, I was honest about my reservations. Of course, it's my fault for not utterly convincing her of the reasons (as if I was supposed to throw out the BPD thing or something worse to scare her from the second child). There is actually some truth to what she said. Then again, it was more of a father/daughter relationship between us. One of my friends, who likes us both (one of my few friends who actually likes her), said he had observed that dynamic between us. And he didn't even see us that often. I knew it too. And had even verbalized it to her. She never took it seriously, "I know you're not my father!"

At the end, however, when I confronted her about her affair and asked her why, she threw out, "you abandoned me. It felt just like my father!" <insert profanity here from Turkish>

I still have this warped 5% hope that she will try to recycle me now, since she's still in my home for at least another month. I really don;t know what I will do. Do I want her, or do I want the same dysfunctional Caretaker of a BPD dynamic? How far does unconditional love travel, or should it? I am thankful, at least, that she is self aware enough and high functioning enough to know that running into my arms due to fear is "need" based, and not "Turkish" based. That shows some growth on her part, despite me still observing the BPD dynamic playing itself out in my household.

[nowwhatz]

Relationship recycling is a two way street.  Most relationships don't end on the first breakup.  It's when it gets to be the norm - making up and breaking up.

Here's a workshop on recycling with some good questions to ask yourself as to why you might have wanted to try again

Relationship Recycling

What is it?

This workshop is about "break-up/make-up" cycles and when and how it can become toxic and what we should do.  

When is this unhealthy?  

Let's break this down.  Sixty-two (62%) of relationships do not end at the first break-up.  For a wife to have second thoughts about a divorce is normal. Sometimes our own self doubt makes us want to try one more time.  Sometimes one partner promises to change something.   To reconnect with a person after a break-up 1-2 times is really not all that unusual.  

When there are more than 4, 5, 6 "break-up/make-up" cycles in a relationship there is something seriously wrong. And when this happens, the conventional relationship expectations are pretty much out the window.

Why do we get caught up in cycles?

These are the questions we need to answer if we ever want the break-up/make-up cycle to end.  Are we returning to this person because we are in love with them and the relationship has a chance, or are we returning to this person because they feel safe?

• Are we afraid to be alone?  

• Do we have our own abandonment issues?  

• Are we fearful that we cannot find someone as good as them again?  

• Are we fearful of the next step (dating, financial issues, etc.)  

Why do our "BPD" partners recycle?

It is hard for us to understand why our partner is expressing an interest after they left in a torrent of bad behavior (e.g., cheating, raging and telling us that we are a horrible people).  "If they don't love me, why this?"  The answer is much of the same reasons as we have... .plus a few others that are related to the disorder.

• Inability to deal with acute loneliness

• Severe insecurity / needing validation (from someone that highly values them)

• Shame / wanting to prove they are a good person (to us or themselves)

• Immaturity/Manipulation/Control - the break-up was just a way to get their way.

If You Want to Stay in the Relationship: The ability to end break-up/make-up cycles and stay in a relationship takes a deep commitment by both partners.  This often means structured rehabilitation (counseling, workshops, classes, self-help programs, etc.).

If you are both open to restarting the relationship, remember the problem isn't going to go away without work. Hope is not enough (on both sides).

You may believe that your partner has changed, will change, is sincere this time, will get into treatment if only you come back. They may believe that the you changed.  But unless there is specific work on some serious level is going on - don't count on it.

If You Want to Leave the Relationship: The power to end the relationship and end the toxic break-up/make-up cycles lies with you... .not your partner.  Moreover, it doesn't help us to blame it on your partner - that tends to make us think that they have a power over us.  Besides, if you both repeatedly recycled you have condition this behavior as "normal" in the relationship - just look at these numbers of break-up/make-up cycles in a recent bpdfamily poll

Number of break-up/make-up cycles (L-3 Leavers)

-------------------------- None 1-2 (not unusual) 3-5 (unhealthy)     6 - 10 (very unhealthy)     10 or more (wow)     We haven't broken up     Other

------- (12.8%) (14.9%) (38.3%) (8.5%) (23.4%) (0%) (2.1%)

<click here>

If you are truly done with the relationship, if you have expressed this to the ex and he/she continues to contact you, it is best to go to reduce your frequency, timing, and the personal nature of your communications (controlled contact) - possibly all the way to ending them (limited or no contact).  They are contacting you to engage you... .if you stop engaging the other person will usually move on.  

Is he/she sincere or is this just more toxic recycling?

Many non's spend much time trying to figure out if the attempted "re-engagement" is sincere. For this reason, it's important to understand the emotional make-up of someone with BPD.  They are not crazy/insane - their behaviors are often predictable - especially if we understand the disorder and their history with us.  So it is wise to accept that the person with BPD is probably very sincere in wanting to reconnect.

It is important to consider that pwBPD can be highly impulsive and those impulses can change quickly.

So sincerity is not the issue.   The issue is whether the person with BPD (as well as you) can follow through with an emotional commitment.[/list]

GM this is an amazingly helpful post. Thank you.

I am in the middle (or near end) of recycle 9 or 10 or 11?   I can't remember. In February I will have know this gf 3 years.

I know she is sincere but impulsive and then makes really bad decisions... .then goes into survival mode.

The prior recycle ended suddenly with her sincere attempt to rekindle a r/s with her ex-husband... .right before she got evicted. Her sincere guilt and affection for me caused her to cut me off and I had a good 8 month vacation from her completely.

At this point with her on medicaton and getting treatment the prospects of a successful r/s with her have gone up a point or two.  Nevertheless after 45 days I am exhausted and assessing the potential costs of maintaining the r/s.

I am hoping to erect a few more boundaries to give me some relief but not ready to totally pull the plug... .have tried but battery backup kicks in.

Recycles suck.

[UmbrellaBoy]

Depends how you define "recycle," and it depends what you consider part of the "the same event" and what you consider different (as it was one constant roller coaster of chaos... .one problem started where the last one left off) but I'd say that were at least 5 or 6 major "crises" (some bigger than others) that involved one of us "breaking it off" only to have him come back offering hope that this time would finally be different and that he'd settle down emotionally and commit to a relationship... .only to waffle or remain in ambivalent territory or freak out yet again and end it again.

[GreenMango]

Recycles suck.

They do.  It's emotional exhausting to do that. 

When you get sick and tired if being sick and tired things start to change.

[nowwhatz]

Recycles suck.

They do.  It's emotional exhausting to do that. 

When you get sick and tired if being sick and tired things start to change.

You know, in my life even at my age (now 51) I have been know as a person with a seemingly endless supply of energy.  Nobody can keep up with me.

But when I am in the r/s with this woman it is like being in some kind of black hole that sucks the energy out of me.  Initially... .I feel ALIVE but then after about 40 days I am a shell of myself and unstable. 

This recycle has been the most controlled for various reasons but has started to degenerate rapidly over the last week into the familiar disasterous patttern.

Financially this recycle has me hemorraging money as well.

I guess I am not sick and tired enough yet to to be tired of being sick and tired. Maybe it will take something really bad to happen to wake me up.

[ThanksForPlaying]

Recycles ... .Mini-recycles... .Push-pull can become addicting.

I do mean literally addicting as the endorphins affect your brain.  Some people have more addictive personalities (me), which basically means our brains get hooked on endorphins more easily, no matter the source.

I don't get excited by non-dramatic relationships, but I've found that I can try to create endorphin rushes elsewhere, sometimes as easily as just working out.  I'm trying to get addicted to healthy rushes, so I don't need the drama.  It's not easy, but better than the alternative... .

[nowwhatz]

Recycles ... .Mini-recycles... .Push-pull can become addicting.

I do mean literally addicting as the endorphins affect your brain.  Some people have more addictive personalities (me), which basically means our brains get hooked on endorphins more easily, no matter the source.

I don't get excited by non-dramatic relationships, but I've found that I can try to create endorphin rushes elsewhere, sometimes as easily as just working out.  I'm trying to get addicted to healthy rushes, so I don't need the drama.  It's not easy, but better than the alternative... .

I am addicted for sure. I started running in the morning in september with who a girl who liked me (hates me now because I am 'back' with BPDgf) and was a nice rush. maybe can start running again albeit alone this time.

I have tried but can't get into 'normal' women.

[Ironmanrises]

How many times did you recycle... .?

Once... .

In relationship.

She came back to me... .

I allowed her back in.

Twice.

If you include friendship.

She exhibited the same push/pull behavior.

I only realized this... .

Much later.

[Oliolioxenfree]

Hi Guys,

 As I am sitting at my desk (ah the calm around me) I am reading these boards and just got curious.

How long were you with your BPD and how many times did he/she pull you into a recycle?

I was thinking about this past year. I was with my ex since last July (2012). Our first breakup was a few days, the second, a few days and the third was about a week. The fourth, she left me to see her ex girlfriend three states away to "give it a go" (mind you this ex had dumped her previously and she considered her "the one that got away". THIS was her best friend she talked about me to the whole first part of our relationship. Ironically, on her drive home from Minnesota she called me frantically. This completely blindsided her ex when she returned home and got back with me yet again. In the process she lost her "best friend" (which should have been me but whatever  

And now the last breakup came this Wednesday. I was very upset about a personal matter the weekend before the Halloween holiday and she was stressed over a friend of a friend who passed. She was angry at me all week grieving this person she had never even met-which I found strange. (I invited her to dinner Monday and she said, "I'm not really into a forgive and forget dinner". She was fine with me Weds via text and then calmly came over to my house and promptly dumped me with: I feel we would make best friends over lovers. It's over.

I was devestated.  I do not want to be her friend so this isn't going to work. I told her I refuse to replace her ex. She then started from calmly wanting to be my friend to completely painting me black. She threw out all our pictures (which she never did before) as well as gifts. She blocked her number and stated she was trying to give me closure but it wasn't working.

So bazaar that the week before I am the love of her life to this isn't working because of stress. Every break has been when something big is affecting her like her Mother's stroke or when I need comfort. I got called a self absorbed a hole as well as other things.

So hurtful. This was very different than past recycles. Actually lovely with the exception of her outbursts that I was not around enough for her. After awhile I needed to escape, .

So I am at 5 breaks in a year. Anyone hedging she comes back? Anyone have the same FINALITY that they wanted to be friends and were no longer attracted and came back?

Well when I was in my two year relationship with my BPDexbf, we recycled roughly 6-7 times in two years.  I did not realize at the time 1. What BPD was and 2. That these were in fact recycles.  The time between breakup and recycle ranged from 1 day to a month.

The breakups (6 times out of 7were initiated by me) came once every 3-4 months.  In hindsight I believe this was his cycle.  After each breakup , hed stalk me and try to win me back.  Hed text me nonstop and call and email incessantly, then promise change, and a small change would be made, then 3 months later hed get triggered and cycle back into his disorded behavior, act up and do something s****Y again.

Our last and final breakup occurred roughly 9 months ago.  To date there has been No Contact and there has been no recycle attempt.  However, I am certain that this is due to the fact that he had lined up my replacement a month before he finally discarded me.  This time was different because during every other previous recycle he had no replacement lined up, and I had broken things off with him.  When they finally have a replacement they can discard you. The game changes.

I read a great and very poignant quote by Magick which gives a very clear picture of the idea of a recycle and if they may reengage.

Magick stated that basically, depending on how your BPDex views you at the time their replacement relationship begins to falter, they may or may not try to reengage you. 

Mine has painted me black. Jet black, so Im not worried about another recycle attempt. 

Magick’s great post is found at the link below (its definitely worth a read) It is SPOT ON

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=202063.msg12261821;topicseen

[Pretty Woman]

I am 99% sure mine had a replacement lined up. She told me she felt we should see other people, but remain friends.  When I told her that wasn't happening she raged, blocked me from all means of communication, painted me a villain to everyone and says the entire demise of the relationship was my fault.

She has done this once before when she had a replacement lined up only she didn't block communication.  I truly believe this is it. 

[RecycledNoMore]

8yrs, Im ashamed to admit there must have been 20 at least.

[Oliolioxenfree]

I recycled 6 times...

[Traumatized]

7 times in a little over a year.

[PhoenixRising15]

6 times in 6 months.  And yet somehow I still want her back. F me

[Pretty Woman]

Questioning,

I think once they replace you it's easier.

Ok not easier but the replace helps pull you out of the fog. 

I was dumped 6x in a year.  The 5th time she left for an ex in Minnesota.  That lasted a week.  This time she is dating someone I thought was my friend.  So I guess I was technically recycled once. 

Don't plan on a 2nd round.  Once you get away from them and start getting back to you, you start to realize if anyone else did this to you,you wouldn't allow it.  Why now?

[santa]

Too many

[Octoberfest]

Too many times to count in 9 months.  Easily 20+

[Pretty Woman]

Holy Cow, Oktoberfest 

    How long was your longest break?

[winston3]

Ten, would do it again.

[winston3]

Ten, would do it again.

Oh and 7 composite years of dating, 4 of friendship.