How can you tell if you're not split black anymore?

[Depression = 72% of members]

I was talking to my ex of 4 months today (about our child) and she was basically angry and acting all ticked off. Then, I made a few clever comments, took responsibility for a lot of the things that happened with us, and made her laugh a couple of times. Obviously, it's a pretty small step, but she's had nothing but venom for me for months now, so this is the first time she's been the slightest bit nice to me.

I'm sure she'll go back to hating me tomorrow. Lol

We're supposed to see each other at the end of the week for the first time since our split, just to exchange our child. Not sure what to expect.

Is this a sign that she's not splitting me black anymore? How can you tell when they stop doing that?

[santa]

I was talking to my ex of 4 months today (about our child) and she was basically angry and acting all ticked off. Then, I made a few clever comments, took responsibility for a lot of the things that happened with us, and made her laugh a couple of times. Obviously, it's a pretty small step, but she's had nothing but venom for me for months now, so this is the first time she's been the slightest bit nice to me.

I'm sure she'll go back to hating me tomorrow. Lol

We're supposed to see each other at the end of the week for the first time since our split, just to exchange our child. Not sure what to expect.

Is this a sign that she's not splitting me black anymore? How can you tell when they stop doing that?

[Ironmanrises]

When she shows up unsolicited on your doorstop. When she begins to directly text you asking you to talk, under a multitude of different guises. When you start to get blocked numbers, followed by silent voicemails, to direct phone calls. If she is with the replacement, very possibly after the day she gets triggered with him as devaluation for him increases. Careful what you wish for. You may very well get that painting white. Just remember what follows that. A loop. White to black to white to black, on and on. In my case, it was far worse the second time. A third time, if that were to occur would kill me. I cannot take another psychological battering again. 

[santa]

When she shows up unsolicited on your doorstop. When she begins to directly text you asking you to talk, under a multitude of different guises. When you start to get blocked numbers, followed by silent voicemails, to direct phone calls. If she is with the replacement, very possibly after the day she gets triggered with him as devaluation for him increases. Careful what you wish for. You may very well get that painting white. Just remember what follows that. A loop. White to black to white to black, on and on. In my case, it was far worse the second time. A third time, if that were to occur would kill me. I cannot take another psychological battering again. 

There's no chance of us getting back together. We've got a kid though, so I've got to deal with this woman for the rest of my life. I'm just hoping we can find some respectable way to treat each other.

[Ironmanrises]

You will need a firm constitution and strong boundaries. Hang in there.

[Surnia]

Hi santa

Wow, it would be great you could see your child! 

I think yes, she wouldn't do that if you are really painted black.

There's no chance of us getting back together. We've got a kid though, so I've got to deal with this woman for the rest of my life. I'm just hoping we can find some respectable way to treat each other.

Yes, I think this is a great goal regarding the fact you have a child together. 

Are you a bit familiar with the communication tools?

[santa]

Hi santa

Wow, it would be great you could see your child! 

I think yes, she wouldn't do that if you are really painted black.

There's no chance of us getting back together. We've got a kid though, so I've got to deal with this woman for the rest of my life. I'm just hoping we can find some respectable way to treat each other.

Yes, I think this is a great goal regarding the fact you have a child together. 

Are you a bit familiar with the communication tools?

Yeah, I'm pretty excited to see my kid.

I'm not familiar with the communication tools. They sound helpful though. We need all the help we can get with that. Where can I find that?

[Surnia]

Yes, very true. 

The best starter I think is Validation: Communication using validation. What it is; how to do it.

Validation is a great tool for any communication.

Another good one would be to avoid circular arguments. Arguing - don't engage.

[santa]

Yes, very true. 

The best starter I think is Validation: Communication using validation. What it is; how to do it.

Validation is a great tool for any communication.

Another good one would be to avoid circular arguments. Arguing - don't engage.

Awesome

Thank you

[Surnia]

You are welcome. 

Keep us posted how is it going with your child.

[Iwalk-Heruns]

Hi santa

Wow, it would be great you could see your child! 

I think yes, she wouldn't do that if you are really painted black.

There's no chance of us getting back together. We've got a kid though, so I've got to deal with this woman for the rest of my life. I'm just hoping we can find some respectable way to treat each other.

Yes, I think this is a great goal regarding the fact you have a child together. 

Are you a bit familiar with the communication tools?

Surnia, is that true? I guess I was under the impression that you get painted black and later after time they may need you for whatever reason or temporarily forget what they are mad at you about or replacement explodes.  But once you are painted black it will always go back to devaluation.  I didn't think that because they were temporarily being reasonable that it means you were never painted black. The whole thing is confusing.

[letmeout]

Psychological battering = run for your life. I thought my ex purposely painted me black so he would have an excuse to rage. He admitted one time that raging and dumping his emotions on others made him feel good. Often he would act all happy-go-lucky after a rage. He was like a tornado, leaving chaos and destruction, but he never understood why people felt injured when he was done with them. 

[Rapt Reader]

Hi, santa 

Surnia gave you some good advice about using the communication tools and techniques to help with dealing with your Ex. Have you checked out any of the THE LESSONS links to the right-hand side of this page? The links there are good to check out along with the great ones that Surnia posted above. Here are some more that you should find helpful:

TOOLS: S.E.T. - Support, Empathy and Truth

Shared Parenting 

Co-parenting after the Split

I've found with the BPD people with my life that being painted black usually lasts for a certain amount of time (sometimes a short amount, sometimes longer), and then things will be better for awhile (sometimes a little while, sometimes longer). But since I've learned how to deal with them better--using Validation, S.E.T., Compassion, Empathy, Radical Acceptance--the painted black times have been much fewer and they don't last as long.

Since you need to deal with your Ex in order to co-parent your child, learning these tools and techniques is a really smart thing to do. You are really in the right place to learn these things, and you are very mindful in being willing to do it. The information in the links from surnia and included above should be helpful in navigating this frustrating and complicated relationship 

[Skip]

Surnia, is that true? I guess I was under the impression that you get painted black and later after time they may need you for whatever reason or temporarily forget what they are mad at you about or replacement explodes.  But once you are painted black it will always go back to devaluation.  I didn't think that because they were temporarily being reasonable that it means you were never painted black. The whole thing is confusing.

Be careful not to adopt "all or nothing" thinking yourself, Iwalk-Heruns.  Everyone is different and people with BPD are notoriously impulsive so things change more than they stay the same.  I might look at this more in terms of the idealization - when that extinguishes - we all become a mere mortal. 

Some ex's never want to see or hear from us again.  Some will remain in or social circle, work, or family and become detached and friendly and everything in between.  This is true BPD or not, although its fair to say that more exBPD relationships will be of the "never want to see or hear from us again".

Santa, you might do best posting about this on the Staying board. Members there are working these tools.  The way you handled the conversion is good.  Generally, lots of validation and letting the zingers fly by when they come is the best tactic.

You may want to look into parallel parenting with the objective of growing into co-parenting.  The experiences her on the board suggest this is better than the starting with o-parenting, damaging the relationship, and then moving to parallel parenting as a way to get peace.  Being proactive on this pays off.  The co-parenting board can help with this.

[Iwalk-Heruns]

Surnia, is that true? I guess I was under the impression that you get painted black and later after time they may need you for whatever reason or temporarily forget what they are mad at you about or replacement explodes.  But once you are painted black it will always go back to devaluation.  I didn't think that because they were temporarily being reasonable that it means you were never painted black. The whole thing is confusing.

Be careful not to adopt "all or nothing" thinking yourself, Iwalk-Heruns.  Everyone is different and people with BPD are notoriously impulsive so things change more than they stay the same.  I might look at this more in terms of the idealization - when that extinguishes - we all become a mere mortal. 

Some ex's never want to see or hear from us again.  Some will remain in or social circle, work, or family and become detached and friendly and everything in between.  This is true BPD or not, although its fair to say that more exBPD relationships will be of the "never want to see or hear from us again".

Santa, you might do best posting about this on the Staying board. Members there are working these tools.  The way you handled the conversion is good.  Generally, lots of validation and letting the zingers fly by when they come is the best tactic.

You may want to look into parallel parenting with the objective of growing into co-parenting.  The experiences her on the board suggest this is better than the starting with o-parenting, damaging the relationship, and then moving to parallel parenting as a way to get peace.  Being proactive on this pays off.  The co-parenting board can help with this.

Thanks skip!

I realize that some have to deal with their BPD ex and I feel for those people and agree it is crucial to learn the tools.

My circumstance is that mine leaves and then weeks, months later always comes back. So you think he is gone for good but he is not. He has done this several times and it is excruciating and very damaging to me.

So the reason for my question was to understand exactly what happens. I tend not to be an all or nothing thinker but I do have to put myself in the right frame of mind so that I do not allow him to treat me like a rag doll and wound me more. I have an undeniable attachment to him so if I start thinking I could make it work it makes me think there is a chance and I can't do that.

I guess my confusion stems from hearing people say there must be something unhealthy about us to even have been in the relationship in the first place and then I hear there are tools for you to make it better.  I guess it's just the difference between having to deal with someone and being able to walk away.

I am trying to detach. It's like survival for me to do this.

[nevaeh]

Psychological battering = run for your life. I thought my ex purposely painted me black so he would have an excuse to rage. He admitted one time that raging and dumping his emotions on others made him feel good. Often he would act all happy-go-lucky after a rage. He was like a tornado, leaving chaos and destruction, but he never understood why people felt injured when he was done with them. 

It has confounded me for the past 18 years of my marriage to uBPDh how he could have a rage (leaving a path of destruction, literally), subject me to days of silent treatment, and then one day he is laughing and joking like nothing happened.  I will never understand that and can no longer accept it. 

H and I had a fight a few months ago where he was mad at me for coming home 15 minutes later than I said I would.  He was so mad that he emptied the contents of the freezer onto the kitchen floor.  As I'm picking the stuff up (WHY do I DO that?) I'm screaming at him telling him that I can't take this anymore... .why does he have to ruin everything and throw things around and break things?  He got up in my face and yelled at me "would you rather I beat on you?"  I screamed back... ."you might as well beat on me... .I feel like every time you are doing this you are envisioning beating me up and that is a really scary thing!" 

The really bad part of all of this is that I have learned and taught myself to cope with these rages.  Psychological battering is right. 

[santa]

Hi, santa 

Surnia gave you some good advice about using the communication tools and techniques to help with dealing with your Ex. Have you checked out any of the THE LESSONS links to the right-hand side of this page? The links there are good to check out along with the great ones that Surnia posted above. Here are some more that you should find helpful:

TOOLS: S.E.T. - Support, Empathy and Truth

Shared Parenting 

Co-parenting after the Split

I've found with the BPD people with my life that being painted black usually lasts for a certain amount of time (sometimes a short amount, sometimes longer), and then things will be better for awhile (sometimes a little while, sometimes longer). But since I've learned how to deal with them better--using Validation, S.E.T., Compassion, Empathy, Radical Acceptance--the painted black times have been much fewer and they don't last as long.

Since you need to deal with your Ex in order to co-parent your child, learning these tools and techniques is a really smart thing to do. You are really in the right place to learn these things, and you are very mindful in being willing to do it. The information in the links from surnia and included above should be helpful in navigating this frustrating and complicated relationship 

This is good stuff.

Thank you.

[Surnia]

  santa

any news about seeing your child?

(Keeping my fingers crossed for you.)

[santa]

 santa

any news about seeing your child?

(Keeping my fingers crossed for you.)

Turns out she's "too sick" to spend the weekend with me. The ex said it seemed like she might be about to have an ear infection... .even though she's never had an ear infection before. She wasn't "too sick" for my ex to take her to day care Thursday. Just "too sick" to see her dad. I'm pretty irritated, but there's nothing I can do about it.

I'm supposed to have her for a week after Christmas. We'll see, I guess.

[santa]

Speaking of day care... .I'm pretty ticked off that she's in day care. The ex and I had always said that we weren't going to put her in day care. As soon as she started calling all the shots though... .straight to day care. I hate it... .but, once again, nothing I can do about it.

[Surnia]

Oh, not the good news. 

Sounds like she changed her mind again a bit. I can understand that you are ticked off that she is in day care.

So, right now you have legally no rights at all?

[santa]

Oh, not the good news. 

Sounds like she changed her mind again a bit. I can understand that you are ticked off that she is in day care.

So, right now you have legally no rights at all?

We have joint custody, so I do have rights. We agreed that she wouldn't travel when she's sick though. If it starts happening a lot, I can make an issue of it, but since it's the first time I just had to accept it.

She only goes to day care twice a week for 6 hours. My ex calls it "school", but it's day care. No 18 month old goes to school. It's ridiculous.

[Surnia]

I see. Yes, for the first time I would probably do the same thing, accept it.