are we minimizing abuse?

[Depression = 72% of members]

If you google 'my boyfriend hits me but I still love him', the only advice you will see is, "LEAVE NOW". Are we perpetuating our own misery by minimizing the 'abuse' by not simply saying that it is  ABUSE?

[frenchie]

If you google 'my boyfriend hits me but I still love him', the only advice you will see is, "LEAVE NOW". Are we perpetuating our own misery by minimizing the 'abuse' by not simply saying that it is  ABUSE?

[fromheeltoheal]

Oh, it was abuse alright, psychological, emotional and physical abuse in my case.  Yet I stayed.  The worst thing we can do is tolerate it because we think we deserve it; I never went there, I went to second worst, if I can just love her a little more, figure her out a little better, I can fix it and she won't need to do that.  Ha!  Nice try.  All it took was focusing on my needs for a minute and it became clear leaving was the only option.

[frenchie]

that's kind of my point. You don't see any advice on 'validating' the abuser's feelings, or how to 'communicate' with them, or 'tips and techniques' on living with a physically abusive person. 

[fromheeltoheal]

Yes, physical abuse is definitely crossing the line, although in my case the physical abuse was the least of it.  I'm twice as big as she is and her flailing didn't hurt, although still unacceptable, but the psychological and emotional abuse cut to the core.  Sometimes an abusive person sneaks up on you, certainly did on me; she'd say things that I didn't think were abusive at the time, but then think about it later and go 'wait a minute'.  And of course I didn't say anything, just got busy trying to 'fix' her again, and of course she escalated.  After a while the physical abuse was actually a relief from the crap coming out of her mouth, and it lowered her rage level too, which almost made it beneficial.  What the heck?  Sick sht man, gotta go.

[Findingmysong723]

That's true, I keep going back in forth in thinking my Ex was someone who has BPD or traits or is he just an abuser?

His Father was abusive alcoholic and abused his Mom, and I do believe that my Ex was a Bully at times in our relationship. I know he doesn't like how his Father was when he was growing up and wouldn't want to be like his Dad. I believe my Ex may of been the more sensitive brother and he feels more but he now takes that pain out on others. I remember him telling me about how his brothers used to tease him etc and now he is the Bully. He didn't speak to his Father for years, neither did his Mom but his Mom and her husband are able spend the Holidays together. My Ex and I spent a lot of time with his Father, I liked him, but of course his Father isn't the same guy anymore or doesn't behave that way anymore! Although, I blame his Father for hurting his family and hurting my Ex and the dysfunction that he helped make normal to him!

I also remember my Ex telling me once that "The way I behave isn't good, but what does it say about you for taking it?" I admit my low self esteem and taking his behavior wasn't healthy but isn't that what an abuser would say, right? Makes me think that even though his Mom and him are really close, the abuse that his Mom endured, my Ex may blame her a little bit because his Mom "allowed" this to happen in his home that was supposed to be a safe place. They say that the kids blame the abuser but that deep down there is a part that is angry at the abused parent for not getting away! I've read something like that.

Wanting to call him a Bully is something I keep having these fantasies of saying to him, I think it would hurt him but maybe give him an insight of what he has become. I was too far into the fog to say it to him when we were breaking up, I just told him he was a good person etc.

My Ex was emotionally abusive, verbal and I think he withdrew from sex on purpose but I could be wrong. However, He was never physical, but he broke something on the wall out of frustration. After trying to be intimate and medication causing issues etc and of course stress of money, he punched a hole in the door... .I was very freaked out. He later when into his car and went for a ride in his car, screaming about the situation, even losing his voice. I actually thought he was trying by leaving the house and screaming in the car instead of staying there freaking out. I remember him telling me after he came back and calmed down that he wanted me to hug him and tell him it would be okay. My Ex said "I'm like the girl in the relationship" or something like that. I admit, even know I kinda wish I would of just gave him a hug or held him, but I was scared and had every right to be!

[MrConfused]

Oh, it was abuse alright, psychological, emotional and physical abuse in my case.  Yet I stayed.  The worst thing we can do is tolerate it because we think we deserve it; I never went there, I went to second worst, if I can just love her a little more, figure her out a little better, I can fix it and she won't need to do that.  Ha!  Nice try.  All it took was focusing on my needs for a minute and it became clear leaving was the only option.

^^ This. I never had physical abuse, but I certainly had emotional and psychological abuse. I kept thinking that if I put up with it just a little longer, I'd be the one to finally fix her issues. I'd get glimpses of this, only for her to throw it back in my face. I kept getting told to leave by my friends but I kept pressing on, I'd invested so much. I didn't realise the damage I was doing to myself at the same time.

[Findingmysong723]

I remember him asking me, "are you scared of me?," I told him no but sometimes I feel nervous or uncomfortable. I remember him saying that's no good. I think I even told him I felt like " I was walking on eggshells or something like that," ah the irony.

I remember him telling me once that it was good I wasn't with an abusive person because I would be a person that would take it or something like that. So ironic, it's like wait you are an abusive partner, or maybe it was projection. I remember he had a thing about me being comfortable, he would say that he wanted me to feel at "home" in his apartment and at times I didn't. We were starting to be intimate and sometimes I can get a little nervous or awkward and he freaked out, he thought I flinched and the mood was ruined!

Ah all these thoughts... .

[Waifed]

There is definitely abuse. Being with a Waif that only raged outwardly once in 3 years it is more difficult to pick up on, especially once I was in the FOG.  The silent treatment was bad enough but the, refusing to communicate, circular arguments, subtle comments and well timed actions to mess with your head (self esteem) were brutal. I never realized how bad it affected me until the day after the relationship ended.  I could concentrate at work for the first time in 3 years. I thought I hated my job (family business she tried to get me to quit), but after 4 months I love it again.

The abuse is about as bad as a human can take mentally.

[Waifed]

I remember him asking me, "are you scared of me?," I told him no but sometimes I feel nervous or uncomfortable. I remember him saying that's no good. I think I even told him I felt like " I was walking on eggshells or something like that," ah the irony.

I remember him telling me once that it was good I wasn't with an abusive person because I would be a person that would take it or something like that. So ironic, it's like wait you are an abusive partner, or maybe it was projection. I remember he had a thing about me being comfortable, he would say that he wanted me to feel at "home" in his apartment and at times I didn't. We were starting to be intimate and sometimes I can get a little nervous or awkward and he freaked out, he thought I flinched and the mood was ruined!

Ah all these thoughts... .

Projection... .she used to always say she was scared of my temper. I never raised my voice except once. I can only imagine what was going through her head. Probably how she was going to mess with me next.

[frenchie]

I also remember my Ex telling me once that "The way I behave isn't good, but what does it say about you for taking it?"

[/quote]
That made me profoundly sad :'(

So why do we approach PDs with such 'kid gloves'? why all the 'tips and techniques'? whey don't we all just say, "Get the "F" out now" like with physical abusers?

[MrConfused]

The silent treatment was bad enough but the, refusing to communicate, circular arguments, subtle comments and well timed actions to mess with your head (self esteem) were brutal.

Did we date the same person? Mine *never* raged at me but she did all of the above. Silent treatment, refusing to answer certain questions. Passive aggressiveness & snarky comments.

I'd get fed up and call her out on it, only to find out that she was still upset/worred about things we'd already argued over & agreed to move on from (repeatedly) There was one big issue that she couldn't seem to understand I was ok with & that any hurt from it that might occur was my problem to deal with. I didn't need her to protect me, I'm capable of making my own choices.

As for the timing, yup it was always well timed. Usually when she knew I was out or thought I'd be out.

Mindgames, constantly.

[MrFox]

That's true, I keep going back in forth in thinking my Ex was someone who has BPD or traits or is he just an abuser?

I would say those things aren't mutually exclusive.  If someone is being abusive they are an abuser, regardless of the reason for them doing it.  Having BPD does not give one immunity from being labeled as an abuser, in my opinion.

My mother has BPD.  Growing up she emotionally and mentally abused my sister and I, occasionally did so physically.  She is an abuser.  The fact that she has BPD helps me understand why she behaved/behaves the way she does but it doesn't change what she did and continues to do to the people around her.

My exBPDgf never got violent but she blamed everything wrong in the relationship onto me.  She lied, she manipulated, she accused, she attempted to isolate me from friends and family, she did the silent treatment, she left me and then recycled me because I dared stand up to her, and when it ended she engaged in a smear campaign to destroy my life.  She is an abuser.  An abuser with BPD.

[love4meNOTu]

I knew instinctively that what he was doing to me was WRONG. I did not call it abuse (because he had not hit me), until I went to my therapist and she gave me the domestic violence "wheel".

Verbal attacks/ name calling / threats/ punishing sex/ forced communications... .following me from room to room screaming at me, holding me down during an argument because I wouldn't "listen", taping an argument that we were having because I might falsely accuse him of hitting me... .yea... right What the heck. His paranoid ideations, accusing me of all manner of things, so terribly twisted.

He is a sick man.

And now? He says I was the abuser. Because I pushed him away from me with my feet when he had me cornered on the bed screaming in my face.

Ok, that's enough... .I guess I had to get that out.

I have never encountered an individual like this before, and I pray to God I never will again.

I'm so very glad he is gone.

Now my children and I have peace in our home again. We are going to be ok.

[frenchie]

I'm very happy to hear that you got away from the abuse... all of you

[Findingmysong723]

Yea we all deserve better! Love isn't supposed to hurt! Think how great it will be, to be loved by someone who can really love you  with all the emotions that come with it!

[patientandclear]

I also remember my Ex telling me once that "The way I behave isn't good, but what does it say about you for taking it?"

Reading this makes me remember my ex telling me I was "naive." I pushed him to explain.  Turns out he meant I was naive because I'd offered a possible explanation for something he'd done (actually, when he left me) in terms of him having trust issues because of childhood abuse by trusted adults.  He said he considered my explanation but then decided, nah, he was just being a jerk (essentially).

He was basically saying he didn't respect him because I was letting him get away with this bad behavior.  He was right, on that score.

[Iwalk-Heruns]

Frenchie. I Couldn't agree with you more. I have made similar points on posts here about the tools only being for someone who has children or maybe parents with BPD or need to at least be cordial to an estranged partner for the children's sake.

In many of the circumstances here I think it is dangerous thinking to think that learning the tools may somehow save the relationship. If they aren't working on getting help I don't think that would work anyway. Even if they were up to the task of working on themselves, (which in most cases is unlikely)it would be extremely difficult.

validating an abuser is only asking for more abuse and letting them think it is ok. Mental illness or not it is still abuse and can be potentially life threatening and the emotional abuse will definitely suck the life out of you.

[State85]

I experienced the whole wheel of abuse... .emotional, verbal, and physical. When she was in a rage, she would not stop until she felt she had won, and then would say things like "just cause I did those things, does not mean I don't care". Then would ask me to give her a hug... .

[Changingman]

Hang on, have I missed something?

I thought having BPD MEANS you are abusive in the most terrible destructive emotional ways possible!

If it wasn't it wouldn't be a problem! Isn't that why we are. Here.

I was stripped of all humanity by my BPD, near murderious, suicidal, mental and emotional breakdown. And she knew.

Learning,

she is in hell.

Good.

Get help,

stop hurting people.

Goodbye