How do we all get here?

[Vatz]

Been reading the posts and what not. I read a bit about codependency and the type of personalities that get tied up in these kinds of relationships.

I mean, after reading so many stories, almost everyone is left devastated in one way or another. It looks as though by the end of these relationships we're left with so much less than we had, whether it be our sense of self, sanity, or financial security.

But worst of all is that pull. How so many folks (including myself) seem to still on some level desire such partners (not EVERYONE, of course.) Despite the loss, the pain, and the crazy-making that left us questioning whether or not any of it was real, or left us feeling alone even when right next to them, the *pull* is still there. It's like something out of a horror novel. After reading the stories, there seems almost a supernatural level of gravity these disordered people have. Is it us? Are we just vulnerable? But even so... . it's bad. It's just bad.

But how the hell do we even end up here? I mean, I get how one might seek out a support group. I mean, how do we get pulled in and when does it reach a point where it's just too damn hard to walk away? Also, why?

I really want to hear people's stories about this.

[Blimblam]

I really think the fact that we ended up here says something about us.  I am sure there are a lot of other people they have had "relations" with them do not get as devastated that they would end up here.

BUt man do I get where you are coming from.  I am still trying to figure out my own puzzle in all of this. 

I fully commited to mine heart and soul at the very core of my being.  Made myself completely vulnerable gave my full trust my 100%.  I had no idea what BPD was until after the fact.  I wanted to know why I had lost my marbles and felt like killing myself when I had never felt that way before.

I think most of her exs never gave there all they were less invested so got hurt less but I realy don't know, and I am not going to contact her exs.

[antjs]

I really think the fact that we ended up here says something about us.  I am sure there are a lot of other people they have had "relations" with them do not get as devastated that they would end up here.

BUt man do I get where you are coming from.  I am still trying to figure out my own puzzle in all of this.  

I fully commited to mine heart and soul at the very core of my being.  Made myself completely vulnerable gave my full trust my 100%.  I had no idea what BPD was until after the fact.  I wanted to know why I had lost my marbles and felt like killing myself when I had never felt that way before.

I think most of her exs never gave there all they were less invested so got hurt less but I realy don't know, and I am not going to contact her exs.

blimblam i did not last with my ex long. it was only 6 weeks. i realized and exposed her early. i was healthy enough to end it that soon. even my therapist said so. but what i find unhealthy is the grieving. she does not deserve one moment of sadness from me. my grieving is unjustified (at least on the surface i am still probing here). i too has invested so much love, trust and commitment during the first few weeks. my life was going bad that i have fully jumped into this relationship as it was the only "good" thing to see in my life at that time. i expected a lot out of this. i am sure some people just cross BPD partners they get rid of them, get over them and move forward, without searching, without knowing all these BPD terms and psychology. they are like "oh he\she is crazy." and next day they wake up have breakfast continue their life and they are 100 % ok with it. do you think the 100 % commitment did make us grieve that much ? i am grieving a 6 weeks old r\s for god's sake !

[Vatz]

Antony, great point about how some folks are like "She's crazy" and that's the end of it. I envy those people.

[DiamondSW]

I ended up here because I was so confused and confounded by her lies.  There were so many.  And they didn't make sense, they just contradicted themselves... . which made me confused further, frustrated and depressed... .

In short, I wanted answers.  Why was she acting so crazy and was it my fault?

I got my answers here and via a fabulous Therapist.

She was plain nuts.  Her mother was worse tho!   Married a total stranger in Scandinavia on the 1st day she got off the plane from the Middle East after skyping for 2 mths... . ah, that's real love!  (not) 

Internet dating is fine, internet marriages... . er... .   bit weird!

[Blimblam]

I really think the fact that we ended up here says something about us.  I am sure there are a lot of other people they have had "relations" with them do not get as devastated that they would end up here.

BUt man do I get where you are coming from.  I am still trying to figure out my own puzzle in all of this.  

I fully commited to mine heart and soul at the very core of my being.  Made myself completely vulnerable gave my full trust my 100%.  I had no idea what BPD was until after the fact.  I wanted to know why I had lost my marbles and felt like killing myself when I had never felt that way before.

I think most of her exs never gave there all they were less invested so got hurt less but I realy don't know, and I am not going to contact her exs.

blimblam i did not last with my ex long. it was only 6 weeks. i realized and exposed her early. i was healthy enough to end it that soon. even my therapist said so. but what i find unhealthy is the grieving. she does not deserve one moment of sadness from me. my grieving is unjustified (at least on the surface i am still probing here). i too has invested so much love, trust and commitment during the first few weeks. my life was going bad that i have fully jumped into this relationship as it was the only "good" thing to see in my life at that time. i expected a lot out of this. i am sure some people just cross BPD partners they get rid of them, get over them and move forward, without searching, without knowing all these BPD terms and psychology. they are like "oh he\she is crazy." and next day they wake up have breakfast continue their life and they are 100 % ok with it. do you think the 100 % commitment did make us grieve that much ? i am grieving a 6 weeks old r\s for god's sake !

antony I think you may have split her black to help cope with the grieving process.  Remember she is a human being and she does suffer quite a bit from her condition, she is a tormented soul.  If your love for her was real then of course she deserves your sorrow.  She tried to be that person for you she really wanted to, but she is disordered and she failed.  She tried to be your dream girl and when she realized that wasn't enough and felt trapped by it and that you weren't perfect she sabatoged it. You tried to you fully invested in the dream you were complicit.  Is that not worth feeling sorrow for? It is a tragedy it really is.

[Samsara121]

antony I think you may have split her black to help cope with the grieving process.  Remember she is a human being and she does suffer quite a bit from her condition, she is a tormented soul.  If your love for her was real then of course she deserves your sorrow.  She tried to be that person for you she really wanted to, but she is disordered and she failed.  She tried to be your dream girl and when she realized that wasn't enough and felt trapped by it and that you weren't perfect she sabatoged it. You tried to you fully invested in the dream you were complicit.  Is that not worth feeling sorrow for? It is a tragedy it really is.

I like your words Blimblam, thank you for keeping it grounded and compassionate.

After analysis, I realized that I ended up here mostly because I cannot say NO to heavy seduction. I lack so much love and attention that I step in disregarding all the red flags that are being put in my face. Before my last brief story with a pwBPD, I had NO idea of what a healthy r/s really is, I was taking the verbal abuse and manipulative behaviors without the strength to go away. I would fight it sometimes, but without any perspective, just out of my intuition, and then come back like nothing had happened. I ended up here because intermittent loving is a non-issue for me, as I'm not yet capable of consistent feelings because of my own issues with my FOO.

In hindsight, I know that in my life I was briefly involved with 2 pwBPD and yeah they are the most difficult partner to stay away from. It takes a great amount of time. Yet they also offered me a great opportunity to look deeply into myself and seek understanding. I grew so much out of my last r/s, in pain for sure, and also in long lasting self awareness benefits. I learned validation, boundaries, self respect, more love to myself. Now I focus on myself and go on with my T.

So hats off to everyone of us! Peace out

[antjs]

I really think the fact that we ended up here says something about us.  I am sure there are a lot of other people they have had "relations" with them do not get as devastated that they would end up here.

BUt man do I get where you are coming from.  I am still trying to figure out my own puzzle in all of this.  

I fully commited to mine heart and soul at the very core of my being.  Made myself completely vulnerable gave my full trust my 100%.  I had no idea what BPD was until after the fact.  I wanted to know why I had lost my marbles and felt like killing myself when I had never felt that way before.

I think most of her exs never gave there all they were less invested so got hurt less but I realy don't know, and I am not going to contact her exs.

blimblam i did not last with my ex long. it was only 6 weeks. i realized and exposed her early. i was healthy enough to end it that soon. even my therapist said so. but what i find unhealthy is the grieving. she does not deserve one moment of sadness from me. my grieving is unjustified (at least on the surface i am still probing here). i too has invested so much love, trust and commitment during the first few weeks. my life was going bad that i have fully jumped into this relationship as it was the only "good" thing to see in my life at that time. i expected a lot out of this. i am sure some people just cross BPD partners they get rid of them, get over them and move forward, without searching, without knowing all these BPD terms and psychology. they are like "oh he\she is crazy." and next day they wake up have breakfast continue their life and they are 100 % ok with it. do you think the 100 % commitment did make us grieve that much ? i am grieving a 6 weeks old r\s for god's sake !

antony I think you may have split her black to help cope with the grieving process.  Remember she is a human being and she does suffer quite a bit from her condition, she is a tormented soul.  If your love for her was real then of course she deserves your sorrow.  She tried to be that person for you she really wanted to, but she is disordered and she failed.  She tried to be your dream girl and when she realized that wasn't enough and felt trapped by it and that you weren't perfect she sabatoged it. You tried to you fully invested in the dream you were complicit.  Is that not worth feeling sorrow for? It is a tragedy it really is.

though i was really touched by your words and i was about to tear but all i got was the abuse. forget the intentions. i just should believe in what i see, hear or feel. when she said "i am a miserable woman. you can do better." i should have believed her. during the idealization phase, when i felt "its too good to be true." i should have believed my own words.

[Infared]

Quoting BlimBlam:

"I fully commited to mine heart and soul at the very core of my being.  Made myself completely vulnerable gave my full trust my 100%.  I had no idea what BPD was until after the fact.  I wanted to know why I had lost my marbles and felt like killing myself when I had never felt that way before."

Um... . me too!

The thing was I saw her doing bad things when I met her... . but she was nice to me and telling me tons of lies. Call me stupid... . but I DID NOT KNOW... . I have to say... . it was right there in front of me. GEE she lives with boyfriend (" oh... . but that relationship has been over for a year... . I am just living there"... . Now, I don't think HE knew that!)... . having sex with goofy married guy who has 4 kids... . Me scratching my head thinking, this girl is hot... . What the heck is she doing with him. She is telling me it is wrong and she feels bad about it (victim?... . hello... . she is out there cheating on her live-in boyfriend with this putz! Do I watch what she does? No way... . I listen to what she tells me... . poor hurt girl... . oh... . let me fix this for you... . DUH!)

I tell her I will not date her unless she is out on her own... . she has her own place in 2 weeks! (guess I laid the law down huh!). The mirroring starts and I am happier than I have ever been in my entire life... . this is the girl for me... I am ALL IN!.  This lasts 5 years... . (she cheating on me by then... . but I don't know. She is an expert.)... . it all "abruptly" ends (for me!). She off to new hero... . hey ... . wait a minute ... . I think I resembled that guy... . um... five years ago? 

Major pain, depression, suicidal. ... . but wait... . only person I have to forgive is me (very hard!)... . IT WAS ALL RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF ME BEFORE DATE ONE. ... . but I went anyway... . that won't happen to me... . she really loves me. Yeah right.

To be fair... . I knew nothing about BPD... . This $hit brought me to my knees. Brutal.

I got here here... . long after the fact to sort out and understand BPD to finally heal and create my own closure. God knows you will get none from a BPD. THEY ALWAYS.WANT THE WOUND WIDE OPEN. extremely sick individuals.

This website has REALLY helped me to understand what happened back there and to heal. Thank God for all of you!

[LettingGo14]

vatz -- I'll take a crack, based solely on my experience.  As I have progressed on this path, I've consciously stopped labeling myself and my ex-girlfriend, because I found that labels kept me stuck.   It has boiled down to three things for me:  (1) what I thought I had, (2) what I thought I lost, and (3) how I feel (emotions).

I met my ex-girlfriend after a difficult and cold marriage.  I was completely and utterly engaged by my ex-girlfriend in the idealization phase -- in part I was "rescued" and in part I felt I was "rescuing" her and I ignored all red flags because I imagined I found everything I wanted in a relationship [reality check:  my own projections blinded me to red flags].  I thought I had it all -- mentally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually [red flag:  soul mate talk].

The reality of the relationship involved the standard splitting, black/white thinking, emotional drama, BS, push/pull, and walking on eggshells.  The reality was sometimes really, really good and quite often, dreadful.  We cycled and recycled, until ultimately I was triangulated out and painted black.  Period.   And I wonder now why I couldn't get off the merry-go-round.

I imagined I lost my soul mate [reality:  not true] but my brain clung to the idea -- at least for a while -- that she was THE ONE.   And that I lost her.

Ultimately, in the devastation, I turned all attention back to myself -- and feeling my own feelings.  I still have days where I'm wondering What the heck.  But most days now, I'm sitting with the idea that I am where I am supposed to be.  Processing my emotions.  No longer numbing, or running, or ignoring.  

My relationship was a fantasy that I created in my mind.  The actual relationship was messy and not really satisfying.  But I wanted it to be awesome.  

I no longer want a soul mate.  I just want to be okay with me, good & bad, and to find someone ultimately who is okay being herself, good and bad.   And start there... . one step at a time.

[Alex86]

I have begun reading the posts of 2010. I 'm trying to respond to that question. In the end, I think all members should read his posts. His understanding of the disorder is profound. I have only been shaking my head. Take a small taste:

Borderlines don’t pretend to be victimized. They are at a stage of arrested development that promotes disordered thought about their inability to become whole. That’s a fancy way of saying they are immature and are showing you the age of development where they are stuck.

Because of the failure to separate and individuate during development, they often attract people who have “ideas of reference” about who they are. Borderlines then turn these people into pseudo-parents which further reinforces their unstable sense of self and causes them to flee. The easiest and most life affirming connection they make is with people who place them in “one-down” positions. Those are the rescuers, saviors and white knights as well as the voice hogs and self centered.

Rescuers, saviors, white knights are all “false selves.” They are all coats of armor to protect the “true self” from being hurt. Borderlines are attracted to the “false selves” of others because of their ability to value the needs of the Borderline *and* in return, Borderlines adapt themselves according to whatever the “false self” of the partner projects.

Confused? That’s OK. It will take some understanding of your identity which is now suffering a crisis.

Here’s probably what happened: The lack of stable self (the Borderline) bought protection out of weakness by attaching to the stronger “false” self, but this formed a false bond out of neediness for both parties. People who need helpless people to feel better about themselves, (hereafter known as vulnerable narcissists) pair up resplendently with Borderlines, whose compulsions involve attaching to people who have strong opinions about how they should live and then hating them for those opinions. This activates intra-psychic scapegoating and persecution fears which further fuel engulfment fears and create the need to escape. In effect, finalizing the distorted belief that BOTH PARTIES have that they have BOTH been victimized and cannot trust anyone.

Borderlines will impulsively find a new person with strong opinions and repeat the process or they will become hermits and never leave the house. Vulnerable Narcissists will also find a new rewarding mirror ball to feel better about the carefully constructed "false self."

That bears repeating: The Borderline lack of stable self bought protection out of weakness. The “false self” presented strength and offered it in exchange for the weakness. This is an immature, fantasy based scenario for both parties that could not be maintained because all humans need to be autonomous and act on their own free will before they can be healthy adults. A person with Borderline personality will be constantly struggling with this.

All good relationships have an element of childlike wonder in them. However, if a fantasy role (supported by the false self of the altruist and the true self of the Borderline) was the majority of the relationship, then one person is using the other to remain in a one-up parent position while the other remains in a childlike or irresponsible state.  For her to become mature means putting away childish expectations of being carried like a child in life or having a pseudo-parent for a partner.

And being a pseudo-parent is going to cause some demons to trigger in the mind of a Borderline. This is a person with an extremely fragile sense of self which causes her to have a need to displace blame for her anxiety concerning her failure to become “whole.”

In blame, people cast distorted perceptions about *others responsibility* for their painful, fractious self, which causes the recipients of their blame to become defensive and then reflect blame in return. That goes against exactly what Borderlines don’t want *intellectually* to happen; their abandonment. It does, however, do exactly what the *disordered belief* wants and needs concerning persecution, scapegoating and splitting.

Contrary to much of what is written by misinformed people who are still knee deep in their own pain, people suffering from Borderline aren’t doing this to you on purpose. This is a disorder.

Blame disallows any self-introspection to occur- for both parties. So let’s take a look at this again.

Borderlines borrow aspects of “others” to strengthen themselves. They do this with idealization of personality strength, in what can appear to the “other” like a soul mate bond. This causes projective identification on the part of the partner who projects “good” onto the other. Projecting good can also mean that the bad parts of the self are disowned and projected onto the other in order to be resolved.

That means that a younger woman who is doing her best to avoid growing up, may look for an older man who will encourage her helplessness but not her feelings about helplessness. If that young woman has Borderline personality disorder, she may even prefer a large age gap between her partner to balance the neediness of *both people* and make what she has to offer more viable. Youth and sex become a personalized commodity in the evaluation of the partner’s “needs.”

These two things can be very appealing to an older Man, but they are dependent upon an exchange. These relationships are not about equality and growing old together - they are about fighting growing old, for both parties. Feelings come out of this.

When the Borderline fear, which is defuse and pervasive, is displaced onto the attachment bond and the partner receives an attack on the false self without warning, two things happen- the partner either withdraws or feels forced to defend the “false” self. At this juncture, both parties are participants in maladaptive coping measures- especially those concerning identity.

How will you know and recognize your false self? When it doesn’t work anymore. Whatever was presented in strength has now become a weakness. If you started out as a rescuer, you will eventually become a victim. If you started out in a one up position, you will end up at the same level. Because your false self involves fantasy thinking rather than reality testing; it has not survived. As they say, the mask comes off.  Not theirs- YOURS.

If you are continually finding yourself in one-up positions in your relationships rather than a stance of equality, therein lies your need (to overcome.) Your drive toward these unequal partners supports your false self. You've got to stop repeating the lessons that you should have learned from previous failures of rescuing needy women and then feeling used by them. That’s further entrenching your armor.

You want a person to love you, not for what you can give them, but for who you are. Not your false self. Not the car you drive, the money you spend, your physique or appearance, but the true you. That little kid inside that’s behind all that armor, who you keep hidden, that just wants to be loved.

Let it happen but first let go of the need to pretend and fix your false self. It’s broken for a reason.  

[Soulslider]

I ended up here because I was so confused and confounded by her lies.  There were so many.  And they didn't make sense, they just contradicted themselves... . which made me confused further, frustrated and depressed... .

In short, I wanted answers.  Why was she acting so crazy and was it my fault?

I got my answers here... .


Yes me too 100%. I'm sure that I was vulnerable at the time as well, looking for a meaningful relationship. The red flags were there from the beginning and heck she even told me the first time I met here that she's DBPD. Just after a few days I noticed the many strange behaviours and it reminded me of the care work I did with EBD (emotional behavioral difficulties) teenagers. I thought I could help... . little did I know of BPD. Very good topic BTW, please don't blame yourself :-) take care

[Karmachameleon]

I've been struggling with this really badly.  I've been NC with my dBPDxbf for a little over a month and he moved to another state.  I also think my dad called and warned him not to contact me anymore, so he probably won't.  But how insane is it that that is secretly disappointing to me?  Really?  I know we are for sure broken up for good.  My family knows of some pretty scary stuff that he did and if I got back with him they would have me committed so I know it's not an option.  But there is this thing in the back of my head that starts thinking of any possible scenario for him to miraculously get better and be able to prove himself to my family and we could live happily ever after.  It is completely asinine and makes me so mad at myself.  How stupid could I possibly be?  And I sit and cry and tell myself that I've never wanted anything in my life more than this relationship.  Why?  How could I possibly think that?  I've found out so many lies and he was so mean and hurtful to me in the end.  I should be so thankful it's over.  Last night I thought I had the radical acceptance epiphany I've been waiting for.  Then this morning I woke up just sobbing for him.  It is ridiculous and I just want it to stop.  So, to answer your question, I have no idea how I got here except that educating myself seems to help somewhat.

[LostGhost]

Had an insightful session with my therapist today that coincides with the question. We discussed how being drawn to these people is very much like a severe addiction to drugs. Even when we get clean and sober when we're months out of the relationship and we might appear happier, healthier and stronger... . when the opportunity presents itself to take the drug again, it takes an unfathomable amount of willpower and determination to resist the urge. I fully expect to see a recycle attempt at some point. A large part of me hopes for it every day. Logically I know it will lead to further deterioration of my mental and emotional faculties. I know I'm setting myself up to experience further pain. I'm an addict. We all are. It makes no difference if the relationship was 6 weeks, 6 months or 6 years. We all took a hit of the same drug and now we're suffering.

Therapist made a distinction between mistakes and foolishness. We all made a mistake engaging with these people in the first place. Our gut instincts tried to prevent us from doing it, our minds perceived the red flags and tried to warn us about the threat. Yet we were blinded by our own desperate wants and needs. An honest mistake, one we can learn and grow from. But to reengage our exes in the hopes of having a different result is deliberate foolishness. Nothing good will come of it. But I know despite all the pain and suffering, I am likely to take one more hit of her drug if she comes around.

[neverloveagain]

Love toking the BPD crack pipe, no feeling quite like it.

[Soulslider]

Quoting Infared:

"Um... . me too!

The thing was I saw her doing bad things when I met her... . but she was nice to me and telling me tons of lies. Call me stupid... . but I DID NOT KNOW... . I have to say... . it was right there in front of me. GEE she lives with boyfriend (" oh... . but that relationship has been over for a year... . I am just living there"... . Now, I don't think HE knew that!)... . having sex with goofy married guy who has 4 kids... . Me scratching my head thinking, this girl is hot... . What the heck is she doing with him. She is telling me it is wrong and she feels bad about it (victim?... . hello... . she is out there cheating on her live-in boyfriend with this putz! Do I watch what she does? No way... . I listen to what she tells me... . poor hurt girl... . oh... . let me fix this for you... . DUH!)

I tell her I will not date her unless she is out on her own... . she has her own place in 2 weeks! (guess I laid the law down huh!). The mirroring starts and I am happier than I have ever been in my entire life... . this is the girl for me... I am ALL IN!.  This lasts 5 years... . (she cheating on me by then... . but I don't know. She is an expert.)... . it all "abruptly" ends (for me!). She off to new hero... . hey ... . wait a minute ... . I think I resembled that guy... . um... five years ago?  

Major pain, depression, suicidal. ... . but wait... . only person I have to forgive is me (very hard!)... . IT WAS ALL RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF ME BEFORE DATE ONE. ... . but I went anyway... . that won't happen to me... . she really loves me. Yeah right.

To be fair... . I knew nothing about BPD... . This $hit brought me to my knees. Brutal.

I got here here... . long after the fact to sort out and understand BPD to finally heal and create my own closure. God knows you will get none from a BPD. THEY ALWAYS.WANT THE WOUND WIDE OPEN. extremely sick individuals.

This website has REALLY helped me to understand what happened back there and to heal. Thank God for all of you!"

Infared, this could have been my relationship just as well! When we had our first major break up, I was on my knees until I got back with her. I didn't want to leave her! Even though deep down I knew I'm just holding onto a dream. When it "abruptly" ended, I broke it off when I reached a point of no return (I had to follow my gut instinct) I knew it's going to be a long long painful process. Leaving them is probably just as hard as being left. They all have their own impications

I know it's been said and stated here many times, but it's mind wrecking how similar these relationships are! No wonder!

[Confused?]

I know I got here asking if it was my fault and could I do better and the answer is no. Could not have done anything differently or it probably would have brought me to the point of my body fully shutting down. I was here like most asking how can a person actually be like this? Just a fantasy I guess. A book, a mirror, and whatever they need to be to survive. It kind of reminds me of Santa Claus. When u were a kid you believed he was real and then you grew up and eventually you were told the truth. But how can there be a human being in this world that was completely made up but never told the truth eventually. A person that just kept pretending to be what you thought they were. That's the main reason I am here

[Vatz]

You know, regarding lies, I sort of don't want to know when she was telling the truth or not. It's too scary, and I don't really need that can of worms. Will it help me develop? Maybe. But maybe all I might learn is that she lied and that's it. Whatever hard work I put in was predicated on a lie. On fantasy. It's a good word to use, it's harsh but it paints a good picture.

It's less than a week till she's supposed to leave, and although I anticipate loss, part of me is hopeful that it'll be the first step in crawling out of the hole that I got myself into.

After reading your replies, and insights, I have to remind myself that the biggest factor in all this pain is me. I let myself drink the kool-aid, and re-engage. I may not have *deserved* what happened, but over the span of four years, I *earned* my pain through poor decisions and ignoring my gut. So there's that. Thanks to everyone for the responses, and for the support.

[Blimblam]

You know, regarding lies, I sort of don't want to know when she was telling the truth or not. It's too scary, and I don't really need that can of worms. Will it help me develop? Maybe. But maybe all I might learn is that she lied and that's it. Whatever hard work I put in was predicated on a lie. On fantasy. It's a good word to use, it's harsh but it paints a good picture.

It's less than a week till she's supposed to leave, and although I anticipate loss, part of me is hopeful that it'll be the first step in crawling out of the hole that I got myself into.

After reading your replies, and insights, I have to remind myself that the biggest factor in all this pain is me. I let myself drink the kool-aid, and re-engage. I may not have *deserved* what happened, but over the span of four years, I *earned* my pain through poor decisions and ignoring my gut. So there's that. Thanks to everyone for the responses, and for the support.

Yeah, I feel you.  It's like yeah I saw the man behind the curtain.  That lets you know you weren't crazy or the source of the problem.  There is still the pain to process through though.  It's like all the inner demons we have in us have been unleashed to wreck havoc in our mind and lives in the aftermath.  How do we go about tackling those?

[Samsara121]

Thank you Alex86 for the thread of 2010. It hits home for me!

I'm 4 months b/u with my pwBPD. She has now become an hermit, doing drugs and not leaving home beside her job. We are in LC.

I smiled at the concept of "two partners not willing to grow up". The ambiguity of the r/s and the mirroring made me aware of what I COULD live and what I COULD NOT. Being the strong one all the time is exhausting and does not correspond to whom I wanna be. By her mirroring my ex- would show me how great it is to be supported in tough times, she truly touched me in places I never thought exist in myself.

Respecting her and considering her as an equal was always in my mind, now I feel the need to move on and meet someone else, with all what I've learned I feel more confident with myself.

Thank you LostGhost also for you sharing about mistakes and foolishness. I also feel like an addict at time, and fancy a recycling. Then I go back to the "deal breakers" and cool down. 

Thank you all for your sharing!

[jackhzrd]

vatz -- I'll take a crack, based solely on my experience.  As I have progressed on this path, I've consciously stopped labeling myself and my ex-girlfriend, because I found that labels kept me stuck.   It has boiled down to three things for me:  (1) what I thought I had, (2) what I thought I lost, and (3) how I feel (emotions).

I met my ex-girlfriend after a difficult and cold marriage.  I was completely and utterly engaged by my ex-girlfriend in the idealization phase -- in part I was "rescued" and in part I felt I was "rescuing" her and I ignored all red flags because I imagined I found everything I wanted in a relationship [reality check:  my own projections blinded me to red flags].  I thought I had it all -- mentally, emotionally, physically, and spiritually [red flag:  soul mate talk].

The reality of the relationship involved the standard splitting, black/white thinking, emotional drama, BS, push/pull, and walking on eggshells.  The reality was sometimes really, really good and quite often, dreadful.  We cycled and recycled, until ultimately I was triangulated out and painted black.  Period.   And I wonder now why I couldn't get off the merry-go-round.

I imagined I lost my soul mate [reality:  not true] but my brain clung to the idea -- at least for a while -- that she was THE ONE.   And that I lost her.

Ultimately, in the devastation, I turned all attention back to myself -- and feeling my own feelings.  I still have days where I'm wondering What the heck.  But most days now, I'm sitting with the idea that I am where I am supposed to be.  Processing my emotions.  No longer numbing, or running, or ignoring.  

My relationship was a fantasy that I created in my mind.  The actual relationship was messy and not really satisfying.  But I wanted it to be awesome.  

I no longer want a soul mate.  I just want to be okay with me, good & bad, and to find someone ultimately who is okay being herself, good and bad.   And start there... . one step at a time.

Amen brother! 

Nothing in my life has sucked as hard as the last 10 months. But I should still have a good 50 years in me so I'm glad I'm over and done with the sucking hard -part. I starting to feel that I 'needed that' in order to grow and now I'm focusing on me and if there's love for me in the future, I'll welcome it with open, strong, experienced and just a tad bit cautious, arms!

[Ventus2ct]

Earlier in the thread re wanting them back despite knowing how they made us feel, I was explaining to my counsellor the other day, that the high's were higher than anything I've ever come across, the low's, lower than anything too. I stated that the relationship made me feel alive, the first time in years. A normal loving relationship just seems boring, I simply don't respect the other person. Is this the same for the rest of you?

I too wake up every day with the hope that she will make some form of contact, come rushing back, say she made a mistake etc etc but the reality is she won't as i suspect she has someone else by now. What makes us feel this way, why can't we see it? When everyone else around us can clearly!

Its madness but I crave for it still every day/night, I am an addict too it would appear!

[brokenbutalive]

Earlier in the thread re wanting them back despite knowing how they made us feel, I was explaining to my counsellor the other day, that the high's were higher than anything I've ever come across, the low's, lower than anything too. I stated that the relationship made me feel alive, the first time in years. A normal loving relationship just seems boring, I simply don't respect the other person. Is this the same for the rest of you?

I too wake up every day with the hope that she will make some form of contact, come rushing back, say she made a mistake etc etc but the reality is she won't as i suspect she has someone else by now. What makes us feel this way, why can't we see it? When everyone else around us can clearly!

Its madness but I crave for it still every day/night, I am an addict too it would appear!

Yes, it's the same for me. Maybe not the part about wanting her back, but definitely the part about not wanting anyone else because they seem boring in comparison. I feel like I've exhausted the medium with her. No-one will ever make me feel like that again so why bother.

When we first broke up, I went through a spell of going to bars non stop trying to meet new girls and move on. I discovered two things. First that I no longer feared making a fool of myself or being rejected when I tried to chat up girls because they're not her so why would I care. A good thing you might think but the other side of the coin is that there is quite simply no fun or interest in dating because I don't care enough. It's just going through the motions, pretending, when all I want to do is go back home, bury myself under the duvet and think about her.

The scale of the amount of work I have to do on myself to get my life back together is immense.

[Ihope2]

Reading about Trauma Bonding is very helpful to me to understand how I got here.  May I recommend Patrick Carnes' book "Betrayal Bonds".

Being in a high drama, high conflict relationship of such high intensity FEELS like it is a close, intimate relationship, but intensity does not = intimacy!

Our system can get used to the chemical rush associated with high drama, conflict and betrayal, pain and anguish and then the rush of intensity when we recycle and make up again after the drama.  Only for it to be repeated over and over again.

If we were exposed to similar dynamics in our FOO, it can be that we develop the propensity to be attracted to people who treat us badly!

It is like being addicted to, or living in a soap opera! An endless cycle of drama, high emotion, intensity, betrayal, highly-charged break up and make up events.

[Ventus2ct]

Yes, it's the same for me. Maybe not the part about wanting her back, but definitely the part about not wanting anyone else because they seem boring in comparison. I feel like I've exhausted the medium with her. No-one will ever make me feel like that again so why bother.

When we first broke up, I went through a spell of going to bars non stop trying to meet new girls and move on. I discovered two things. First that I no longer feared making a fool of myself or being rejected when I tried to chat up girls because they're not her so why would I care. A good thing you might think but the other side of the coin is that there is quite simply no fun or interest in dating because I don't care enough. It's just going through the motions, pretending, when all I want to do is go back home, bury myself under the duvet and think about her.

The scale of the amount of work I have to do on myself to get my life back together is immense.

Am in the exact same state, I have loads of girls wishing to go out with me, and not one even raises a flicker, have zero interest at all in dating.

I too am aware of the amount of work and understanding of myself in order to progress, I have been NC 2 months and still miss the illusion like crazy, I ask myself was it all an illusion or was it real, were the feelings real or was I just looking into a mirror and seeing what I'd always wanted to see as a partner.

Counsellor said I have 2 options, learn about how it all happened with "crazy" understand the how's and why's. She said if I still wished to have this style of relationship, i'd be unhappy, they'd never last and kids would not be a realistic long term option.

Or I could have a "boring" relationship with kids and a wife, i.e. normal relationship.

I have to somehow learn to accept that boring is in fact not boring and is in fact the norm, am sure this all stems back from childhood issues, in seeing a situation that I did have some control over and trying to change the outcome from one experienced when a very young child and having no control.

But yes, I would have her back tomorrow in an instant even now!

[Infared]

Just wanted to say that I identify with all of the conversation on this page and that I am so glad this website is here... . It is so valuable to my psyche to know of others like myself with similar experiences... . You ALL help me.

[Time4me]

I got here when my husband was diagnosed BPD 25 years into our marriage.   It causes me to go into therapy and I found out I was co-dependent.  I started researching BPD and found this site.  It has been a life saver for me.  I haven't posted much but I've been reading for 2 years now.  I am now in the middle of a divorce.  My marriage lasted 27 years. My marriage was difficult from the get go.  About 10 years ago my husband started having panic attacks and extreme anxiety.  It got him to the hospital eventually where he got diagnosed BPD.  It took almost 8 years and countless doctors and therapists and hospital visits to get that diagnosis.  I am thankful I now know what I am dealing with and for this site that has helped me so much.  Thank you to all that post.

[fromheeltoheal]

Yes, my ex was an expert at getting emotional hooks in an attachment, good at attaching in general, she has to be, because she is convinced everyone will leave her, and she's got a lot of references of exes who have left her to reinforce that belief, so she goes in strong and hard, definitely was intoxicating as hell for me, to the point I didn't really notice at first when the devaluation started.  I now realize that her main ploy is to 'catch' someone and then attempt to make them feel so badly about themselves that they will never leave; it never works, or not for long anyway, but in her head it's the only way she can possibly see to get someone to stick around, fear of abandonment driving it all, and of course her opinion of herself is so low, when it isn't narcissistically high as compensation, that she couldn't imagine someone sticking around if she was just her self, open and honest and present.  Then again, a borderline does not have a fully formed self, she needs someone else to 'complete' her, in that unhealthy fusing-of-two-psyches-into-one way.

But that's her.  I was in a relatively short relationship with her, more than long enough to do damage, but today it's more helpful to focus on me entirely.  There's that persistent thing I do where I confuse the longing for love, the quest, for real love, something I'm working very hard on, now that I know what I do, and I have my ex to thank for that.  That's what kept me hooked, it wasn't anything she was doing, in fact had I looked at her behavior objectively I would have walked away much sooner, it was my intense need to keep moving forward, keep trying but never attaining the 'love' I thought was there; that longing was the drive, just like the longing an addict feels for his substance, never attainable, and how would it feel if it was?

[antjs]

Yes, my ex was an expert at getting emotional hooks in an attachment, good at attaching in general, she has to be, because she is convinced everyone will leave her, and she's got a lot of references of exes who have left her to reinforce that belief, so she goes in strong and hard, definitely was intoxicating as hell for me, to the point I didn't really notice at first when the devaluation started.  I now realize that her main ploy is to 'catch' someone and then attempt to make them feel so badly about themselves that they will never leave; it never works, or not for long anyway, but in her head it's the only way she can possibly see to get someone to stick around, fear of abandonment driving it all, and of course her opinion of herself is so low, when it isn't narcissistically high as compensation, that she couldn't imagine someone sticking around if she was just her self, open and honest and present.  Then again, a borderline does not have a fully formed self, she needs someone else to 'complete' her, in that unhealthy fusing-of-two-psyches-into-one way.

But that's her.  I was in a relatively short relationship with her, more than long enough to do damage, but today it's more helpful to focus on me entirely.  There's that persistent thing I do where I confuse the longing for love, the quest, for real love, something I'm working very hard on, now that I know what I do, and I have my ex to thank for that.  That's what kept me hooked, it wasn't anything she was doing, in fact had I looked at her behavior objectively I would have walked away much sooner, it was my intense need to keep moving forward, keep trying but never attaining the 'love' I thought was there; that longing was the drive, just like the longing an addict feels for his substance, never attainable, and how would it feel if it was?

i can write this post exactly as it is. thank you.