Friends with Benefits

[Depression = 72% of members]

OK this is probably an odd question, but one that I have been thinking about for awhile.  My ex uBPDgf seemingly had the following issue.  First before I start I am almost 100% sure that she never cheated on me, and didn't want to.  I think she KNEW she had an issue, and I think she thought that her relationship with me was her last chance at a relationship (meaning if it didn't work she was done trying with anyone).

She had a very difficult time being in a relationship with me (just the relationship label).  If she thought of us a friends with benefits than everything was fine.  Even if there was NO DIFFERENCE in how we interacted with each other. 

Does anyone else have a similar experience?  I never did understand this myself.

[Tincup]

OK this is probably an odd question, but one that I have been thinking about for awhile.  My ex uBPDgf seemingly had the following issue.  First before I start I am almost 100% sure that she never cheated on me, and didn't want to.  I think she KNEW she had an issue, and I think she thought that her relationship with me was her last chance at a relationship (meaning if it didn't work she was done trying with anyone).

She had a very difficult time being in a relationship with me (just the relationship label).  If she thought of us a friends with benefits than everything was fine.  Even if there was NO DIFFERENCE in how we interacted with each other. 

Does anyone else have a similar experience?  I never did understand this myself.

[Frankcostello]

More than likely she enjoyed the intimacy and companionship but wanted to keep her options open. 

[Blimblam]

More than likely she enjoyed the intimacy and companionship but wanted to keep her options open. 

I agree with this.  Not that she was actively looking but they find round about ways of making whatever they feel like doing acceptable. 

[patientandclear]

I have seen many stories with that dynamic here. My ex pursued a variation on that approach: we were functionally partners except though he called it "friends." The label was super important to him--I think because then there wouldn't be expectations he knew he wouldn't be able to sustain, and thus he thought he would not risk losing our r/s.

Sadly it did not work out that way, but that is another topic.

[BacknthSaddle]

My ex danced around the relationship "label" during and since as well.  I'm sure this has something to do with keeping options open, but there is probably a deeper issue too related to defenses against shame, dissociation, etc.  Perhaps one of our more senior members can chime in with thoughts on this. 

[Ventus2ct]

Yes, had my ex offer that to me when we first started together, I declined and stated that she either has a relationship or nothing.

When we first broke up, she instigated a FWB situation which then in her mind gave her carte blanch to do as she pleased.

She constantly stated that she wished to be "beholden to no one".

So in effect as said above, she wanted to keep her options open but also wanted all the physical benefits of a relationship but without any of the associated commitment.

I sensed that she had been seriously let down with all her boyfriends in the past and can recall one conversation where she stated that she made me promise to "Not let her down".

I find all these similar traits that keep appearing on this board so very fascinating and surely they must be "more" than pure coincidence?

[goldylamont]

Tincup my guess is that FwB only works for her if she's the one benefiting much more than you.

If you were seriously considering this, I wouldn't do it without already having another partner I was seeing. How do you think your ex would react to being just "FwB" if you couldn't hang out with her because you were going out on a date with your other romantic interest and she didn't have anybody to be with that night? My bet is she'd be begging for a relationship  then when you stopped seeing your other lover she'd dump you for another guy.

[myself]

A way to stay kind-of connected, on the surface, without much depth.

Is that less feelings of abandonment? Easier to be the one who abandons?

It's probably both, and a whole lot more.

When you don't admit to yourself who you really are, is any r/s real?

The 'benefits' can be very temporary, as well as an illusion.

Although I can see how they could solidify, with choice and honest effort.

[Arminius]

Ventus, 'beholden to no one' struck a chord with me! Mine, at the end, when she admitted large debts ($30k with nothing to show, not even fancy shoes... .) would not accept help from me, and stated she had kept it secret all those years as she didn't want to be beholden to me... .These people seem to have huge egos.

When I first met her, I was still married. I was honest about that, and the fact that the marriage was in the separate bedrooms stage. My uBPDxgf , who oozed a confident persona at that time, said 'No problem, it just means things are on my terms.'

When she said that she oozed confidence, control, experience and even sophistication , if you can imagine that. She seemed, well, worldly.

As soon as we were together, she lost all worldliness. The 'waif' became far more prominent and she herself became more childlike, more biddable... .obedient almost.  Over time she blamed me for making her change.

Wow, writing this down, prompted by your comments, is really, REALLY helpful. The signs were there, they are always there, we just don't see them, caught as we are in their wonderful, beautiful and dangerous web.

[Tincup]

Thanks for the comments everyone.  I have to be honest in that I don't think she said friends with benefits to keep her options open.  I think deep down she really liked being with me.  I think it was something deeper than that.  She was constantly trying to label the relationship.  She told me right up front that she would never get married again.  I was coming out of a marriage when we met.  We had been to a couple of social events about a year before we started dating.  I didn't know her at all during those events.  But a year later on our first date she told me everything that I did during the social events, even down to what clothes I was wearing (talk about a screaming red flag that I ignored). 

I really think I was targeted by her because she was attracted to me, and I was SAFE.  Meaning she really thought I was her last hope.  I think as long as she was able to attach that label to the relationship than it was less pressure to her.  I think in a "relationship" she felt too needy (that is her exact words once when we talked about it). 

[patientandclear]

Absolutely, Tincup.

A friend described my ex's desire to be my partner in all but name this way: "he can only be intimate by denying that's what is going on."

Simple, but an incredibly challenging situation when understood that way.

Why/how did that arrangement end (or did you decline it)?

[BorisAcusio]

Thanks for the comments everyone.  I have to be honest in that I don't think she said friends with benefits to keep her options open.  I think deep down she really liked being with me.  I think it was something deeper than that.  She was constantly trying to label the relationship.  She told me right up front that she would never get married again.  I was coming out of a marriage when we met.  We had been to a couple of social events about a year before we started dating.  I didn't know her at all during those events.  But a year later on our first date she told me everything that I did during the social events, even down to what clothes I was wearing (talk about a screaming red flag that I ignored).  

I really think I was targeted by her because she was attracted to me, and I was SAFE.  Meaning she really thought I was her last hope.  I think as long as she was able to attach that label to the relationship than it was less pressure to her.  I think in a "relationship" she felt too needy (that is her exact words once when we talked about it).  

You're a bit overcomplicating the matter. The basic dynamics here: she gets her needs met, without being hold accountable.

[goldylamont]

TinCup, I read some of your previous posts and it seems like this Friends with Benefits dynamic has pretty much pervaded much of the r/s with your ex, for years? Many of us here are aware of how dishonest a pwBPD can be, yet, there's plenty times when they are trying to be as honest as possible. They tell us their truth, but we refuse to listen. From my outside perspective it just seems like there has been a dance going on between you two for the last half decade. Of course there is some real attraction going on since she keeps coming back, I don't mean to deny this exists. But for years this woman has told you that what she desires is FwB. You state that you only want to be intimate in a r/s. So, she mirrors your desire for this to get the intimacy and sex she wants from you, then when the r/s hat doesn't fit anymore she walks away.

You said that your ex gets sexually involved very fast. That she is very intense sexually to the point where you think she uses it to soothe and feel close. And we also know she's consistent in not wanting to be in a committed r/s with you, although she will do it for a few months before bailing or bringing drama. You also mention that you are nearly 100% sure that she doesn't cheat. In a sense I feel like my ex didn't *want* to cheat either. I get that.

But I think it's important to think about this possibility: you are dealing with a woman who shows and says she doesn't want to be committed to you long term. your r/s takes frequent breaks. she's highly sexual and gets involved sexually very very fast, using sex to self soothe. she either doesn't cheat or doesn't want to. you breakup, a lot, and then she returns. she sees other men during these breaks, sometimes telling you about them (which of course hurts your feelings).

To me I can see why she keeps returning to the r/s--because her needs are being met. She likes being with you but not committed long term. She knows she can end the r/s when she wants, see other people when she wants, and then come back to you when she wants (this may not be the case now if you are done for good). Sure, she'll have to work at it and there will be some friction while you work out your feelings, but ultimately she's getting close to having real intimacy, while never following through on long term commitment.

You openly tell her you only want a r/s with her, she resists, then eventually gives in (mirroring your desires) to get the intimacy she wants. But there's no real follow through, we can see this in her actions.

Yes sometimes when you breakup you could argue that she was feeling too close to you. But you have to be very careful to not become too attached to the idea of having a special bond that no one else has with this person. All day you can read others' stories here and their suffering coming to terms when realizing that although they may be special, what's more important to a pwBPD is their immediate needs.

All of this is to say that some of the times you broke up could be rooted in abandonment fears and her fears of being too close. But it also could be that she just wanted to be with someone else. So many stories on here about pwBPD who will create arguments and drama to purposefully cause a breakup. And at the root of it is not just that we are so special to them that we scare them with our extremely close bond. The root of it sometimes is that they simply want someone else to meet the needs we (foolishly? narcissistically? naively?) think we can only give them.

Maybe she doesn't want to cheat. So being FwB is a way for her to get her needs met with other men while still being able to be intimate with you when she feels the need.

[Tincup]

Wow, this all has given me stuff to think about. I want to be clear on a couple of points.  First we are at least 9 months post break up and I am 100% NC and do not want any contact.  I also want to be clear that we were in a committed relationship.  I think when she made the statements about FWB it was to make her feel less needy, not so she could be with other guys.  She was married for over 20 years before me, and I know her ex cheated on her because her kids confirmed that piece.  So I really don't think she cheated on me.  So I just don't think it was to keep her options open.  I think she was honest with me about not getting married because of the horrible experience that she went through with her ex.  She was in her 50's and didn't want to go through that again.  I do think she intended to stay with me long term though.

[Arminius]

I don't have any evidence  that mine was unfaithful. I can't see how she would have had the time as we spend all our non work time together, and she didn't ever go out with friends. But... .I have t accept that if there is a will ( and I don't know if there was) there is a way.

What I do know is that she , like many, moves in to sex dad's. It's a soother, a validator, a control point. They use it for all three.