VDay coming up and Anniversary at end of the month

[hurthusband]

made it through another day...

took kids to Boy Scouts last night and home... then went back to parents to sleep.  VDay coming up and Anniversary at end of the month really make things weird...

[sweetheart]

I can hear that it's difficult being apart from your wife on special occasions, my h was in hospital last year for our anniversary and I was sad but I also accepted that it was a positive thing for our marriage. You living apart from your wife at the moment gives you both some much needed space to just catch your breath and for you to refocus on what are the important things that need doing so that you can aim to eventually get back home.

Remember though HH you can send a card, or flowers, whatever might be right for you at the moment to let your wife know how you feel about her.

I'm glad to hear what sounds like a relatively stress free day for you, taking your son to scouts and getting a good nights rest.

[BestVersionOfMe]

made it through another day...

took kids to Boy Scouts last night and home... then went back to parents to sleep.  VDay coming up and Anniversary at end of the month really make things weird...

My wife started the day with saying in a text, "I'd like to figure out what days you want kids this weekend so that I can plan my weekend."  I didn't even respond because I know her motivation for doing so so I refuse to give her a reaction.  About an hour later some friends sent us a group text to hang out with the kids and my wife replied, "sure sounds fun!"  So at the end of the day, she had nothing going on anyways and we will all spend time together going on a hike, having a bbq, and roasting marshmallows.  Then she sends two lengthy awful texts about everything but the kitchen sink.  Didn't respond to those either and then I came home and she acted as if nothing had transpired.  Not sure where I'm going with that.  I guess Vday is just a commercialized holiday and has nothing to do with love and respect.  Hang in there. 

[Michelle27]

I am really struggling with even wanting to celebrate Velentine's Day at all.  It's frustrating when I am committed to stay for a certain length of time while he works on his stuff and I work on mine.  But I'm not sure I feel like "celebrating" when I'm unsure if a year from now we'll still be together or not.  I know he has big plans... .he's been talking all week about my amazing gift and asking how I'd like to celebrate.  I'm not being enthusiastic but also not dismissive either.  I just want it over with.  *sigh*  And less than 2 weeks after V Day, it's my birthday.  Is it wrong that I just want to go away and celebrate by myself?

[hurthusband]

VDay is a day of pain.  That is what I see.

Last night... I went home to confront problem with my son and afterwards go to see my dying grandfather.  My wife who we are on tenuous ground as i do not live at home wanted to go.  She went with me and was very kind.  I had made reservations for VDay and asked if she wanted to go.  She started getting sad as we went home which eventually lead back to her being upset over my mother.  My mother who had threatened her few days ago after my wife threatened to take kids from me.  I told her that my mother was wrong in what she did.  I told her that even.  I said though while no excuse she too threatened me and that fed into the situation.  I do not know what my wife wants.  She wants my family gone but wants me happy.  She the said she hated me and I will never get to see the kids again.

Now she wants to go to lunch but not talk to me.  Just cause she has nobody else.

I do not know what penalty to make my mother face that is fair at this point... what is right in defending my wife but also myself.

This holiday is stressing things even more.

[momtara]

How about saying next time, "I don't want to talk about my mother  and I have told her not to talk about you anymore because it only causes fighting, so let's move on."  No one should have to face a 'penalty.'

[Grey Kitty]

Two very good boundaries for you:

"Wife, I will not speak to you about my mother."

"Mother, I will not speak to you about my wife."

That is all you need to say when either of them brings up the other. You absolutely know that NOTHING good will come when either of them starts telling you what the other is doing wrong, and that is all they will talk about.

Hang in there and good luck with your vday lunch.

[thepenguin]

I'm in the same boat as many on here. I just try to remind myself. Vday is just another day - it's a day for Hallmark and others to make a whole ton of money. It's commercialization of a calendar day, nothing more.

[momtara]

My ex thought it was a stupid holiday and we never did anything for it.  So I'm pretty much doing what I did when I was married: Nothing.

[Zon]

hurthusband,

Not that it necessarily helps, but I pretty much have just survived our anniversary and Valentine's Day with them being only a few days apart.  I bought some flowers for her and a couple of things she likes to eat.  I did not get red roses because I did not want to convey too much meaning, however, the flowers I did get were pretty.  For more fun, we had MC between those two days.   

I had researched quite awhile what to get your wife when in MC and things are not going grand.

[hurthusband]

survived VDay... whole thing was put under more stress as my grandfather died on Friday. Anniversary on 26th

Bit out of it right now.  Vday had good moments and bad moments.  Funeral today. 

[momtara]

sorry to hear about the bad and about your grandfather but i'm glad you survived and that some of it was nice. you are a trooper! if things get worse, please do reach out to someone professional who is more aggressive and can do something positive for your situation.

[hurthusband]

VDay was strange.  I had planned on taking the day off and took off from moms business to spend time with my wife.  I had booked a hotel room and dinner reservations.  It actually started Friday.  Friday morning my wife was blasting me then I got word my grandfather died.  I had put off some Thursday work onto Friday needing to get it done before Saturday cause I was taking off, but when grandfather died, my wife was kind and wanted to be there for me.  We went to my grandmothers to comfort her and my wife said she would ride with me to get some work done.  I wouldnt get it all, but I could get some.  I kept being ultra paranoid that it would upset her.

Anyways, we got through day and then I realized I screwed something up major at work.  I got yelled at by a guy at work who was pretty mean considering i fit him in on a day when my grandfather died.  Wife said we could handle it Saturday.  I did not want to work Saturday.  I did not want it held against me later on.  I got up early when she wanted to eat breakfast.  I kept panicking.  Did some work...   She was kind and I took her to consignment store and she picked up a nice jacket for $25.  Real steal honestly.  Got the work done and headed home.  I calmed down and then she started getting depressed and panicking.  I did all I could and before we left for hotel everything was good. 

She got a bit irritable getting into the hotel cause her shoes.  She then apologized and we were calm and went to dinner.  She described how she was feeling calmly and how her eating was only control she had so she couldnt eat.  I explained that at a certain point I do not want to betray her but I have an obligation to call doctors for that.  It all went fine.  She did not eat which bothered me but we got along fine.  She then wanted to go dancing which was fine with me even though I am not much of a dancer.  There was a "gay" bar down the street that she wanted to go to which was fine.  I mean I would prefer a straight club just cause I have had some odd things proposed to me at "gay" bars before, but it was fine.  I agreed.  Oddly enough a guy was performing there we knew of from internet which was a nice touch.  During the actual show though I needed to use the restroom and she wanted a drink.  Apparantly her favorite song of his was played then and she missed most of it.  We had been there for over 3 hours and I just needed to use restroom.  She became furious and was beligerent to me.  Maybe I was overly senstive but I became panicked and fearful.  She was pissed and got her some food as she wanted to eat.  Then she wanted a cab faster so we got one and got back to hotel where she was aggressive and vomiting and finally went to bed.  It was nerve racking and scary.  Next morning things were fine.  We got along.  Took her to brunch after she was a bit irritable.  Went to grandparents to see my grandmother before funeral but we had not been there for 30 minutes when wife felt ill so we had to leave.  While there I noticed the obituary did not name my kids in it and I apologized to wife who pointed out her name was spelled wrong.  That made me nervous.  That sort of stuff usually sets her off.  It was then mentioned that my father did not plan enough limos to fit the great grand kids so he said he would handle it all

Rest of day is a bit of a blur but goes okay I suppose, except when my wife said that she would not talk to my mother and my mother better not say a word to her which terrified me about the next day.  We went to be at like 7 pm cause she was feeling down and I was too. 

Yesterday i went into work just to tie up some ends.  Still have not done the work from Thursday and I lost some of the business as a result.  Anyways, my wife was doing great and kind and did all sorts of small nice things.  Everything was fine.  She took a bit too long getting ready and we were a few minutes late to get to limos which arrived early which made me nervous but I am always late so I am not upset.  I am upset when we get tehre that there is not enough room for my whole family.  Normally I would just deal with it but I think the frustration was mainly cause it once again reinforced my wife's notion she was not part of the family.  Now this could be due to the fact we never visit or see anyone.  I am terrified and express I am upset but my wife is calm and fine.  I am still very worried.  At funeral my wife asks me to point out when I see my mother.  I do not want to hear any talk of the two of them.  The funeral goes on and i am worried my wife is upset the whole time.

As we are leaving at the door way to my horror is my mother.  My wife was behind me so I could not see what would transpire.  My mother gave me a hug.  Later on my wife said she turned away to hug son and not sure if my mother saw her.  I do not know if my mother did and saw this as a snub.  I then got separated from them because I was a palbearer.  It was freezing at 28 degrees and miserable out.  We finished the ceremony.  Apparantly my mother crawled over some crap to be by my grandmother who is her ex- mother in law from 30 years ago.  The whole thing seemed weird since she had not called since grandfathers death but whatever.  It was also weird my kids and wife did not do the shoveling of dirt which is tradition, but mother did not neither. 

My wife then came up and said they were getting in the car.  She seemed upset.  We went to my grandmotehrs afterwards and I was very very nervous.  My wife then tells me they were at curb and my mother walked right past them and did not acknowledge them but slightly nudged my wife.  She was upset that my mother snubbed our kids which I understand.  now my wife did say she would get a restraining order on my mother before so i dont know if that played a roll or both my kids got their long hair cut off the day before and she did not recognize or what was going on.  The person with her a family friend said hi though.  I am mortified.  I do not know what to do.  The worst thing for my wife happened at the funeral and I once again cannot think or grieve over my grandfather because my wife and mother apparantly had something happen.  My wife wants to leave.  I do not want to as I hate being teh last one there and first to leave on my grandmother.  All the family is there aand its only been like an hour.  There might be a service later at 6 pm too, but we leave.  I get in bed when we get home as does she.  She starts crying and wanting support.  I just am worn out.  I cannot keep up all teh support she needs and I need support too.  She goes on how she was hurt and I let her know that I am hurting too.  She says I do not know what its like and she had been so good to me and me ignoring her.  I just then let her know how I am feeling about it all.  How I felt it was rude that we left, how I am stressed and want to help but i need help too.

Devolved from there.  I did not want to call my mother and confront her there cause she might be drinking, I wanted her side too which my wife will say i am being too soft.  I try to leave.  I want to listen to her but it just goes on for hours.  I cannot comfort her and it does not seem to acknowledge her roll in any of this neither.  This is years of poor communication and mental illness that has made this web.  I keep iterating that we need to ignore everyone else and concentrate on us.  It does not matter what they think or feel and if we are getting along and happy they in turn will see that and be kind and open armed to her.  That is ultimately the biggest hurdle we have is that my family sees me tormented and has apprention for her cause of it.  I think she wants to be cared for like she is an equal to me which she is, but they are going to value me more than her cause they have a relationship with me.  She has not really been around any of them that much at all.

Anyways, I tried to leave, i did not want to argue.  She did not want me to stay in car cause its cold but I wanted the pain to stop that she was saying and did not want to fire back.  Maybe all of this is due to be being overly senstive now due to all the past crap.  I have no where to go now.  I cannot go to my mothers cause I do not know what is going on there.  She will also take pot shots at me for that.  My grandmother has her own set of problems so I cannot do that to her.  Those are the only people I have in town besides my sister who is a firestarter and no room and my sister in law which would be awkward for all involved.

Now my wife says we are over.  Its over.  I honestly never grieved my grandfather... i just wanted some time yesterday to relax and be with my family and have her with me as part of my family.  It just was not going to happen.  It just feels like her grief monopolizes everything. 

I feel sick now.  Everything is so messed up. 

[hurthusband]

i kid you not... she just asked me about flowers for VDay cause I always get them... She did spend $180 on me in gifts which I wish she had not but thoughtful.  Between hotel, getting her sister flowers, getting flowers for her mothers grave, getting her presents, hotel, bar, food, etc... $1100... and brought up was flowers

The hard part is I want somewhere to just go for a separation.  I just do not know where I can go at this point.  We both know we need a break but she only has her sisters but wont move the kids.  I do not have anyone period.

[Zon]

It probably would not have gone down the same way for you, but I can tell you of my recent experience in a somewhat similar situation.  Last year, my father died.  My wife was thoughtful and helpful for most of it but was doing a bit of recruiting for her side in our relationship issues during the funeral.  My mom, with whom I get along well, even overheard a bit when my wife was talking with one of my sister-in-laws.

Sometime later (days or more?), she did complain that I did not comfort her enough like my brothers were comforting their wives.  She takes the best qualities from all men in my life and creates a perfect man (for her) to hold against me.  I did not comfort her more because we were having a bad time even in MC.  Not to mention that my dad just died.  My wife was quite attached to my dad and stepmother, but it was almost like she was hijacking my dad's death.

I also fear when my mom and wife run into each other.  I try to be right there to hear what actually transpires instead of what my wife imagines.  I remember one event where I had not unfinished unloading the car to get inside, and my wife already was feeling insulted.

[momtara]

HH, most of that sounded good except that you had to be terrified of making a wrong step the whoel time, which is no way to live.  And it shouldn't take the death of a grandparent for her to try to be ok, and then even then she got upset.  That said, at least you two had some nice times and it didn't explode until the end.  Sounds like you dealt with the work stuff well, too.

She puts you in a position where you are made to feel bad no matter what and choose from a few things you need, when you should have ALL of them.  You hae the right to care about both your wife and your grandmother.

You have seemed a bit calmer lately.  Maybe because your wife's T talked to you - sounds like she is concerned.  Maybe it's because wife knows she needs you, including for dealing with son's problems.  I doubt she will divorce you.  But you seem to be thinking separation, legal or not, may be good.  Not getting sucked into arguments will be important.  Sorry that you have no where to go, but maybe there is an answer out there. 

Just keep doing what you are doing.  Clearly you are doing your best.  And, again, it never hurts to have more professionals on your side.

[hurthusband]

my mother claims she acknowledged my kids and tried to hug them on way out of the building, but they ignored her which she figured was cause they were supposed to and because my wife had threatened a restraining order my mother did not try again.  My wife and kids told me my mom was lying.  My wife is demanding I confront my mother...

I suppose I have to.  I dont see how I can stay working for my mother.  I wish my wife would just say it was crappy of her to do but o well and move on, but it is her or me in her eyes.  So I have to choose her because she was right if what she says is true.  At same time, I have to leave my wife.  She hates my guts and I am terrified of her.  I will never do enough.

I am giving up my family, my parents, im sick... im angry. I am angry at my mother for lying.  I am angry at my wife for demanding all she does and of my honor.

she keeps calling me asking if i have taken her to task yet.  thats all she cares about is me quitting and getting mad at my mother.

its all she cares about

what should i do?

[Panda39]

VDay was strange.  I had planned on taking the day off and took off from moms business to spend time with my wife.  I had booked a hotel room and dinner reservations.  It actually started Friday.  Friday morning my wife was blasting me then I got word my grandfather died.  I had put off some Thursday work onto Friday needing to get it done before Saturday cause I was taking off, but when grandfather died, my wife was kind and wanted to be there for me.  We went to my grandmothers to comfort her and my wife said she would ride with me to get some work done.  I wouldnt get it all, but I could get some.  I kept being ultra paranoid that it would upset her.

Anyways, we got through day and then I realized I screwed something up major at work.  I got yelled at by a guy at work who was pretty mean considering i fit him in on a day when my grandfather died.  Wife said we could handle it Saturday.  I did not want to work Saturday.  I did not want it held against me later on.  I got up early when she wanted to eat breakfast.  I kept panicking.  Did some work...   She was kind and I took her to consignment store and she picked up a nice jacket for $25.  Real steal honestly.  Got the work done and headed home.  I calmed down and then she started getting depressed and panicking.  I did all I could and before we left for hotel everything was good. 

She got a bit irritable getting into the hotel cause her shoes.  She then apologized and we were calm and went to dinner.  She described how she was feeling calmly and how her eating was only control she had so she couldnt eat.  I explained that at a certain point I do not want to betray her but I have an obligation to call doctors for that.  It all went fine.  She did not eat which bothered me but we got along fine.  She then wanted to go dancing which was fine with me even though I am not much of a dancer.  There was a "gay" bar down the street that she wanted to go to which was fine.  I mean I would prefer a straight club just cause I have had some odd things proposed to me at "gay" bars before, but it was fine.  I agreed.  Oddly enough a guy was performing there we knew of from internet which was a nice touch.  During the actual show though I needed to use the restroom and she wanted a drink.  Apparantly her favorite song of his was played then and she missed most of it.  We had been there for over 3 hours and I just needed to use restroom.  She became furious and was beligerent to me.  Maybe I was overly senstive but I became panicked and fearful.  She was pissed and got her some food as she wanted to eat.  Then she wanted a cab faster so we got one and got back to hotel where she was aggressive and vomiting and finally went to bed.  It was nerve racking and scary.  Next morning things were fine.  We got along.  Took her to brunch after she was a bit irritable.  Went to grandparents to see my grandmother before funeral but we had not been there for 30 minutes when wife felt ill so we had to leave.  While there I noticed the obituary did not name my kids in it and I apologized to wife who pointed out her name was spelled wrong.  That made me nervous.  That sort of stuff usually sets her off.  It was then mentioned that my father did not plan enough limos to fit the great grand kids so he said he would handle it all

Rest of day is a bit of a blur but goes okay I suppose, except when my wife said that she would not talk to my mother and my mother better not say a word to her which terrified me about the next day.  We went to be at like 7 pm cause she was feeling down and I was too.

Yesterday i went into work just to tie up some ends.  Still have not done the work from Thursday and I lost some of the business as a result.  Anyways, my wife was doing great and kind and did all sorts of small nice things.  Everything was fine.  She took a bit too long getting ready and we were a few minutes late to get to limos which arrived early which made me nervous but I am always late so I am not upset.  I am upset when we get tehre that there is not enough room for my whole family.  Normally I would just deal with it but I think the frustration was mainly cause it once again reinforced my wife's notion she was not part of the family.  Now this could be due to the fact we never visit or see anyone.  I am terrified and express I am upset but my wife is calm and fine.  I am still very worried.  At funeral my wife asks me to point out when I see my mother.  I do not want to hear any talk of the two of them.  The funeral goes on and i am worried my wife is upset the whole time.

As we are leaving at the door way to my horror is my mother.  My wife was behind me so I could not see what would transpire.  My mother gave me a hug.  Later on my wife said she turned away to hug son and not sure if my mother saw her.  I do not know if my mother did and saw this as a snub.  I then got separated from them because I was a palbearer.  It was freezing at 28 degrees and miserable out.  We finished the ceremony.  Apparantly my mother crawled over some crap to be by my grandmother who is her ex- mother in law from 30 years ago.  The whole thing seemed weird since she had not called since grandfathers death but whatever.  It was also weird my kids and wife did not do the shoveling of dirt which is tradition, but mother did not neither. 

My wife then came up and said they were getting in the car.  She seemed upset.  We went to my grandmotehrs afterwards and I was very very nervous.  My wife then tells me they were at curb and my mother walked right past them and did not acknowledge them but slightly nudged my wife.  She was upset that my mother snubbed our kids which I understand.  now my wife did say she would get a restraining order on my mother before so i dont know if that played a roll or both my kids got their long hair cut off the day before and she did not recognize or what was going on.  The person with her a family friend said hi though.  I am mortified.  I do not know what to do.  The worst thing for my wife happened at the funeral and I once again cannot think or grieve over my grandfather because my wife and mother apparantly had something happen.  My wife wants to leave.  I do not want to as I hate being teh last one there and first to leave on my grandmother.  All the family is there aand its only been like an hour.  There might be a service later at 6 pm too, but we leave.  I get in bed when we get home as does she.  She starts crying and wanting support.  I just am worn out.  I cannot keep up all teh support she needs and I need support too.  She goes on how she was hurt and I let her know that I am hurting too.  She says I do not know what its like and she had been so good to me and me ignoring her.  I just then let her know how I am feeling about it all.  How I felt it was rude that we left, how I am stressed and want to help but i need help too.

Devolved from there.  I did not want to call my mother and confront her there cause she might be drinking, I wanted her side too which my wife will say i am being too soft.  I try to leave.  I want to listen to her but it just goes on for hours.  I cannot comfort her and it does not seem to acknowledge her roll in any of this neither.  This is years of poor communication and mental illness that has made this web.  I keep iterating that we need to ignore everyone else and concentrate on us.  It does not matter what they think or feel and if we are getting along and happy they in turn will see that and be kind and open armed to her.  That is ultimately the biggest hurdle we have is that my family sees me tormented and has apprention for her cause of it.  I think she wants to be cared for like she is an equal to me which she is, but they are going to value me more than her cause they have a relationship with me.  She has not really been around any of them that much at all.

Anyways, I tried to leave, i did not want to argue.  She did not want me to stay in car cause its cold but I wanted the pain to stop that she was saying and did not want to fire back.  Maybe all of this is due to be being overly senstive now due to all the past crap.  I have no where to go now.  I cannot go to my mothers cause I do not know what is going on there.  She will also take pot shots at me for that.  My grandmother has her own set of problems so I cannot do that to her.  Those are the only people I have in town besides my sister who is a firestarter and no room and my sister in law which would be awkward for all involved.

Now my wife says we are over.  Its over.  I honestly never grieved my grandfather... i just wanted some time yesterday to relax and be with my family and have her with me as part of my family.  It just was not going to happen.  It just feels like her grief monopolizes everything. 

I feel sick now.  Everything is so messed up. 

Like momtara mentioned

HH, most of that sounded good except that you had to be terrified of making a wrong step the whole time, which is no way to live.

I also picked up on your anxiety your anxiety and stress pepper your post.  Have you spoken to your therapist about your anxiety level?

As far as the feud between your mom and wife I'm with Grey Kitty... .

Two very good boundaries for you:

"Wife, I will not speak to you about my mother."

"Mother, I will not speak to you about my wife."

That is all you need to say when either of them brings up the other. You absolutely know that NOTHING good will come when either of them starts telling you what the other is doing wrong, and that is all they will talk about.

Hang in there and good luck with your vday lunch.

[hurthusband]

Yea it's a mess.  Wife and kids say mother never touched them.  Mother says as they walked past the door they would not look at her but she touched each of their backs but did ignore my wife. Then said nothing afterwards cause wife did threaten restraining order.  My stepfather gave me exact same dory mom did and they had not talked for 24 hours... they not getting along.  Now is thst what happened or did mom set this all up yesterday? He aid she was upset they didn't say anything.  I can't imagine that mean of a thing.  My wife says thar for me have any chance I have to cut my mother out of my life compkwtely.  Job and everything.  Mom did say she would take lie detector

[Grey Kitty]

Really... .it is a mess... .GET OUT OF THE MIDDLE OF IT.

Your wife will leave you and divorce you... .or she won't.

She makes a lot of threats when she is dysregulated. Some she follows through on, others she doesn't.

The best thing you can do is refuse to engage with either woman in any way about the other.

Don't talk to them about the other one.

Don't tell either one what to do with the other one.

Don't pass any messages from one to the other.

If one of them tries to bring up the other one, inform her that you won't talk with her about it anymore.

It won't solve everything... .but it will shut down a bunch of drama.

[momtara]

"I dont see how I can stay working for my mother."

Your wife keeps pressing you to leave your job, the only thing bringing in decent money.  It's completely illogical.  Remember when she said that, then later changed her mind?  You know it's the wrong thing to do.  If you do it, it may take a day or three days, but she will make you feel like it was a really bad decision.  Because it is.  I can hear her now: "Why did you listen to me?"

BPD folks will keep putting pressure on you to drop something you care about and need, so that it gets to the point that the idea actually becomes a relief and feels better than sticking to your guns. So you do it, and then the BPD person will just find some other thing to get upset over.  Like not having enough money!  If you quit your job to please her, the peace and harmony will last maybe a day or two.  Then you won't be able to provide for yourself, much less the family.  You know already that a lack of money causes problems in your house as it is... .

If a person cares about you, they don't force you to choose between two things you love or need.

 Please follow everyone's advice and set the boundary about not talking about one in front of the other.  You can tell your wife you are giving your mom the same guideline.  If she violates it, then the problem is hers.  She can't blame you.

It is a much better answer than giving up the few people who support you, or a job that keeps things from getting really, really, really bad.  

You need to set clear boundaries so you don't keep getting sucked into the same argument.  You've been having these arguments for months, no?  What if these topics, mom and job, were taken off the table?  Cut off her argument supply.  It may start to feel good and it may even make things better, finally.  No guarantees, but why not try?  Maybe you can even say your job is off limits for discussion until someone else in the family is bringing in an equal amount of money.  She may take that as a dig, so that's up to you, but you can still say the job is off limits for discussion. 

In fact, you can say your Therapist strongly urged those topics to be off limits.

[Grey Kitty]

If a person cares about you, they don't force you to choose between two things you love or need.

Yep. I do believe she cares about you... .but she's so lost in her own pain and dysfunction that she is completely incapable of seeing what the impact of the bind she's trying to put you in would be. Either for you personally or for your family financially! So even though she probably does care to the best of her very limited ability, she is taking actions that are the opposite of caring.

Please understand this: Your wife cannot force you to do this. She cannot force you to quit your job or stop talking to your mom.

She can pressure you to do this sort of thing. And she is.

Please remember that these are your actions, and doing it is your choice

Your wife can say otherwise. She has. I'm sure she will again.

She can say she will leave or divorce you. She has before. I'm sure she will do that again too.

That is her choice. Her actions so far make that sound unlikely to me, but there is no certainty there. Continued threats do sound very likely though.

 Hang in there, please get your own therapy and any other support you can find. This is a really tough time for you.

[hurthusband]

the question is whether or not my kids were abused and the action that is warranted without going overboard.  I am just not sure on that area

My wife seems calmer today but she wrote my mom a nasty text and things are just that much worse.

supposed to see her doc with her today... see what might happen.

She did get on my computer which shot my ocd up big time.  its really bothering me...

[Grey Kitty]

the question is whether or not my kids were abused and the action that is warranted without going overboard.  I am just not sure on that area

If you were to pretend you never heard your wife say anything about it... .based on what you saw and what your kids said, and what your mother said, do you see any indication that your kids were abused?

In the world I live in, a hug or a pat on the back from a grandparent wouldn't even merit consideration for abuse!

Am I completely misunderstanding the situation here?

To me it looks like your wife is trying to create a crisis out of nothing, and is doing a pretty good job of dragging you into it, which is keeping you from addressing other things or taking care of yourself or your kids.

[hurthusband]

the question is whether or not my kids were abused and the action that is warranted without going overboard.  I am just not sure on that area

If you were to pretend you never heard your wife say anything about it... .based on what you saw and what your kids said, and what your mother said, do you see any indication that your kids were abused?

In the world I live in, a hug or a pat on the back from a grandparent wouldn't even merit consideration for abuse!

Am I completely misunderstanding the situation here?

To me it looks like your wife is trying to create a crisis out of nothing, and is doing a pretty good job of dragging you into it, which is keeping you from addressing other things or taking care of yourself or your kids.

well its that she says my mother is lying about it all.  i dont know.  we went together to her therapist who seemed to re-inforce my thinking that why should my mother matter.  wife cant let go though.  I just am worn out. 

it is just my wife cannot empathize.  plays herself up as a victim too much and wont let go of it.  I just want something to happen at this point

[Zon]

the question is whether or not my kids were abused and the action that is warranted without going overboard.  I am just not sure on that area

If you were to pretend you never heard your wife say anything about it... .based on what you saw and what your kids said, and what your mother said, do you see any indication that your kids were abused?

In the world I live in, a hug or a pat on the back from a grandparent wouldn't even merit consideration for abuse!

Am I completely misunderstanding the situation here?

To me it looks like your wife is trying to create a crisis out of nothing, and is doing a pretty good job of dragging you into it, which is keeping you from addressing other things or taking care of yourself or your kids.

well its that she says my mother is lying about it all.  i dont know.  we went together to her therapist who seemed to re-inforce my thinking that why should my mother matter.  wife cant let go though.  I just am worn out. 

it is just my wife cannot empathize.  plays herself up as a victim too much and wont let go of it.  I just want something to happen at this point

Your situation is quite similar to mine, however, I do not believe my mother is what my wife says.  According to my wife, my mom (a therapist LOL) is an expert manipulator, will warp our children and can influence me with just a look.  Here are some of the reasons I do not believe my wife:

• My wife proclaimed forcibly that my mom is "evil".  It was done a bit too strongly with a look of terror across her face.



• That look from my mom (read above) happened at times when my mom had zero contact with me.



• Even statements of fact from my mom are actually manipulations according to my wife.



• My stepmother thinks my wife is too rigid and disagrees with her assessment of my mother.



• My wife has gotten angry at me when I have asked for clarification about my mother's transgressions.  I have to ask because I do not know the context at times.



• My wife has lost control at the most minor things with my stepmother.  Both mothers (quite different personalities) are against her?  Come on!



• Our D9 shows that she "hates" my wife at times in her expression.



• Our S4 wounded her greatly by saying he did not like her.  Months later, she had zero problems when he said he love me more than her.  To her, it was perfectly normal for children to do that with their limited vocabulary.  She acted like that had always been her stance.

My daughter tends to avoid my mother because she is afraid to anger her mom.  Is that what is happening with your children?  Could it be that your wife is trying to drive support away from you?

[Grey Kitty]

the question is whether or not my kids were abused and the action that is warranted without going overboard.  I am just not sure on that area

If you were to pretend you never heard your wife say anything about it... .based on what you saw and what your kids said, and what your mother said, do you see any indication that your kids were abused?

In the world I live in, a hug or a pat on the back from a grandparent wouldn't even merit consideration for abuse!

Am I completely misunderstanding the situation here?

To me it looks like your wife is trying to create a crisis out of nothing, and is doing a pretty good job of dragging you into it, which is keeping you from addressing other things or taking care of yourself or your kids.

well its that she says my mother is lying about it all.  i dont know.  we went together to her therapist who seemed to re-inforce my thinking that why should my mother matter.  wife cant let go though.  I just am worn out. 

it is just my wife cannot empathize.  plays herself up as a victim too much and wont let go of it.  I just want something to happen at this point

I didn't ask you what your wife said. I asked you what you thought.

I know from reading your story that anything your wife says is likely to be far from reality.

She doesn't have to let it go. She can keep barking up the wrong tree for the next six months, and you cannot stop her.

YOU have to disengage when she does it, to protect yourself from it.

[momtara]

Everyone makes mistakes. It doesn't mean you disown a parent. Or anyone else. These two topics - your mom and your job - are being used by your wife to pressure you too much. It is an idea to tell her your T said to not discuss them with her.

[hurthusband]

I think my mom has her own problems and is not necessarily a reliable person to lean on for my wife.  I believe my mother can be overly zealous in defense of her children.  I do not think my mother is the monster my wife says she is.  I do not think my kids would lie.  They might to defend mom out of fear, but I think they did not notice.  I could be wrong

My mother is capable of some manipulation.  My mother and wife are similiar in many ways, but my relationship with my mother is not like my relationship with my wife in toxicity.  My mother and my step father may have some shades of us though, but still with reason.

I think the one difference is the attempt at telling me i am crazy.  After meeting with her therapist, I am feeling more confident, I am sane and she is in fact insane.  I could tell her therapist trying to walk the line of explaining what she is doing is not fair without seeming to side with me and break trust.  My wife is very much, with me or against me mentality.

[momtara]

You don't seem insane. You may have some psych problems like many of us do (you've said you have ocd). People like your wife will undermine your sense of reality until you doubt yourself. Gaslighting, crazy-making, whatever you want to call it.

Regarding your mom, " I do not think my mother is the monster my wife says she is."  So, there you have it. You shouldn't have to disown one or the other.  You have only a few people left in your life - your wife seems to want you to lose one of the few remaining people you have, so that you have no support and you will be under her control completely. Losing your job would also render you without financial help or a place to go during the day.  Then you'd need your wife even more. Your mom and job are among the few sources of support you have left, even if tenuous.  :)on't let her take them away.