Split white

[How to communicate after a contentious divorce...]

For the last three years I have been split black and in the last few months I noticed my ex has slowly been splitting me white.

She emotionally checked out of the marriage and our family. I say family because she had checked out on the kids too. She had an exit affair, denied reasonable access to the kids and was in her honeymoon and wasn't really taking good care of the kids. She was girlfriend first and mom second.

She really didn't give me a reasonable explanation with why we were done and only that it was time for her to move on. I had a feeling that she was cheating because of her behaviors and I was in denial. The last few months was hell at home.

That being said, she had projected and said that I was emotionally abusive to her and the kids, financially abusive and physically abuse and she had a smear campaign. She had maxed out our credit cards, took what money we had as a family and left with her boyfriend.

I didn't have financial means to take her to court, I filed anyway because I couldn't bear seeing the kids every second weekend. She had a lawyer and I represented myself for much of it, I did manage to retain a lawyer and he quit right before we were about to go to trial. I managed to deal with my exe's lawyer and we agreed on the parenting plan I had created with a few tweaks and a couple of things my ex had put in. That year was not a fun year.

My point with this thread is that I had become used to being split black, I hadn't thought that far and I felt like I was going to be split black for a long time. I feel angry at being split white. I say that because she checked out and now it feels like she's trying to get with the program. I didn't forget the hell she put me through and I thought that there would be more time behind me if and when I was going to get split white.

Can anyone relate with being split black, smear campaign, denied reasonable access then your ex wants to be friends, validates you for being a good father and feeling angry because you're split white?

[Mutt]

For the last three years I have been split black and in the last few months I noticed my ex has slowly been splitting me white.

She emotionally checked out of the marriage and our family. I say family because she had checked out on the kids too. She had an exit affair, denied reasonable access to the kids and was in her honeymoon and wasn't really taking good care of the kids. She was girlfriend first and mom second.

She really didn't give me a reasonable explanation with why we were done and only that it was time for her to move on. I had a feeling that she was cheating because of her behaviors and I was in denial. The last few months was hell at home.

That being said, she had projected and said that I was emotionally abusive to her and the kids, financially abusive and physically abuse and she had a smear campaign. She had maxed out our credit cards, took what money we had as a family and left with her boyfriend.

I didn't have financial means to take her to court, I filed anyway because I couldn't bear seeing the kids every second weekend. She had a lawyer and I represented myself for much of it, I did manage to retain a lawyer and he quit right before we were about to go to trial. I managed to deal with my exe's lawyer and we agreed on the parenting plan I had created with a few tweaks and a couple of things my ex had put in. That year was not a fun year.

My point with this thread is that I had become used to being split black, I hadn't thought that far and I felt like I was going to be split black for a long time. I feel angry at being split white. I say that because she checked out and now it feels like she's trying to get with the program. I didn't forget the hell she put me through and I thought that there would be more time behind me if and when I was going to get split white.

Can anyone relate with being split black, smear campaign, denied reasonable access then your ex wants to be friends, validates you for being a good father and feeling angry because you're split white?

[enlighten me]

I can relate to all.

My exwife split me white last summer. Wanted to spend time with me on the pretext of seeing our sons. Talked to me about her husband and his bad behaviour. Flirted with me. etc etc.

Don't worry Im split black again as she didn't get what she was after .

[Mutt]

Your ex wife had split her H black. My ex hasn't said anything about her boyfriend. If I mention something about him she'll quickly rescue him.

My ex didn't flirt with me but had a similar pretext in that she said its time that we be friends for the sake of the kids.

The way I see it is that we don't have to agree on anything to get along and my idea of friendship is different, my friends are people that have similar morals and values, people that I trust. I don't trust my ex.

She's secretive, she says one thing and what she does is very different. I don't think that I got over the affair. What little trust that I had left, she broke. I'm not interested in friendship. Did your ex send friendly type emails? If so, how did you respond?

[enlighten me]

No emails but she started texting then calling. I took my boys over to see their gran one day and the ex was there. The x spent the time I was there giggling and flirting. Little touches and the like. My ex MIL was horrified.

Now because the boys don't want to have anything more to do with their mum I am blacker than black again and awaiting to see if she ends up dragging me through court.

[saintgrey]

Something similar with me but no kids involved, like you there is no trust or share same values (actions speak louder than words for me) so i don't see the point in a friendship.

The things i knew and learned recently makes it impossible for me to trust this person ever again and makes it easy with her lack of remorse.

I think we are split white when things are not going their way and they need someone else to share secrets and personal life outside the r/s.

[rickdeckard]

No kids involved, but I can relate to the anger from being split white.

She sent a message to me through a fake FB account, supposedly this person had talked to ex and was telling me what she said (it was all in third person, but you get to recognize writing styles), how she had lost the only man who truly loved her, sorry for hurting me, truly did love me, the passion was real, etc.

I emailed her (her real email, not the fake profile) and asked her if she was using that profile. She denied it.

note that all this was quite some time after she married replacement and had made the marriage as public as possible on all social media.

This made me a little angry.

So I checked her favourite haunt, FB (her real page, not the fake one). We aren't friends so I can only see what's public. And... .she had removed replacements last name from hers (again) and deleted or hidden from public all the wedding and cute couple pictures. And any reference to him. Like he didn't exist. However, she did keep public a picture of a place she and I went to.

I've been through this exact thing before, her hiding him, and now I was really angry.

She ditched me for this guy twice. Then married him a couple of months after our last split.

Now I'm the only man that ever truly loved her (again). I am split white (again).

I replied to the fake account, she replied in first person with personal stuff about her life, and I wrote back that I don't care - very angry at this point.

I'm trying to process the reason that made me angry now. All kinds of thoughts start swirling, and most have to do with lying and deception. She lied to me a lot andis lying to me, him, or both about how much she loves us. And she is contacting me through a fake profile, hiding it from him. And lying to me about that as well. And, now, hiding him from public view (assuming, correctly, that I would check after getting the PM) even though they are married.

So, I'm thinking that is why the splitting white makes me angry. Because it feels like another lie, another deception, she is using to get something from me. I don't know or care what that something is.

Like everyone else said, there is no trust. And why would I want to be friends with a person like that?

[mywifecrazy]

Hey Mutt... .Long Time!

I feel for ya brother. Like someone mentioned earlier, they paint you white when they want something or need something from you. I can understand why that would make you angry. It's like they think your stupid and forget all the horrible things they said and have done to you. Like you exist only to be used by them.

I really appreciate how you mention that you are friends with people who have the same morals as you. My uBPDxw sent me an email saying the kids need to see that we don't hate each other. Really? Did she think I forgot how she was telling anyone who would listen that I raped and beat on her and beat on my sons? Just words, I go by her actions! No Thanks uBPDxw I'm not interested in you using me for whatever you need. I will keep my healthy boundaries in place. I must be civil towards you but I do not need to be friendly with you.

Hang in there!

MWC

[LonelyChild]

Can anyone relate with being split black, smear campaign, denied reasonable access then your ex wants to be friends, validates you for being a good father and feeling angry because you're split white?

I was split black, my uBPDxgf did insane and horrible things. I forgave her, but my anger was growing. I lost my feelings towards her. She then split me white.

It was very upsetting. It felt VERY unfair in many ways. I felt that I had given her her chance and she had thrown it away. That she didn't deserve to get more love from me because she had already thrown it away. At the same time, I was angry at myself for caring so much about her. It was also very painful to detach when split white. Today, I regret not detaching and going NC when split black, because it's so much harder when she's split me white.

Why do you think you're feeling angry because you're split white?

[LonelyChild]

I think we are split white when things are not going their way and they need someone else to share secrets and personal life outside the r/s.

This is absolutely true. I KNOW that my uBPDxgf will split me black the second she gets a chance (as her life is now, there will be no such chances). I am honestly looking forward to that moment, because then I will be able to go NC without causing her huge amounts of pain. I don't want to do that.

As OP says, uBPDxgf broke what little trust I had left for her. Nothing she says ever feels real anymore. It all feels made up. I think even a friendship relation is destructive at that point.

[Mutt]

Hi mywifecrazy,

It has been a long time. I hope everything is well for you and your family. My youngest had his birthday in July and she had mentioned in an email that she would like that we celebrate with both families, by going to a restaurant.

What irks me is that she had an affair with her boyfriend and I don't want to get mixed up with doing things with both families.

Why do you think you're feeling angry because you're split white?

It makes me feel angry because I feel invalidated with how she treated me and how much pain she caused. I was at the lowest point in my life when she left, I felt SI but I couldn't do something like that to the kids. She was out on her honeymoon and I was knee deep in pain and she walked out of the marriage, I didn't mention that I had to declare bankruptcy due to our marital debt. It took a long time to recover.

Her reasoning like mywifecrazy mentioned is that she wants to do this for the kids. What I mean by that is that she finds the court order non compromising and she wants more flexibility.

It's not about flexibility it's about boundaries. I don't want both families to get mixed up with each other ( enmeshment ) My kids asked me if I was going to take them out on Halloween, they're confused because they went with mom last year, but it happens to fall on her weekend, we have all if the major holidays sorted out.

She told the kids that because I get Thanksgiving and Christmas ( I don't get Christmas ) that she gets Halloween. My daughter was confused and told me that doesn't make sense, we were with mom last year. She's not doing this for the kids, she's doing this for a friend or a family member, she doesn't want to look bad. She hates if a friend calls to do something with her and the kids when it's on my time.

She chose to divorce. A decision that I wasn't privileged to discuss and it affected the lives of not just her but everybody in the family.We're not responsible for mom's feelings it's about the kids and their love for mom and dad and equal time spent with each other.

The anger is in the frustration because she's trying to control. This is a need for her because she feels out of control and is trying to control her environment. She just had a baby with her boyfriend and she's probably feeling like a hot mess from her hormones and PPD.

The difference with being split white and split black is that being split black, it's like I don't exist. It's like saint gray mentioned, it's because things are not going well for her and I feel objectified. She wants rescue.

[Lostinkitimat]

oh man I can totally relate. but at the moment im split black... .and loving it!

we are recently separated. it was hell getting the separation agreement drawn up the verbal, emotional and physical abuse was hard. but I think what was harder was after words her wanting to be friends. it was like a free pass like she didn't say and do all those nasty vindictive things.

I still am piecing together the demise of my relationship and need time and space to do that. but she was relentless in wanting me to come over for coffee, dinner, etc. like all of a sudden she didn't punch me say nasty things sleep with like 10 guys in the first two months of being split up .

any way she lost it about a week ago send some threatening messages to me and my mom. generally bullied and bashed everyone and then tried to carry on like nothing happened. I just said friends don't treat friends that way. I only want to speak to you if its about the kids. then the projecting started with threats. so know im completely black. and im fine with it. but im sure it will change.

[myself]

You don't have to play along. You're already doing what you see is best for your kids, in your own way and time. It's about detaching not re-attaching. Tell her where you're coming from, or not, but stick with your boundaries. She won't be able to process it and will soon enough split you black again.

[LonelyChild]

Why do you think you're feeling angry because you're split white?

It makes me feel angry because I feel invalidated with how she treated me and how much pain she caused. I was at the lowest point in my life when she left, I felt SI but I couldn't do something like that to the kids. She was out on her honeymoon and I was knee deep in pain and she walked out of the marriage, I didn't mention that I had to declare bankruptcy due to our marital debt. It took a long time to recover.

Her reasoning like mywifecrazy mentioned is that she wants to do this for the kids. What I mean by that is that she finds the court order non compromising and she wants more flexibility.

It's not about flexibility it's about boundaries. I don't want both families to get mixed up with each other ( enmeshment ) My kids asked me if I was going to take them out on Halloween, they're confused because they went with mom last year, but it happens to fall on her weekend, we have all if the major holidays sorted out.

She told the kids that because I get Thanksgiving and Christmas ( I don't get Christmas ) that she gets Halloween. My daughter was confused and told me that doesn't make sense, we were with mom last year. She's not doing this for the kids, she's doing this for a friend or a family member, she doesn't want to look bad. She hates if a friend calls to do something with her and the kids when it's on my time.

She chose to divorce. A decision that I wasn't privileged to discuss and it affected the lives of not just her but everybody in the family.We're not responsible for mom's feelings it's about the kids and their love for mom and dad and equal time spent with each other.

The anger is in the frustration because she's trying to control. This is a need for her because she feels out of control and is trying to control her environment. She just had a baby with her boyfriend and she's probably feeling like a hot mess from her hormones and PPD.

The difference with being split white and split black is that being split black, it's like I don't exist. It's like saint gray mentioned, it's because things are not going well for her and I feel objectified. She wants rescue.

Although I don't have children with my uBPDxgf, I can empathize;

Your daughter being confused is not ok. I think prio 1 is giving her some solid ground. I grew up confused because of a BPD father. As you probably know - children tend to blame themselves when they can't find answers elsewhere.

Beyond that, I absolutely feel your frustration in the first paragraph; as you, I was left to my own at the absolute worst possible moment - almost ending my own life because of the unbearable pain. This forced me to detach (which I am thankful for). Being split white after detaching is merely problematic.

Without sounding demeaning; your frustration is yours - if you felt that you were in control of the situation, maybe you would not be as frustrated. This makes me think she might still have a hold on you.

Do you feel that your ex-wife still has a hold on you; some way of controlling you? Are you afraid that if you don't meet her demands, she might alienate you from your children?

[Suzn]

You have:

A non compromising court order (they all are unless otherwise stated, only the people involved can be compromising)

Boundaries of your choosing, no explanation needed, they're yours

A choice

If you aren't ready to be fully compromising, then you aren't ready. You're still hurt and angry, you're still attached. Are you concerned someone will judge you for not being flexible? Are you struggling with letting her know you plan to stick with the current holiday schedule? 

With my ex's visitation schedule it didn't matter who's time the holiday fell on, if it was their holiday they got the kids. Is that how your's is set up?

[LonelyChild]

You're still hurt and angry, you're still attached.

I don't feel that this is a fair assessment. The white-splitting is rather an offensive move after detachment, because it means that they still do not respect your boundaries or your feelings towards them.

[Mutt]

I grew up with a narcissistic father and I married a person that displays traits of BPD. I learned to supress my feelings, because expressing my feelings was often met with emotional abuse. I think it's Ok to have feelings and not have an emotional attachment?

That being said, she had projected and said that I was emotionally abusive to her and the kids, financially abusive and physically abuse and she had a smear campaign.

She ruined my credit with having to file bankruptcy. I was charged with false domestic abuse charges, I had to go to court for that and again for family court.

I, like many members went through a lot. I think I have a right to feel anger. Three years is not that long ago, I'm frustrated because it was peaceful and she hasn't tested boundaries like this since she had left and I started to assert myself, it feels like dysfunction and drama is interrupting my life. I need more time behind me, its triggering. I've been split black for so long and I thought it would be longer, I don't miss this stuff.

[Suzn]

I think it's Ok to have feelings and not be attached?

It's OK to feel the way you do no matter what. There's no judgment here.  

What irks me is that she had an affair with her boyfriend

It makes me feel angry because I feel invalidated with how she treated me and how much pain she caused.  

The difference with being split white and split black is that being split black, it's like I don't exist.

I feel objectified.

By attachment I don't mean you want to be with her only that you still have feelings of anger and hurt. No one can make you feel these things, either you do or you don't or somewhere in between. The opposite of love isn't hate, it's indifference and what you shared above about how you feel doesn't sound like indifference.

The anger is in the frustration because she's trying to control.

No one can control your choices unless you let them. She is who she is my friend, being frustrated about it is your choice. Though very understandable that it's not an easy choice with the history you share.  

I think I have a right to feel anger.

Absolutely. You have a right to everything you are feeling.

Three years is not that long ago, I'm frustrated because it was peaceful and she hasn't tested boundaries like this since she had left and I started to assert myself, it feels like dysfunction and drama is interrupting my life. I need more time behind me, its triggering. I've been split black for so long and I thought it would be longer, I don't miss this stuff.

So there was a long lull and things got comfortable. Now things are uncomfortable. Take a deep breath or ten. You're likely more ready than you know to handle this.   

So what's your plan?

[Mutt]

So what's your plan?

Honestly, it's not personal. She is who she is. Depersonalize it.

She won't be able to process it and will soon enough split you black again.

It's pull behavior. The pendulum also swings the other way.

[Suzn]

So what's your plan?

Honestly, it's not personal. She is who she is. Depersonalize it.

Agreed, it's not personal. What does depersonalize it mean?

[Mutt]

So what's your plan?

Honestly, it's not personal. She is who she is. Depersonalize it.

Agreed, it's not personal. What does depersonalize it mean?

It means depersonalize her behavior. It has nothing to do with me.

[Mutt]

I think it's Ok to have feelings and not be attached?

It's OK to feel the way you do no matter what. There's no judgment here.  

What irks me is that she had an affair with her boyfriend

It makes me feel angry because I feel invalidated with how she treated me and how much pain she caused.  

The difference with being split white and split black is that being split black, it's like I don't exist.

I feel objectified.

By attachment I don't mean you want to be with her only that you still have feelings of anger and hurt. No one can make you feel these things, either you do or you don't or somewhere in between. The opposite of love isn't hate, it's indifference and what you shared above about how you feel doesn't sound like indifference.

Hi Suzn,

I thought about the anger, the objectification and why I feel insulted. I don't think that things are going well for them and I think that the reason why she wants to have both families do things together is to make him feel like he fits in. I'm not her fixer and helper to help her clean up her messes.

She has a right to be happy if she wasn't happy with me. What I don't agree with is how the kids moved out of the family home into a new home and was introduced to him right away and he was having sleep overs.

The kids went through a lot of stress, their family life was turned upside down and they weren't given a chance to get used to things. I'm the one that was there for the kids while they were self centered and having their fun.

I think that she wants me to help him feel better. They made their choice, I'm not responsible if he feels guilt or feels uncomfortable with their affair. They were impulsive, showed little thoughts and empathy for my kids, if you don't think things through your actions catch up to you.

I'm angry because she wants me to help her. He broke my home, he's not going to get my help. Its how it's insinuated that it's for the kids, it's about her needs ( boyfriend ) If he feels guilt or he's uncomfortable when he's around me and doesn't feel like he "fits" that's on him to sort out.

We're two separate families, the kids have two homes. That's a part of life, we don't need to have blurry lines and a dependency on me to ease dysfunction. I'm split white because she has an emotional need that she wants fulfilled,  I am her savior?

It's emotional blackmail when she says I'm uncompromising which really means that she doesn't like my boundaries; she wants her freedom with my family to parade in front of her friends and family like things are Ok; my friends at one point in my life, people that I trusted.

I have issues with trust and it's something that I'm working on because people that were important to me in life; I feel abandoned by and not everyone is going to treat me this way. I feel resentment and disrespected when they were told the most horrible things about me and this was going on without my knowledge for many months before she exited.

I still have hurt feelings over that and she wants rescue; an ends to a mean. I mean really, you need me back in your life and celebrate birthdays or be a part of activities with them again and make your boyfriend comfortable?

[mywifecrazy]

I've been split black for so long and I thought it would be longer, I don't miss this stuff.

I think we should all have this framed and hanging on our fridges as a reminder when black turns to white!

The kids went through a lot of stress, their family life was turned upside down and they weren't given a chance to get used to things. I'm the one that was there for the kids while they were self centered and having their fun.

I think that she wants me to help him feel better. They made their choice, I'm not responsible if he feels guilt or feels uncomfortable with their affair. They were impulsive, showed little thoughts and empathy for my kids, if you don't think things through your actions catch up to you.

I'm angry because she wants me to help her. He broke my home, he's not going to get my help. Its how it's insinuated that it's for the kids, it's about her needs ( boyfriend ) If he feels guilt or he's uncomfortable when he's around me and doesn't feel like he "fits" that's on him to sort out.

We're two separate families, the kids have two homes. That's a part of life, we don't need to have blurry lines and a dependency on me to ease dysfunction. I'm split white because she has an emotional need that she wants fulfilled,  I am her savior?

It's emotional blackmail when she says I'm uncompromising which really means that she doesn't like my boundaries; she wants her freedom with my family to parade in front of her friends and family like things are Ok; my friends at one point in my life, people that I trusted.

I have issues with trust and it's something that I'm working on because people that were important to me in life; I feel abandoned by and not everyone is going to treat me this way. I feel resentment and disrespected when they were told the most horrible things about me and this was going on without my knowledge for many months before she exited.

I still have hurt feelings over that and she wants rescue; an ends to a mean. I mean really, you need me back in your life and celebrate birthdays or be a part of activities with them again and make your boyfriend comfortable?

That's exactly it Mutt, YOU have a right to establish YOUR OWN healthy boundaries as YOU see fit. And you shouldn't feel guilty about it. You also have the right to modify your boundaries when YOU see fit. If down the road you feel more comfortable allowing something to happen that maybe your not comfortable with today, its OK and its totally YOUR call.

Yes I love how that happens. A man wrecks your family and now your asked to help him with his discomfort   What about the discomfort and stress he put and IS putting your kids through? Don't fall for it. They are responsible for the consequences of their actions, not you or anyone else. You are right, "Their chickens have come home to roost", "They are reaping what they have sown", etc.

Yes the reality is there are two families now. SHE chose that and she now has to live with that and the consequences of it. She chose to toss you away and when she tossed you away she also tossed away using you as an object to soothe herself, unless you choose to let her do that. I know you're smarter than that

I feel for you having your emotions being toyed with like this but it was nice to see your post and to see how you're doing as I'm not on here much anymore. Keep being the best Dad and man of character that you can be because in the end all you CAN control is your actions and your reactions to others.

Peace!    MWC... .

[Mutt]

I've been split black for so long and I thought it would be longer, I don't miss this stuff.

I think we should all have this framed and hanging on our fridges as a reminder when black turns to white!

The kids went through a lot of stress, their family life was turned upside down and they weren't given a chance to get used to things. I'm the one that was there for the kids while they were self centered and having their fun.

I think that she wants me to help him feel better. They made their choice, I'm not responsible if he feels guilt or feels uncomfortable with their affair. They were impulsive, showed little thoughts and empathy for my kids, if you don't think things through your actions catch up to you.

I'm angry because she wants me to help her. He broke my home, he's not going to get my help. Its how it's insinuated that it's for the kids, it's about her needs ( boyfriend ) If he feels guilt or he's uncomfortable when he's around me and doesn't feel like he "fits" that's on him to sort out.

We're two separate families, the kids have two homes. That's a part of life, we don't need to have blurry lines and a dependency on me to ease dysfunction. I'm split white because she has an emotional need that she wants fulfilled,  I am her savior?

It's emotional blackmail when she says I'm uncompromising which really means that she doesn't like my boundaries; she wants her freedom with my family to parade in front of her friends and family like things are Ok; my friends at one point in my life, people that I trusted.

I have issues with trust and it's something that I'm working on because people that were important to me in life; I feel abandoned by and not everyone is going to treat me this way. I feel resentment and disrespected when they were told the most horrible things about me and this was going on without my knowledge for many months before she exited.

I still have hurt feelings over that and she wants rescue; an ends to a mean. I mean really, you need me back in your life and celebrate birthdays or be a part of activities with them again and make your boyfriend comfortable?

That's exactly it Mutt, YOU have a right to establish YOUR OWN healthy boundaries as YOU see fit. And you shouldn't feel guilty about it. You also have the right to modify your boundaries when YOU see fit. If down the road you feel more comfortable allowing something to happen that maybe your not comfortable with today, its OK and its totally YOUR call.

Yes I love how that happens. A man wrecks your family and now your asked to help him with his discomfort   What about the discomfort and stress he put and IS putting your kids through? Don't fall for it. They are responsible for the consequences of their actions, not you or anyone else. You are right, "Their chickens have come home to roost", "They are reaping what they have sown", etc.

Yes the reality is there are two families now. SHE chose that and she now has to live with that and the consequences of it. She chose to toss you away and when she tossed you away she also tossed away using you as an object to soothe herself, unless you choose to let her do that. I know you're smarter than that

I feel for you having your emotions being toyed with like this but it was nice to see your post and to see how you're doing as I'm not on here much anymore. Keep being the best Dad and man of character that you can be because in the end all you CAN control is your actions and your reactions to others.

Peace!    MWC... .

Hi mywifecrazy,

Thank you. I agree with everything you said.

I don't want the kids to feel confused and send them the wrong message that dad's Ok with all of this; I just can't do it.

I am friendly, but it doesn't mean that we all have to do stuff together. I see boundaries as something malleable; I can change and soften them. Perhaps in the future, her next boyfriend / husband won't have a history with me; not one that wrecked my home.

[SummerStorm]

Mutt,

I know exactly what you're going through.  I was split black until my former friend BPD needed a place to live.  Then, she asked if she could live with me, in the new house I just bought.  This was three months after she took back what she said about wanting to live with me just days after looking at a house with me.  I was angry and insulted, especially since she acted like nothing bad had happened between us. I'm now split black again.  She split me black the day after she told me she'd found an apartment and on the same day she robbed her ex-boyfriend (her birthday).

I'm holding out hope that she is finally done with me, I guess we'll just have to see.  That's the worst thing about push/pull.  The reason for the push is usually clear (engulfment fears, etc.), but the reason for the pull is usually unclear.   

[Teereese]

Every post is relatable to me. I am surprised that so many others have been through what I felt so alone going through for so long.

My soon to be ex uBPDh contacted me earlier this week. We are divorcing. He left on and off for the last year to drink and drug. He finally moved out and I filed for divorce. He has been extremely cruel for the last few months. Since there was minimal contact he waged his war in other ways ... .financial, emotional. painting black to friends, family, anyone who will listen.

He is now having to deal with issues that I had always taken care of and is uncomfortable.

I suddenly went from the black, "controlling b___ of no value or worth" to the white,  "help me, it is all too much, I want to give up, I am so disappointed with my life, tell me what to do"

It frustrated me but really wasn't worth anger. I see it for what it is ... .he doesn't need me ... .he wants to use me. He is feeling overwhelmed and uncomfortable with the natural consequences of his own actions and needs somebody to fix it for him.

I was frustrated because he thought he would pull me back in and that I would bite. I can't blame him, that had been the cycle for so long. Why would he think any differently?

I actually felt indifferent to his pleas. I did not feel the need to save him or explain why I would not help.  That, for me, was huge.

I accept that he will revert back to painting me black.

I accept that I am only white when he wants something from me and he has no one else to turn to.

[jhkbuzz]

I think it's Ok to have feelings and not be attached?

It's OK to feel the way you do no matter what. There's no judgment here.  

What irks me is that she had an affair with her boyfriend

It makes me feel angry because I feel invalidated with how she treated me and how much pain she caused.  

The difference with being split white and split black is that being split black, it's like I don't exist.

I feel objectified.

By attachment I don't mean you want to be with her only that you still have feelings of anger and hurt. No one can make you feel these things, either you do or you don't or somewhere in between. The opposite of love isn't hate, it's indifference and what you shared above about how you feel doesn't sound like indifference.

Hi Suzn,

I thought about the anger, the objectification and why I feel insulted. I don't think that things are going well for them and I think that the reason why she wants to have both families do things together is to make him feel like he fits in. I'm not her fixer and helper to help her clean up her messes.

She has a right to be happy if she wasn't happy with me. What I don't agree with is how the kids moved out of the family home into a new home and was introduced to him right away and he was having sleep overs.

The kids went through a lot of stress, their family life was turned upside down and they weren't given a chance to get used to things. I'm the one that was there for the kids while they were self centered and having their fun.

I think that she wants me to help him feel better. They made their choice, I'm not responsible if he feels guilt or feels uncomfortable with their affair. They were impulsive, showed little thoughts and empathy for my kids, if you don't think things through your actions catch up to you.

I'm angry because she wants me to help her. He broke my home, he's not going to get my help. Its how it's insinuated that it's for the kids, it's about her needs ( boyfriend ) If he feels guilt or he's uncomfortable when he's around me and doesn't feel like he "fits" that's on him to sort out.

We're two separate families, the kids have two homes. That's a part of life, we don't need to have blurry lines and a dependency on me to ease dysfunction. I'm split white because she has an emotional need that she wants fulfilled,  I am her savior?

It's emotional blackmail when she says I'm uncompromising which really means that she doesn't like my boundaries; she wants her freedom with my family to parade in front of her friends and family like things are Ok; my friends at one point in my life, people that I trusted.

I have issues with trust and it's something that I'm working on because people that were important to me in life; I feel abandoned by and not everyone is going to treat me this way. I feel resentment and disrespected when they were told the most horrible things about me and this was going on without my knowledge for many months before she exited.

I still have hurt feelings over that and she wants rescue; an ends to a mean. I mean really, you need me back in your life and celebrate birthdays or be a part of activities with them again and make your boyfriend comfortable?

I know this is a difficult situation for you Mutt, but what I see in your post is a very healthy indignation at:

1. Your ex's attempts at manipulation (especially using the kids) and,

2. Her callous disregard of YOUR feelings in this situation.  

Good for you! It's very difficult for someone to abuse you when you can see everything for what it is.

The fact that she's framing it as something that would be good for the kids is especially infuriating. It is clear from her ACTIONS that she cared little about your children through the affair, breakup and new living situation. That may sound harsh of me to say, but love expresses itself in actions and not words. And as if that wasn't bad enough, she is now "pretending" that what she's suggesting would benefit the kids when, in reality, it's to benefit herself and her r/s. That's gross, quite frankly.

Take a deep breath and take a step back. I remember this feeling well - the unfairness and the distortions of my ex could send me from 0 to 60 mph in no time flat. Wait for your emotions to cool, and make your decisions unapologetically - based on what's best for you and your kids. You can see through her. Get your validation from within and from these boards and ignore the craziness.

[Suzn]

I think that the reason why she wants to have both families do things together is to make him feel like he fits in.

Is there a reason behind why you think this?

I mean really, you need me back in your life and celebrate birthdays or be a part of activities with them again and make your boyfriend comfortable?

Does there need to be a reason behind saying no, I'm not comfortable hanging out? The anger and or resentment with this guy and your ex is just. My point was you get to feel how you feel, you get to do what you want going forward without having to justify or defend your choices. I had issues with setting boundaries while I was in my relationship and for a long time afterwards. Like you, my upbringing has had it's affect. With the help of my T, these boards, like minded friends and practice that changed. I will no longer offer justification for my choices, I may explain my thought process however. And that is for those people whom I want to build meaningful relationships with or with say with a work colleague where it is important to find a solution.

This was the basis of bringing up attachment.

Detachment can move us from acute suffering into something close to peace.

FREEDOM [Stage 5]: You've reached this stage when thinking about your loss (or the thing you desire) doesn't interfere with your normal feelings of well-being. Desire, fear, and hopelessness are deeply embedded in our psyches, and we feel their pull whenever any remnant of attachment exists. We know that we've begun to achieve real detachment in a situation when we can contemplate what's occurring without immediately getting blindsided by these feelings.

The fifth stage is a state of true liberation, which the sage Abhinavagupta describes as the feeling of putting down a heavy burden. It's no small thing. Every time we free ourselves from one of those sticky feelings, we unlock another link in what the yogic texts call the chain of bondage.



Since I am working on issues in my own family that involve a child I get how super hard this is when your children are involved. Trying to keep them safe and teach them about coping skills is difficult while the actions of your ex are still triggering. There's nothing "wrong" or "bad" in this mix, the emotions left over from this relationship, and your own childhood from what you say here, just still exist. I totally get that, working on setting aside being hurt and angry in the past and looking for solutions going forward has been challenging. As the text above states, it's no small thing.

So what's your plan?

Honestly, it's not personal. She is who she is. Depersonalize it.

Agreed, it's not personal. What does depersonalize it mean?

It means depersonalize her behavior. It has nothing to do with me.

It takes a lot of courage to take steps to honor your feelings by setting boundaries for your own well being when we weren't use to doing this in the past. I asked about the term used here to simply "depersonalize it" sounded like a light switch that could be flipped on and off. This acknowledgement is part of a much bigger picture for those of us raised in an environment such as the one you described.

I don't want the kids to feel confused and send them the wrong message that dad's Ok with all of this; I just can't do it.

This could be treading on dangerous territory. Can you see a way to work on you and your "relationship", for the lack of a better word, with their mother that don't include any messages that might put your children in a position to chose who's right or wrong, or who's good or bad? That's a heavy burden for a child.

I am friendly, but it doesn't mean that we all have to do stuff together. I see boundaries as something malleable; I can change and soften them.

This sounds totally reasonable. I agree with jkbuzz, making your decisions unapologetically - based on what's best for you and your kids is a good place to be after all that's happened. 



 

[Mutt]

I think that the reason why she wants to have both families do things together is to make him feel like he fits in.

Is there a reason behind why you think this?

A family member asked me about a picture she put up on social media and I saw the picture later at my youngest 's daycare. The kids were asked for pictures of their family.

The picture was of all of the kids and mom and her boyfriend and each child was holding up a card, with a word, and all of the cards created a sentence "we are expecting 2015"

This was the basis of bringing up attachment.

Detachment can move us from acute suffering into something close to peace.

FREEDOM [Stage 5]: You've reached this stage when thinking about your loss (or the thing you desire) doesn't interfere with your normal feelings of well-being. Desire, fear, and hopelessness are deeply embedded in our psyches, and we feel their pull whenever any remnant of attachment exists. We know that we've begun to achieve real detachment in a situation when we can contemplate what's occurring without immediately getting blindsided by these feelings.

The fifth stage is a state of true liberation, which the sage Abhinavagupta describes as the feeling of putting down a heavy burden. It's no small thing. Every time we free ourselves from one of those sticky feelings, we unlock another link in what the yogic texts call the chain of bondage.

I agree.

There's nothing "wrong" or "bad" in this mix, the emotions left over from this relationship, and your own childhood from what you say here, just still exist.

Absolutely true, I also realize now how much compounded trauma I have from childhood, past events effect current behaviors. It has made me think about what I want to work on in therapy, exploring things that are unresolved from childhood.

This could be treading on dangerous territory. Can you see a way to work on you and your "relationship", for the lack of a better word, with their mother that don't include any messages that might put your children in a position to chose who's right or wrong, or who's good or bad? That's a heavy burden for a child.

Recently, I was surprised to hear my son, he's 4, say that he wants mommy and daddy to be together again. My daughter was 7 when my ex left, she had similar fantasies, she may still have them, I'm not sure. Getting back to the point with my son is that he was maybe 18 months when we split, I was surprised he would remember anything about "us" being together.

We may not realize that kids are constantly watching us and some things might fall through the cracks that we don't realize, they pick up on this stuff.

I think that I can work on what I can control ( me ) in our relationship, I can do that. You're right that I don't need to give an explanation to her if I don't feel if what she asks isn't right for me.