Realistic expectations

[pallavirajsinghani]

It's possible that his behavior is due to extreme guilt and shame he is feeling about lying about his divorce.  He saw a brass ring, he reached out to you.  In his desperation to be happy with you, he lied... .or rather fudged some facts... .because the intention to divorce was a fact... .but the timing of his narrative regarding the divorce was not.

I am a firm believer that forgiveness cannot occur with an apology.  Forgiveness is a result of restitution, it is an automatic reaction to restitution.  Please allow me to clarify:  A wrongs B.  B is hurt.  B communicates that hurt to A.  A is remorseful, apologetic and promises never to do it again.  B believes that he/she has forgiven A because A has shown remorse and shame and has understood that the act was hurtful.

To me, this is not forgiveness.  I think forgiveness is a natural process when and if... .after the remorse and the shame and the guilt and the apology... .B performs actions that make up for the initial transgression.

So Please allow me to make the following observations:

1)  I sense that regardless of how you feel right this moment, you come across more comfortable on the Staying Board than the Undecided Board.  This alone is revealing, in that... .the kernal of forgiveness has already taken root somewhere in your spirit.  It may be a sapling so small that you are not totally aware of it... .it has not yet resulted the fruit of fulfillment and joy.  It is still a sapling.  If this kernal had not taken root, it is possible that you could be on the Leaving Board... .your resentment is justified, but it is not a raging fire that has sent you to the Leaving Board.  That fact alone is the hope that needs to be worked on.

2) His actions are being positive and are enriching your life in many ways (his interest in your daughter's welfare for example, reflects his intention to honor your status as a mother... .and his general acceptance of your relationships with your family).  This is why perhaps the kernal of forgiveness has already taken root in your spirit.

3)  When he says or writes something positive, he wants to take it back... .his behavior and thought process seems to me as though he is ashamed and sorry and guilt-ridden and expects punishing behavior from you.  Perhaps he has experienced this punitive behavior for instance when he calls you to tell you that he is thinking of you in an intimate way, a loving response to this, regardless of being tired would be,  "O, that is so sweet... .I would love to be pictured that way because in reality today I have had a bad day dealing with the school etc... .so your thinking of me this way is so joyful.  Thanks... .you made me day.  I am very exhausted and will talk to you tomorrow... .etc."  Instead, he expects and perhaps gets verbal lashing... .because of your resentment.

4)  If the above hypotheses is somewhat correct (and you will intuitively know whether or not it is), then the line to follow is not learning validations skills that you can use to him and for him.  Rather learning self healing and validation skills to be used for yourself and to yourself fundamentally.

As your own personal healing grows, the rest will follow automatically. 

So the narrative needs to be changed to:  How can I get over my resentment, my feelings of guilt and shame of being in love with a married man (facts are not always in direct correlation to feelings... .it does not matter that you are not the one who originally fudged the truth... .the guilt and shame of being with a "married" man is symptomatic of a moral person.  If you did not have this guilt and shame... .even though you did not do anything wrong, you would be an amoral person... .and I do not get this sense at all.).

Your sense of justice and fairness is outraged. This fairness and justice is what will heal the relationship.  When you are restored internally, you will be able to restore the issues outside of yourself.

Seek self-forgiveness first.  Like I said, even though you did not fudge the truth, the shame and guilt could be damaging you because your feelings may not be line with the facts in this area.  And herein comes the resentment... .it is shame and guilt resulting in anger.  Resentment is self-directed anger.  (I know this because my sister has suffered from it for decades with her husband... .and only now they are in counseling and she is owning her own responsibility... .she build him up waaaaaay beyond he should have been... .she did not address his demeaning words to him immediately and swiftly... .rather to buy peace she accepted them as truth... .etc.)

Deliberately create good sensations and good memories for yourself... .start small with a deliberate pursuit of minor pleasures... .favorite cup of tea, favorite exercise, favorite book, favorite song... .be deliberate.  Each deliberate act of seeking small pleasures for yourself seems insignificant  in itself until each droplet of water becomes a powerful deluge.

He has not cheated on you... .He fudged the facts.  He did not fudge the truth.  There is a powerful difference here.

My intuition tells me that with careful pruning and careful watering and careful nurturing your relationship with him and his with you has all the essential elements that can blossom into a powerful strong joyous bond.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[unicorn2014]

Palla, you are right, your reply made me cry. I am dealing with anxiety, I'm seeing a social worker weekly for it. It has drastically increased since January.

( In August I had terminated therapy when my therapist intern left the agency, with her approval. In September when I found out my partners divorce hadnt been filed I elected to see a social worker. )

She sent me home with a pleasurable activities sheet, which I learned about in DBT. I'm currently enrolled in DBT . You are correct about the shame, the guilt would be from divorcing my husband 10 years ago .

(He is still abusing substances today.)

you are correct , I'm a devout Christian. I'm also in recovery as an adult child and my former sponsor was working with me on self forgiveness.

(She terminated the relationship because she couldn't handle my deep issues with my partner as well as strongly disagreeing with parenting decisions I made, because of her own adolescence. She has no children and has never been married.)

[waverider]

He suspects your level of forgiveness, and feels vulnerable to further punitive actions. So quickly withdraws this vulnerability in times of sensitivity

You don't feel the restitution is sufficiently complete to move past it either.

As pallavirajsinghani states this is a time of transition, almost a grieving of innocence, and it will take time to consolidate and move on.

In the meantime you are both a little fragile.

Does change make you feel vulnerable and a times want to stubbornly hang onto ideals out of principle?  Momentum of thinking patterns varies within individuals , and can't always be turned on a dime.

[unicorn2014]

Wave rider, I think part of the problem is his wife doesn't want to let go of him even though he's already started talking to his parents about me and my daughter.

I know I have a resentment against him and I know I need to let go of it and move on. I have been successfully able to uphold my boundary of keeping the relationship long distance until the divorce is filed which I want to talk about on another thread related to boundaries.

I know there is a part of me that wants to punish him for lying to me, not about the divorce, because I don't think he lied about that, but about the marriage. I'm still mad at him for that because it makes me look stupid. I know that's a very primitive reaction but that's what I'm struggling with. I didn't learn forgiveness in my FOO either .

[pallavirajsinghani]

... .like I said, forgiveness is a process.  It begins fundamentally with forgiveness of ourselves.  When we are able to do this, only then can we truly be forgiving of outside of us... .

I am glad of those tears.  These are healing tears.  They wash away stifling cobwebs that have been imprisoning heart and soul.

I also believe (and this conclusion is also based on personal experience) that when a person manages anxiety, one can manage the issues. We believe as though we manage anxiety by managing issues... .but this is backwards.  We can only manage the issues that need to be changed once we manage the anxiety.

So, whether it takes a combination of therapy/counseling/medication-----whatever a healthy concoction of these it takes, pursue it.  With the reduction in your anxiety level, you will notice that issues will be more manageable... .and you will be more powerful to usher in the changes that you want.

I do see that your anxiety level is already reduced by being on this board vs. on the other board.  The posts are resonating differently with you.  Your spirit is on the path of healing... .the concept of healing is not a finality.  It is not as though a grand miracle happens and suddenly we stay on cloud 9 for ever.  Emotional health is like standing on a tight rope it is a moment by moment balance.  Once should expect times where the wind is strong and one has to flail arms wildly to stay on the rope... .but one does not fall... .the balance still remains... .precarious it may be though.

Walk on sister... .occasionally hold on to us here when you need us... .like you are doing now.

:-)

[unicorn2014]

Thank you palla, I do take medication, I do see a social worker, and am in DBT. I do feel very positive he is talking to his parents  again although his father is a problem. I am glad I was able to send his parents a card and some photos. I'm looking forward to reading his father's reply.