Got A Christmas Present From My Ex

[Turkish]

A self help motivational book. Am I that much of a lost case? No. She's just being nice, maybe projecting a bit since she's deep into this stuff. It reminds me, though, of what my T said over a year ago: that after six years together, she really didn't know me. Sci-fi military thriller, science, history, or philosophy are my style, not self-help.

I also got a card, thanking me for all that I do (as a co-parent, I guess), but the p.s. was "I wish someday  you could forgive me for all my wrong doings  "

Yes, she wrote the smilies. I'm being triangulated.

I can forgive her for cheating, but it's the pain she caused our little children I have trouble forgiving. Leading a double life for the 5 months it took her to move out, then introducing the kids (then D1 and S-barely-4) to her affair partner now step-dad. Next month will mark two years since she moved out. We co-parent ok. I approach it like a Vulcan: do what needs to be done for the best interests of our kids, now D3 and S-almost-6.

I thanked her for the present by text. I didn't mention the card, which I imagine may feed into me being Persecutor. Am I still, by not flat out telling her, "everything's ok." To me, that feels like  enabling, because she wanted that while still living here and leading her double life.

[AwakenedOne]

Has she been sorry in a normal remorseful type of way for what it is that she wants your forgiveness on?

[thisworld]

What makes you think you are being triangulated Turkish? (I'm trying to learn more about these triangulations and your comment will be helpful if you have the time.)

[unicorn2014]

Yeah, I got a Christmas present from my ex too that I'm tossing around posting about on the coparenting board... .Its definitely got me spun out.

[mywifecrazy]

Hang in there Turkish. Trying to figure out there real intentions is an exercise in futility. Best to be polite and keep her at a distance. You know what it's like in her world!

I have to laugh because my uBPDxw got me a cheap little clock as a gift from one of my sons. On the face of the clock was an inscription... ."Family is the key to Happiness".  This from the woman that abandoned her kids to go live with my neighbor. This from the woman that hasn't had anything to do with her own Mother, Sister, Brother, etc for almost three years. This from the same woman that told horrible abuse stories about me her sons Dad as well as horrible stories about her Dad and her brother... .Really? Family is the key to Happiness? You can't make this stuff up!

MWC... .

[Turkish]

MWC, knowing your story, a gift like that would make my head spin.

thisworld, she's asking me for an emotional rescue, though I'm not the persecutor, she made her choices. I'm responsible for my part in the dysfunction of our r/s, but she owns her choices, and I'm not responsible for her emotions.

Saw my T today. I check in every once in a while, today being primarily to tell the saga of me recently moving my BPD mother in with me (it's a bit calmer going into week 3). I spent 10 mins taking about me and the kids. I showed him a picture of the card (he gave me a "that's a weird gift to give" look when I showed him a pic of the book. His response was the obvious, "she feels guilt."

Then he role played talking to me as if I were her and he were I. I wish I could record this stuff... Something like, "Ex, you betrayed me and lied to me. You demonstrated that you are untrustworthy; therefore, I cannot trust you, and I would actually be foolish to trust you. You want forgiveness? That's ok. I forgive you. Trust or lack thereof has nothing to do with forgiveness; they are seperate matters [and here he repeated my take on our parenting relationship as being "business]. "You have your life and have moved on. So have I. I'll encourage you to be the best mother you can be, and I ask that you also encourage me to be the best father that I can be."

He suggested sending it in a New Year's card, perhaps. It helps me feel better, but I don't think I'm going to do it. The downside may be occasional communications from her like this. Less drama=more peace for me. I don't want to engage in this conversation with her, but I will file this for the future.

[once removed]

turkish, i feel similarly in terms of how id respond or not. likewise id have similar questions about whether my response or not was adequate for the situation; youd know that better than anyone and whether this could escalate beyond what youre comfortable with. in my utterly non professional opinion, a response like that would be opening a door id have no interest in walking through. its also a boundary, and saying your piece, i just suspect thats less necessary to your healing these days. and if im wrong with that, by all means.

its also (as written) a really confrontational way to respond to a christmas gift. id certainly be irked by it. id probably write half a dozen notes to her in my head. you thanked her and didnt go deeper; thatd be my angle, i like to think.

having said that, it does sound like shes increasingly reaching out. asked for a hug, implied regrets, now asks for forgiveness. id ask myself: do you think there is a certain path, how do you feel about your responses, if there is a path, what could the most extreme points look like?

[Mutt]

Hi Turkish,

I think that my ex wife was looking fir forgiveness when she sent me an email. She said to let go of whatever anger that I'm holding onto. She doesn't think that she has done anything wrong but she did acknowledge that she knows that how she left hurt me. She said that she forgave me and that it felt amazing for her.

My point. I forgave myself and I forgave her but I didn't tell her that I forgave her because she doesn't understand what I'm forgiving her for. Does your ex understand her actions and behaviors if you forgave her? I find your T's response a little JADEy where he is explaining the difference between forgiveness and trust.

Do you find it JADEy?

[thisworld]

Thank you Turkish.

[Turkish]

I may have muddled it a bit, Mutt. However, even if not JADEy, it seems harsh. This goes more to the feelings f mine that despite everything, I don't want to hurt her, and like she told me over the summer, "I like the fact that you feel protective of me." She's wracked with guilt (shame), "compatrmentalized" too, as my T said, and that makes sense. I think I can handle occasional waifishness ("rescue me emotionally" on her side without engaging in the drama.

She reaching out to me has slowly died down, though I have only a few data points: the marriage sermon at church this past summer, where she hugged me tightly and said, "I wish things could have been different, I know now how much I did wrong" (waifish confession), and two months ago, after 4 months of marriage, "if I knew then what I know now, I need would have left you." (narcissistic confession). No accountability nor acknowledgement of the pain she caused; however, I know she feels it, even if it's centered upon her. I have no interest in adding to, or amplifying her feelings, good or bad. I'm trying to move on. Detach.

[Mutt]

You're right. It does sound harsh. What good is going to come out of it?

I have no interest in adding to, or amplifying her feelings, good or bad. I'm trying to move on. Detach.

Well said.

[shatra]

Turkish wrote-- I don't want to hurt her, and like she told me over the summer, "I like the fact that you feel protective of me." She's wracked with guilt (shame), "compatrmentalized" too, as my T said, and that makes sense.

====I am confused by this... .can you explain what ll that means?

====If you think the letter you wanted to write sounds like JADE, is there another way to express it? What you wrote/ther. said sounds great to say to a non-BPD

[Turkish]

Turkish wrote-- I don't want to hurt her, and like she told me over the summer, "I like the fact that you feel protective of me." She's wracked with guilt (shame), "compatrmentalized" too, as my T said, and that makes sense.

====I am confused by this... .can you explain what ll that means?

My T, who only saw her twice in individual sessions before she quit (because I was the problem, naturally). observed that she was compartmentalized, and likely a disintegrated personality. She presented herself differently to different people. She could betray, lie, and throw her juvenile r/s in my face, basically, while I got the vibe that she desired that I would be happy for her. To say it was unsettling is an understatement. This is how she copes, focused up her own feelings at the expense of others. She knew she was hurting me, and she knew she was hurting the kids, but she stiall did it. She only reached out to me about the anger of then S4 after she couldn't handle it. He was obviously angry about she bringing the OM in as a replacement right away. She didn't realize her "mistake" as she put it, until it affected her by way of his anger. Does this answer your question?