Need advice desperately

[Narkiss]

Person in your life: Romantic partner

Part of this was posted on the (wrong) subject:

   

I am in a romantic relationship with someone with BPD, and it is causing me tremendous pain. So many problems. So much chaos in his life. I am losing myself and putting my life on hold. We separated for a while and now are back together -- sort of. Every time I try to end the relationship, I feel even more pain and start hoping it could work out. When I met him, he told me that he was separated from his wife for years (they live in different states), and that they would divorce after some property matters are taken care of. All that may be true, but they are not as separated as he led me to believe and seem to be enmeshed.

He has had excuse after excuse why he goes and visits her. Now she is helping him with a family issue, which will mean more stress, contact and enmeshment. I told him last night that the situation was incredibly painful to me (which he acknowledged) and that he is not as separated as I thought (which he also acknowledged). I told him that I don't know what their relationship is or what she means to him or really what will happen in the future. He told me what he has told me before. After they sort out the property issues they will get divorced.

He told/tells me he loves me. I think he does feel love and affection for me. At the best, he is loving, tender and supportive and adoring. He is incredibly bright. At worst, he is selfish and arrogant and entitled and bitter. I went to visit him a month ago. He told me he wants to be with me forever. I saw him a few weeks after that. He packed me up and told me it was time to go home. He is under a lot of stress (may lose his job). Can anyone give me suggestions, options, advice? No one has treated me so well or so badly.

[Daniell85]

hello, how long have you been having a relationship with him? You said you broke up for a while. How long was it, why did you break up?

A lot of this begins with you. Have you had a chance to read the links on the right side of forum pages?

Did he tell you when he thought he might be filing for divorce?

Help us get oriented with you. What would you like to see happen?

[Narkiss]

This has been going on for about 10 months. We broke up -- if you can call it that -- because he was supposed to come and visit, then he never made plans to come in, which was tremendously hurtful because I told him how important it was to me.

He has done this before, but this time he did not give an excuse. Then I discovered that actually he was going to be in town for an event -- to which I was also invited -- a few days before and was bringing a guest. I went. He was embarrassed, defensive and angry. We traded a couple of text messages after, but did not speak for nearly a month. I was starting to get over him -- when he called and told me that he cared deeply about me. He never apologized. All he said then and later was that he did not know if I could/would move to another city to be with him, and he was worried that I would ask him to leave a job and come to me (a trigger for him).

He has not given me a time frame as to the divorce. In the past, he has told me that he does not love her, but feels pity and responsibility for her. But that said, he has been visiting her monthly, first to take care of their property matters, and then just because (Thanksgiving, Christmas). He had to care for a family member last weekend and she flew in to help him.

What do I want to happen? I don't know. I am quite sure that he is aware of the BPD -- we've talked around it -- and that he knows I suspect it. There are enough other dysfunctional things in his life (he is unreliable, inconsistent, selfish, emotionally immature, trouble-making, self-sabotages, etc) that I do not know if it could ever work. I put more effort into the relationship than him, although he calls a lot. I cannot completely trust him. On the other hand, I love him, I care about him and we can be quite wonderful together. I guess I want this relationship to work -- or just end. I feel so much sadness and pain and guilt just thinking about that. As it is, it is not satisfying to me. I am also starting to worry that I am the other woman. And despite her extreme dysfunction and chaos-making -- which he is aware of and tells me he's tired of -- he won't leave.

[Narkiss]

Another thing you should know (although I am not proud of this). I was married when I met him, although very unhappily. He knew this and chased me relentlessly. At some point, I decided to separate from my husband. Through it all, he gently encouraged me to leave and talked about a future with me. I left, and that was when he broke the promise to come in, etc.

[Suzn]

Hello Narkiss 

Welcome! I'm sorry you're going through all of this. Living in limbo is a difficult place to be.   

He never apologized. All he said then and later was that he did not know if I could/would move to another city to be with him, and he was worried that I would ask him to leave a job and come to me (a trigger for him).

My first thought is how does he know this is a trigger for him, has it happened before? (to him) With all the chaos you are already seeing, are you considering moving?

From what you've shared this man is quite enmeshed with his wife still. Whether it's for the sale of property or more he seems emotionally unavailable for your needs right now. It might be helpful to take a step back to create some space for yourself if you are feeling you might need clarity.

What does "I've put my life on hold" look like?

[Narkiss]

Yes, his wife has done that to him -- tell him that she'd move to be with him and then reneged. I have family obligations here, but I could spend half my time where ever he is and I've told him that.

There were so many red flags that I ignored because I liked him so much and also because the relationship filled a need in me.

I guess "putting my life on hold" has meant that I've been preoccupied with him for nearly a year. I've kept it together for work, but I've been emotionally checked out and stopped doing many of the things I enjoy -- not because he asked me to, but because I've felt like I've been in a holding pattern.

Next time he calls, I probably will tell him that I need some time to think. Before the BPD thing came together for me, I found some of his behavior inexplicable (radical mood swings, bad decisions), but we cared about each other so much and seemed to be so close that I honestly began planning a life with him. (I assumed that he meant what he said and not just in the moment). That is hard to let go. I've also felt from nearly the beginning that he could just disappear without any warning and I'd never see him again -- which caused a lot of insecurity and anxiety. Even now, I feel that way. I am sitting wondering if he's going to call, which is crazy because I don't especially want to talk to him. But I feel pain that he won't. It's like an addiction I have to break in order to look at this clearly but I don't know how

[Suzn]

I've kept it together for work, but I've been emotionally checked out and stopped doing many of the things I enjoy -

It's like an addiction I have to break in order to look at this clearly but I don't know how

It would help to start getting back to things you enjoy, even if you don't especially want to. I'm sure you've heard that saying "I may be moving slow but I'm moving faster than those on the couch." Sometimes pushing ourselves a little bit helps us gain momentum a little at a time. Do you have friends or family you can reach out to? Even getting ourselves to the gym or just taking a walk to get some endorphins moving around can help boost our mood.

[Narkiss]

Yes, I have been walking and today I started working out. I have also been trying to see friends (who think I'm crazy).

I just can't believe that someone could tell you he loves you and wants to be with you and then two days later be back with his wife. For such a long time it seemed that we wanted the same thing, the same kind of relationship. I had no idea he was not capable of it. So many things he promised me and never did -- from large to small. We made so many plans that he canceled. And it destroyed much of my enjoyment when I did them myself. I don't think he did it to hurt me, but he disregarded my feelings. I think he may have forgotten about me at times. At others, I was a wonderful dream girl.

Not long ago, I grabbed his hand and asked him if reality wasn't better than fantasy. He agreed wholeheartedly. But then two weeks later... .

He didn't call. He probably won't. It's also probably for the best.

[Jazzy]

Narkiss,

Your story almost reads like mine. I was with a wonderful( so he made me believe) man for 6 years. When we first got together he told me he had walked out on his wife , that he would file for a divorce soon. After a few months he started visting her for reasons such as  sorting out tax issues, property issues etc.  A few years down the line, he even went on a couple of holidays with her. Each time I complained  and told him it made me insecure ,he said if he did not listen to her, she would turn nasty and not give him the divorce. My instinct told me things were not right. I tried to break off , but found it more painful to keep away from him. He said I should trust him which I did because I loved him and still do.6  years later I have been replaced  and discarded . I do not recognize the gentle person I was in love with. He has turned nto a nasty, mean person.Before going NC 4 months ago, he told me he had sent the divorce papers to his wife.  I am surprised that he did this a month after meeting my replacement , while I waited 6 years .I doubt he told me the truth.He is currently living with my replacement who he met a year ago.

Not only am I devastated and a complete mess, I feel so stupid at having ignored all the red flags.I wish my heart had listened to my head right at the beginning and spared me all the hurt and pain that I go through every second of my life.

My advice to you would be to listen to your gut instint. If you feel something is wrong it probably is the case.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Hugs

[Narkiss]

Jazzy-What finally led you to NC? How did you do it? I have ignored and disbelieved so many red flags and excused so many others. I can't talk about our relationship for the most part without sending him running. I keep hoping he'll change even a little and be the self he is sometimes. He has told me in the past that he does not love her, but feels responsible for her. He gives her a ton of money-- to the point of destabilzing himself. She is incredibly dysfunctional -- and he has told me he is tired of dysfunctional women. But I think he loves her again. I hate the feeling of being the other woman. I did not expect this. So far, he has not called and I have not. I asked him to send me info on a project. He said he would, but didn't. He also didn't answer my last email. What it means, I don't know. I am doing my best not to contact him at least until I have enough space to get clarity. I can put up with a lot. But I can't stay with him if he is just going to go back to his wife or dump me on my head again.

[Jazzy]

Narkiss,

I got to know  I had been replaced in July 2015.He had already been seeing  my replacement since March 2015. He wanted to remain friends and since the thought of not having him in my life was so unbearable, I continued to remain in touch with him. However he turned from the gentle person I knew into a mean , horrid man.He would not take my calls, but expected me to be available when he called. Plus he started calling me names and humiliating me. I bore it all , as I did not want him to cut me out of his life. However when the name calling extended to my family I could not take it anymore. I told him I would not communicate with him .All he said ( on text) was " Okay ". That was exactly 4 months ago. He has never contacted me since then , not  even once  to say sorry. This was the man I was  with for 6  years and the one I was going to get married to .The last few months have been the worst in my life, but I know I  have to go through the pain for the sake of my sanity. I do not know whether his wife knows about the new woman in his life and vice versa. I know he is a master of his game and that he never had any intentions to marry me. All through our r/s he  told me things  I wanted to hear ( "you are the only one I have ever loved. I care for my wife , but never loved her" etc) to keep me ensnared  till he got fed up of me and discarded me like a used toy. Then his mask fell off and his true self emerged.I guess he is now playing the same game with my replacement and his  ( estranged?)wife.

 

The last 4 months have been very difficult Narkiss , but I am doing it for me.There are times when I want to call him just to hear his voice or text him, but so far I have been able to stay NC. I loved this man with all my heart and I still do.Cutting him off from my life has been the hardest thing I have ever done, but by doing so I have taken away his power to keep on hurting me and to treat me like an object.

Good luck with whatever you decide... Hugs

[Narkiss]

I have not talked to him since I told him that the situation with his wife is so difficult for me. I am struggling not to call him. I want to so badly if only to relieve this pain. It makes me so anxious to have a relationship with someone who wants me one day and doesn't want me the next and who consistently chooses the path most likely to cause chaos and least likely to get him what he wants. I know I cannot suppress my feelings and always pretend he's wonderful and everything is ok. I can't deal with his wife. I really can't. It's humiliating. I know all this, but still... .

[Narkiss]

General questions: What are my options?

[JohnLove]

All he said ( on text) was " Okay ".

Hello Narkiss and Jazzy, coming from a man I am sorry to hear how you have been treated and how you are both enduring through this. I would encourage you to turn your life around. Learn from the negative experiences. Remember the wonderful times. Accept what "Love" you did recieve. I know this is not easy and I understand first hand how painful these relationships can ultimately be. I know where you are coming from.

I am in cintact with my exBPDgf but am coming from a position of some strength and refusing to recycle a second time. In my belief system once a relationship gets to the point where it "breaks" then that is every indication that something is really wrong. There are so many opportunities and possibilities before that happens, and if they're not employed or fail, well... .

It's like dying in a sense. There's no coming back from that... .OK, so there was this ONE guy.

I was happy to read you supporting each other. If only our BPDex's were capable of this.

Those "OK" texts were some of the worst responses to me pouring my heart out to my exBPD partner. They are illogical responses to usually something very very troubling and concerning your feelings. Theyre also invalidating, rude, heartless, condescending... .I'll stop there. 

[Narkiss]

We were hardly ever able to resolve any kind of relationship issue. If I made a request -- he felt pressured. If I was unhappy about something (like him not considering my feelings) -- it made feel bad, which he couldn't handle. The relationship became stalled on simple things that could have been easily fixed. We talked about communication but never did it. I know he treated me terribly -- but I was and still am in denial about that. Either I made excuses (terrible childhood, lots of stress now) or disbelieved it. I still am not sure that it's over -- unless I want it to be. He never broke up. Just hasn't called. The last thing he told me was that he loved me. 

[Jazzy]

John Love,

Thankyou so much for understanding. Yes those one word responses were terribly humiliating. I got a lot of them throughout my 6 years with him. It made me feel so insignificant , almost like my presence or absence in his life did not matter to him at all.

Narkiss,

There have been numerous occasions when I have tried to ask my ex for answers and  his response has typically  been," You know what , I don't want to talk about it " or he has turned the situation around in such a way that I have had to apologise for  having the gall to question him  .He was always breaking down any communication meant to resolve issues.  As long as he felt validated everything would be fine, but heaven forbid I questioned him about something, then he would clam up and give me the silent treatment till I apologized.After he replaced me , the silent treatment was replaced by raging ( something I never witnessed when I was with him), name calling and generally bashing me up for every thing I said.

My ex told me he still loved me even after he started living with my replacement, also that he was not sure he loved her .Initially I though he had realized he had made a mistake and would come back to me, but after reading up here I realize that is  their way to keep you hanging on in case their new relationship doesn't work out .Just the way he was supposedly in love with me and was going to marry me, but never stopped meeting his ( estranged?) wife.

I miss my ex too Narkiss and it takes a lot of effort to not call him or text him.I am on the wrong side of 40 and feel I may never find  love again . I feel lonely , depressed and angry that I let him use me the way he did. However I also know that if I contact him I will once again give him the power to control my life and ruin me all over again.I must stay NC and reach a point where I can become indiiferent to him. As of now it seems impossible, but I must keep on trying.

Do what you feel is right for you. Hugs.

[Jazzy]

Narkiss, If I may ask... .why are your bf and his wife living separately? Is it for work reasons?

My ex bf and his wife lived in different states for work reasons. They had not separated as he made me believe although he was constantly talking ill of her  and saying he did not love her .  He used to keep repeating that she had no place in her life for anything other than her work... She was doing much better professionally than he was  and I believe somewhere at the back of his mind that was the reason he did not want to cut off from her. She provided him with stability while he was in and out of jobs. He "needed" to have her in his life to provide support each time he was without a job.

[Narkiss]

Sort of. He told me they separated because she said she didn't care about him or something like that. But practically, he took a job in another state and she didn't want to give up hers. I've wondered if I would encounter his wife, ex-wife or a girlfriend on these boards. I don't think we have the same guy, but if you want to send me a message, I'll give you more information. I met him in April 2015. Thinking back, I think he may have been seeing someone when we met, although he said he had not been with anyone since he separated from his wife. In fact, there were several times that he called me and dissasociated or sounded really sad and regretful, and now i think that he momentarily split me black and called up his wife or an old girlfriend and made plans to see them-- and then felt bad about it, because he knew it would come out and it would cause a break.

[Jazzy]

Narkiss,

The behavior of my ex and your bf are so similar, it almost sounds like it is the same person! However mine is currently living with my replacement and posting very' happy to have found one another"  pictures on FB.  The new woman in his life is a retired person who has been single many years now. From what I hear he is still in the idealizing stage and she is very happy with him.

I wish you all the best.

Hugs

[Narkiss]

Ah. No, we have never lived together and he is not on Facebook (also I am not retired). I bet a lot of stories sound the same because these relationships follow very similar patterns. That is one of the things that scare me.

[formflier]

That is one of the things that scare me.

I would encourage you to think about this. 

There is power in all of these stories being the same.   You can learn their playbook. 

Warning:  Their playbook and "language" is going to seem odd to you.  Look at this as learning a foreign language. 

Narkiss,

I would focus on understanding "push/pull" behavior.  My theory is that when you left your marriage to "pursue" him (even though that is what he said he wanted) that it triggered him to "push" you away.  Many of your behaviors since then seem to have the same effect to trigger him to "push" you away.

Last thought for now.  Are you now or have you ever been involved with a T (therapist)? 

bpdfamily is a great part of a support group.  Think of it as a three legged stool.  bpdfamily is one leg, a T is another leg, and a solid social circle is (perhaps) the third leg to help you have a grounded, healthy life.

Looking forward to getting to know you better.

 

FF

[Narkiss]

Formflier: I'm sure I triggered him by leaving my husband. But then again, I do not know if I can be in a relationship where it is all on the other person's terms. Honestly, that is one of the big reasons why I left my husband, who is a very difficult person and needs to live in a certain way or he has trouble coping. I finally got tired of living my life accommodating him.

I know my pwBPD deeply cares about me and (sometimes) dreams of us being together. But I really don't know how much he wants me. He never went out of his way for me. I was the one who did most of the visiting, etc. He broke promises, even simple ones. It makes me feel dizzy and nauseous that he can say something one week and the opposite the next. And I feel a shell of myself when I can only express beautiful feelings but must suppress unpleasant ones for fear of upsetting and triggering him.

[Narkiss]

And yes, I have a T, who looks unhappy whenever I tell him that me and my pwBPD are back in contact.