Planning on a divorce, as described in Spitting.

[Before you can make things better, you have to stop making them worse...]

Hello,
I just read Splitting, and am trying to plan for any eventuality and trying to get to a point where I can actually separate/divorce.  A large issue is financial. Hard to leave when there is no where to go.
Also dealing with the "normal" times in between outbursts and anger.  It's such a relief that it makes me think, "this is not so bad, maybe if it would just stay like this".  But I know it won't.
Another difficult thing for me is knowing my imperfections and wondering if this is partly my fault, particularly financially at the moment.  "If our finances were worked out, maybe she would not erupt and be so mean/rude to me and the kids".
Very tired of walking on eggshells though. It does not seem to be a lot to ask to want to be with someone who is not mean to me.
Thanks,
Charles

[miavn]

Hello,
I just read Splitting, and am trying to plan for any eventuality and trying to get to a point where I can actually separate/divorce.  A large issue is financial. Hard to leave when there is no where to go.
Also dealing with the "normal" times in between outbursts and anger.  It's such a relief that it makes me think, "this is not so bad, maybe if it would just stay like this".  But I know it won't.
Another difficult thing for me is knowing my imperfections and wondering if this is partly my fault, particularly financially at the moment.  "If our finances were worked out, maybe she would not erupt and be so mean/rude to me and the kids".
Very tired of walking on eggshells though. It does not seem to be a lot to ask to want to be with someone who is not mean to me.
Thanks,
Charles

[livednlearned]

Hi miavn,

Be kind to yourself and give yourself the benefit of the doubt.

You did (and are doing) the best you can under difficult circumstances. It takes a lot of strength to not be emotionally injured by someone who suffers from BPD.

It often feels like there is nowhere to go, altho when you make a change new paths seem to pop up like daisies   often ones we could never have foreseen.

I notice that men equate their worth with financial provision, altho honestly, financial security can be very challenging when you are trying to hold back the tides of BPD fury on a daily basis.

You are surviving right now and yes, it's tiring. We're here to walk with you on this path and keep you company. You're not alone.

What are your thoughts about leaving? How many kids? What kind of custody arrangement are you hoping for?

How are the kids doing?

LnL

[SamwizeGamgee]

I hear you. I am, and have been, debating whether to divorce or try to endure marriage.  I know it's really tough to think about hurting (by divorcing) your wife when you have a good, or even great, day together.  I'm confused by the cycle between the Dr. Jekyll and Mrs. Hyde.
And yes, although I finally got my head clear from the notion that "it was all my fault" as my wife enforced for years, I ask myself if there is more I could do, should have done, to improve the marriage.  I try to have a balanced view of myself and my life.  I am not as bad as she says, nor am I perfect, but, I fit in the "average but trying to improve" category.
I read Splitting as my first book specific to divorce and BPD.  It opened my eyes.  I read dozens more and have gotten something from each one.  I will point out that unless you are in danger of bodily harm, or relentless abuse, you can go on your schedule.  Take the time you need to study, ponder, seek help.  Time itself can make you stronger.  Our bodies and minds were built to heal from damage.

[lmnd]

Wow this is exactly how I feel!  I am just learning about BPD and its scary to me.

[ForeverDad]

Also dealing with the "normal" times in between outbursts and anger.  It's such a relief that it makes me think, "this is not so bad, maybe if it would just stay like this".  But I know it won't.

I too went through that endless roller coaster ride of ups and downs.  However, it gradually got worse, especially after some trigger or trauma.  Eventually it got to the point I was always apologizing (and her not) and always appeasing (her demanding) and no one could reach through to her and it imploded.

Another difficult thing for me is knowing my imperfections and wondering if this is partly my fault, particularly financially at the moment.  "If our finances were worked out, maybe she would not erupt and be so mean/rude to me and the kids".

If only it were that simple... .

Yes, we're all imperfect.  However, you shouldn't feel too guilted because she's doing an immense amount of Blaming and Blame Shifting onto you.  Let's say it was 10% you and 90% her.  Honestly, why should you feel it was "All Your Fault"?  (Yes, there's a book, also by Bill Eddy, It's All Your Fault!)  What's she's doing to you is shades of Stockholm Syndrome.  Remember that?  That's when hostages start to sympathize and connect with, even support, their captors.

It's not just about the money.  There are millions of poor families out there and they're not blaming the other spouse for the financial circumstances.  It's the warped perception, the disordered perspectives.  Browse our threads, there are lots of members who do have money (not rich but not destitute either) and they suffer the same blaming and blame shifting as you experience.  The money aspect is an excuse.  Take that factor away and there will still be other conflicts.

However, money can be a factor to consider in a divorce.  But that hurdle, just like all the others, can be addressed and overcome.

[ForeverDad]

Regarding your worries about your share of responsibility in the relationship's dysfunction and downfall, note this comment by another member this week that mirrored my post that you shouldn't be too hard on yourself... .

I know my future will eventually get better/easier, and I know I need to remain as constant as I can for my boys - but it is not getting any easier for the moment. It is as if she wants to punish me. I wasn't perfect but I also wasn't that bad.

[CrossroadsGuyMn]

I relate very well to your thoughts around the 'good' times, and them making you feel like you can keep going, or that you are wrong to feel the way you do.

Through the help of my therapist, and re-reading SWOE, I'm coming to realize that maybe the 'good' times aren't really what they seem.  My BPDw went 7 days without any episodes of BPD behavior or alcohol abuse.  This was the longest stretch of good, that we've had in about 6 months.

In my situation though, I think its just a sham.  Its the 'pull' phase of the push/pull cycle.  And wouldn't you know it... .she's been very symptomatic of BPD 3 of the last 4 days, and has been drunk those same days.

But by recognizing it, I was able to prepare myself for the push phase that she is in now.

If nothing else, know that you are not alone, and we have all felt similar pain to what you are feeling.

[SamwizeGamgee]

Knowing a lot about BPD is like you are still driving a bumper car, but this time with the lights on.  You can see the problems and twists ahead.  You know why your pwBPD does what she does, thinks how she thinks, maybe even got where she did.  You can't make her drive better, but you know to swerve or brace for impact. 
Recognition is important.

[miavn]

Thanks for all the support. It feels good not to feel alone.  I have not been on in a while, trying to keep this hidden (probably don't need to explain why) and got a new PC.
Now I'm reading Stop Caretaking... .It all seems like great advice, and I am pretty much past the first few stages and know there is a problem.  Almost certain the marriage needs to end.

"What are your thoughts about leaving? How many kids? What kind of custody arrangement are you hoping for?"
A 11 year old daughter, 15 year old son. I can't have full custody because I have to travel for work sometimes and have no one to help out, although I would like to do so.

Yesterday I was repeatedly hit and had my nice sunglasses stomped on (again) in the driveway as I drove away.  Driving away because she crossed the boundary of insulting/cursing at me (then the hitting on the way out the door).
Then, later, when I got back home, loud, vicious insults (which the 15 year old son could probably hear from his bedroom) and threats to tell the kids about something bad I did 13 years ago, which would obviously only hurt them.
It is very hard not to just take her up on the offer when she tells me to move out.  Unfortunately, the cost makes if pretty much prohibited.  I am planning on doing so in the near future as financial issues change.

Hard week, obviously.  Probably partly because my parents and brother will be visiting over the weekend.  That always helps things.

Thanks for listening. 

[lpheal]

I just wanted to share with you that I am also in a similar circumstance with uBPDw. We have a D3 and I worry about her well-being above anything else. It has become very clear to me in the past few weeks that I need to leave my marriage. This was a particularly bad weekend for me as well, as she blew up at me at an Easter dinner we were invited to by my work colleagues (there weren't enough seats for all of the adults... .minor issue that was fixed in minutes... .why do you have to take it so personally?). First time I've had something like that happen outside of our home in an intimate setting like that. Very embarrassing for everyone else (and me) I would guess (no one said anything), but might make it easier for everyone to understand when I eventually tell them.

Knowing what needs to happen and having the courage to take the next step are very different. I have been really struggling with acceptance for at least six months, but getting there finally. It helps me greatly to hear others also struggle with those good days. I also haven't found the right attorney, which is apparently quite important from advice on here. As soon as I do I feel like I will be ready.

I've also dealt with verbal and low level physical abuse, so I'm not sure what will be the safe way to tell her when it is time.

You are definitely not alone though!

[takingandsending]

A 11 year old daughter, 15 year old son. I can't have full custody because I have to travel for work sometimes and have no one to help out, although I would like to do so.

Hi miavn. Sounds like you have done a lot of reading and have been dealing with your BPD spouse for some time. I have started the divorce process with my uBPDxw. I wanted to ask you how much "sometimes" is related to your travel. My xw has told me over the years how much burden she has carried because of my work travel. Honestly, I allowed myself to be FOGged into believing that I could not possibly care for the kids because I do travel. But when I actually talked to the lawyer, mediator and other peers, the reality is that my travel of 4-5 business trips per year lasting 3-5 days each is not excessive. I found that I have bought into a lot more of xw's bullsh-t than I realize.

I want to encourage you to really consider whether or not you truly believe that you couldn't manage full custody, because I'd bet you would find ways to work it out. I am traveling for 6 days starting this Sunday for work and have made arrangements for my sons on my days in the event my wife does not opt for her first right of refusal. It feels good knowing that I can find workable solutions. I didn't think I could until I followed through with leaving. I guess what I am saying is you may be underselling your own strength and resources. It is so hard to know what you can do until you take off the fetters of care taking and negotiating a sick spouse out of your environment.

Your resources definitely improve, and you will find you are not alone. I have had many of my kids' classmates' parents reach out to me, letting me know they had kept their distance because of my wife. All of a sudden, more possibilities for me and my sons exist where previously there were none. Hang in there.

[miavn]

Thanks so much for the very thoughtful and helpful replies.
You are right, I had never even considered taking full custody, maybe I could work it out.
Absolutely time to find a good lawyer. 
I am pretty much in the acceptance stage, but am finding the suggestions for dealing with manipulation in Stop Caretaking difficult to apply on the spot.  I feel there is progress though.

An observation that I wonder if others have gone through is the incredible and sudden change on a person with BPD's face when they contemplate being alone.  I can see the unbelievable depths of the fear, like being dunked into to a black hole of despair.  It's shocking to see, and makes it very clear this is a serious mental condition (even if one didn't already know from all the other behavior).

Thanks again.

[lpheal]

the incredible and sudden change on a person with BPD's face when they contemplate being alone. 

I haven't seen it, but I heard it in her voice once. I left the house once for 24 hours when she was being physically abusive in front of D2. The fear was very real. Hoping for insight I came back, and the fear was replaced with the usual anger.

[SamwizeGamgee]

Miavn - [Pardon me.  Sorry, I have to climb up on my soap box] do not move out of the house without a signed court order for custody, unless you are absolutely convinced you are following your best attorney's advice.  When / if a dad moves out, he shows the court loud and clear he can manage without the kids, and vice versa.  That will haunt your case for custody for ever.  If anything comes to physical violence and something requires you to flee - make it so that your wife is the one who must leave - even for a medial lock-up / evaluation.  [climbs down from soap box]

On a happier note, I found "Stop Caretaking the Borderline... ." one of my absolute top three best books as I navigate the stormy waters of uBPDw.  I refer back to it once in a while, and always find some useful reminders that get me heading back towards sanity and calm in my personal life.  I think that book should be a mandatory semester at secondary schools everywhere.  I'm only slightly exaggerating.  I also recommend "Emotional Blackmail" by Susan Forward, and probably "The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans as recommended reading if you're in a situation similar to mine, and have and inclination to read. 

I travel for work periodically, and most trips are Monday to Friday.  Although I am not in a divorce process, if I were, I would not expect a problem vying for 50/50 custody, exchanged on weekends.  I can travel and be great employee, and be a great dad on my week for custody.  I live in the opposite of a progressive county though, and getting a fair argument for 50/50 will be the bigger hurdle, not what I do with the non-custodial weeks.

As a footnote, I would like to comment on something you said about the mom revealing something you did 13 years ago.  Give it some thought to see if there's a way you can resolve it on your terms.  The worst thing to do is leave it as an active hot-button that she can push to blackmail you.  My wife is holding a grudge against me for my behavior before we were married (even before we met) and she has brought it up in threats loud enough that I suspect my teenagers know about my past intimate behaviors, in college, 25 years ago.  I had to search around and find my own peace with it and live life forward.  Hopefully my kids will react to having a fully involved dad and not the terrible guy mom seems to think I am/was.  The net effect of my peace-making process is that I have forgiven myself, made good with God, and focus on living a life with integrity and role-model behavior for my kids.  The positive effect is that her threats and power she used to have by recalling the information is now void. The negative effect is that I have resolved to never divulge feelings, ideas, stories, thoughts, past or present, to my wife.  She is quarantined from anything and everything that makes me human.   But, she has no way to blackmail me.