Need someone to tell me I'm not insane

[needsupport33]

I'm so emotionally fatigued, yet anxious beyond measure. I feel like I need to leave but its so terrifying.

I've made a couple brief posts previously. I've spent so much time reading the articles, practicing not reacting, trying to be validating.

The bottom line - I'm 39, my wife is 38 upwbpd. I was married for 10 years previously and had 2 kids. My ex-wife cheated on my with a 63 year old married man, and I caught her with a PI, and then divorced her.

Within a few months, I met my current wife. We dated for 9 months (I know) and then she moved in with her 2 daughters, which she has them most of the time. I have my kids (7 yo girl, 10 yo boy) 50% of the time.

My ex-wife is the devil - she did alot of stuff to my kids to try and get them to hate my current wife, but overall things ended up pretty good - and they really do love her. But my god - anything and everything is evidence to my current wife that the kids hate her.

My son had a watch in his bed, and my wife says its because my ex-wife sent him here with it to set an alarm because he was complaining to his mom that we weren't getting him up in time for school. There is literally no evidence of that - its so out of left field. And apparently he didn't pick up a peice of trash that she asked him to - so his mom is telling him not to obey her rules. And if he leaves his shoes in the wrong place - it's just to spite her. Everything - literally - is a microagression. And it's all my fault.

Last night, I had to stay up late to finish my work. I was up until 4am. I am a physician, and because her ex-husband doesn't pay child support (and I do pay it to my ex of course) I am responsible for all 6 of us, and my kids at both houses. I work literally 80 hours every single week. I work at night, come home, do telehealth all day (constantly interrupted by her - she literally dumped an energy drink on my computer one day because I wasn't agreeing that my daughter got marker on the dress she bought her at school, because, you guessed it, her mom must have told her to destroy the clothes that she buys her). I was on a telemedicine call with a patient, and she literally dumped an energy drink on my computer and me DURING the patient visit. Later, I apologized to her. Yes, you read that right.

Mind you, I have learned my lesson to a small degree. Today, when she was railing on me about my son and how he is disrespectful and hates her, I went into the kitchen (I was working and left my patient queue to go comfort her) to tell her that I was on her team and loved her, and that I understood why she felt that way (although I really don't). I didn't say it the right way though. As a result, the rage started. I ended up losing my temper - because she started mocking me for "just wanting to do your appointments" (I work 8 different telehealth websites to support her and her kids and my kids). We've gone about 170k in debt in 2 years from taking 7 disney world trips (actually), remodeling bathrooms, buying a mercedes for her, paying child support and attorney fees, a trip to london for her and her girls to go to her cousins wedding, about 4k in doordash per month, etc. etc. etc. And we've gone into that much debt despite me increasing my salary 3x over within a 2 year timeframe.

During my work weeks, I sleep 2-3 hours a day. If I am not completely attentive to her wanting to talk about my ex-wife while I'm working AND on that much sleep, I get raged at.

The first week she lived here, it was my daughters birthday. As I was cutting her cake, with my parents in the room, she walked up to me and whispered in my ear that she was leaving me and that I was "worse than all the PLEASE READboys I've ever dated". This was because apparently my mother gave my son more corn before he finished his vegetables, which apparently she told him he had to eat his veggies first, but I wasn't there for any of it. But of course, I was in her mind ('there's no way you didn't hear that").

Today, she punched herself repeatedly in the face until she gave herself a black eye. She rolled around on the ground repeating "I'll do better, I'll do better, I'll be a good wife" but if I walked up to try and comfort her she kicked at me. She then followed me upstairs while i was crying and postured like she would hit me (she has before).

She repeatedly goes on tirades (directly to her daughters, who are both actively working on personality disorders too I fear) about how she can't believe how she ever chose me, how I'm a man-child, just use her for sex, am abusive etc. Her daughters glare at me anytime I enter the room generally. The younger daughter is the golden child - the older is a scapegoat. The younger daughter is the most histrionic 13 year old I've ever seen. The older daughter is definitely borderline.

Today, we fought because I didn't affirm her enough when she ranted for 10 mins in the middle of my work day about my son bringing a watch here from his moms. When I said I needed to see a patient, she mocked me, and it set me off. Like I work 80 hour weeks, and it shows. My beard has turned gray.I barely having time or energy to shower. And it's been that way for a long time. Despite that, she just ordered a 12k dollar couch from pottery barn, because she hates the couch I have in the living room now. She just texted me that she hopes I "have a good time playing x-box with your bestie tonight" (referring to my son). I spent 10 minutes last night playing x-box with him, because he was having a lot of feelings (I think he was overtired - and yes, I should've just made him sleep at that point then, but you get the point).

My daughter, at our last disney trip, asked her (out of nowhere, it's possible my ex put her up to this, I don't know) what the brown stuff was on her teeth. Now, I took away 2 special privileges from my daughter for saying that (it's disrespectful - like wtf - I get it) and made my daughter sit in the hotel for most of the day with me as a result. But my current wife, right after my daughter said this, leaned down and very toxically said "I know mom tells you to say bad things about me, like my teeth are crooked or stained. But let me be clear - the only thing your mom is going to win is a hot dog eating competition". My daughter is 7.

I need to leave this marriage. I've tried so hard. I am told I am a narcissist, manipulative, a liar, a martyr, all the mocking things constantly. At one point I was suicidal during this marriage (not now).

I just told my kids (its my custodial week) that I was going to file for divorce, and their little hearts broke. My son started sobbing crying. They love her. Because when things are good - she's the most caring and loving and attentive person ever. When things are good - 'the kids do love me and things have been good for a while now - I'm so hopeful' - but the next day - none of that ever happened. One week my daughter is alienated and hates her - the next week it's my son; back and forth.

I need someone to tell me to leave. I know that's not the answer, but I just feel like I've been made to be out the problem so much that I have PTSD or something, I don't even know.

[Notwendy]

I don't think you are crazy. You are working long hours to to support 2 families and also have a wife who is disordered. It's probably hard to think clearly when you have so much going on. You are also not getting much sleep.

We don't tell posters to leave. (or stay). It's an individual decision.

I can approach it from the perspective of the child. Children will naturally love a parent - even an abusive one. It's all they have. It's their only example of a parent. They don't have another choice.

But to have a parent who is both loving and abusive- is not good for children. I think you know that.

I have an idea of what your children are experiencing. I have a mother with BPD- and I have experienced the kids of behaviors you described.

Divorce was brought up at times- and I recall at about age 10, I did think it was scary. It's a scary idea to a child but children have limited comprehension of relationships and also divorce. Yes, your son cried when you said this. I did too at that age. As a teen, I still didn't understand it all but I wouldn't have cried. I wanted to get away from my BPD mother. If my parents had divorced, I'd have asked to live with my father. They didn't divorce- so college became my path to independence. Of course, their relationship was more complicated than I could have understood then too. These are adult decisions. My best advice is to not speak about it to the kids unless you are at the point where legally it is going to happen. Talking about it to them when it isn't happening doesn't do them any good.

I think you already know this but your children are experiencing emotional and verbal abuse. They aren't your wife's biological children. She doesn't have to care about them. You also know this- that to have a non-biological parent who is abusive sets the stage for this. You didn't intend to put them in this situation when you married your wife but you see it now.

I won't tell you to leave your relationship. I'll put it another way - you have a choice here- between your marriage and the best interest of your children. Because, if you stay with your wife- the children will continue to experience her behavior.

This is different from families where the BPD spouse is the biological parent- because in these situations, there's custody concerns. When a poster with children considers divorce, there is concern that the BPD parent would have part time custody. This is more clear cut where the children are concerned. You will have custody of them. Most likely, your wife would not want it anyway.

I could share examples of what I experienced but you've seen enough already to know what you and your children are experiencing. You are their only parent in this household. They also need you to be your best emotional self. In order to be able to take care of your children, you also need to take some steps to take care of you.

Look at it this way. If you were your own "patient" who came to you describing the situation- saying they aren't getting enough sleep and are working long hours, and with marital difficulties, what would you say to him about taking care of his own physical and mental health?

[Notwendy]

I will share that in my family, the "punishment" didn't necessarily fit the "crime". Sometimes the smallest slight would be seen by my parents as the crime of the century and punished as such.

I understand it was stressful for my father and sometimes he'd react in order to keep the peace because there was so much on his plate. And I can see there's a lot on yours too.

I also agree that kids need structure and discipline and to speak to parents appropriately. In a generally loving and supportive home, the occasional parent over reacting is the exception and if it isn't abusive, probably not memorable.

But the Disney trip is memorable because, going to Disney is special and she missed out just because she asked her step mother about stains on her teeth? From a child's perspective, taking away Disney World is a huge disappointment. I don't remember the times I got disciplined in usual and age appropriate ways, like "no TV till you do your homework" type discipline. But being overly punished, and disappointed- this errodes a child's trust in you, it confuses them.

My BPD mother said all kinds of things to me but the words and actions that had the greater impact on me were when my father said them because he acted more like a parent to me.  When Dad said or did unreasonable or hurtful things in order to appease my BPD mother, this sent a very confusing message.

I understand your situation. You are stressed and pulled in all kinds of directions. Your immediate reaction is to put out emotional fires immediately and so coming down on your kids to avoid a larger reaction from your wife is probably automatic. You are in survival mode. You can't control your wife but you can control your kids with with discipline. It was similar to my father's situation. He was human, so are you, and doing what he felt he could do in the moment.

I have good memories of my father- far more than the not so great ones. And I am not bringing this up to dwell on them- but to say- a relationship with a parent is built over time and your kids are young. While you have the responsibilty of providing for them, your relationship is more than this. You are a role model for them. They need to feel secure with you. How you treat your D is setting the stage for her future marriage one day. I do agree that in an emotionally stable marriage, the parents should be aligned but also in this situation, both parents are aligned in the best interest of the child. This isn't the situation here. It's your wife's feelings before your daughter's.

I think you are stressed, overworked and sleep deprived. Please take care of yourself. I think it's important for you to do this to be able to think clearly.

I hope that one day, you can go back to Disney with your kids and your daughter gets to be a princess for the day.

[needsupport33]

Thank you both so so much for the well thought out responses. Honestly, the validation has given me the strength to move forward with the divorce.

"I hope you go back to Disney and your daughter gets to be a princess for the day"

This literally made me sob crying. You are so right. I feel so guilty. But I'm going to set it right.

[PeteWitsend]

I went through some of this; I wasn't working the hours you were, and was in my first marriage, but had similar thoughts and feelings.

I remember reaching out on a different board, telling people I felt like I was the one who was crazy, and someone commented that BPD is notorious among therapists for "crazy making," i.e. they often see the partners of pwBPD, but not the BPDers themselves... who of course are in denial that their behavior is out of line and 100% committed to the bit of being a manipulative nightmare to the poor people unfortunate enough to be close to them.

I also got some counseling for myself, and that helped me see that I was perceiving the situation as it was.  And then saw and attorney to understand my rights and likely outcome of a divorce.

I too later got into a subsequent relationship with another likely pwBPD, although I didn't marry her and was able to get out before too much damage had been done.  Still more than I would've liked.  She didn't come with the same obvious red flags the first one did, but I made the mistake of living with her when I had cause for concern that the relationship might head in a less healthy direction.

You need to re-prioritize your life here.... put yourself and your kids first.  She should be at the bottom. 

Easier said than done, but take this in small steps and plan it out.

And for god's sakes man... 80 hours a week?  Take care of yourself PHYSICALLY.  You've got a lot riding on your shoulders here...

[PeteWitsend]

also, don't tell kids anything - or anyone who's not 100% in your camp - what you plan to do. 

file for divorce THEN tell people. 

pwBPD are very paranoid and vindictive... no sense giving them a headstart by having them hear from a well-meaning step child that you're going to file for divorce.  You need to move first.

I remember BPDxw and I discussing divorce and agreeing we'd mutually tell our daughter the next day.

well, what did she do?  She went behind my back to wake our daughter up in the middle of the night and tell her I was leaving her because I didn't want to be a father anymore. 

That was the last time I even thought to do anything with her. 

no pwBPD has any concern beyond themselves... she still to this day maintains that because I left her, I really left my daughter.  She cannot separate her own needs from those of our child's, and has no concern that in attempting to make me look bad, she would affect our daughter.

Keep in mind THAT's what you're dealing with here.

[ForeverDad]

also, don't tell kids anything - or anyone who's not 100% in your camp - what you plan to do. 

file for divorce THEN tell people. 

pwBPD are very paranoid and vindictive... no sense giving them a headstart by having them hear from a well-meaning step child that you're going to file for divorce.  You need to move first...

no pwBPD has any concern beyond themselves...

Reasonably normal people like us live our lives trying to be as Fair and Nice  as possible.  That is certainly an admirable perspective and personality... in a normal life and normal relationship.  However, your sense of Fairness can/will sabotage you when dealing with a negative and actively obstructive person.

So, as PeteWitsend warned, you don't give what you would be inclined to consider Fair Notice.  Our collective experience has been that this is TMI (Too Much Information) and virtually invites sabotage.

The general advice... If you are trying to repair a relationship, then you do share information while attempting to foster or restore trust.  But if you recognize that a relationship is failing or has failed, then you limit what you share.  For the most part you share only needed financial information and parenting details.  Anything more and you (and your goals) risk being obstructed and sabotaged.

For example, at this point you haven't had any children with her... it's only her with her children and you with your children.  In a divorce with no shared children the only major concern would be the financial aspects.  (Well, unless she makes "unsubstantiated" allegations of DV or child abuse.  That can become horribly scary and expensive.)  So be careful not to risk having a child with her.  She may in desperation imagine that if she can get pregnant then you're stuck with her.  If there is intimacy, you have to be the one in charge of contraception.  You can't risk her saying, "Oops, I forgot."  Sorry, the trust is gone.

[Notwendy]

I cried when I read about the Disney trip. It reminded me of some of my own childhood experiences.

I am glad that you understood my message about the Disney trip. It wasn't to make you feel guilty but for you to be aware that this kind of punishing your child for the purpose of appeasing your wife is for your temporary reprieve of a reaction but it's at your daughter's emotional cost- so you can make changes and make a difference and make different memories with your children.

But in order to be the best for your children, you need to take care of yourself both physically and mentally.  You also need to get some clarity on the dynamics of your marriage. If you haven't looked to therapy- I think it would help you. You are in the position of helping everyone else but as they say on an airplane- put your oxygen mask on first and you are running on fumes right now.

[ForeverDad]

Over the years I would expect that you're referred distressed patients to counselors for therapy.  Don't ignore that you - and your own children - would benefit from counseling.  (It is probably impractical for you get or manage therapy for your spouse or the step children.)  Remote peer support for yourself is great but it is also limited due to the nature of online support.  Build up resources for yourself and your kids locally... trusted relatives, trusted friends, local professionals, etc.

Get your legal ducks in a row, so to speak, follow advice of your experienced family law attorney, one experienced with court hearings, trials, etc because our sort of divorces almost always become more difficult and protracted than we could ever imagine.  Your spouse and her kids have used you for an extended free ride, they won't be happy for that to end.

[needsupport33]

We had one last couples session today.

I decided to lay it all out on the line. I described what I saw - intense mood swings, fears of abandonment, rapidly fluctuating opinions about people/subjects/etc etc.

It went about as well as I thought. I got raged at - I'm the entirety of the problem. My kids are demons who hate her.

I see the attorney Wednesday. I'm not saying anything until its all drawn up.

Sad.

[ForeverDad]

Even if you didn't mention divorce, she may sense the change in you, that the End is looming.  After all, the counselor witnessed it too.  Don't be shocked if she files first, claims abuse or whatever and demands you assume her debts and only money will make the divorce simpler.  Or she may stage some sort of nasty situation so she can later claim how bad you or your kids are and hold it over your head.

Technically, who files first does not necessarily hold the high moral ground.  Yet, when I divorced, I was the petitioner and I felt better about that.  (Didn't make the court like me.  Despite her facing a Threat of DV charge in another court, she was gifted her the usual "mother gets default preference at the start of a divorce".)

It seems like all of us had to struggle to get through our divorces.

[needsupport33]

The absolute hardest part is the realization that the woman I was so in love with, and thought loved me, is gone, or never existed? I feel like I'm in a dream. Like this can't be real...but it is. I'm so confused...like I know I could've done some things better, but everyone can, right? I'm being told our house is like a warzone - as her and her daughters are eating ice cream and watching movies on the other side of the house undisturbed. As I'm working and supporting them still. Living with me is unbearable and abusive because my son didn't pick up all of his clothes off the floor when she told him to? That's why my wife is gone? What is happening?

[PeteWitsend]

The absolute hardest part is the realization that the woman I was so in love with, and thought loved me, is gone, or never existed? I feel like I'm in a dream. Like this can't be real...but it is. I'm so confused...like I know I could've done some things better, but everyone can, right? I'm being told our house is like a warzone - as her and her daughters are eating ice cream and watching movies on the other side of the house undisturbed. As I'm working and supporting them still. Living with me is unbearable and abusive because my son didn't pick up all of his clothes off the floor when she told him to? That's why my wife is gone? What is happening?

It's sometimes hard to fathom, but I think it's more akin to "that person never existed" than they changed.  They're more like a "'chimera" you know?  Two separate people combined as one: the one charming and sweet enough to get you to fall in love, and then the other form that comes out once she feels she's secured your commitment.

The conflict has nothing to do with the things they claim it does; she uses conflict as a means to an end.  The conflict is the whole point.  you could be perfect and she'd complain about that, and still demand you find a way to give her more.

[PeteWitsend]

I would come up with a plan for a living situation between the time you file and the time the divorce is finalized.

A family law judge doesn't typically have authority to evict one party, or order them out of the house pending resolution, absent a protective order for physical abuse, so both parties could have to live together for months - or years -  while the divorce proceedings go on.

It may be in your interest to rent a condo or something for you and your children - without conceding your right to home ownership. 

depending on your state's family law regime, the house may be considered joint property if not one party's property.  You could force her to sell it to pay you your share, assuming she can't afford to buy you out.  Or vice versa.  As part of the property settlement, she might have to vacate. 

[Tangled mangled]

Needingsupport,

I have read all your posts and the response from members here.
I’m a female awaiting my divorced from a bpd male, I’m physically separated from my husband and btw also with a medical background.

My relationship too was chaotic and the grief I experienced towards the end is similar to what you have described.Sounds like you are in denial/shocked/disbelief in the grieving process.

I interpreted things as being scammed off life when I was at this stage.I felt robbed of my peace and sanity.
At one point I experienced dissociative symptoms and it felt like I was existing in an alternate universe.

The issues you’ve described between your son and his stepmom are quite common on these forums. The pwbpd is incapable of placing the needs of a child even their own biological child before their own.
As a mother of boys, there’s nothing out of the ordinary to find their clothes and shoes and other items scattered on the floor around our home, even after asking a few times.

It’s insane that your wife takes it personal. It’s unfair to your son to experience pressure from any adult about being this normal behaviour for a child.

What I see in your situation is that your wife is working hard on sabotaging your relationship with your children especially your son as he’s seen as a threat. She would like to have you all to her self and her daughters and even that will not satisfy her bottomless well of needs.

It’s great that if you choose to go through with a divorce, that you won’t have any custody issues with her and you are not responsible for the child support of her daughters.
But remember that it can get really nasty when she realises that she has a lot to lose.
If I was in your shoes I’d be mindful not to give her any reasons to make absurd claims of DV/SA against you. She has daughters so be very careful- I’ve heard some horrible stories of false accusations made about an ex and children when the pwBPD realises their game’s over.
Members here have been advised to wear cameras or secret recordings for their safety.

If at all it’s possible, it may be useful to move important items away from the home and move out temporarily to a different accommodation- perhaps family/ friends until it’s sorted by the courts.
You will experience a ton of weight being lifted off your shoulders when you don’t have to worry about her rage and awful behaviour on a daily basis.

Take care of yourself- your children will be proud of you in the future for standing up for yourself and for them.

[ForeverDad]

... and even that will not satisfy her bottomless well of needs.

Have you pondered these?  Discuss with your T how to reconcile her posturing when romancing started and when the romancing seemed to grind to a halt.

The Bridge
The Backyard Black Hole

[Notwendy]

If at all it’s possible, it may be useful to move important items away from the home and move out temporarily to a different accommodation- perhaps family/ friends until it’s sorted by the courts.
You will experience a ton of weight being lifted off your shoulders when you don’t have to worry about her rage and awful behaviour on a daily basis.

Take care of yourself- your children will be proud of you in the future for standing up for yourself and for them.

This whole post by Tangled mangled is informative. I am highlighting this because one of my BPD mother's behaviors when she is angry is to destroy meaningful personal property. If we left a toy out when we left the house, if she was angry at us for anything- it was possible she'd destroy it or hold it as a means to make us do things "if you want to see that toy again...". She continues to do this with sentimental items. Although we moved her into assisted living and she had to downsize- she has held on to some of our childhood items as a part of this.

Before you even indicate a wish to initiate divorce, my advice would be to get yourself a safe deposit box for yourself and put important records, papers, your license, medical school records- and sentimental photos, or letters- anything that is important to you- in your name where she can't get access.

If an item is larger than the box- get yourself a storage unit.

Move what you want to protect before your wife knows you are planning to divorce.

Of course, keep yourself safe too- but protect items that you wish to keep and especially the ones that are needed for your work.

[PeteWitsend]

I went the storage unit route.

I paid cash monthly, and they let me do this to avoid any cc bills or invoices coming to my home that might've tipped BPDxw off.

I didn't feel bad about this because she had been throwing things of mine away, including gifts my mom sent me or my daughter, and hinting I better get my boxes of family heirlooms, photos and stuff out of "her" house.

Note that the stupid storage unit place still mailed me something despite my best efforts, and BPDxw found it - it was an offer for insurance for the unit - but for some miracle reason she laughed it off as junk mail, instead of being suspicious. 

Having the storage unit also made moving out a lot easier when I eventually did it.  Got all my books, movies, etc. some furniture and what not in there without having to move everything at once. 

ALSO: if you have joint accounts with your spouse, talk to your attorney about this, but you might want to pre-emptively pull your half out and put it in a separate bank account.  you're not hiding assets - you WILL disclose it during the divorce - just preserving them.

BPDxw tried to loot all our accounts to keep me from divorcing her.  I did eventually get my half of these funds back, but not until the divorce was finalized . Fortunately she wasn't able to access our daughter's savings account, so I had that money to use to get out and get settled. 

it was a fortunate bank error!  I put her name on that account too, but the bank forgot to list her as an account co-owner!

[PeteWitsend]

Don't believe anything they say, or poverty they plead, for sympathy from you.

I was entirely above board, disclosing all my assets and painstakingly documenting the balances in accounts all the way back before we were married.  I didn't want to be accused of anything, or provoke her into behaving in bad faith..  Well...

1) she accused me of "stealing her money" anyway, and
2) she charged a ton of stuff on my cc after divorce and refused to compensate me for all the furniture and home furnishings I left (I paid for all of it), and the mediator took her side on this, and yelled that she wasn't going to spend a second of mediation trying to account for it.

[ForeverDad]

Having joint accounts or joint ownership or joint titles is a royal pain.  It is said many CC companies won't close joint credit accounts until it is paid in full.  So if you suspend it, the spouse can potentially call them and unsuspend it.

Fortunately, I had my own credit card and she had her own too.  So when we separated, I called my CC and canceled her card.  As for the card I had to her account, I cut it up.

[PeteWitsend]

Having joint accounts or joint ownership or joint titles is a royal pain.  It is said many CC companies won't close joint credit accounts until it is paid in full.  So if you suspend it, the spouse can potentially call them and unsuspend it.

Fortunately, I had my own credit card and she had her own too.  So when we separated, I called my CC and canceled her card.  As for the card I had to her account, I cut it up.

I think it depends on who opened the account.  When I filed for divorce, my soon-to-be-ex was an "authorized user" on a card I opened more than 10 years before I met her.  I was able to cancel the card, have her removed from the account, and have a new card issued to me only. 

I should've followed my attorney's advice and did this immediately.  I waited a couple days, and in the meantime, she ordered a $2500 couch for herself online using my card... 

I was also able to cancel our joint checking account at Chase, but it didn't really matter as she had already looted it. 

Fortunately I had opened a personal checking account elsewhere for emergencies like this earlier in the year, so it was a simple matter to change the deposit for my paycheck. 

[ParentingThruIt]

I’m so sorry. You didn’t cause this behavior and you don’t deserve it.

Maybe try to think of what boundaries with her would keep you and your kids safe. It seems like you need financial boundaries and physical and emotional ones. That might tell you whether you need to leave.

Remember, you are the stable person for your kids. You need to take care of yourself so you can take care of them.

The books Splitting and Stop Caretaking the Borserline or Narcissist are really helpful.