somewhat urgent: family and friends begging i drop NC and contact BPDex

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

quick summary: NC with BPD ex except some emailing for a month, broken up almost 3. friends and mom of BPDex reaching out today to beg I call him as he is spiraling into an absurd level of depression/sadness.  no threats of suicide, no psychosis, just fully miserable.

hey all, I've been off this board for a while focusing on me and decompressing from what became an obssesive habit of non stop rumination about my relationship with BPDex.  wont go into too much detail but it was 3 years of a very long idealization phase with the last year melting down into cheating, non stop (one sided rageaholic) fighting over the smallest things, physical abuse resulting in hospitalization/reconstructive surgery, STDs (curable thank god) me sliding into a real bad drug/alcohol addiction, losing my job, leaving my city, going to rehab... .and two months ago i dropped the final axe and ended it.  In the prior 3 months we had a sorta long distance thing costing me thousands in expenses to see him, only for it to be unfathomably long fights/dissociations, sex and not much else.

it became too much.  feel free to read some of my posts to get a sense. 

after the break up i kept contact but it got to be too much as well.  He would pile up hundreds of text by the end of the day with me usually giving standard "hope you are well, will always love you, good night" or a much worse reaction: i would get so frustrated by the "love fest" in the face of all I endured and just lay into him.  call him a sl*t, dirty cheating POS, hope you get aids and die kinda thing.  Really not good for me or him, he would break into pieces, cry and beg me to stop... .i wouldnt.  Then I'd realize how monstrous the things i said were and apologize, feel bad and start to get nostalgic for the better days of our relationship and consider taking him back.  very dangerous thinking, and I began to hate myself for all the terrible things i would say.

about a month ago i disclosed to him i had been on a date and hooked up with the person, and that sent it all into a brand new level of toxicity.  he vowed to go on a spree of (his always risky, very gross) sexual encounters... .were gay and in my community (especially in the big city we lived in) sex is 5 mins or less away with an iphone and the desire.  he had this fixation on much older, out of shape and generally sleazy guys and has caught a few curable STDs in the process. no bueno.

a week after my disclosure we got into a long fight over the phone and i hung up, told him i was blocking him, then blocked his number and all social media.  i left him unblocked on email and would respond a few days after he would send me long loving messages.  they have gotten increasingly desperate and sad.  he is now seeing a psychiatrist but has been given lots of benzos and adderall (grreeeat... .) which he has blown thru, according to his friends, at a dangerous pace.  He says he has cut off all interest in sex/dating to focus on himself and generally because it reminds him of me and is too painful.  His friends vouch for that.

he is undiagnosed but anyone who knows him, upon reading the DSM say "nails it." to a T.  both my psychiatrist and therapist agree thoroughly.

today, his mother a few friends have been contacting me begging i at least give him a call.  Say hes more broken than they have ever seen and is in dire need of support that only i can provide. that his mother, who pretty much hates me, would reach out was a major shock. BPDex and his mom have a pretty awful relationship and he will go weeks to months avoiding contact with her.  this is very out of character.

I explained NC to his mom and said it was really for his protection as I would lash out and say awful things and generally twist his head and my own up about how very much over our relationship is.  she agreed with the premise but persisted that he is in a bad bad bad place and i might be able to help.  I insisted I am not the cure and I dont want to give false hope, or by reiterating theres no chance, kick him when hes already down. I feel that would be the result no matter how gently I deliver the message.

I told a mutual friend and asked that she contact him to see whats up and give him some hope, also to go to a CoDa (codependency Anonymous) or SLAA (sex and love addicts anonymous- he was def a sex addict, racked up 200 people before he was 18, 50+ inside our relationship in less than a year, and we had sex at least 3-4 times a day... .awesome passionate loving sex or straight up porn sex... phew!) meeting, or any twelve step thing... .its the best free group therapy in the WORLD. she came back saying wow, ive never ever seen him like this, and she has seen him at his worst (they were roomates during our on/off phase of the last year and his depression got so bad she literally moved out... .saw him cutting and all this madness).

so here i am.  everyone is begging i call him.  I dont know what to do.  I would be lying, also, if i didnt say I've been wondering about taking him back in some ways... ive had some great dates but it has never matched our (disordered) level of passion.  And also that these dates dont end with that instant (also disordered) attachment still feels foreign to me.  I know in my rational head this is all good, but the heart and my friend downstairs arent the most rational of beasts.

i think its probably a bad idea that i call him.  I am fairly convinced i may either A) turn on him half way thru and become a monster again or B) even by gently reaffirming its over, cause harm or C) slowly get hooked into another pull myself which is dangerous, stupid, illogical as I am unemployed and cant afford to go see him and he is a broke student who cant come to see me.  Also, my parents would call the cops if they saw him even near the house we share, they HATE the boy.

I just dont know what to do, how to really control or put boundaries (and what boundaries) on a call if it happens, and its feeling somewhat urgent as there is an expectation from his mom and friends I will do it or if I wont, at least tell them so. My heart says I should. i love this guy and always will.  But my brain is floundering.

he is unlike many others BPDs in that he isnt finding replacement or acknowledging abandonment and moving on... .kinda wish he would.

[cbm419]

quick summary: NC with BPD ex except some emailing for a month, broken up almost 3. friends and mom of BPDex reaching out today to beg I call him as he is spiraling into an absurd level of depression/sadness.  no threats of suicide, no psychosis, just fully miserable.

hey all, I've been off this board for a while focusing on me and decompressing from what became an obssesive habit of non stop rumination about my relationship with BPDex.  wont go into too much detail but it was 3 years of a very long idealization phase with the last year melting down into cheating, non stop (one sided rageaholic) fighting over the smallest things, physical abuse resulting in hospitalization/reconstructive surgery, STDs (curable thank god) me sliding into a real bad drug/alcohol addiction, losing my job, leaving my city, going to rehab... .and two months ago i dropped the final axe and ended it.  In the prior 3 months we had a sorta long distance thing costing me thousands in expenses to see him, only for it to be unfathomably long fights/dissociations, sex and not much else.

it became too much.  feel free to read some of my posts to get a sense. 

after the break up i kept contact but it got to be too much as well.  He would pile up hundreds of text by the end of the day with me usually giving standard "hope you are well, will always love you, good night" or a much worse reaction: i would get so frustrated by the "love fest" in the face of all I endured and just lay into him.  call him a sl*t, dirty cheating POS, hope you get aids and die kinda thing.  Really not good for me or him, he would break into pieces, cry and beg me to stop... .i wouldnt.  Then I'd realize how monstrous the things i said were and apologize, feel bad and start to get nostalgic for the better days of our relationship and consider taking him back.  very dangerous thinking, and I began to hate myself for all the terrible things i would say.

about a month ago i disclosed to him i had been on a date and hooked up with the person, and that sent it all into a brand new level of toxicity.  he vowed to go on a spree of (his always risky, very gross) sexual encounters... .were gay and in my community (especially in the big city we lived in) sex is 5 mins or less away with an iphone and the desire.  he had this fixation on much older, out of shape and generally sleazy guys and has caught a few curable STDs in the process. no bueno.

a week after my disclosure we got into a long fight over the phone and i hung up, told him i was blocking him, then blocked his number and all social media.  i left him unblocked on email and would respond a few days after he would send me long loving messages.  they have gotten increasingly desperate and sad.  he is now seeing a psychiatrist but has been given lots of benzos and adderall (grreeeat... .) which he has blown thru, according to his friends, at a dangerous pace.  He says he has cut off all interest in sex/dating to focus on himself and generally because it reminds him of me and is too painful.  His friends vouch for that.

he is undiagnosed but anyone who knows him, upon reading the DSM say "nails it." to a T.  both my psychiatrist and therapist agree thoroughly.

today, his mother a few friends have been contacting me begging i at least give him a call.  Say hes more broken than they have ever seen and is in dire need of support that only i can provide. that his mother, who pretty much hates me, would reach out was a major shock. BPDex and his mom have a pretty awful relationship and he will go weeks to months avoiding contact with her.  this is very out of character.

I explained NC to his mom and said it was really for his protection as I would lash out and say awful things and generally twist his head and my own up about how very much over our relationship is.  she agreed with the premise but persisted that he is in a bad bad bad place and i might be able to help.  I insisted I am not the cure and I dont want to give false hope, or by reiterating theres no chance, kick him when hes already down. I feel that would be the result no matter how gently I deliver the message.

I told a mutual friend and asked that she contact him to see whats up and give him some hope, also to go to a CoDa (codependency Anonymous) or SLAA (sex and love addicts anonymous- he was def a sex addict, racked up 200 people before he was 18, 50+ inside our relationship in less than a year, and we had sex at least 3-4 times a day... .awesome passionate loving sex or straight up porn sex... phew!) meeting, or any twelve step thing... .its the best free group therapy in the WORLD. she came back saying wow, ive never ever seen him like this, and she has seen him at his worst (they were roomates during our on/off phase of the last year and his depression got so bad she literally moved out... .saw him cutting and all this madness).

so here i am.  everyone is begging i call him.  I dont know what to do.  I would be lying, also, if i didnt say I've been wondering about taking him back in some ways... ive had some great dates but it has never matched our (disordered) level of passion.  And also that these dates dont end with that instant (also disordered) attachment still feels foreign to me.  I know in my rational head this is all good, but the heart and my friend downstairs arent the most rational of beasts.

i think its probably a bad idea that i call him.  I am fairly convinced i may either A) turn on him half way thru and become a monster again or B) even by gently reaffirming its over, cause harm or C) slowly get hooked into another pull myself which is dangerous, stupid, illogical as I am unemployed and cant afford to go see him and he is a broke student who cant come to see me.  Also, my parents would call the cops if they saw him even near the house we share, they HATE the boy.

I just dont know what to do, how to really control or put boundaries (and what boundaries) on a call if it happens, and its feeling somewhat urgent as there is an expectation from his mom and friends I will do it or if I wont, at least tell them so. My heart says I should. i love this guy and always will.  But my brain is floundering.

he is unlike many others BPDs in that he isnt finding replacement or acknowledging abandonment and moving on... .kinda wish he would.

[joeramabeme]

 everyone is begging i call him.  I dont know what to do. 

"everyone" is begging you to call him?  All your friends and close family members that know he slept with 50+ people while you were with him are begging you to call to get him back?

I think you do "know what to do" but arent comfortable with the answer as there is a level of disordered excitement that is really hard to stay away from and the ever lingering perhaps it will be different this time.

What should you do?  The right thing for you, according to your values and boundaries.  Just be sure that whichever decision you do make, that you take your understanding of BPD dynamics with you as it is invaluable information.

Keep us posted.

[cbm419]

everyone is begging i call him.  I dont know what to do. 

"everyone" is begging you to call him?  All your friends and close family members that know he slept with 50+ people while you were with him are begging you to call to get him back?

I think you do "know what to do" but arent comfortable with the answer as there is a level of disordered excitement that is really hard to stay away from and the ever lingering perhaps it will be different this time.

What should you do?  The right thing for you, according to your values and boundaries.  Just be sure that whichever decision you do make, that you take your understanding of BPD dynamics with you as it is invaluable information.

Keep us posted.

fair statement.  the everyone is his family, friends are mostly just his and know me well enough to reach out.  i havent floated this by my family, friends, therapist.  speaking about him w my parents is sort of like saying voldemorts name in harry potter.  they just dont want to hear about him period.

my values instruct me to make the call not because of some disordered excitement (though youre nailing it with that term) but because i genuinely care about him and do want to be helpful where possible.

the part of my heart that has been romanticizing our past is definetly not strong enough yet to fall to his act, which may be a good reason to do this now before he gets worse and that little birdy tweeting sweet calls has somehow turned into a hawk that would carry me back to him.

think im going to offer it.

[cbm419]

I caved and just wrote an email expressing a strict boundary while offering for a call... .pasted for the peanut gallery:

I am hoping to not regret this, but I would like to call you
tonight around midnight to talk and see if i can provide support and
help you withdraw from this phase of sadness and emotional turmoil.

I need to be up front and set a clear expectation: this is not me
calling to take you back, reconciliation is not on the table right
now. As much as you believe me to be an effective cure to your
sadness, that is not true and not useful to you.  Even if i were to
agree to "working on things," which I am not offering with this call,
I cannot move back to (city) or even afford to travel there in any recent
future.  I have stopped getting unemployment and am living very
strictly on a dwindling savings.  But that is not why reconcilliation
is not on the table, the reason is that I am not ready to say I will
take you back and neither of us are emotionally fit, at this time, to
be with one another.

that is a strict boundary I need to set before I pick up the phone.
If you feel that facing that reality is more harm than good, please
reply to this message as such and we dont have to have the call.   I
care about you deeply and truly desire for any contact, as I have
committed to recently, be positive and helpful for us both.
Anyway, please let me know what you think and if you would like me to
call around midnight. 

[ynwa]

hey CBM, 

I read your email and posts, and want to thank for sharing and being honest.
And I know this isn't easy.

You have been through a lot, and seem to be working on moving forward, and now this right?  Caring for someone with this disorder is complicated and is very one sided. 

I wanted to ask, if you feel like you are starting to get emotional during a conversation, what do you plan to Do?

[infjEpic]

I need to be up front and set a clear expectation: this is not me
calling to take you back, reconciliation is not on the table right
now. As much as you believe me to be an effective cure to your
sadness, that is not true and not useful to you.  Even if i were to
agree to "working on things," which I am not offering with this call,
I cannot move back to (city) or even afford to travel there in any recent
future.  I have stopped getting unemployment and am living very
strictly on a dwindling savings.  But that is not why reconcilliation
is not on the table, the reason is that I am not ready to say I will
take you back and neither of us are emotionally fit, at this time, to
be with one another.

I believe these phrases are going to cause problems.

Do you want to be recycled?


Here is what I think he is going to see from your msg:

I heard you're hurting, I'm coming to the rescue
But You hurt me really bad, so my head says 'no',
but you know my heart always says 'yes' for you
I really, really hope you will win me back somehow

Whatever you do - do not have sex with him.

[infjEpic]

my values instruct me to make the call not because of some disordered excitement (though youre nailing it with that term) but because i genuinely care about him and do want to be helpful where possible.

We're all caretakers - goes with the territory it seems.

Just don't forget to take care of yourself, because he won't.

[Panda39]

FOG (Fear, Obligation, Guilt) Emotional Blackmail

He is using his family/friends to amplify his FOG and it's worked he has gotten what he wanted you have now engaged with him (email) and plan to engage more in the future (phone call).  There is nothing wrong with contact if it is on your terms, you are aware of the FOG, and have boundaries around where you are willing to go with this.

What is it that you want or expect to get out of this conversation?  We know what he will get out of it (your attention/your engagement... .recycle?), but what do you hope to get out of it?  What does this conversation do for you?  Why is it your job to care take here since you are no longer together?  Yes, you are a nice caring person trying to help and he is using those values that he knows you possess as a tool to get you to re-engage with him.

infjEpic is right on the money... .Do you want to be recycled?  If not what are your boundaries?

[hope2727]

Hi I just had to reach out. I am sorry you have been put in this position. Please know that he is an adult and as sad as it is he has lots of resources out there to help him. It is unfair to ask you to be his therapist.

Whatever you decide you will be supported here. Just remember the not my circus not my moneys principal.

[lovenature]

Hey cbm

Focusing on your heart: the most compassionate thing you can do for both of you is to stay NC.
Be realistic about your families concerns and his family/friends who have most likely been listening to pleas and victimhood talk from him; very different versions of events perhaps?
Look out for you.