Does a pwBPD every think beyond feelings?

[glaciercats]

From my experience it seems like the whole relationship revolves around the person with BPD's feelings.  What I mean is they don't see things rationally.  Like when you point out things to them that are happening and the reason's for it they don't seem to understand.  Everything is based on raw emotion.  In my experience when you try to have important conversations about things like work, or bills, or any kind of adult responsibilities they seem to disconnect.  Does anyone else notice this?  It gets very frustrating like trying to talk to a child about these things.  It makes me feel like a parent scolding a child if that makes sense.  I just want some adult conversation sometimes.

 

[SuperJew82]

My exDiagBPDGF was high functioning with multiple degrees ( not strategic degrees ). She had no direction in her professional life. Paying bills wasn't a big deal.

You would sit her down and explain how what she did was hurtful and how she could look at something in a different way or approach something differently and she would turn into a bobble head and readily agree with everything - but NOTHING would stick. She would do the same hurtful things again and again.

She told me the story about how she decided to become a nurse. She was waitressing and someone suggested that she became a nurse and so she completed nursing school. It was just another odd story she had.

She was empty inside. She was a pathological liar. She was an emotional sociopath.

Something fascinating was that she would do something undesirable to me... .One example: She would steal my prescription medication time after time and of course we would have a mini-breakup because of it ( so this is a big deal for me ) . The last time she did it I asked her why in the world would you do something that you clearly know is wrong and hurtful. I would ask "Why would you sabotage our relationship by doing this very well known dealbreaker?".

She would answer: " Because I was mad at you " There was no argument going on in this case.

This is one of many examples of how their thought process works. They act primarily on emotion and impulse, then in their mind, they automatically build some type of flawed real world logic to support it. Then they store this event in memory and it becomes their real history.

She would go off and have very risky sex. Why? Because I was going to leave her and she needed to get over me.

The list goes on.

They are run on emotions only. More specifically, they do whatever they need to feed their screwed up emotional needs at whatever cost.

Emotional sociopaths that destroy lives and hurt everyone who happens to get in their paths. You are toys to them. When you as a toy become uninteresting or they start feeling negative about the toy - they treat it ( you ) not as a person but just a thing.

They have no empathy and will never make a decision because it protects your emotional well-being if it uncomfortable for them.

[glaciercats]

That actually makes perfect sense SuperJew.  I couldn't have explained it better.

Everything they do is on raw emotion alone.  They never look at the consequences of what they are doing.  It is somehow because of someone else.  Never because of their own actions.   

[SuperJew82]

They are the complete opposite of a lot of us caretakers. I think I'm a pretty good guy. I know I have some things that might annoy people but nobody has ever said anything to me about it. I annoy myself the most.

I will sacrifice my own comfort and happiness to make someone happy. This gives me purpose. It hurts when someone not only doesn't even acknowledge it, but instead rips my heart out by lying and cheating.

It really hurts when I mispresent the truth. I have never cheated on anyone in my life. I know it sounds odd to hear that, but not even in high school. I'm a 34 year old guy. I couldn't do it, it would eat me alive knowing that someone would be hurt. I want to say that I have told a significant lie, but I really can't say that I can recall one. When I say significant, I mean a lie that if the interested person would have found out - it would cause them pain.

I have unintentionally hurt women after I finally went NC with my ex 3 months ago. I would tell them I wasn't in a place to have another relationship, but we could go out and do things out on the town etc... .and in many of these cases we would drink a bit too much and have sex - and that eventually would cause emotional distress for me and the girl. I have made real effort to avoid these situations. Honestly, even the best sex doesn't do anything for me when I don't have a connection with the person. That is what made it easy for to cut my exBPD out. Sex was a tool to her. It was another form of manipulation. At the end when I had been hurt in so many ways, as the Righteous Brothers nicely put it,  "I lost that loving feeling" .

Now the words coming out of her mouth were clearly lies. I was now impervious to the craziest sex she could throw at me. She was not physically beautiful to me anymore. Her quirkiness was not cute anymore. It was weird. Her attention was no longer comforting but was annoying and pointless. The adaptations in my brain were finally complete. My engineer inside my head finally rerouted my power from fantasy ideas of this working and used it to raise my shields  - and although my warp drive was still too damaged to hit light speed, impulse thrusters kicked in and I was able to steadily maneuver away from the black hole that was sure to suck me in and transform me into something unrecognizable.

She will never be happy, but I know I can be, because I am now. I have so much in my life to be grateful for - and so do every one of you.

I beg everyone who stumbles upon this article to stop for a second. Take a break from surfing for validation of something you already know and do something. Close your eyes and think of all the good positive things that are in your life. Think about all the things that the toxic emotional black hole distracted you from.

I have the two most wonderful daughters a father could ask for. I have some of the best group of friends anyone could need. I have a good job with coworkers who care for me like I'm family. If I never have a relationship again, I'll still be happy. If I find a positive person to be my companion, then that is great too. But never again will I make the mistake of letting someone hurt me time and time again. I take responsibility for this. I am now educated. I am still optimistic.

I survived an emotional sociopath. So can you.

[Claycrusher]

Super Jew82 has pretty much NAILED IT here.

Makes me wonder if we weren't in a relationship with the exact same person, LOL... .

Excellent posts, Super Jew 82 !

[earlyL]

She was not physically beautiful to me anymore. Her quirkiness was not cute anymore. It was weird. Her attention was no longer comforting but was annoying and pointless. The adaptations in my brain were finally complete. My engineer inside my head finally rerouted my power from fantasy ideas of this working and used it to raise my shields  - and although my warp drive was still too damaged to hit light speed, impulse thrusters kicked in and I was able to steadily maneuver away from the black hole that was sure to suck me in and transform me into something unrecognizable.

I caught a glimpse of this today - I work with my exBPD but I truly feel like I have started to see her in such a different way. It is incredibly sad and the waves of guilt and denial will still be there, but for the first time I didn't have the want to be with her. Raw emotion is a good phrase to use. Thank you both for this post.

[glaciercats]

Thank you for writing what you did Super.  It seems like our stories are so very similar.

I feel so alone without her even though I know it can't ever be.  It will be good for a minute but each time the good lasts less and less.  But it is still so hard to be without her.  I have good days and bad.  And today isn't so good.

The texts from her are becoming less and less as she is settling in with my replacement.  They are less than 2 months in so it is still mostly in the honeymoon stage I imagine.  I know they are hearing the same words I did.  Being looked at like I used to be.  I'm not sure why that hurts so much, but it does.

Communication has almost all shut down.  She doesn't see what she is doing as wrong.  Of course its all my fault she is already with someone new. They treat her so well apparently.  And no telling what horrible things the replacement was told about me.  So they are in full savior mode. But love out of desperation is not love at all.  It will only last as long as the replacement is able to play the game.  

But still anyway I look at it doesn't make it suck any less. Got to keep these walls up though.  Have to protect myself this time.



We all deserve as much love as we give.  Keep your head up it will get better with time and distance.
 

[Aesir]

I've encountered this too. I tried to reason with her over and over again but when she became stressed the same behavior would surface. The fact that we had discussed it and resolved (to me) made know difference. One thing was evident her feelings mattered and mine did not.

[SuperJew82]

Make a promise to yourself to go NC if you do not have kids together. There is no other way.

I promise you if you do this, it will be the best thing you have ever done. It took me a year to figure this out. I'm telling you this in hopes you will take the advice from me and others on here and go NC starting today. No replies, block her numbers. DO NOT READ WHAT SHE SENDS. They are experts at putting together fishing messages and keeping you in the available pool of guys. Don't recycle.

My old phone with store blocked communication in a " blocked folder " - that was bad because I couldn't resist reading it. I bought a new phone that I could block it before it even comes in.

Successful alcoholics don't hang around bars and don't keep vodka in their fridges. Communicating with these exBPD people will only prolong your suffering.

I promise you this.

[SuperJew82]

They are great and can pass as normal when they get what they want. When they become stressed that's when the real "interesting" stuff starts.

bad thing is that most of the time the "stress" is manifested by them out of thin air. ): It's not only the normal stuff.

Ironically, I have befriended a pwBPD. She was an employee/friend of my best friend. She is about a decade younger than me and very attractive. We were discussing my crazy ex at a little gathering at my house. She later started talking to me when we were alone and shared with me that she had BPD and had been in DBT for years. Keep in mind I have my shields up and see her as some kind of tamed lion. I'm going to keep my distance. I think hers is more mild than my exBPDgf. She strangely told me never to trust a pwBPD, as they (she said we ) can be horrible people.

We have talked about how my ex would cheat on me and how horrible that must have been. She then would say how wonderful her new exclusive girlfriend is and has facebook posts to go along with it ( she is bi ). A couple of hours she would suggest coming over with less than wholesome intentions. When I would explain why that isn't a good idea she would thank me for setting her straight and would tell me how she hates it when she cheats.

strange stuff.

[AustenJ]

A borderline is like a child's piggy bank with a slot for the coins at the top but no plug at the bottom to keep the coins in... .this BPD bank is always empty/hollow as we nons relentlessly and blindly keep feeding emotional coins into them, coin after coin after coin, all of our coins falling through them, unable to save them, until we become emotionally bankrupt... .as hard as we try, we can never fill the emptiness of the BPD bank... .

[glaciercats]

Never thought of it that way complicated.  But your so right.  At first it's like you can keep up.  But as time goes on you get ran down and exhausted physically and emotionally.  Until you have nothing left to deposit.

That's when they look for someone new.  That hasn't been spent yet.  Then it's like when we recharge they want us back.  Its a crazy cycle if you stay in it.

[SuperJew82]

Awesome analogy!

I closed her account.

[bus boy]

My Xw is very intelligent, high functioning, had the same job for 18 years, very reliable, pays her bills perfectly, takes very good care of her self, owns a nice house, well respected by coworkers, well by coworkers that don't work close to her. This is where the emotional disorder comes into play. Xw is despised by coworkers that have to work closely with her. In our r/s Xw was very emotionally abusive, a very different person behind closed doors, deceiving and manuplateing. Very mature except in dealing on a personal level. Very extremely sarcastic, act like a child but bring up some kind of a character defect she comes unglued. She would accuse me of lying, laughing at her, take most everything out of context and put her own twisted spin on something. One the outside the kind of partner anyone would be proud to call a wife but to be in a close r/s a very mentally and emotionally crippling toxic person.

[Mutt]

Hi glacier cats,‎



I haven't read all of the comments before my post. It helps to read about BPD, it's a huge part of the healing process, you can learn to depersonalize the behaviors, the mental illness is not personal it's something that our exes are going through, become indifferent to the behaviors.
‎
You are right, a pwBPD are at the emotional level of a two year old in an adults body, feelings equals facts. When a situation presents itself, we look at the facts and our feelings those facts, it's flipped the other away around for a pwBPD. A pwBPD live in the present and can't recall feeling any other way than that, so they can't connect feelings that they had about someone in the past, they don't look forward in the future either. 

‎Everything is based on raw emotion.  In my experience when you try to have important conversations about things like work, or bills, or any kind of adult responsibilities they seem to disconnect.

I completely understand the frustration, it's like someone to act or be someone that they can't be, a pwBPD want emotional intimacy but cannot sustain healthy adult intimacy. Your ex is who she is, i'm guilty of trying to show my ex faults with her logic and getting frustrated with her. The silver lining with being a r/s with a pwBPD is that it teaches you how to be better in r/s's. There's a fundamental logic to why our exes behaved the way that they did, read about BPD.‎

[blanchard]

From my experience it seems like the whole relationship revolves around the person with BPD's feelings.  What I mean is they don't see things rationally.  Like when you point out things to them that are happening and the reason's for it they don't seem to understand.  Everything is based on raw emotion.  In my experience when you try to have important conversations about things like work, or bills, or any kind of adult responsibilities they seem to disconnect.  Does anyone else notice this?  It gets very frustrating like trying to talk to a child about these things.  It makes me feel like a parent scolding a child if that makes sense.  I just want some adult conversation sometimes.

 

They view the world through their pathological ego defenses, and all interpersonal connections are corrupted as a result.  Developmentally, they are still infants... .emotionally. 

[glaciercats]

I've been doing a great deal of reading lately. It's just so frustrating when you can't have an adult conversation about anything or make them see any sort of reasoning. Makes me want to beat me head against the wall.

[Mutt]

You're trying too hard with someone with erratic behaviors and a distorted belief system, it's like fighting against a current, we can't reason logic with someone with a serious mental illness.

You can set a goal with accepting her mental illness, there's less tension, less stress and less frustration with understamding your exe's impairments, she can't meet you in the middle but you can meet her as far she can go, Blanchard mentioned ego defenses, with that in mind we as well have to let go of our egos.

[SuperJew82]

You will get to a point where you try everything you would normally use with another person and it just fails. I've heard of "success" stories where the non basically becomes an honorary therapist and constantly have to put them in their place and set boundaries.

Their success stories do not sound anywhere close to my idea of success. I've had too much and I know I do not wish to pursue a relationship with someone who is not compatible with a healthy one.

Hard pass. There are tons of girls out there that have the normal crazy stuff guys complain about all the time. I will run to that all day long. I hate it when guys complain about their girlfriend or wife being "crazy" ... .they have not seen what the real crazy looks like... .