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[Depression = 72% of members]

So i went NC on Thursday. Told her the reason I had to do it. Email and phone number blocked. I guess she was trying to reach out to me all weekend because I just received an email from her through my work email (can't block her on work email) asking for the dog back. Just to reiterate, we got the dog together. Stayed together 3 more weeks because she told me to take her because she couldn't afford to keep both dogs.

I know I could easily email her back explaining why that's not going to happen. But when I saw the email I began to sweat and get dizzy. I don't think they realize how traumatic this can be for us when they leave in the manner they do. But I can't break NC. I have been doing so well, and have thought about her less and less since NC. But I'm such a sucker sometimes that I am being empathetic and thinking of all the times I wanted a response from her and she would ignore me. I know that pain all too well.

I am processing whether I am doing this to be spiteful or not. But I genuinely believe I am doing this to protect myself. One email from me will start the cycle over, and I will be left in pain again. For once since I have known her, I want to do what is best for me. And that means NC. Maybe in months time as I continue to do therapy and move on I can send her something explaining why I did what I did, and why I never responded to her.

I don't think she is crazy enough to try and take me to court over the dog or anything. She would lose anyway. All the vet bills since we had her are paid by me. She had her a total of 2 weeks at her place. I have had her with me over 2 months. The only thing is that the ownership papers are in her name. But legally, I have done research, dogs are treated as property and physical ownership counts for anything else. And her agreement when she signed the adoption paper was that she will never give the dog away. So I feel like she voided that ownership contract anyway.

I don't know. I need to set this boundary. She will probably say I'm being controlling by not answering her. I don't care. I have finally started to feel better with NC because I knew why I was doing it. It was for my own sanity. I don't want to talk to her again. Maybe down the road I can explain. But not now. It will reopen all my wounds.

[roberto516]

So i went NC on Thursday. Told her the reason I had to do it. Email and phone number blocked. I guess she was trying to reach out to me all weekend because I just received an email from her through my work email (can't block her on work email) asking for the dog back. Just to reiterate, we got the dog together. Stayed together 3 more weeks because she told me to take her because she couldn't afford to keep both dogs.

I know I could easily email her back explaining why that's not going to happen. But when I saw the email I began to sweat and get dizzy. I don't think they realize how traumatic this can be for us when they leave in the manner they do. But I can't break NC. I have been doing so well, and have thought about her less and less since NC. But I'm such a sucker sometimes that I am being empathetic and thinking of all the times I wanted a response from her and she would ignore me. I know that pain all too well.

I am processing whether I am doing this to be spiteful or not. But I genuinely believe I am doing this to protect myself. One email from me will start the cycle over, and I will be left in pain again. For once since I have known her, I want to do what is best for me. And that means NC. Maybe in months time as I continue to do therapy and move on I can send her something explaining why I did what I did, and why I never responded to her.

I don't think she is crazy enough to try and take me to court over the dog or anything. She would lose anyway. All the vet bills since we had her are paid by me. She had her a total of 2 weeks at her place. I have had her with me over 2 months. The only thing is that the ownership papers are in her name. But legally, I have done research, dogs are treated as property and physical ownership counts for anything else. And her agreement when she signed the adoption paper was that she will never give the dog away. So I feel like she voided that ownership contract anyway.

I don't know. I need to set this boundary. She will probably say I'm being controlling by not answering her. I don't care. I have finally started to feel better with NC because I knew why I was doing it. It was for my own sanity. I don't want to talk to her again. Maybe down the road I can explain. But not now. It will reopen all my wounds.

[earlyL]

Hi,

I can totally understand the anxiety caused by the email, I currently work with my exBPD and am in the same way. I had a really good day today and then she emailed tonight and I am feeling sick and shakey again. I know it will pass but I really want to get past these feelings. We finish our current project together this week and I feel the same as you - to go NC, because I think it will be the only way to help me properly grieve and move on. However my T and family have suggested going cold turkey might not be the best way forward for me. (am thinking here the dog is like the company I run with my ex). And perhaps they are right, they don't want me to make any big decisions about walking away from the company while I am this emotional, but I can't see how to move on. Our thoughts at the moment is that I tell my ex I need three months out to think and I need NC in that time, and to be open about that. Is that something that you could respond with, that you need time away and where you keep the dog but you are happy to discuss in a month,  or two depending on how you feel?

[roberto516]

Hi,

I can totally understand the anxiety caused by the email, I currently work with my exBPD and am in the same way. I had a really good day today and then she emailed tonight and I am feeling sick and shakey again. I know it will pass but I really want to get past these feelings. We finish our current project together this week and I feel the same as you - to go NC, because I think it will be the only way to help me properly grieve and move on. However my T and family have suggested going cold turkey might not be the best way forward for me. (am thinking here the dog is like the company I run with my ex). And perhaps they are right, they don't want me to make any big decisions about walking away from the company while I am this emotional, but I can't see how to move on. Our thoughts at the moment is that I tell my ex I need three months out to think and I need NC in that time, and to be open about that. Is that something that you could respond with, that you need time away and where you keep the dog but you are happy to discuss in a month,  or two depending on how you feel?

Thanks early. That helped clarify for me. Because I did tell her a week ago that I would not be able to make a decision about the dog. She probably thinks I'm going to give her away. Which I told her I would not do. I love the dog. She's my best friend.

And the first two months I asked her every weekend if she wanted to see the dog, wanted the dog for a weekend, etc. I honestly think this is all coming out because I told her Thursday I was done, and she told me to answer my work phone and I never responded to her. Maybe she finally realizes I'm serious about not wanting to speak to her again? And that I am really moving on.

And I'm sorry you are in that situation. We did work together but she moved to a different location, but I contemplated a medical leave of absence because everything in that building brings back bad memories. And I will have to look at paperwork, and sometimes see notes she is writing. And it just sets me off. Thanks for replying. Seriously. It's something I can consider if she continues to try and reach out.

I just know our dynamics. She knows I will eventually cave, and give her whatever she wants. But I'm not that person anymore. This is my life now.

[earlyL]

 But I'm not that person anymore. This is my life now.

i feel so the same, my ex said to me she didn't know who I was anymore, i thought, no, because I am not just doing whatever you want all the time. I have to work in the same building as her and the replacement (who is married... .) and it is so incredibly painful, but also yes, anything with her writing on sets me off too. I find it so hard to explain to people, it sounds so dramatic, but it is like that.

It sounds like you are handling it all really well, and you have been quite a bit of communication with her, for her benefit about the dog - I think you are right though, time to be NC, you need that. I am positive they still want communication with us, they need the attachment, and this development has come from you saying you need space. I can see in my exes eyes, that she is desperate for us to be friends, I just don't know how she thinks it is possible. I have  week to decide how I am going to tell her I want NC - can I ask how did you tell her that? Did she respond?

[roberto516]

i feel so the same, my ex said to me she didn't know who I was anymore, i thought, no, because I am not just doing whatever you want all the time. I have to work in the same building as her and the replacement (who is married... .) and it is so incredibly painful, but also yes, anything with her writing on sets me off too. I find it so hard to explain to people, it sounds so dramatic, but it is like that.

It sounds like you are handling it all really well, and you have been quite a bit of communication with her, for her benefit about the dog - I think you are right though, time to be NC, you need that. I am positive they still want communication with us, they need the attachment, and this development has come from you saying you need space. I can see in my exes eyes, that she is desperate for us to be friends, I just don't know how she thinks it is possible. I have  week to decide how I am going to tell her I want NC - can I ask how did you tell her that? Did she respond?

Just as I read this she tried to video chat me on facebook messenger. And I didn't open the message but I saw that it said "are you f'ing kidding me?" I can't do it. I won't be manipulated by her. I can't be bullied. Thanks for the support.

I did tell her. Just flat out that for my own sanity I needed to do this. Because I have felt this differently than her, and I needed to care about myself. She tried to call me at work right after, and I didn't answer. That's when she emailed my work email.

Now she is non stop trying to video chat with me. I don't care. I am shaking all over. She won't do this to me again.

[earlyL]

Now she is non stop trying to video chat with me. I don't care. I am shaking all over. She won't do this to me again.

This is what terrifies me the most about all this, that it will never end.

You are absolutely doing the right thing, do not respond. You need time to heal and she needs to understand that. I don't know if this helps, but I read somewhere about saying my emotions out loud (if you are in a place you can do that). It is strange but it has really helped me when I am on my own, if I say, 'I am feeling shakey' loudly it somehow takes some of the pressure off and makes me know it won't last.

Sending positive vibes over. You got this!

[roberto516]

This is what terrifies me the most about all this, that it will never end.

You are absolutely doing the right thing, do not respond. You need time to heal and she needs to understand that. I don't know if this helps, but I read somewhere about saying my emotions out loud (if you are in a place you can do that). It is strange but it has really helped me when I am on my own, if I say, 'I am feeling shakey' loudly it somehow takes some of the pressure off and makes me know it won't last.

Sending positive vibes over. You got this!

The last thing I sent her when I said I wouldn't speak to her again was "you told me I have to accept and respect that we are finished. You have to accept and respect that I can't speak to you ever again."

Thanks for the support. I just did what you suggested and it really does help. Thanks for that brother. Thanks for the support too. This weekend was so good and I am starting to really move on.

[Mutt]

Hi Roberto516,

I don't think that she's intentionally trying to bully you through Facebook messenger, you've blocked her, I think that she's trying to get in touch with you. I can understand how difficult it is when we're knee deep in pain and our exes are not validating the pain that they caused.

I agree with you about self protecting but I just wanted to point something out about boundaries, boundaries are meant to be low fences and not really high fences, I think that it's a trap that we fall into, many of us didn't have boundaries or had floating boundaries, it's not a hard and fast rule and we sometimes go too far one way.

Also, a boundary is set on you, you can't control her, you have control over two things, your thoughts and feelings, you don't need to explain to her anything.

Let's set aside self protection, boundaries and pathology aside for a second and talk about the dog. How about someone neutral, she can see the dog while you have a family member or friend there and you step out for awhile? Does she want to keep the dog?

[roberto516]

Hi Roberto516,

I don't think that she's intentionally trying to bully you through Facebook messenger, you've blocked her, I think that she's trying to get in touch with you. I can understand how difficult it is when we're knee deep in pain and our exes are not validating the pain that they caused.

I agree with you about self protecting but I just wanted to point something out about boundaries, boundaries are meant to be low fences and not really high fences, I think that it's a trap that we fall into, many of us didn't have boundaries or had floating boundaries, it's not a hard and fast rule and we sometimes go too far one way.

Also, a boundary is set on you, you can't control her, you have control over two things, your thoughts and feelings, you don't need to explain to her anything.

Let's set aside self protection, boundaries and pathology aside for a second and talk about the dog. How about someone neutral, she can see the dog while you have a family member or friend there and you step out for awhile? Does she want to keep the dog?

I'm not sure what she wants. When we broke up she gave the dog to me because she said she couldnt care for it and she'd have to give it back to the pound. As a couple we had the dog for maybe 3 weeks. By myself, I have had the dog for over 2 months. In the beginning I tried to reach out to set up play dates with the dog she has and the one she told me to keep. But she refused.

I honestly don't think it's about the dog. I think it's because I haven't reached out in over 4 days to her and I am changing my steps to this dance. There might be a time when I can do that. But as my therapist said when I suggested just what you did he said "why would you drag your family into this?" If we had the dog together for years I can see the point. But not even 3 weeks did we both have her together.

It's just something she can always use to reach out and get to me if she wants.

[Mutt]

She might changed her mind because she guilty or you trigger feelings of shame. Regardless, if you took care of the dog longer then her and you paid for the bills, then I wouldn't worry about it. Keep doing what you're doing now with self protection, don't give her attention, just keep mind that the behaviors tend worse before they get better, she may escalate the behavior with plea's, messages etc.

[AustenJ]

Roberto-

It's really tough going NC... .but it's the right thing for you! And I'm sure if your dog could talk it would tell you the same thing!

You may not be able to block her on your work email but perhaps you could designate her emails as spam or simply delete her emails before you open them.
Her emotional manipulation of you is trash... .so take the trash out!

Hang in there, my friend!

[heartandwhole]

Hi roberto516,

I had to go NC to help me recover from my breakup, too. It's not for everyone, and I was lucky in that pwBPD respected my need to do it (for the most part). That gave me time to focus on myself and deal with my personal issues and patterns that blew up in my face during the relationship.

I think NC works well when we have the opportunity to explain to our partners: 1) what we are doing and 2) why we are doing it. We can't control if our partners will understand, accept, or respect our intentions, but we can clearly and concisely communicate them, and then do what we said.

It sounds to me like you have expressed the what and why to your ex. Her reaction is her issue, not yours. I know it's much harder to work through this than what I just wrote, but it's so easy for us to forget that we have as much right to do what is best for us, as anyone has to do for themselves. We matter. What we need matters. What we feel matters.

As for the dog, it also sounds to me like she clearly gave it to you and said she couldn't take care of it. The offer of play dates is over, because you've decided that you need time to get your ex out of your daily life so that you can move forward. It doesn't mean forever, but you decide when you are ready, not anyone else.

If you find that the dog ownership question becomes more complicated and you have to communicate with her, there are ways to do that without re-engaging.

As    Mutt says, our boundaries are not walls; when we are firm about our values, they actually have space and flexibility to them.  

heartandwhole

[roberto516]

Hi roberto516,

I had to go NC to help me recover from my breakup, too. It's not for everyone, and I was lucky in that pwBPD respected my need to do it (for the most part). That gave me time to focus on myself and deal with my personal issues and patterns that blew up in my face during the relationship.

I think NC works well when we have the opportunity to explain to our partners: 1) what we are doing and 2) why we are doing it. We can't control if our partners will understand, accept, or respect our intentions, but we can clearly and concisely communicate them, and then do what we said.

It sounds to me like you have expressed the what and why to your ex. Her reaction is her issue, not yours. I know it's much harder to work through this than what I just wrote, but it's so easy for us to forget that we have as much right to do what is best for us, as anyone has to do for themselves. We matter. What we need matters. What we feel matters.

As for the dog, it also sounds to me like she clearly gave it to you and said she couldn't take care of it. The offer of play dates is over, because you've decided that you need time to get your ex out of your daily life so that you can move forward. It doesn't mean forever, but you decide when you are ready, not anyone else.

If you find that the dog ownership question becomes more complicated and you have to communicate with her, there are ways to do that without re-engaging.

As    Mutt says, our boundaries are not walls; when we are firm about our values, they actually have space and flexibility to them.  

heartandwhole

Well I finally had to break. She was calling nonstop. Calling my work phone. Even calling reception first so that it came up as a transferred call and not her name. Then a coworker (I'm actually the boss of her) called me to her office and said my ex called her and told me to call her. So I sent her an email which said "No. I told you I'm going to be keeping the dog and not give her away." Then her mom texted me telling me to call her. But that has to be it. I'm not falling for it anymore. I won't allow my empathy to be played with again.

Thank you everyone for the support. If I never found this site I would have been right back to square one. Maybe one day I can repay the favor for others.

[Mutt]

Hi roberto516,

Well I finally had to break. She was calling nonstop. Calling my work phone. Even calling reception first so that it came up as a transferred call and not her name. Then a coworker (I'm actually the boss of her) called me to her office and said my ex called her and told me to call her. So I sent her an email which said "No. I told you I'm going to be keeping the dog and not give her away." Then her mom texted me telling me to call her.

It's not about your empathy being played it with although I can see how it would garner feelings of empathy with her behavior. I mentioned earlier that things will get worse before they get better, I'm not saying that she's having an extinction burst, I just think that it helps to understand the pathology because it can feel distressing being on the receiving end of it.

The best analogy that I can think of is I recall when my D11 was a baby, she was my first born so I didn't have prior experience, she had a soother and I think that she was about a year and a half, she was less than two years old anyways, we took her soother away, it was habitual for her, we took away something that she was used to and every night for about a week and a half she cried for it,  I found it really hard to hear because it tugged at my heart, I just wanted to give her what she wanted so that she felt better and would stop crying.

She'd cry for an hour, an hour and a half and the cries kept escalating, it felt like wasn't going to stop and one night it simply stopped the behavior peaked and she experienced and extinction burst. In the context of your situation, in simple terms it's eliminating the behavior by not reinforcing it, because she probably knows from past reinforced behaviors that if she keeps testing your boundaries at some point you'll give into what she what she wants. Remember a pwBPD are emotionally arrested at the young age of a child? That being said, don't reinforce her behaviors, it will eventually subside. I hope that helps.

BPD BEHAVIORS: Extinction Bursts

[roberto516]

Hi roberto516,

It's not about your empathy being played it with although I can see how it would garner feelings of empathy with her behavior. I mentioned earlier that things will get worse before they get better, I'm not saying that she's having an extinction burst, I just think that it helps to understand the pathology because it can feel distressing being on the receiving end of it.

The best analogy that I can think of is I recall when my D11 was a baby, she was my first born so I didn't have prior experience, she had a soother and I think that she was about a year and a half, she was less than two years old anyways, we took her soother away, it was habitual for her, we took away something that she was used to and every night for about a week and a half she cried for it,  I found it really hard to hear because it tugged at my heart, I just wanted to give her what she wanted so that she felt better and would stop crying.

She'd cry for an hour, an hour and a half and the cries kept escalating, it felt like wasn't going to stop and one night it simply stopped the behavior peaked and she experienced and extinction burst. In the context of your situation, in simple terms it's eliminating the behavior by not reinforcing it, because she probably knows from past reinforced behaviors that if she keeps testing your boundaries at some point you'll give into what she what she wants. Remember a pwBPD are emotionally arrested at the young age of a child? That being said, don't reinforce her behaviors, it will eventually subside. I hope that helps.

BPD BEHAVIORS: Extinction Bursts

Thanks for the help Mutt. That's some good insight.

The drama continues. My dad just called me, I moved back home after we broke up, and he said she's at the house and wants to see the dog and talk about the dog. So I told him to tell her when I recover from this I will reach out one day. I feel bad for her. I was thinking this might be an extinction burst. I hope it is. Again, thanks everyone for the help. If you're reading this and you don't think they will ever ever try to get in touch again please know that they will. I was sure she was done. And I guess me finally moving on meant she needed to get back in touch.

And my dad is such a nice guy he will probably let her see the dog. But that's okay. If it gives her peace of mind to stay away then it's all for the better.

[ynwa]

Hey Roberto,

I agree with Mutt.  I'd say let sleeping dogs lie, as it were.  I have found for me as far as boundaries, I use stones instead of fences.  I view anything with my ex, as what I am willing to carry. If I feel it's too heavy, I don't carry it.  I cannot go fully NC with my ex, as her cat has to stay with me, and she's unable to move all her belongings out.  Having said that, I have gotten myself in situations with her, that are too much, and can't let go.

I've been reading your posts Roberto, and you are being as honest as you can be. It's simply not possible to detach and remove someone from your feelings.  It's hard when you cannot predict or expect certain behaviors.  But trust yourself.  Whether it's the email or the dog, just let it down for awhile. It's part of your attachment with her, and unless you can fully break it, just let it be for awhile and focus as much as you can on something else.

YNWA

[roberto516]

Alot has happened in 24 hours. She's good . Got me to converse by accusing me of cheating knowing I'd defend my character . Then an email saying "and I was gonna try again but you won't unblock my number." Long story short she asked me to stay the night for her "emotional support" she needs at this time. Never thought it would happen with me.

[once removed]

Never thought it would happen with me.

whats your plan?

[roberto516]

whats your plan?

I have two choices that I see. But this is only what I see. First, tell her no and this is why I can't do that right now. Second, offer her support, and let her know that I'm doing this once because I am a nice person but this will have to be it.

I honestly don't know what to do. Right now I would be perfectly fine with going over. Giving her support, and leaving. The attachment is gone right now. But I don't know how I'd be in the actual moment. Especially if she tried to touch me, etc. etc. It's like an addiction. I have the best intentions but if you put a substance in front of me and allow it to stay around me for an amount of time there's a good chance I'd relapse.

[marti644]

roberto,

This is hard and you must search your feelings to decide what you really want. In the end its up to you. If you meet you will likely be part of a recycling attempt. Is that what you want?

But I have read your story at I see all the hurt that has been done to you. I suggest you stay away and let yourself heal. Are you ready to support her if you are still emotionally weak yourself?

Just some thoughts. Stay strong brother.

[once removed]

when we are wounded and vulnerable, our ability to give support is limited... .and often as it should be.

are there other ways you can support her, and support yourself at the same time?

[roberto516]

when we are wounded and vulnerable, our ability to give support is limited... .and often as it should be.

are there other ways you can support her, and support yourself at the same time?

It's something I will have to process. I'm still at work for another 3 hours. Honestly, I have a 99% belief she is going to message me saying ":)on't come over. I was not thinking right." Which would be fine with me. But I guess me thinking that's my thoughts if she said that is a clear enough sign of what I know I have to do. Which is take care of myself.

[AustenJ]

Roberto-

I remember as a boy following rabbit tracks across a pond, anxious to see where she led me... .well she led me over thin ice and I fell through as I was not paying attention to my surroundings... .I was lucky that day as I had plenty of friends around to pull me out... .can you imagine what would have happened if I didn't have my older, wiser, more experienced friends around?

I'm 10 weeks out from my discard, but I know I would not be strong enough to just provide support to my ex if she asked me to come over. I don't think I would be strong enough if she asked me to meet over coffee at a Walmart on a Saturday during dollar steak day.

I get the feeling from your other posts that you have been awaiting this invite from her for a long time... .which you thought would never come. Careful what you wish for... .

Protect your heart at all costs. Feel your inner strength when you don't respond to her or you say no. Your choice will go a long way to helping or hindering your healing progress. I wish you well, my friend.

[roberto516]

Complicated I love the analogy! Can I steal that ? I told her no. I told her that she wants this and that out of me and I won't do it. I wanted to tell her all about this forum and her traits but there's no point. The important thing is I know. And without all you amazing people I might have followed the rabbit tracks  

A very amazing person here told me that one path will lead to pain and the other path will lead to freedom from this pain. I've felt the pain for 2 months. Embraced it, felt it harder than ive ever allowed myself to feel an emotion. Because i knew it would make me stronger. But I'm gonna keep walking the path that will lead me out of this pain.

[Sadly]

Well done Roberto516
You are doing so well and sounding so positive and I love you for loving your dog so much, you have tried to be fair . For sure they don't like us taking control of our own lives back, even if they don't really want us anymore. Be strong, the pain and sadness will fade to manageable and the days it hits hard come here.
Love from
Sadly x

[roberto516]

Well done Roberto516
You are doing so well and sounding so positive and I love you for loving your dog so much

Thanks Sadly. I predicted what would happen though. She said "i don't think this is a good idea" so I agreed. Then she tried to find out why we couldn't just be friends. I told her it wouldn't end well for me. And the last message before i blocked her was "I guess when I saw a picture of you up on facebook with the wife of your best friend I got real jealous. I guess I still have feelings for you. But I don't want to be in a relationship right now so please block me." Which I did. I felt like that was her trying to get me to keep a communication channel open. To see if I would take the bait about her saying she has feelings. But I appreciate her honesty about not wanting to be in a relationship. I'll give her that.

And one last thing. When I came home from work yesterday and was still unsure if I'd go over my dog was so excited. Jumping around. I laid on the bed and she immediately nuzzled into me and started kissing me and wouldn't let me get up. I never saw her so excited. And a part of me likes to think she was saying "Please stay with me tonight. Don't go back to her. We both know how she is ."

Thanks everyone. I know the feelings have now resurfaced because I broke NC. But it's not feelings of missing her or anything. I feel good today. And for this moment I'm going to embrace that & help others so I can keep helping myself.