Verbal Abuse and Projection

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

Hi Peeps,

Patricia Allen, the verbal abuse expert, says that defining someone else as if you are in their head and know what they are thinking/feeling/experiencing is verbal abuse, i.e. "you're too sensitive, you're a liar, you're stupid."  And that verbal abuse is very often projection. 

My ex stalked me for about 10 months after I ended the r/s.  I kept a spreadsheet of all phone, text, email contacts in case I needed it.

In his 600 contacts to me, he made 1000+ "you" statements. 

I had excel "find and replace" all of his "you" statements with "I" statements as a way to peer into what he was REALLY telling me about himself. 

These turn-around statements are all quite accurate and seem pretty much true about him. 

Here are but a few samples:

-  "I" are a selfish ___.
-  "I" have caused much more pain, than help. 
-   F*ck "I"
-  "I" MUST BE A SOCIOPATH. "I" CLEARLY ARE A LIAR, A JUDAS
-  "I" are not thinking correctly. 
-  "I" live in FEAR OF BEING PLAYED. 
-  "I" HAVE LIED DOZENS OF TIMES.
-  "I" know this is wrong"
-  I am so frustrated by "I" (my) Goddamn resolve
-  "I" are crazy.
-  "I" (my) anger is self-created, self-nurtured, self-destructive and destructive to others.
-  "I".f*cking.destroyed.my.life.and.future

This is a good exercise and would be a good tool for interpreting any "you" statements still being hurled by an exBPD. 

[ReclaimingMyLife]

Hi Peeps,

Patricia Allen, the verbal abuse expert, says that defining someone else as if you are in their head and know what they are thinking/feeling/experiencing is verbal abuse, i.e. "you're too sensitive, you're a liar, you're stupid."  And that verbal abuse is very often projection. 

My ex stalked me for about 10 months after I ended the r/s.  I kept a spreadsheet of all phone, text, email contacts in case I needed it.

In his 600 contacts to me, he made 1000+ "you" statements. 

I had excel "find and replace" all of his "you" statements with "I" statements as a way to peer into what he was REALLY telling me about himself. 

These turn-around statements are all quite accurate and seem pretty much true about him. 

Here are but a few samples:

-  "I" are a selfish ___.
-  "I" have caused much more pain, than help. 
-   F*ck "I"
-  "I" MUST BE A SOCIOPATH. "I" CLEARLY ARE A LIAR, A JUDAS
-  "I" are not thinking correctly. 
-  "I" live in FEAR OF BEING PLAYED. 
-  "I" HAVE LIED DOZENS OF TIMES.
-  "I" know this is wrong"
-  I am so frustrated by "I" (my) Goddamn resolve
-  "I" are crazy.
-  "I" (my) anger is self-created, self-nurtured, self-destructive and destructive to others.
-  "I".f*cking.destroyed.my.life.and.future

This is a good exercise and would be a good tool for interpreting any "you" statements still being hurled by an exBPD. 

[ReclaimingMyLife]

-  "I".f*cking.destroyed.my.life.and.future

Seeing this quote earlier today was powerful.  This was the most accurate and a complete confirmation of what actually went down with him since we met.  It is good to know the truth.  The actual truth.  And it is straight out of his mouth. 

This is THE TRUTH  to remember: that HE destroyed his life and future.  Not me. 

What things did your pwBPD say allegedly about you that was really about him/herself?

I imagine I am not alone in this!

[Larmoyant]

I imagine I am not alone in this!

Definitely not! I think this is a really useful exercise. Push it back where it belongs  . Your list is my list 

[marti644]

Reclaiming this is such a useful exercise! I sincerely regret deleting all the texts she sent me right after she discarded me. They are a useful reminder of what actually happened that I shouldn't forget when I get weak. Your reminder of some of the things she said is great, thank you!

[stimpy]

This is a good exercise and would be a good tool for interpreting any "you" statements still being hurled by an exBPD. 

Thankfully the hurling of insults has stopped since she dumped me.

But it is a good exercise, and I have a boundary now, that anyone who does the "you are *****" thing, is not worth my company.

As you say, reversing it is quite interesting... .so it means that... .

she "is too sensitive"
she "is abusive"
she "can't help her character"
she "is schizophrenic"
she "is a player"

Yep, that just about has it exactly!

A thought crossed my mind, is how they describe themselves... .in her case "loyal" - NOT TRUE, and a "people person" - NOT TRUE, are they descriptions of us?

Also, mine stalked me as well, for about a year, though she never talked to me, just showed up where she knew I'd be, kinda like dangling herself in front of me, waiting for a reaction. Nasty stuff.

[once removed]

are these statements of projection?

it might be that from our perspective, these are statements of hypocrisy. it can be easy to confuse the two.

alternatively, taking into account the nature of a person with BPD, with feelings of persecution and victim hood, these might be statements that arent projection, just lashing out. weve all been there. we might have used hyperbole, or said things we regret, but odds are we werent projecting, and in most cases, the same is true for our ex partners.

it might seem like splitting hairs, but it helps to distinguish.

[ReclaimingMyLife]

Thanks for everyone's comments. Very good to question ourselves and each other, once removed, as we ALL project... .not just the BPDex's.

That said, I actually do think these examples are very much projection.  Early on my ex called the mutual friend who introduced us "an as$ hole" and another mutual friend a "habitual liar."  I wish I had known then that he was actually projecting and was telling me what he had in store for me and my future.

The definition posted by Skip here on bpdfamily seems to agree:

[Projection is a defense mechanism, operating unconsciously, in which what is emotionally unacceptable in the self is unconsciously rejected and attributed (projected) to others.  Projection is denying one's own unpleasant traits, behaviors, or feelings by attributing them, often in an accusing way,  to someone else. 

I think this is absolutely what my ex was doing.  The lies he told me in hindsight are far too many to count, and yet he accused me repeatedly of being a liar.  (Among many other things!)

What do others think?  When is something projection and when is it not? 

Thanks again, all!

[Larmoyant]

Hi Reclaiming,

.What do others think?  When is something projection and when is it not?

.
 
I was repeatedly accused of being a liar too and I’d consider that projection as in “you’re a lying, cheating sl*t” who likes to frequent “sleazy bars”. He was describing himself.

Other times his verbal abuse didn’t seem to be so clear-cut. They could have been instances of projection, but then again maybe devaluation, splitting or projective identification. BPD defenses. We all use defenses, but I’ve read that pwBPD perceive and use them as necessary against imagined insults to their own well-being. They may even be reliving past experiences and then project feelings associated with those events onto us. Fleeting relief from their own emotional pain I suppose.

What about our pain? The emotional damage caused by verbal abuse causes so much destruction. One year later I still have moments when I hear his voice echoing in my ear reminding me what an awful person I am. It’s so important that we stop internalising the abuse. The exercise above was useful for me so thanks for posting. It doesn’t hurt them, they don't get to see it, it’s for us.

I’m sorry for going on and I’m probably not addressing your question well, but for some reason I feel triggered by this thread. It's the memories of all the insults I think, but it's good to get it out. Thanks for posting this.

[FSTL]

My has stopped with the abuse, but only because of the way I communicate with her now (which is LC).

The abuse when it was delivered was a mixture of:

- lies,
- projection,
- lashing out about her fears (which involved projection and lies), or
- statements to confirm devaluation (which may also have involved projection).

It's all abuse, although intellectually it's interesting to know the slight distinction between them.

All I need to know is I don't want to be entangled with someone who thinks/acts abusive.