Home page of BPDFamily.com, online relationship supportMember registration here
March 28, 2024, 05:58:12 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Board Admins: Kells76, Once Removed, Turkish
Senior Ambassadors: Cat Familiar, EyesUp, SinisterComplex
  Help!   Boards   Please Donate Login to Post New?--Click here to register  
bing
Things I couldn't have known
Supporting a Child in Therapy for Borderline Personality Disorder
Anosognosia and Getting a "Borderline" into Therapy
Am I the Cause of Borderline Personality Disorder?
Emotional Blackmail: Fear, Obligation and Guilt (FOG)
94
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Finally figured it out  (Read 391 times)
ExhaustedMom58

Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Posts: 4


« on: May 22, 2017, 11:50:03 AM »

Ok, here goes.  My first post here.  I apologize for the length.  It took my husband and me over 20 years to finally realize that our 36 year old daughter very likely has BPD.  It was suggested to us from time to time by knowledgeable friends that maybe she had a personality disorder, but we always seemed to find some other explanation for her horrific behavior, e.g., it's "just" adolescent depression/acting out; she's not feeling well, physically; she's in an abusive relationship; etc.  Our other three children were skeptical.  She lashed out at them with a vengeance and with utterly no provocation at times.  They expressed concern about the impact she was having on my husband and me, as we extricated her each time from the terrible situations into which she got herself.  She's totally severed ties with her family three (now four) times over these past 20 years, each time in conjunction with entering into a destructive relationship with a man (two of whom she married and divorced, so far).

We just finished spending five solid years "rescuing" her from an abusive marriage, incurring enormous legal fees on her behalf to help protect her and her children, which she said she would absolutely pay back, but now says she will not (she will not get a job and relies on child support).  In those five years, she and her two little children lived in our home, while we largely supported her in every way, physically, financially, and emotionally.  She seemed to initially become more stable after becoming a mother herself and we thought she was finally on the path to building a stable life. But, in the last two years she has been declining. 

Dealing with her significant legal and emotional issues on a day-to-day basis resulted in a stress-induced heart attack for me one year ago.  I'm only 58 and have no risk factors for heart disease ... .none ... .except for the unrelenting stress and worry.  That was a wakeup call for me.  If I don't start taking care of myself, I won't be around for these little grandchildren, who are going to need me, not to mention my wonderful husband of almost 40 years and our three other children.

Suddenly, in January 2017, in a fit of anger and impulsivity, she moved herself and her two little boys in with a young man she had met only 3 months prior.  Yes, we wanted her to work toward moving out and getting her life in order, but not like that.  Apparently, the trigger was that we had made the "mistake" of failing to support one of her decisions, one that made us seriously concerned for the welfare of one of the children.  In a matter of days, we went from being the most wonderful parents and grandparents anyone could ever ask for to being abusive, manipulative, controlling villains.  She has cut off all communication with us and her entire family.  She refuses to even allow the children to speak with us, much less visit with us. 

We are devastated and frightened for these young children (ages 2 and 4).  We have been their constants, their stability, and key loving figures in their young lives.  She refuses to speak to us, refuses to even answer email.  Silent treatment and severing ties is her MO.  But, if past experience has taught us anything it's that she will implode.  It's only a question of when and how bad it will be.  She drinks A LOT and she smokes A LOT of pot.  She has a history of suicidal ideation and self-harm.  She refuses to seek therapy.  This is the first time children have been involved during one of her "rampage" episodes (which can last for months or even years) and we feel the risk to them is high. 

So, yes, we have finally realized that we need to set boundaries for ourselves.  That we need to protect ourselves from our daughter, because her behaviors have been extremely abusive to us.  But, what to do about these two vulnerable children.  The emotional cruelty of our daughter's behavior with respect to the children and their relationship with us has been particularly hard to grasp.  Her emotional instability makes us concerned for both their emotional and physical safety.  But, she can turn it off and on.  She will seem cool as a cucumber to outsiders and will justify her behaviors based on her allegations of abuse by her family . . . most profoundly me . . . mom.  I'm so tired.  I'm so sad.  I'm so worried.  But, I DO have a good therapist for myself and a wonderfully supportive husband, family, and circle of friends.  The children are our concern now.  They cannot stand up for themselves.
Logged
Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders
Huat
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: Estranged
Posts: 595


« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2017, 04:38:19 PM »

So, so much of your story resonates with me!   We, too, rescued our daughter... .emotionally and financially many, many times.  We, too, were "the best parents ever!" many, many times.  In the blink of an eye that could/would change to "the worst parents ever!"  Actually, it is me (her Mom) who is always singled out as the reason for all her problems.  Then it is me (her Mom... .not her Dad) who is the one she comes to when her life hits rock bottom.

I am in my 70's... .our daughter is 50... .our troubles with her going back to when she first ran away at age 12.   Long time, huh?  I sometimes think I suffer from PTSD because of the trauma of trying to deal with her all these years... .cautious to embrace the "good times" because of being fearful of the next unexpected blow-up.

Our "grandbabies" are now in their late 20's.  We were surrogate parents to them because of all the gut-wrenching drama going on between their mother and their different fathers.  Until they got into their teens, we were much loved by them.  Sadly they watched and learned as our daughter role-modelled her lack of respect of us.   Although I have worked hard to forgive our daughter for what she has done to us, knowing this is a mental illness she is living with, stripping us of a loving relationship with our grandchildren does fester in me... .but it has strengthened me.

In those early years we put-up-and-shut-up so much because of her threats to cut off ties (and it did happen a few times).  That, of course, meant that we would not see our precious grandchildren.  Well, here we are now, in our senior years and her anger has been escalating to the point where we have taken heed from a professional who told us, "You are sh-- on her shoes.  The verbal abuse can turn to physical abuse."  It is now us who have cut off ties and this action has really added fuel to her fire.  She is now on a campaign, contacting friends of ours to "fill them in" on who we really are.

I feel for you and your husband, ExhaustedMom58.  Those little grandchildren are SO young and your worries about them are justified.  Do you feel they are in harm's way because of their mother and her current living arrangements?  Do you feel you have to talk to authorities?   That can be a hard call to make because you stand the chance of deepening the rift between you and your daughter if decisions are not made in your favour.  The Prayer of Serenity... ."God grant us the serenity to accept the things we cannot change... .the courage to change the things we can... .and the wisdom to know the difference."  Hmmmmm?

As difficult as it will be, perhaps at this point it is time to stop trying to make contact.  A shift in your actions (non-actions) will be recognized by her.  She knows those grandchildren are her trump card.  Sadly, family relations with your daughter and her children may never turn out the way you want them to be.  Life cannot be choreographed... .but you can still dance.

I agree that you have to set boundaries for yourself... .and the sooner the better.  It is nice to read that you are seeing a therapist for yourself.  You need someone who knows how to be a sounding board.

Answers, ExhaustedMom58"?  There are none.  It is research, trial and error and making sure you and your husband look after yourselves first. 

How important, too, to know you are not alone in this journey.  Keep reading... .keep writing.  What you have to write may just be of help to someone else.  This forum has been so helpful to me... .and I hope for you.

Logged
ExhaustedMom58

Offline Offline

What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Posts: 4


« Reply #2 on: May 23, 2017, 10:16:20 AM »

Wow, thank you, Huat.  Your response brought tears to my eyes.  I so appreciate all that you wrote, even though it makes me realize that things may be rather hopeless for our daughter and grandchildren.

Our daughter also ran away, at age 16.  We couldn't figure out why at the time and she's never verbalized why since.  She was gone over 11 months and we thought she must be dead.  It was agony.  Then she called and asked for forgiveness.  We were so relieved to get her back.  I thought it was a miracle.  But, the cycle of running from us, for whatever reason she cooks up in her head, has repeated many more times.  Now, it's the grandchildren that our hearts break for. 
It's very hard to walk away from them.  We love them and they are deeply attached to us.  But, you are right, they are her trump card now.

No, we do not feel they are safe, either emotionally or physically at this time.  But, she is very, very good at spinning her yarns about us when it suits her.  I've never been able to lie, nor my husband.  I don't know how she got so good at it.  It must be part of the illness? 

It's possible that if we alert the father of one of the children, he will seek custody.  He's not a great role model and has abusive tendencies at least toward his partners, but maybe it would be better and more stable for this child to be in his care.  We just don't know.  I think it would be very painful for this child to be removed from his mother and little brother.  But, I had a sister with mental illness, which I recently found out included BPD, and the horrific impact she had on my niece (and my parents) is not a scenario I want to see repeated.  My sister ended up committing suicide when her child, my niece, turned 18, which was both a great sadness and a relief for everyone, including her child.

Our wonderfully insightful and wise pastor, who knows our family well, recently counseled me:  "[Daughter] has shown you that she is willing to do whatever it takes to achieve her goals, even if that means destroying you."  That was hard to hear, but it seems to be the truth.  It makes me incredibly sad to know this.  Some days I rather wish I didn't wake up.  But, I have a wonderful husband, three other wonderful children (sons), and three other young grandchildren, all of whom do cherish me and I them.  Still, we grieve for the ones who are lost.

Did your daughter ever seek therapy?  We wish ours would, but she will not consider it. 

Thank you again for your response.  It DOES help to hear from others who have struggled with the same issues.
Logged
JoeBPD81
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Posts: 709



WWW
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2017, 08:20:33 AM »

Hello there,

I'm sorry to hear about your suffering. I would be in the role of the partner of your daughter, she came to me from an abusive marriage and after living with her mom for a while. I try my best, but I know any word of understanding from her parents means the world to her, it has the power to heal. If they could just say "I think you are a good person", it could change the whole world for her.

My girlfriend has two kids too, and the older shows syntoms of a behavior disorder and it's very difficult. It's so easy to feel his victims, or to think he is trying to manipulate us all the time. Same with my loved one. But I know it's not the case.

This Disorder makes that they lose contact with their goals. Her goal is not to make you suffer. She doesn't feel good enough to do anything right, so she gets pulled to do bad things and get the punishment afterwards, because it's the only thing she feels she deserves. We, the people who are close and care about her, get involved and get hurt, but we are the side effect, the colateral damage, while they get a crushing pain. They seem to react to small things or to misunderstanding as if it were the end of the world... .But for them it is. People with BPD are often described as "emotional burn victims". Burn victims have no skin, so any contact is incredibly painful. This happens to them in the field of emotions. Even good/positive emotions can hurt and need an immediate escape.

Boundaries are absolutely needed. But it's also needed to take a step back and forget everything we know about parenting, and learn new ways that are completelly different than the ones we used to use. That is a lot. I read that you care a lot, I read that you have a big heart, if only it was enough, it would be great. But I read also judgement, and that judgement feels like a burning iron right on her skin, and she needs to escape without thinking. Relationships for them are like a room full of spiders for an arachnophobic.

I would recommend you a couple of books that have helped me a lot:

The Buddha and the Borderline
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=133356.0
A First person brave telling of what pwBPD feel and think.

Loving Someone with Borderline Personality Disorder
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=149336.0
Tips and strategies.

It takes a lot to think that we, with the best intentions have been making things worse, and that changing ourselves can make things better for everyone. Because we did nothing wrong, we just didn't know how to make things right with a disorder that is so complicated and so counter-intuitive for the ones that have not experienced it.

Please, don't throw the towell on your daughter. As much as she push you away, she needs you more than anything. If you want her back, you can start by talking about her as someone who deserves to come back. I know you are scared and hurt, and it feels like there is no fix for this. I'm sorry if I've been harsh, but I believe things can get so much better for all your family.

God Bless.
Logged

We are in this together.
Huat
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Relationship status: Estranged
Posts: 595


« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2017, 01:00:36 PM »

Hello JoeBPD81!

Wonderful to get input from your side of the equation! 

Our daughter has had a few relationships and so many times we listened to her tell us how abusive that partner could be... .sided with her... .went to her aid.  Terrible men?  Hmmmm?

If I reflect back on our own history with our daughter, remember the stories she would spread about us... .until her next apology, I wonder about the stories we would hear about those ex-partners.  Were they really abusive?

I know, for ourselves, that we have always told our daughter we love her (and we do!)... .verbally and in written words.  If we ever thought of a way to help her... .we did ... .emotionally and financially.  We have done our homework (and continue to do so) on how to deal with this terrible illness.  It can hurt so much, though, when professions of love are scoffed at.   Possibly this has happened to you.

Give up on my child?  Never!  Change tactics?  Yes!

My hat goes off to you, JoeBPD81!  You are in a  relationship you can choose to stay in... .choose to leave.   Our child will ALWAYS be our child... .womb to the tomb.

Your partner is a lucky, lucky person to have someone who is so understanding.   Your calmness in her storms is her lifeline to better tomorrows.
Logged
JoeBPD81
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Romantic partner
Posts: 709



WWW
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2017, 03:40:15 AM »

Thanks for taking it well.

One of the things I've learnt is that more than in other people, for pwBPD perception is reality. If they feel something is abusive, it is, her experience of the world is that that is abuse. For most of us, when we learn that we were wrong, we take some time to interiorize it and then our perception changes. For them, the feeling lingers and it's more powerful than the facts.

Alan Fruzzeti tells it this way (from memory): If someone tells me "your dog was killed by a truck on the road!" I'll be very upset. Then I find out that it wasn't my dog, but I'll continue to be upset for a while, it doesn't go away as soon as I find out the truth.

For people with BPD that upseting feeling that remains, could stay there for days or weeks, it feels like it won't ever go away. And as they can't change it, I find that eventually they can dismiss the reality, as it is easier to ignore/forget the truth that to get rid of the feeling. That is scary, and of course hurts us a lot, the people who love them. But when we talk to them, we have to adknowledge what they believe. It is not that they want to deceive us, or themselves on purpose. It's a defense mechanishm against something that feels unbereable to them.

It goes like this: I think my mother hates me - that is unbereable - I find out she loves me - that enters in conflict with what I'm feeling - The feeling is stronger that the realization - If I accept my mother loves me while I'm feeling she hates me, I'm crazy, or a really really bad person - that thought brings a lot of shame and guilt - that is even more painful than before - My system blocks something to stop this spiral of pain and despair , the easiest to block is the truth that she loves me (because it's the hardest to believe, I'm not worthy of love)... .- I keep thinking my mother hates me.

From the outside this is too dramatic. It seems easy to focus on reality and snap out of that. As they can't do that, we get angry, or we try to explain, to confront their reality, to show them (show them they are wrong)... .And none of that works, even if its the natural thing to do. For us. That constant danger, constant high threat level, is the world they live in. It IS that dramatic for them. And it's not because they want it like that.

Love is too complicated to understand, or to believe. That's why some of them seek attention, or strong emotions, or sex, because it's something immediate that they can understand and it takes their mind off the pain for a minute. They know it's bad in the long term, but they don't think they deserve better.

It's impossible to have all this in mind everytime we talk to them. But we try.

I can say in written and in voice that I love her, that she is my life, my sun and my moon... .And then I drink her coffee and I'm despicable and her worst enemy (for a while). They believe more in what they think they deserve.

It's true I could just leave this relationship, so it's very different from parenting. I only see my stepchild, but I don't know if he will be with me forever, because she might leave me, or I could lose her to this or other illness, and I don't have a claim for the kids, they have a father (Even though he does not call nor visit them). I see how she is living the problems of the kid, how desperating it is for her. She absolutely blames herself, her biology and her care. And well, I'm so new to (step)parenting, that I don't know if I would feel differently if they were my biological kids. I'm trying to make sense of a lot of chaos. I don't think about leaving, but it's true it's not the same as having a kid. It has advantages and disadvantages. I hadn't met them before they were in trouble. I couldn't bond with them then. I dont' have other members of the family that can support me or us, I'm "the head" of the family, and no one else knows she has BPD, diagnosed.

My GF has read that Buddha book I recommended. And it has helped her see she is not a freak, not a monster, and she is not alone in the world. It helped her to reach out to other people with BPD and research ways to improve. There are also some Youtube videos from a recovered woman, she calls herself "recovery mum". Maybe there is something you can show your daugthers.

Thanks for listening.
Logged

We are in this together.
MomMae
***
Offline Offline

Gender: Female
What is your sexual orientation: Straight
Who in your life has "personality" issues: Child
Posts: 184



« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2017, 10:01:36 PM »

Hi Joe  

I wanted to say thank you for your thought provoking posts and for mentioning the books.  I will be definitely by ordering the Buddha and the Borderline and plan on passing it on the my BPDd20, after I read it.  I love finding about resources that others have found helpful and had not come across that book.  The reviews are all excellent.  You sound like a very compassionate, understanding and caring person.  Your girlfriend is fortunate to have you in her life.

ExhaustedMom58, I am so sorry to hear all that you have been through and continue to suffer.  I am new here, too.  I have found comfort in learning that I am not alone in this journey. You are not alone, ExhaustedMom58.  I hope you also find some comfort in knowing that others understand your heartache because we are living it in one form or another, too... Hugs 
Logged

Can You Help Us Stay on the Air in 2024?

Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Our 2023 Financial Sponsors
We are all appreciative of the members who provide the funding to keep BPDFamily on the air.
12years
alterK
AskingWhy
At Bay
Cat Familiar
CoherentMoose
drained1996
EZEarache
Flora and Fauna
ForeverDad
Gemsforeyes
Goldcrest
Harri
healthfreedom4s
hope2727
khibomsis
Lemon Squeezy
Memorial Donation (4)
Methos
Methuen
Mommydoc
Mutt
P.F.Change
Penumbra66
Red22
Rev
SamwizeGamgee
Skip
Swimmy55
Tartan Pants
Turkish
whirlpoollife



Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2006-2020, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!