How can I feel guilty for my hyper-reactions to someone bent on my destruction?

[Chynna]

Hi folks! I am sure this is not a new topic. If we all have to confess before healing: How can I feel guilty for the ignorance of knowing not of this condition? We all belong to the imperfect genus of homosapian; even the seemingly strongest have their insecurities. How can I feel guilty for my hyper-reactions to someone who seemed bent on my destruction as I knew and loved myself. (I do... .we represent ourselves after all... .) How can I feel guilty for being sensitive and caring towards another fellow human being? How can I feel guilty for having the tenacity to "march into hell for a  Heavenly cause? Only to find that living this way was destructively finite. Almost 8 months n/c. Still miss his goodness(he did possess some). In healing, ~Chynna

[Lucky Jim]

Hey Chynna, Who knew?  I was nine years into my marriage before I learned about BPD.  Before that, I was just scratching my head and swinging in the dark.  No, I don't recommend beating yourself up with feelings of guilt, because I'm sure you did the best your could under the circumstances.  BPD is under the radar for most folks.  Agree, a BPD r/s is often a destructive path and I admire your clarity to move on from it.

LuckyJim

[gotbushels]

Chynna  

How can I feel guilty for the ignorance of knowing not of this condition?

Yes.  

We all belong to the imperfect genus of homosapian; even the seemingly strongest have their insecurities.

Certainly.  We can't know everything all the time. Even the experts have difficulties diagnosing let alone treating this BPD thing--so it doesn't make sense to self-flagellate over it.

How can I feel guilty for my hyper-reactions to someone who seemed bent on my destruction as I knew and loved myself.

Surely. Sometimes our bodies adjust to protect us from a more dangerous environment and people with whom it doesn't feel safe with--e.g., someone you see as bent on your destruction. So if you adapted with hypersensitivity in the past then I think that's a good sign your body had adjusted to protect yourself.  

I hope you're enjoying your peace.

[Chynna]

Hey LJ & GB~well the reason I felt compelled to post this thread is that I've been reading here that confession is involved in healing. And I thought " we all just tried to love someone who was basically unloveable as we know loving to be." So I was just questioning that. I do feel badly about some of my reactions to his nonsense. I didn't think I was capable of that. Given the circumstances, we are capable of anything as, GB says, a means to self protect. After rereading my post, I realize it didn't quite come out as I'd hoped, being in a hurry. I need to work more on self-forgiveness ( tend to be very hard on myself somtimes ) Thank you for your responses  ~ Chynna

[Lucky Jim]

And I thought " we all just tried to love someone who was basically unloveable as we know loving to be."

Hey Chynna, Nicely put.  Yes to self-forgiveness.  I behaved in ways that were unlike me and of which I'm not particularly proud, yet sometimes a BPD r/s seems to bring out the worst in a Non.  It's a red flag  for the future, because now I know that if I'm getting caught up in the drama then maybe the r/s is not right for me.   

LJ

[Wicker Man]

How can I feel guilty for being sensitive and caring towards another fellow human being?

~Chynna

Compassion was what ultimately lead me to begin posting on BPD Family. Yes, people suffering from BPD can (frequently... .relentlessly... .) do horrible things to the people who love them.  They do monstrous things.  They rage, hurt themselves, lie, cheat, and perhaps worst of all can cut us out of their lives completely without even the slightest warning --but they are still human beings. 

They are, in my opinion, suffering pain we can never hope to fully understand as healthy people.  -Their pain does not compel us to consign ourselves to destruction.

If I did not retain love for the lovely part of her, then perhaps I would be the monster.  This love for the good in her, however, did not obligate me to be consumed.  I left out of self preservation and it is the single most difficult thing I have done. -but I do not feel guilty for having done so?  Sad --Yes.  Guilty  --No.

I adored her and she did love me in her way.  --but we were doomed. She cannot escape the bonds of her disorder.  I feel immense pity for her, but no guilt for leaving. 

Her life will continue to be tragic and mine is a little darker since leaving the brilliance of her love, but there was no other responsible choice left open to me.

How can I feel guilty for having the tenacity to "march into hell for a  Heavenly cause? Only to find that living this way was destructively finite.

"... .no lifeguard is required to objectively risk killing or severely injuring themselves in order to perform their job duties."


Wicker Man

[Chynna]

LJ, yes ... .chalk it up to one overall pretty negative learning experience! Devoted way too much time on as you say " scratching my head"... .(huh, what was that?) TY,TY,TY BPD family and members!

[Chynna]

Wicker man... .100%yes! Very eloquent. I lost some friends(?)  trying to make sense of it all b/c I have to hold things in my hands -so to speak-  to examine, as a means to heal. It's just me & I don't regret that... .it's not wasted time. T/Y ~ Chynna

[Wicker Man]

'Friend' is a term thrown around far too easily in our modern era.  It is in times of need when we find out who our friends really are. 600+ 'friends' on Facebook?  Most of these 'friends' would not give me the time of day.

I have 2 real friends on God's green Earth and I consider myself blessed.  They have spent countless hours trying to help me reconcile my experience with BPD.  --What a tragic disorder. 

The last I looked (I know... .I know... .I shouldn't look... .) my ex is still waiting for me to return to her -we have not spoken in nearly 5 months. 

She broke up with me, apparently as a threat... .I simply agreed with her. 

I cannot even begin to imagine the inner turmoil that is a day in the life of someone suffering from Borderline Personality disorder.  My heart aches for her pain.

Confession for me has been easy -dealing with the confusion and accepting reality... .therein lies the challenge of healing.

Thank you for beginning such a thoughtful thread.

Wicker Man

[Lucky Jim]

Their pain does not compel us to consign ourselves to destruction.

Great point, Wicker Man, which is something I've struggled with since leaving my BPDxW.  I even started a recent thread about when commitment becomes unhealthy in a BPD r/s.  I came close to the brink before hitting bottom, which was not fun but enabled me to leave an extremely toxic situation for me.

"... .no lifeguard is required to objectively risk killing or severely injuring themselves in order to perform their job duties."

I'm not a lifeguard, yet I enjoy that quote!

LJ

[Wicker Man]

Lucky Jim

I'm not a lifeguard

It is incredibly hard to say this and mean it --without a feeling of guilt. 

As human beings we need a level of selfishness, by this I mean sense of self.  It takes a lot of introspection to realize when a relationship becomes a case of kill or be killed.  Either end a relationship or be consumed. 

What makes BPD such a conundrum for me to grapple with is my belief that my ex was not bent on my destruction --in fact in her way she loved me, perhaps more than she has ever loved before. 

She is, however at this point in her life, on a path to her own destruction and I could not accompany her into the inferno.

I do not believe she had intent to harm me --although she did a damn fine job of it.  She simply, in my opinion, has no control over her emotional state -if I had seen intent to harm recovering from our failed relationship would be easy for me.  It is this utter lack of intent and control which makes her such a tragic being and my recovery more challenging.


Wicker Man

[Chynna]

Wicker Man, I can feel that you loved her deeply. Is she resistant to treatment? If she is waiting for acknowledgement from you, she also has an attachment to you... .Bp vs. Non love; I know. For myself, I know I have a certain place in his heart (I really do think he is in disbelief that I've been n/c). His silence all these months is proof to me that  per him, he had no part in outcome of r/s & will never admit to being the villain... .there really can't be two now can there? :0) But if he had admitted/accepted his issue and earnestly sought to repair himself, I would have been there for him. But the roll of the dice, you know? ~  Chynna ;0)

[Chynna]

Hmmm... .'intent' to hurt. I can't believe the my xbf did not have the intent to cause me a great deal of pain. He knew what he was doing. At the very least he could have been a better communicator and not assume that I knew what was in his mind and heart (when his actions could be so confusing ). Sins of omission... .there seemed to be at least 2 sets of relationship values: 1 for the general public who's eyes were always watching & 1 for relationships. I'd say he was the master of compartmentalization. I do realize that there seem to be gender differences... .

[Chynna]

Weren't there ever times in your early childhood when you knew some of your behaviors were "unacceptable". But you still went thru with them?

[once removed]

Weren't there ever times in your early childhood when you knew some of your behaviors were "unacceptable". But you still went thru with them?

i think this is really the question. as we got older, we learned to be accountable and to learn from our behavior.

in these relationships we faced real adversity, and in many cases, we acted badly, in ways unacceptable to ourselves. we want to be better and stronger in the next relationship. we will be tested again.

[Lucky Jim]

As human beings we need a level of selfishness, by this I mean sense of self.  It takes a lot of introspection to realize when a relationship becomes a case of kill or be killed.  Either end a relationship or be consumed.  

Hey WM, I might modify your quote by saying that we require is self-love, which is what protects us from abuse.  To me, there's nothing selfish about it because no one deserves abuse.

Hey Chynna, I would also suggest that I suffered from naivete in my BPD r/s, because I expected that my spouse would treat me with kindness and respect, which proved illusory.

LJ

[Wicker Man]

I can feel that you loved her deeply. Is she resistant to treatment?

I have never felt so much love for another human being.  As I look back and try to understand what I experienced I have likened her love to love verging on psychosis.  She loved me to an impossible and unsustainable level.  She loved me with every ounce of her being... .until she raged and then she hated me with just as much passion.

As a child she was misdiagnoses as schizophrenic and bi-polar.  I took this diagnosis at face value as I am not a mental healthcare professional.  She did have auditory and visual hallucinations under extreme duress, but exhibited no other symptoms of schizophrenia.  She out did her self with Rage A+  

It wasn't until ending the relationship I happened across BPD.  Somewhere my college psychology teacher must be laughing about this... .

She lives in Mainland China and mental healthcare is not what it is here in the West.  It was not until we were well into No Contact that I guessed she suffers from BPD.  Once again I am not a professional, but she exhibits all of the behaviors save reckless driving, gambling and spending. 

If she is waiting for acknowledgement from you, she also has an attachment to you... .Bp vs. Non love; I know.

When at the end of a 7 day rage she broke up with me I agreed and we ended our engagement. 

She has been incredibly respectful of our agreement to no longer communicate, however a friend of ours did reach out to me.  I did my best to explain to this friend why our relationship failed.  It failed when it dawned on me she could one day just walk away.  No amount of love and sacrifice would have changed this inevitably.

I struggle with the compulsion to write her directly and explain my suspicion about BPD, but in reality it would likely just start her healing clock from zero.

... .if he had admitted/accepted his issue and earnestly sought to repair himself, I would have been there for him. But the roll of the dice, you know? ~  Chynna ;0)

I know she would say or do anything to bring us back together and I know as I live and breath she would mean every last damn word of it -in that moment.  Further there is nothing in this world I would like to hear more.

This conversation also addressed the idea of intent.  My tryst with BPD only lasted a year, but in that time I never say a Machiavellian design to her actions.  Her final 7 day rage, which was our undoing, came 1 week before I was going to move to China and send a wire transfer her way to purchase a house.  If there had been even a shred of control in her emotional state this would have been the time to exercise it.  --I consider myself lucky that some instinct way down deep helped me realize -she will leave you. 

Her threat was foreshadowing.


Wicker Man

[Wicker Man]

Hey WM, I might modify your quote by saying that we require is self-love, which is what protects us from abuse.  To me, there's nothing selfish about it because no one deserves abuse.

Lucky Jim I see your point. I used selfish, because I ended our relationship out of self preservation, although it was an act of self-love.  I will have to continue to mull this over.

Selfish: arising from concern with one's own welfare or advantage in disregard of others.

Wicker Man

[Wicker Man]

Weren't there ever times in your early childhood when you knew some of your behaviors were "unacceptable". But you still went thru with them?

Ha!  Pretty much no.  I was a dream date of a kid.  I saved all my misdeeds up for adulthood. 



Wicker Man

[Chynna]

Once Removed... .Hi... .I was trying to compare pwBPD behavior and their awareness of what they are doing with a child's awareness of wrong vs right but still choose devilish anyway. So maybe pwBPD are not all that BPD 'innocent' as some seem to blame the illness itself... .

[Chynna]

W/M, so sorry for misdiagnosis. China seems so far ahead on so many things. Apparently healthcare & well- being isn't one of them. I agree; it's just too easy for pwBPD to walk away! I understand the psychotic behavior and everything else you've written here. But I won't ever give anyone here a pep talk. We all have our own developed neuropathways. Healing is unique for everyone and while it wouldn't hurt for healing suggestions from the multitude of self-help books, etc. I believe 'readiness' is key. It will all come together at some point. I think this kind of pain should never be underestimated. It's a killer. Really. So read, write and ruminate away toward your healing. ~ Chynna:0)

[Chynna]

3 Rs of healing... .

[RomanticFool]

Hi Chynna,

After a long period of being embroiled with somebody who never had my welfare at heart, I have reacted, over reacted, under reacted and sometimes never reacted. The fact is I forgave her a zillion times for hurting me. She rarely remembers any of it, much less cares. Her concern regarding my unrequited love for her is at zero - and yet I know I am important to her, at times, when it suits.

It took me a long time to get to the point where I felt I may be able to have a friendship devoid of expectations. I managed it for a few weeks but then she withheld the fact that she went away the past weekend and it triggered my feelings of rejection and I lashed out yet again, over text.

I have been slowly disconnecting myself from her. While I have stayed in contact, I have not seen her for 15 months. The conclusion that I have now come to is that I just do not want somebody in my life who disregards my emotional life. I cannot allow that situation to continue.

[Chynna]

Attaguy! . Really... .thumps up for n/c. It's the only way not to be triggered,etc.

[Gemsforeyes]

Chynna-

Please please, give me more on what you meant by your brief statement about "gender differences".  Since I learned of BPD (when I searched the phrase "unprovoked rage in men" during one of our break-ups 3.5 years into our helluva heartbreaking relationship, things have been just about as clear as mud.

Now a year later, after learning the tools, a lovely reconciliation and then BPDbf's complete raging meltdown 2 days after my best friend died suddenly, I am done done done.  He killed it and every shred of hope I held onto.  Have not seen his face in 3 months, but he continues to text me.  I will NOT say it's over.  I cannot take the cruelty, even in text.  Sorry.

So back to it... .gender differences?  I have my thoughts.  I want yours, please?

Warmly,
Gemsforeyes

[Chynna]

Hi Gemsforeyes :0), It's just that ("stereotypically"speaking ) girls have different methods of going about ways to achieve their goals than boys: girls might go shopping to release stress and boys might, oh- I don't know, go out drinking... .To be more specific, I've read posts here about guys targeting family pets. Not that girls aren't capable of the same cruelty. ~Chynna

[Wicker Man]

I have often wondered about gender difference and the physicality of rage. 

My ex weighted 100 pounds less than I did, so I never felt in physical danger, mental anguish sure... .plenty --but never a physical threat.   

To have a physical threat added to the the mental stress must be truly terrible.

My ex definitely used her outward appearance to garner attention.  Sadly, it was inevitably the wrong kind attention from the wrong sort of guys.  She was... .is... .(I still have a huge issue in what tense to use... .) an amazing artist, and part of her self expression was through coloring her hair and a few tattoos.  She and I spoke about it often. --I used to help her dye her hair.

Who knows perhaps it was me who misinterpreted the self expression -or her interpretation of it changed through my influence (mirroring).

The gender differences in the BPD experience is an interesting discussion.



Wicker Man

 

[Chynna]

Goodmorning WM, I think that mirroring others is often a welcome relief from BPD misery. But still women & men do have different ways of going about things. My xbf didn't engage in the show of physical strength but he sure was an expert at passive-aggressive painfulness to the point I'd rather prefer a 'swat' (never acceptable) to be done with it! Instead of the noisy, crippling silences, etc. Ya know?

[Wicker Man]

Instead of the noisy, crippling silences, etc. Ya know?

Amen sister.  Yep... .verbal blood and pain... .

There was a strange behavior she had adopted just before we parted ways.  She had taken to poking me with her finger, kind of joking / tickling... .

But, after a while, there was a slight strangeness almost a feeling aggression.  It was also in this time she was testing boundaries of control more than ever.  Looking back our last visit was laden with red flags.

--it was remembering this that made me wonder about the threat of physical violence were the tables turned.  I am glad I was the 190# ex-fighter in the relationship.  I strongly considered, time from time, hitting my head against the wall, but would have never hit her... .  I don't know she could have said the same.

During a rage before we met she tore all the flooring out of her grandparents home with her bare hands... . 


Wicker Man

[once removed]

I was trying to compare pwBPD behavior and their awareness of what they are doing with a child's awareness of wrong vs right but still choose devilish anyway. So maybe pwBPD are not all that BPD 'innocent' as some seem to blame the illness itself... .

i know

the OP was about confessing and how can we feel guilty for our actions.

im saying flip the above point around. if we did things we knew werent right at the time, are we innocent? wouldnt our exes say that given the circumstances, they were self protecting?

I do feel badly about some of my reactions to his nonsense. I didn't think I was capable of that.

i think its less about guilt or innocence, right or wrong, and more about "i found myself in trying circumstances, acted badly, and didnt recognize myself. how can i learn from it going forward, and take what ive learned into healthier relationships in the future?"