Confused if I should stay in contact with possible BPD ex-BF?

[SlothMaiden]

I tried to keep my story in summary but still long since it's pretty recent.

I am almost 30 y.o. Asian woman live in Southeast Asia. I had never been in any romantic or sexual relationship before. I met Liam (made up name), an American-Asian guy, 28, who currently resides in the US, a month ago on dating app. He was very intelligent, charming, compatible with me, from reputable & rich family and he seemed into serious relationship and didn’t care about a slight deformity on my face.

We also bonded over our family issues. He stated that he was the black goat of his family. His father physically abused him.

After I agreed to be his girlfriend, we went official. He told his best friend and his mom and sisters. I felt happy. Later, he confessed that he also smoked pot (illegal in his state) to help with depression.

On our second week, he booked the next day flight because he couldn’t bear to wait to see me in person. He planned to stay for 3 weeks. When he arrived, he was everything a girl could dream of. He was handsome, although he was very short (5”2’) and his voice pitch is higher than usual so I think he got some self-image issue.

The first 10 days went on smoothly, just that he always criticized me and every single thing and he started to get into “clingy phrase”. Once I got into fight with dad and refused to go home. Liam was trying to manipulate me to become “independent woman I fell in love with” by saying my dad manipulated me and the he insulted him that he was dirty rich Asian guy. He went from respecting my dad into cursing him to death.

Liam was mad when I “disobeyed” him all the time. His moods always changed several times within half an hour. He would throw things and got aggressive. But when I didn’t pay attention to him enough, he would always accuse me of not interested in him or didn’t like him anymore.

When we had sex, he seemed emotionally detached. He would go on without foreplay, as my “punishment”. He also pressured me into having sex without condom. I had to take emergency birth control pills twice and he said what I did was “overkill” because he didn’t even cum inside me.

The last straw happened on our last day together (about Day 14). My parents came to the apartment and Liam was mad, almost hitting my dad. Liam thought he got set up and paranoid that his life was in danger.

We made up though and went out at night. Liam got really drunk (although he denied it) at the karaoke restaurant. Started assaulted a lady and then I was accused of defending her. He stalked onto me, talking about nonsense (the only thing I could remember was “why did you choose me? Because I’m a bad boy?”) and when I scooted back and didn’t answer him, he poked my forehead and playfully slapped my face lightly. Next thing I knew, he grabbed my forearm harshly (it left bruises) and then he got thrown out.

Liam assaulted the staffs and then walked recklessly while screaming at me into the intersection traffic like a maniac. I had to call the police to force him back. He then called me the whole night, I never picked up but texted him back that I will talk to him in the morning. He then called my crazy bitch and that he only grabbed me because I was jeopardizing his life and that I didn’t listen to him.

Next day, he just took off and blocked me.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I told my best friend and she suggested I looked up BPD and I thought Liam's behaviors fit.

A week later, he called me from the US (even though he claimed his family and friends didn’t want him to contact me anymore) and asked “are you calm enough now to talk logically? Do you feel good when you called me narcissist on Facebook?”. I was like what the heck.

He didn’t seem to recognize what he did wrong that night. I couldn’t get the fact straight with him. He apologized that he shouldn't have let me get drunk so I acted irrational. (what?).

After an hour of talking, nothing resolved. He still tried to school me on me getting a job and that he didn’t hate my dad. He acted like if I got myself together, he would take me back.

For the past week, he tried calling me at my late night or early in the morning. I feel he doesn’t really care about my boundaries. I told him I was overwhelmed when talking with him on the phone but then he thought that was because the signal was bad.

I haven’t replied or called him back for 4 days now and he hasn’t contacted me since but he unblocked me on Facebook and put up the selfie he took on our last day together that I put makeup on him as his profile pic. I got triggered by his actions and I felt really bad that I was too naive to trust him. The whole thing rush back.

I am in dilemma here. Everyone tells me not to go back to him. Yet, I want to continue supporting him but I already felt scared by the whole relationship. I don’t know if I should just continue “no contact” rule with him to recover or stay “friend” with him and maybe I could tell him to go get help in the US, not just using marijuana to calm himself down.

I am also very anxious waiting if I will get pregnant or get any STI from him too (even though he got tested for HIV, etc. here before we had sex). I’m a mess here!

Thanks for reading and I would appreciate any response. :D

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Turkish]

Your profile says he's been gone 2 months.  Given what you said, I'm glad that you're safe now. 

What are your feelings regarding keeping in contact with him? How do you feel about him after the visit, remote contact, and two months later?

[SlothMaiden]

Thank you, Turkish, for the reply and your concern! I'm safe now, physically.

Sorry I kinda mixed the timeline up in my status. The period we dated online + in real life would sum up about a month before he took off. Then he shut me off for about a week before he started contacting me again. Now it's been 3 weeks since he took off but I haven't returned his calls for 4-5 days now.

My feelings about keeping contact with him? At first when he shut me off, I felt I didn't have a closure. Then I learned about BPD and I think that if he had it, I don't want to abandon him, at least let me be his friend. I want to talk to him but I also don't know what to talk about.

I feel hurt whenever I see his profile because I realize he keeps his distance even though he said he wanna build trust between us again. I am not sure about his "love" to me anymore because he just discarded me and now sees me as a shadow of someone he fell in love with.

How do I feel about him afterward? During our time together, especially the period where I stayed with him 24 hours a day, I felt he was a mastermind, very controlling and unpredictable person. I felt that he manipulated me even though he said he did not. And I always felt like I had to keep my guard up all the time or he would just find something to criticize or that he would burst out and be aggressive again (which reminds me of my dad). I was not happy. I kinda feel relieved when he first gone back.

However, I still feel that he has potential to be better (at doing business, at school or at starting family) but I feel that he would never really take any real responsibility too. I also feel that he doesn't really care about me or my well-being. I feel like I gave more than he did (my effort, my virginity, my culture, my pride).

Wow, so many emotions and I feel all over the places. I'm reading the "Stop the Bleeding" topic right now BTW.

[Turkish]

Read the lessons and take time to reflect and tell us what you think. 

[SlothMaiden]

Thank you, Turkish, for your guidance.

I have to say these lessons are a bit difficult for me to understand sometimes because English is my second language. But I try to read as much as possible, and now processing it.

Here's a quick update on something important that I had reflected on so far.

1. I realized that I don't even know what are my boundaries or values. It's hard for me to identify.

2. My communication skill is really bad. Not only for this relationship but in other relationship too, particularly with family members. I always dismiss (invalidate) their words and judge them. I would also become irritate very easily when they try to talk to me in any circumstance, especially my mother. I'm still trying to find the "triggers" on this.

3. I'm still trying to accept that this relationship is not the same anymore and that my fantasy has ended. I try to just accept that I'm hurt, lost and I have to forgive myself for seeking out something I'm not ready for.

I hope this is what you meant by "reflecting" about it. I'm working on step 3 now. Anyway, if anyone has any opinion, please do comment, I really appreciate your thoughts!


 
SlothMaiden.

[SlothMaiden]

Just another update to keep this off my chest because I have no one to talk to right now.

It's been 6 days since I didn't return his calls. I checked my Facebook and found out he unfriended me although he doesn't block me on Facebook Messenger. I tried texting him and calling him but he still doesn't response yet (the last time he cut off mid-conversation, he said that he was asleep but he didn't answer me until 3 days later and then accused me of being mad at him).

I don't know what is the status of our relationship now and it drives me mad. I don't feel like I'm ready to talk to him yet. But now that I feel he's slipping away again, I am very anxious and feel like I'm forced to do something so we can talk again and clear up some confusion.

BTW, I took a depression test and my score right now is 50. I'm trying to keep it down but seeing that he's starting to cut me off again cranking up my anxiety.

[once removed]

hi SlothMaiden,

this is, admittedly, a lot of turmoil in the early stages of meeting/forming a relationship.

the first step, in whatever path you choose to go, is to stop the bleeding. so if hes ignoring your calls/texts, its a good idea to give him some space, and take some for yourself.

how long ago did he unfriend you on facebook?

[SlothMaiden]

Hi, once removed! Thank you for your response and for moving my topic into more appropriate board. I guess maybe the way I've been doing it is to "better" my relationship with him.

I have been reading through the "Stop the Bleeding" topic and trying to take time for myself too, that's why I hadn't returned his calls since last Wednesday (6 days ago) but then I thought I might drive him away again because I didn't call back?

He isn't very active on his Facebook to begin with. But he keeps tabs on me through it. He just reactivated it on Saturday. Then he put me on restricted list on Sunday and just unfriended me today (Monday). So, admittedly, it's not very long

[once removed]

well, "no contact" or not answering calls is generally a tool for trying to detach from a relationship... .

taking/giving space can, however, be a therapeutic tool for oneself or the relationship, though it can have consequences (which dont necessarily mean that its the wrong thing to do).

cutting to the chase, it does sound like hes pouting, and trying to get a reaction and "show you what for" with the blocking stuff.

the question to me is where you want to go next with this. you dont sound like you want to reach out at this time to him, but understandably, his actions are making you anxious, so youre having second thoughts and considering reaching out, right?

[SlothMaiden]

To once removed,

Yes. I had a second thought and well, I already tried calling him and sent him messages saying the reason I didn't return the calls is that I wasn't ready to talk.

I didn't stop and consider that he's pouting, like you said. And I let my anxiety got the best of me by reaching out immediately. So I'm not sure what to do now. I feel like I kinda misstep or something like that.

[once removed]

in the scheme of things, its not a big deal. you indicated you want to talk.

it may be though, in the short term, that he thinks his methodology has succeeded. its not something you would want to continue to repeat in the long term.

i would take, and give some space now, and get a good nights sleep too. in the mean time, i would definitely continue working the lessons and the tools here, and seeking support. have you considered reaching out to a therapist?

[SlothMaiden]

I'm considering seeing a psychiatrist at my local hospital so I can use my public health care coverage.

A little bit off topic here: There are not a lot of therapists & mental health support here in this country. It's still a stigma and I don't think they have anyone specialized in BPD-related stuffs. I used to bring my sister to a private clinic but the doctor didn't even make any diagnosis and just gave her meds and it's very expensive too.   

[SlothMaiden]

Today I feel a little bit better. I still feel some anxiety and "panic attack" throughout the day but I think it is still manageable.

I have been using the technique to deal with ruminations and it helps me not to have crying fits every hour. When I think of Liam or the resentment about this relationship, I would immediately think "Oh! Chihuahua file is out again!" while pulling at my left ear. My "Dark Era" (grad school & childhood) files also come out too and I just think "Oh that's the past, that's not needed here". The problem with me is it's hard for me to recall good memories haha. So I just use Drake's Hotline Blings to distract me with me doing silly dance every time the song is playing.

Also, for the peace of my mind, I decided to send him another message on Facebook Messenger which still appears that he's not blocking me there so the message still be delivered into his inbox even if he put me on "ignore" list. I do not try calling him anymore and this is the last message I will send for now because I just really want this space to sort myself out. And I realize that I can't control what he thinks or how he feels anyway.

I tried to apply "validation" into my text (since in previous texts, he always said that I avoided talking to him because I was mad or upset at him. That I no longer wanted to talk to him. And that we had miscommunication), it reads:

"Hey, We haven't talked for awhile. I understand you may feel like I am upset at you or ignore you, I would feel like that too. I still want to talk to you and make our relationship better. I miss you."

The reason I ended with "I miss you" because I had no idea what to say that's not me apologizing for having my space away from him. At first I also considering thanking him for giving me spaces but that's not the truth because he didn't, he just gave me silent treatment and I didn't want to reward that.

I still don't get to practice these communication skill much since I haven't talked to Liam yet. I think I will start with my family members first and hope it will improve

Anyway, I would like the feedback about the message I sent if it felt "validated" enough? Am I missing something out? How should I improve?

-SlothMaiden 

[SlothMaiden]

Another update.

I sent him a message just an hour ago and when I checked again, he blocked me on Facebook Messenger already. I need no more confirmation that he's using the silent treatment/blocking tactic. But at least I know he read my message.

Now I just wait it out and try to be much more prepare for this kind of behavior in the future. I will not reinforce this in a long term.

Anyway, now our relationship is like half the time active and half the time silent. It's really frustrating because he's not even my boyfriend anymore and I don't know why I want to do this.

[once removed]

I don't know why I want to do this.

from our article here: https://bpdfamily.com/content/what-does-it-take-be-relationship

Strength: It takes a great deal of strength and emotional stability to be in a BP relationship and not be emotionally injured by it.  A person in a weak emotional state, who feels wounded/abused, or depressed is likely to be consumed by the relationship, confused by the intense rages and idealization, and finding their self worth in decline.  If you chose this path, you've got to be very strong and very balanced.

Realistic Expectations: A person with BPD is emotionally underdeveloped and does not have "adult" emotional skills - especially in times of stress.  If you are in this type of relationship it is important to have realistic expectations for what the relationship can be in terms of consistent respect, trust and support, honesty and accountability, and in terms of negotiation and fairness, or expectations of non-threatening behavior.  It is important to accept the relationship behavior for what it is - not hope the person will permanently return to the idealization phase, not accept the external excuses for the bad behavior, and not hope that changing your behavior to heal someone else.

if you are choosing this path, thats a significant part of whats required. are you prepared to do that?

[SlothMaiden]

Thanks, once removed.

I now learned about what to expect from him. I think if he wanna talk then I'll talk with these realistic expectations in mind. But honestly, I don't think I'm prepared enough to deal with him right now. I suspect I will go down with emotional injury from time to time if I talk to him again. I personally have been struggling with emotional stability my whole life and wanna find some rock in rely on. I recognized that my underlying issues and the need to be accepted as who I am probably sent me straight to him at first place when he idolized me & acted like someone from my dream. So I can't be someone's emotional care taker when I can't even take care of my mental health consistently.

[once removed]

it sounds like youre thinking this through.

id encourage you though, not to go underwater/leave your support group. he may change his mind, you may change your mind... .and we have boards that can serve you now, and in whatever stage comes next, if you decide you want to detach.

[Radcliff]

You are being careful in thinking through what you can handle, and being cautious about dealing with him when you're not sure it's healthy for you.  While you are having space from him, what are you doing to support your own mental health?

RC

[SlothMaiden]

Thank you, once removed & Radcliff for your responses and supports.

For my mental health support, first of all, I will continue to be in this message board since like once removed said, I may need to detach or do whatever next step and I will need all the support. This place is my only main support group right now and I found that I can learn a lot from other people's stories (like, I can clearly see the emerging BPD behavior patterns from those threads). I still have to go through all the workshops and lessons to gain knowledge for future uses too. Especially since I'll go on and date some other guys, I probably should know how to spot the red flags and not going through another relationship like this again by setting my own boundaries at last.

I also have my best friend who's currently going through a (complicated) relationship with the guy with possible BPD as well. So she is the one who I confide in and the only one who understands what I'm going through. I can't talk to my family because they kinda hate Liam now for what he did (as in he's a bad guy who came and hurt me) so they don't care if he has BPD. I tried telling my dad that Liam probably has this disorder but he still thinks Liam is just another scumbag.

I also mentioned that I'll try the psychiatrist at my local hospital. Although I don't expect much.

Anyway, since I practice Buddhism, I used to actively practice Vipassanā meditation before. But I found the Zen way is more suitable for me and practicable in daily life and I got the books written by Japanese Zen monk that I used to read. After I read about being mindfulness here and especially the Radical Acceptance method, I find myself just jumping right back into the practice I abandoned for so long and try to be more "present" than just wallow in the past.

Other ways I support my mental health are exercising and doing some small art projects. I also try to eat more because when I get stressed, I will lose my appetite and eat very little.

[once removed]

all of these things (underlying issues, self-help concepts, healthier dating, learning the lessons these relationships can teach us) are things we discuss on the Learning board, so youll be in good company. ive been out of my relationship nearly 8 years now, and im still learning from it. that may come a bit later, if thats the path you take. personal inventory is usually later stage stuff, this may not be concluded between the two of you, and even if it is, there are wounds that need tending.

additionally, id encourage you to not just read, but post in the threads of others. its one thing to realize there are people that walk in similar shoes. its another to connect with them in real time, to learn with them, to grow with them; to be a part of something bigger than ourselves.

its good that youre thinking through next steps and focusing on you. its critical whether we are trying to improve the state of our relationship, or recovering from it. youve got a solid plan, and we will support you at every step.

[SlothMaiden]

Thanks, once remove!

I know at this point Liam and I probably are not done with each other yet. But my wound has been inflicted even if the relationship isn't officially ending yet so I'll have to be mindful about that.

I started replying to some threads. Just a short reply but I hope they will feel that they're not alone in these situations.

Anyway, another update on my self-care.

1) I already got my period days ago so my pregnancy scare ended at last. Less stress, yay!

2) Yesterday I went to my usual ophthalmologist appointment at the hospital. It finished earlier than I expected so I wandered to the OB/GYN ward and finally got to see the doctor for STI tests and she even did the cervical cancer test too. I'm getting the result next week so I hope I did not catch anything from Liam (even though he always said he did not have it). Hopefully, with negative result, I'll have less stress before my birthday!

3) My birthday is next week and I plan to get myself a cake!

4) We adopted a new Persian kitten 2 days ago. She needed a permanent home and is still in a little bit of bad shape from mistreatment so I'm taking care of her right now. It helps with taking my mind of bad experiences.

[Turkish]

Happy birthday in advance and good luck with the kitteh!

[SlothMaiden]

Thank you, Turkish!  We never have Persian cat before so we're gonna have to read up and prepare to get involve with her a lot! 

[Turkish]

We had two Persians back in the day (when I was a pre-teen),  Ying and Yang, brother and sister.  They were cool cats. 

[SlothMaiden]

Oh, Ying & Yang were great names! I'm really looking forward to have much fun with my cat too. She's really playful and sweet!

Another update. I got unexpected phone call from my ex tonight while I was out with my dad. He called several times. I picked up and told him I'm busy. He said "You said you wanna talk. So you don't wanna talk to me anymore?" ... .same old thing he repeats every time he calls me.

Since I really couldn't talk in front of my dad, I told him I was out and couldn't talk right now and can I call him back later? He said ok dismissively and hung up.

Not sure what to say to him but I already promised to call him back so I'll call him later when my phone's charged up.

I'll try to listen to what he's saying with empathy and not invalidate his feelings if he expresses them.

[SlothMaiden]

Ok I called him finally. And after an hour, I couldn't even speak anything. He first asked me if I have a new boyfriend. I said no. Then he said he didn't believe me. When I tried to ask how was he doing, he just answered something irrelevant, almost teasing me and testing me. Then accusing me of being angry at his joke. He asked me how had I been. I told him I was doing fine. He pressed me to say more. I told him I went to amusement park. He said, "yeah, whatever, I don't care". So I refused to elaborate more but he still pressed for more information. I just told him I had motion sickness after the ride and he laughed about it in very mocking way that he's glad I got sick.

After that, he went onto the incident. Still believing me to be the cause of everything that went wrong. He said I had his 100 dollars so I asked if he wanted it back I'll wire it back to him via paypal but then he just dismissed it. He talked like I was a gold digger that wanted his money. I tried to use validation on my statement but he wouldn't have any of it.

When he asked me about the job, I said I haven't heard from them and I didn't want to do the follow up. He schooled me on that too that it was because of my pride... .and that he just called because I called him first (I called him like 10 days ago then he just called me back?) and that he was still decent enough to check up on me seeing if I want anything from him. Oh so this phone call was all about me and he's a good guy here.

Then things escalated to him using verbal abuses & manipulations, starting from saying that I distorted the facts about the incident at the restaurant and he accused me of being drunk so I behaved that way. When I tried to say I understand what he felt, he just barked at me "no, you don't understand, stop saying that". I tried to ask the reason, he just said he didn't have any legal obligation to tell me about anything especially that we no longer have a relationship now.

Afterward, he accused me of backstabbing him, saying "___ you" and then calling me names, mostly about me being a bitch in several ways. I had enough I said if you called me a bitch one more time I'm not gonna have it and sit here for you to call me names but he kept saying it.

He knew I was gonna start crying so he mocked my crying and insulted about me on so many things I lost count. I was so upset. I tried to call him back and he continued to mock me and hung up several times and just imitated me crying saying  bitch over and over. Then he hung up and didn't pick up my call again.

At the point I know I couldn't continue to interact with him and this is the end. I sent him my last voice message saying that he seemed he didn't want to talk to me anymore so I will not call him ever again and said goodbye. Mostly for my benefit that this is the end for real.

I cried so hard after I sent the message out so I called my best friend (the one who knew about BPD) and told her everything.

So I'm just here to say that I have decided to end this stage and I'll start to detach from this relationship. I couldn't stay friend or be with someone like this, even if this is his devalue phrase, the abuse is too much.

I already blocked him on every communication channel I had with him except Facebook because he blocked me first so I can't find and block him.

The question is, after this, should I start my new thread on the Detaching board?

[once removed]

yikes, SlothMaiden.

im sorry you had to go through all that.

The question is, after this, should I start my new thread on the Detaching board?

certainly it is hard to see where there is any room to reconcile or build on this. there arent really any tools when it comes to how you might have dealt with a person behaving that way.

the choice to detach is one we cant make for you, but you are certainly welcome to open a thread on the Detaching board at any time, and we will support you if you choose to. if anything changes, the Bettering board will be here for you.

[SlothMaiden]

Thanks, once removed.

Those phone calls from last night were the worst I have received so far. The first one he called after he left my country for a week was a lot friendlier and he still saw me as "white". But when I gave myself a space away from him, refused to pick up his phones, he now thought of me as "black", there's nothing in-between.

He even said I was schizophrenic. When I asked him to explain why he thought that, he just told me to read it up myself. But I know he thought I distorted the reality of the whole situation and made him into a bad guy. He did not think grabbing me harshly and talking down to me were wrong at all. Well, the strangers who witnessed the whole thing will say otherwise but that's not the point now.

And he admitted that he was very high from smoking weed as we were talking and said even with marijuana he still felt bad and couldn't recall how he was in love with me before or something like that (I couldn't really remember because I was in defensive mode already).

I'm going to post on Detaching board soon. I think it's the best for me. Especially that this relationship was new and I didn't invest much energy into it. Besides, it's a long distance relationship so I don't see any way I can reconcile with him physically too.

[Radcliff]

Slothmaiden, I'm sorry for the pain that you're going through.  Being mocked and ridiculed hurts so much, and despite that, the decision to end a relationship is never easy.  We're here for you, and will keep an eye out for you here and on Detaching.

RC

[SlothMaiden]

Thank you, Radcliff. This website & everyone here have been a huge part of my now self rediscovery. It turns into something way bigger than this r/s. 

If anyone is interested in how I used resources to go through detachment processes, I've posted a new thread on Detaching board here:

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=331329.0