Breakup - Need Help/Support/Understanding Trying to cope. Is this normal?

[Nala2020]

I need to know that other people have experienced something similar and need support for how to navigate these emotions I'm having of hurt, anger, sadness and confusion.

My G of almost two years has been diagnosed with BPD, which I didn't realize until recently.  The first 8 months of the relationship were mostly blissful (I was told how wonderful I was constantly).  Starting about 8 months in and for more than the last year, things have been chaotic.  I was always wondering what I would do next to trigger her (could be not responding to a text within 15 minutes or didn't respond with the right words).  I kept thinking things would change (naively).

My G said that she needed a break at the end of the May while I worked on my issues (apparently, I am controlling, negative and nagging to her).  This was right when we were supposed to be starting couples' counseling and finally had gotten her to agree to go.  We didn't talk for almost 2 months and no counseling.  Then, my G reaches out and says the breaks over, that she loves me, misses me and wants to get married and start our life together.  She demands to move in with me immediately - within 30 days or we're over.  I said that I didn't think that was a good idea and that we need to do some amount of couples' counseling before we made that step (at least 6 months, I thought) and improve our actual relationship first.  She thought moving in with me would solve the issues.  I didn't think it would - but I suppose the security of it would have helped her insecurities some.  I debated about that.

She didn't like that at all, but was willing to hear what I had to say.  We were planning to meet in person to discuss around the middle of August about what I thought we needed for us to move forward.  From the middle of July through the middle of August, we still kept in touch with her repeating to me constantly that she loved me and I was the one for her.  We scheduled our day to meet around our schedules (we live in different cities, so weekends are only option) for 8/15.  We met, she got angry before we barely got started and left.  But she had been drinking (which is another problem), so we were going to try again on 8/29 with no drinking for her.  But before we met, she got angry with me (I was immature and needy) over something small (I called her too late in the evening - which was inconsiderate) and she cancelled the meeting and said she only wanted to be friends.  That was 8/24.  I didn't respond.  I thought I would just write everything down and give it to her because when we tried to talk, she would get too angry.

Yesterday, she posted on FB that she is in a new relationship and that she has never been this happy and she adores this new person.

Help - is this behavior normal?  I rationally know I should have gotten out of this relationship when the chaos started, but I didn't understand BPD then and of course I loved her and because of my own insecurity I didn't set proper boundaries.  How could she go from asking to move in one minute and that she loves me and wants to marry me to being happy in a new relationship in a span of two weeks (obviously, could have been going on longer)?    

[DJACJ5]

That all sounds typical BPD.
I also think that you *did* have some boundaries, particularly about pushing back on marriage when there were obvious issues.

I knew nothing about BPD in my relationship, but reading the stories here, and learning more on other sites, lots of things now make sense to me.

They feel emotions intensely, so when they focus their live on you, it's not easily forgettable. I suspect there might be an addiction-like change to their partners' brains !

Breaking is tough, really tough, but others here have travelled the same path.

Look after yourself - you can handle it!

[Nala2020]

That all sounds typical BPD.
I also think that you *did* have some boundaries, particularly about pushing back on marriage when there were obvious issues.

I knew nothing about BPD in my relationship, but reading the stories here, and learning more on other sites, lots of things now make sense to me.

They feel emotions intensely, so when they focus their live on you, it's not easily forgettable. I suspect there might be an addiction-like change to their partners' brains !

Breaking is tough, really tough, but others here have travelled the same path.

Look after yourself - you can handle it!

@DJACJ5 - thanks for that support.  I normally don't have issues with break ups (not like this).  It's just seems surreal almost.  It's like a dream.  It was literally less than two weeks since she said I love you.  She acts like that was completely normal to ask to move in, say I'm the one for her, and then two weeks later she's completely moved on, enough to post it on FB (sometimes I hate FB for things like that - it's almost immature).  We were friends for 8 years before we dated, so I didn't delete her off FB (never really do delete people) - we have lots of mutual friends.  The most bizarre part was that she didn't give me heads up, but of course, she knows I'm going to either see the post or hear about it.  She continues to "like" stuff on my page last night like we're just still friends.

I think I'm the one who has gone "crazy" in relative terms now!  I am in a constant state of bewilderment and then I am trying to sort through what I actually did wrong vs. what I was told I did wrong and piece it all together.

[Goosey]

Well sounds normal to me though then again I’m posting on this site.
  Upside down world.  It gets slowly more understandable as n/c  gets longer. They move on to the next person. I used to worry about my ex partner, now I understand she is very savvy on getting the partner she can use.
 She’ll be fine.
 

[DJACJ5]

Nala, you're not going crazy. You *are* re-evaluating things which had a significant emotional impact on your life.

In my case, I thought I actually had a pretty good relationship before I decided to break up. I was actually pretty much finished grieving the loss of a partner, and her family (my parents are dead), when I learned that I'd gone from irreplaceable marriage partner, to discarded trash within days.
Suddenly, the nearly finished grieving was back to square one!
This time, I was grieving the loss of the entire 1.5 years of the relationship, as I realised it wasn't a true relationship to both of us.

So many memories had to be reviewed, and seen in a new light, making me feel like a gullible moron each time.

I've learned to process them like a spurned lover cutting their ex out of photos - I take good memories, say, getting a massage, and admit that I don't know what she was thinking or feeling, but nothing can invalidate the fact that it was pleasurable for me.
So, I no longer have a memory of "us" being "close", "special" etc., but I do still have a pleasant memory I can cherish.

Again, hang in there. One day at a time. You *will* heal!

[once removed]

welcome to the family, Nala.

i found this place many years ago when i was going through a similar situation - my partner at the time of three years jumped into another relationship after telling me she was falling in love with me all over again. it was one of the hardest times of my life, but its ancient history now. it does get better.

while none of us can diagnose, i think theres a lot we can all identify with.

what youre going through just really sucks - theres no way around it. it is bewildering.

is it normal? ill put it this way: there really are people out there that are this insecure and impulsive.

one of the first things i did when i came here was read this article. its a good place to start, in understanding what you have been, and are going through: https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/surviving-break-when-your-partner-has-borderline-personality

this happened to you yesterday, as you mentioned, so things are fresh, and raw. it will hurt, and it will bewilder, and it may do so for a long time. in my experience, it even got worse before it got better - expect this - but know that it really does get better. youll need a strong support group. i know of no better place.

[Nala2020]

Nala, you're not going crazy. You *are* re-evaluating things which had a significant emotional impact on your life.

In my case, I thought I actually had a pretty good relationship before I decided to break up. I was actually pretty much finished grieving the loss of a partner, and her family (my parents are dead), when I learned that I'd gone from irreplaceable marriage partner, to discarded trash within days.
Suddenly, the nearly finished grieving was back to square one!
This time, I was grieving the loss of the entire 1.5 years of the relationship, as I realised it wasn't a true relationship to both of us.

So many memories had to be reviewed, and seen in a new light, making me feel like a gullible moron each time.

I've learned to process them like a spurned lover cutting their ex out of photos - I take good memories, say, getting a massage, and admit that I don't know what she was thinking or feeling, but nothing can invalidate the fact that it was pleasurable for me.
So, I no longer have a memory of "us" being "close", "special" etc., but I do still have a pleasant memory I can cherish.

Again, hang in there. One day at a time. You *will* heal!

I just don't know why it hurts so much - I was the one who told her she couldn't move in immediately when she asked recently.  That was my decision.  Now, I didn't know that if I didn't give in to that, that she would move on to someone else immediately - within 2 weeks (or decide to commit to someone that she was obviously already talking to).  I know I wasn't happy in the relationship, but now I keep second guessing myself, wondering what I could have done differently for it to have turned out another way or if maybe I contributed to the chaos in some way.  I know I probably shouldn't have let her move in, but then I find myself questioning if I should have let her temporarily just to have seen if that would have made things any better.

For example, I am a pretty trusting person.  I'm not jealous or insecure in a relationship typically.  However, once she started questioning me about everything (including accusing me of kissing my cousin - she acknowledged this was because of the sexual abuse she endured by a family member), it made me start wondering why - if it was because of her insecurities or if it was because she was doing something herself.  Not too long after the accusations started, I caught her in a lie about a previous relationship of hers, which she then admitted to (I only cared that she lied about it).  Then, I had lost some trust and I think it caused me to question her several times throughout the relationship and I did act insecure after that sometimes.  She would always then tell me I needed to work on myself with God to find inner peace instead of questioning her.

When she had asked for a break in May and we didn't talk for 6 weeks, I was starting to do better by myself than with her.  I thought I was going to be able to move on easily.  I didn't have a lot of hope in the relationship and thought I was preparing for this.  Then when she reached out in July to work things out - I came right back around.  Although, I started to research BPD to educate myself and I wanted to make it clear that we needed to start counseling before she moved in.  I truly didn't understand the depth of how her sexual abuse in her childhood impacted her.  She told me that she had been sexually abused but she never told me the details and I didn't want to pressure her.  I just found out today that she was abused by multiple family members (she posted it publicly today) when she was around 10 years old.  I should have been more aware and hypersensitive to her trust issues and should have tried to learn more about what happened to her.  I travel so much normally for personal and work, and just didn't tolerate any of her accusations well when I would travel - would tell her that she was overreacting because I wasn't doing anything wrong, which I wasn't in reality.

So, is it my fault that I wasn't understanding enough of what she was experiencing or should she know that she has these insecurities and be working through them before being in a relationship?  She says that the flashbacks from abuse stopped a few years back and that she's forgiven her abusers, but the insecurity is still very much there (always wondering who I was texting and saying I didn't set appropriate boundaries with people).

When we saw each other in August for the first time in a few months - I think I'd forgotten how much I enjoyed being around her.  We had such a great day - but then when it came time for the serious conversation, we just couldn't do it.  Was the same communication again.  I get nervous and freeze because I'm always afraid I'm going to say the wrong thing and set her off.  Apparently, I did that anyway.  She stormed off and started texting me for hours about how everything was my fault.  Then the next morning she said she realized she was too harsh on me, but that things needed to change.  We saw each other one more time after that.  I tried to talk to her but she wouldn't.  I called her later that night and she accused me of being needy.  Then a week later, she says she is in a new relationship.

I just feel so caught off guard.  It's not like I had great hope that things would change, but I thought we'd at least get the chance to talk about it before I just got blindsided like this.  I was still holding out slight hope that I could get something to work - I don't know why I'm so devastated.  Was more than the first time when we took break and I wasn't sure if it was over.  The idea that she is with someone else so soon really hurts - it feels like I was cheated on in some way.

Also, I wasn't ever really sure in the relationship if she was with me because she loved me or if she was with me because I could provide safety and security for her.  Sometimes I never felt like she "saw" the person I really was.  I felt like she was in love with me sometimes for all the wrong reasons and that she didn't love me for the things that I loved about myself.

I'm just so hurt and confused and now she's moving on happily while I'm here dealing with the fallout and emotions.

Thanks for listening.

[Nala2020]

welcome to the family, Nala.

i found this place many years ago when i was going through a similar situation - my partner at the time of three years jumped into another relationship after telling me she was falling in love with me all over again. it was one of the hardest times of my life, but its ancient history now. it does get better.

while none of us can diagnose, i think theres a lot we can all identify with.

what youre going through just really sucks - theres no way around it. it is bewildering.

is it normal? ill put it this way: there really are people out there that are this insecure and impulsive.

one of the first things i did when i came here was read this article. its a good place to start, in understanding what you have been, and are going through: https://www.bpdfamily.com/content/surviving-break-when-your-partner-has-borderline-personality

this happened to you yesterday, as you mentioned, so things are fresh, and raw. it will hurt, and it will bewilder, and it may do so for a long time. in my experience, it even got worse before it got better - expect this - but know that it really does get better. youll need a strong support group. i know of no better place.

Thank you.  I found this board recently when I had found out that my G had BPD and I still had some hope that we could make things work.  This new development has completely caught me off guard.  I assume that while we were on our break starting in late May/early June, she met this new person and started talking to them.  My G did tell me in early August that there was someone else interested in her who had been pursuing her and that while she would rather be with me and have the life we talked about, but if we weren't going to work and I was serious about the relationship (moving in), she wanted to pursue that possibility with someone else.  She said it in a text when she was was angry at me and drinking at the time - I asked her why she was considering or talking about other people when we were trying to work through things - the next day she apologized and said she would strive to do better.  I just thought she was using that as a threat, like she had before.  I never knew if her threats were real and over time, I started not to believe them.  She broke up with me any time she was upset over anything and then the next day pretended that it didn't happen.  I thought this was just like those times.  I had no idea there was actually someone else this time.  I didn't take it seriously.  I still thought we were trying to work through things.  Apparently, she wasn't bluffing.  Although, I don't understand why this other person would want a relationship with my ex/G when she also knows she was just in a relationship (apparently this other person has also been diagnosed with BPD according to a friend who knows her).  It all sounds like something from a move and so much drama.  I think I've even gotten used to the drama to some degree and had even started to somewhat "like" or at least tolerate negative attention.

I just know my friends are tired of listening to me, but I feel like I'm living in a bad dream.  I can't eat/sleep/anything and I'm mostly mad at myself.  I almost called her last night.  I know she would take my call, but then what's the point - she's moved on and I should just get on with it and not be that pathetic person trying to talk to her.

[brighter future]

Hello, Nala. I'm sorry to hear about the breakup with your ex and the pain that you're feeling. All of her behaviors sound like typical BPD behavior to me.  I compare sudden and traumatic breakups like this to the sudden death of a family member. They are devastating to say the least. I went through something similar with my ex-girlfriend back in April of this year who is believed to have BPD.

We dated for nearly two years (have known each other for 20 years) and were close to getting engaged. I had bought her a ring this past February, but couldn't break down and do it because of her refusal to face her severe emotional issues. Like your ex, she was sexually abused at a young age by a family member of her father's and had a difficult home life throughout most of her childhood. She entered counseling during our relationship and quit going after 3-4 months. Throughout the rest of our relationship, she stated that she needed to return to counseling as things from her childhood were haunting her but never did return.

The last 4-5 months of our relationship she put a lot of pressure on me to get engaged. I wanted to but said I felt like we needed to address some personal issues before taking that step. She came to my home back in April and burst into tears then gave me the "either we get married or I'm out" ultimatum. I stated that I very much wanted to be married to her, but the personal issues had to be addressed first as marriage would only further complicate them. She disagreed and said that counselors don't work for her, she was fine, and this is just the way she is. As she was walking out my door, she said "You know what you need to do to get me back" meaning give me an engagement ring.

We talked for two weeks on and off after the initial breakup and discussed trying to work things out. I last spoke with her on a Tuesday afternoon, and she asked me to contact her in a couple of days. I contacted her the following Friday and got no answer. When i heard back from her the next morning, she informed me that she was on a date the previous night. Come to find out, it was her rebound man (old high school friend) that she had an affair with after she left her ex-husband. After she and I had dated a month, she told me about this relationship saying that it was unhealthy and inappropriate. She also stated that she broke things off with him to start dating me. Ultimately, when I didn't give her engagement/marriage, she discarded me and went back to this guy. They are still seeing each other over 4 months later, and I've heard that she's now hitting him up for marriage. I was told second hand that he's not interested in marriage, and she told a family friend of hers that she started seeing this guy so quickly after me because she "has a lot of problems being alone" due to insecurity. Oddly enough, I got a social media ping from her two days ago even though I have removed her from all of my social media. My counselor said that this is "bait" to see if I'll bite and to check on my availability. It's been close to 4 months since there's been any contact until that social media "ping" from her, and my counselor said please do not take the bait.

In closing, I wanted to tell you this will get easier as time passes. Going no contact with my ex has helped me tremendously, as well as weekly counseling sessions and spending time on this forum. I still think of her frequently and the wonderful times we had. However, after being out of this relationship for nearly 5 months, I can see all of the red flags so clearly now. I should have set better boundaries and should have taken those red flags seriously while I was in the relationship. Please consider some professional counseling for yourself. It really does help get you pointed in the right direction.

Best wishes and take good care of yourself.

[Nala2020]

Hello, Nala. I'm sorry to hear about the breakup with your ex and the pain that you're feeling. All of her behaviors sound like typical BPD behavior to me.  I compare sudden and traumatic breakups like this to the sudden death of a family member. They are devastating to say the least. I went through something similar with my ex-girlfriend back in April of this year who is believed to have BPD.

We dated for nearly two years (have known each other for 20 years) and were close to getting engaged. I had bought her a ring this past February, but couldn't break down and do it because of her refusal to face her severe emotional issues. Like your ex, she was sexually abused at a young age by a family member of her father's and had a difficult home life throughout most of her childhood. She entered counseling during our relationship and quit going after 3-4 months. Throughout the rest of our relationship, she stated that she needed to return to counseling as things from her childhood were haunting her but never did return.

The last 4-5 months of our relationship she put a lot of pressure on me to get engaged. I wanted to but said I felt like we needed to address some personal issues before taking that step. She came to my home back in April and burst into tears then gave me the "either we get married or I'm out" ultimatum. I stated that I very much wanted to be married to her, but the personal issues had to be addressed first as marriage would only further complicate them. She disagreed and said that counselors don't work for her, she was fine, and this is just the way she is. As she was walking out my door, she said "You know what you need to do to get me back" meaning give me an engagement ring.

We talked for two weeks on and off after the initial breakup and discussed trying to work things out. I last spoke with her on a Tuesday afternoon, and she asked me to contact her in a couple of days. I contacted her the following Friday and got no answer. When i heard back from her the next morning, she informed me that she was on a date the previous night. Come to find out, it was her rebound man (old high school friend) that she had an affair with after she left her ex-husband. After she and I had dated a month, she told me about this relationship saying that it was unhealthy and inappropriate. She also stated that she broke things off with him to start dating me. Ultimately, when I didn't give her engagement/marriage, she discarded me and went back to this guy. They are still seeing each other over 4 months later, and I've heard that she's now hitting him up for marriage. I was told second hand that he's not interested in marriage, and she told a family friend of hers that she started seeing this guy so quickly after me because she "has a lot of problems being alone" due to insecurity. Oddly enough, I got a social media ping from her two days ago even though I have removed her from all of my social media. My counselor said that this is "bait" to see if I'll bite and to check on my availability. It's been close to 4 months since there's been any contact until that social media "ping" from her, and my counselor said please do not take the bait.

In closing, I wanted to tell you this will get easier as time passes. Going no contact with my ex has helped me tremendously, as well as weekly counseling sessions and spending time on this forum. I still think of her frequently and the wonderful times we had. However, after being out of this relationship for nearly 5 months, I can see all of the red flags so clearly now. I should have set better boundaries and should have taken those red flags seriously while I was in the relationship. Please consider some professional counseling for yourself. It really does help get you pointed in the right direction.

Best wishes and take good care of yourself.

brighter future - thank you for taking the time to respond to me so thoughtfully.  I'm feel like I'm an emotional wreck right now, but reading responses and posts from people like you are definitely helping me process.  I do have a counselor of my own, so we have our sessions every Thursday.  I started seeing her in January of this year for two primary reasons: (1) to encourage my girlfriend to go to counseling - she kept saying that she would go and I thought if I showed her I was willing to go (she has a big thing about fairness), that might help push her along (it didn't), and (2) to talk through some of my relationship stuff that I couldn't talk through with my girlfriend because of the instability.  Of course, everyone has things they can work on for themselves also (I have anxiety and some OCD type behaviors).  I just felt like I was always spending all my spare time juggling the emotional roller coaster of my relationship, that I didn't have time for anything else.  There was always some problem that necessitated serious talks on the weekends (we live about 40 minutes a part and mostly saw each other on the weekends) because of something I had done.

Your situation sounds really familiar and similar to mine.  Next month would have been two years for us (have known each other for more than 10 years).  We were very close friends for most of the 8 years before we started dating; although, we had not been as close to each other leading up to when we started dating.  I think the fact that we were close friends before dating made me put up with things that I normally wouldn't because I know deep down she is a wonderful person and I had seen it first hand for a long time.  When she is stable and happy, it's like she's a happy kid - everything in life is great and she can be so caring and wonderful to her partner and to friends, and especially to dogs/animals, and that version of her is infectious to be around.

When we started seeing each other I had no idea about the abuse or her past trauma (I generally knew she had a rough life - she lost both of her parents by age 9 - I didn't know about the sexual abuse or the extent of it) and I certainly didn't know about BPD.  I also haven't been in that many relationships, so I don't have a ton of experience.  I also didn't realize that she was still hung up on someone else when we started dating.  She had been having an affair with someone who was married for two years (granted, she wasn't the one cheating, and I'm not judging, but that's just what happened).  The person kept telling her that they were going to leave to be with her, but never did.  So, eventually they split up, but I strongly suspect my girlfriend wasn't over that person when we got together.  I didn't find out about that relationship until around 10 months into our relationship, but she initially lied about it when I asked - only to come clean a few weeks later.  She had generally mentioned the abuse, but I didn't know until today that it was 3 different people and 2 of which were close relatives.  I've never been in relationships with people with these types of traumas.  So, when she would get jealous over things I thought were minor, I would get mad and tell her she was overreacting, which is obviously not the way to handle that with someone with BPD.

The first let's say 8 or so months were great, but she didn't want a committed relationship at that time, and I didn't push it.  She did hint that she wanted to get married and have kids, but wasn't ready at that time for a serious relationship.  But, all of a sudden about 8 months in, she said she wanted to be in a committed relationship with me, that she loved me, and then immediately wanted to know when she could move in, when we could get married and how soon we could we have kids.  It all threw me - I wasn't prepared for the sudden switch, and it wasn't that I didn't want those things, it just seemed sudden.  Looking back, I'm wondering if she was holding out hope for the person before me, and then eventually realized that wasn't going to happen.  Then, the next thing I know, she sends me a list of expectations, one of which was that she wanted me to pay her a spousal/monthly salary for doing more around the house than she did (I work a lot and would have been the primary provider) and she wanted that to start before she even moved in with me.  I pushed back and that didn't go well.  From there, everything started to unravel and there was hardly any stable periods after that - a week or two at a time, at most.

It started with jealousy (I was flirting with someone she thought and wouldn't admit I liked them) and then there was a really violent episode in June of last year where she pulled a knife on me.  I left at that moment.  We talked about it later and I agreed to continue seeing her if she would acknowledge she had an anger issue and do something about it and that I would leave if something like that ever happened again (she said she wouldn't blame me and that she would never actually want to hurt me, which I know is true when she is stable).  She could mostly control the anger when she wasn't drinking (but she drinks every night).  She did stop drinking for a while, but then I let her slide right back into drinking.  I also think the shame of what she did caused her to lash out at me more.  She also said she would start counseling.  Apparently, she did some counseling when younger.  There was always an excuse (new job - waiting for insurance benefits, then she didn't think her insurance would pay, didn't have time, didn't have the money even though I offered to pay and then it became that God was alone enough to help her and she didn't need actual counseling).  We tried couples counseling - she went for one session and wouldn't go back.  When I would bring it up again, she would say she didn't need a counselor to teach her basic common sense communication - that I needed to get help first.  I think my going to counseling actually made things worse because when she would get mad she would tell me that was just another thing I needed to work on with my counselor.

She always said I wasn't ready for a serious relationship because I wouldn't let her move in.  I had told her that I wanted her to move in, but that I honestly was a little scared because she didn't have control of her anger (she said I was being negative and mean and that I needed to have more faith in God) and that we needed to work on our communication and be able to get along for at least a few weeks at a time without some major episode.  She claimed that moving in would solve our problems - we would be forced to work through them and could go to other rooms when we had a disagreement.  I do actually think things would have been better if she had moved in because it would have made her feel more secure and that I was serious about her (she needs to feel safe) - but I just didn't believe it would solve the other stuff and I was worried about my mental sanity with having to deal with things in my own house all the time.  Maybe I was wrong and I should have let her try it out for a few months just to see how it would have worked before I gave up?

The longer that time went on, the more she pushed to move in and accused me of not being ready for a serious relationship.  Although, she completely ignored all the episodes that happened when she would lose control of her temper and blame it on me because of something I did that started it (I constantly was being disrespectful to her she thought).  Sounds like your relationship with your ex wanting you to propose and ignoring everything else.  There was never another "major" episode, but in January just when I thought things were better, she pushed me over a table because of jealousy issue with someone that she wouldn't let go - out of the blue.  Yes, I know, I should have left, but I kept holding out hope.  She did start going to church and doing Bible studies, and she has become much calmer in the last three or four months.  The triggers are still there, but she reacts in a milder way now - still not ideal, she still makes demeaning comments.  I started to withdraw and I know she could feel it, because I felt helpless and I couldn't talk to her about it.  I didn't know what to do and still thought I could get her to counseling.

Then, she wanted a break.  After a short break, she wanted to move immediately.  When I still said no, that we needed to work on our issues first, she said we could talk, but before we talked, she cut off communication and started this new relationship.  I actually know the person (well, know of the person).  The person was with someone I know well for 5 years until recently.  I don't know if it's true, but I'm told the new person my ex is with also has BPD (was around domestic abuse when young, recently recovering alcoholic, does the push and pull in relationships, wants to be engaged one minute and then doesn't want to talk the next), but I don't know them personally, so no opinion on that.  I'm sure my ex and this new person were talking before my ex officially ended it with me, and then when I couldn't give her what she wanted, she moved on.  This new person already has three kids and is prone to have people moving in fast, so I likely think they'll move in together soon, and then my ex will have the family she thinks she's always wanted.  I'm just left feeling confused and mad and wondering how I could have done this differently.  How do I even know if she was with me because of me or because of what she wanted?  I'm some part relieved and some parts incredibly hurt and now I have to suffer through this while imaging her with someone else.

I'm trying to stay calm, but it's hard.  I almost called her last night - some part of me wants to talk and have closure, but what's the point, and am I that insecure that I would actually considering wanting her back?  I don't know how I'm feeling or what I want.  I'm normally such a rational person!

[Nala2020]

One more thing - when someone with BPD pressures their partner to let them move in or to get married, does that actually solve anything, or once that happens, are there new demands?  Does anything make them feel secure?

[DJACJ5]

My partner had been married twice before. She told me the first marriage imploded (or failed, can't recall her exact word) on the wedding night, with a huge fight, and the 2nd was 18 years of domestic violence.

In her case, I think marriage was a trigger to the engulfment part of BPD, and made it much worse.

[grumpydonut]

Hi Nala,

No, it doesn't solve anything.

Think of people with BPD as a bucket with holes in it. You want to fill (complete) them, so you give into their demands, pour your love in again and again in the form of doing everything you can for them. At the end of it, you still have an empty bucket.

People with BPD have internal issues that they wrongly believe they can fix with external stimulus (relationships, sex, drugs, shopping sprees, etc). But this never works.

Also, I understand the question to be really "did me not letting her move in cause this. Is it my fault?".

The answer is yes, you not allowing her to move in did cause her to act this way. Is it your fault? NO. If it wasn't this issue, it would have been something else. Thus why to be classified as someone with BPD that person must have a history of unstable interpersonal relationships.

[grumpydonut]

Let me clarify.

You not allowing her to move in did cause her to do this, in this instance. But if you have into this demand, there just would have been another later. Unless you are willing to be a doormat, it's very hard to satisfy every demand of a BPD partner. And then when you do, they still might leave due to fear of engulfment. Leaving you as a partial version of who you truly are.

You set a reasonable boundary. And she responded replacing you. That tells you a lot about who she is at her core.

[Nala2020]

Let me clarify.

You not allowing her to move in did cause her to do this, in this instance. But if you have into this demand, there just would have been another later. Unless you are willing to be a doormat, it's very hard to satisfy every demand of a BPD partner. And then when you do, they still might leave due to fear of engulfment. Leaving you as a partial version of who you truly are.

You set a reasonable boundary. And she responded replacing you. That tells you a lot about who she is at her core.

The one thing that stands out is that she was in a 14 year relationship (that ended in probably 2013 - we started dating in 2018).  So, I can't figure out how that was maintained for that long?  They had long periods of relative calm.  I knew them when they were together and I've talked to the other person who was with my ex.  Now, the other person in the relationship was much better at setting boundaries than I am (I eventually set one, but I gave in a lot too before that) and I know they had their issues in their relationship (my ex pulled out a baseball bat out at one point early in the relationship and they separated for a while), but generally I think they maintained relative calm for years at a time.  So, I don't understand how that happened. That's the anomaly.  I know that eventually they got into a fight and my ex was asked to move out.  My ex will freely admit that she is the happiest when she lives with someone and is in a "married" type of situation because she says she wants to be the care taker.  I know she craves that perceived safety and stability.  Every relationship my ex had since 2013, up to, and including our relationship was chaotic and aligns more with what I am understanding about BPD.  At first I felt like I was blaming her and BPD for everything that went wrong or just looking for reasons to make it her fault - but I just couldn't make sense of her demanding to move in or we were over to going to a new relationship just 2 weeks later.  We had been together for almost 2 years (and known each other for 10), so I understand on some level why she thought I wasn't willing to move forward when I still wasn't ready for her to move in at the 2 year mark (I would have been but for everything that happened), but I don't understand how she saw that as some magic fix or didn't understand that it was reasonable for me to ask her go to counseling with me before moving in.  The other reason I didn't let her move in is that while a lot/the majority of our fights were when we were apart, there were still fights when we were together (she'd say over at my house, we'd have a great evening, and then she would wake up and see something in the room, maybe something that was given to me by an ex that had been there for years, that would set her off into a frenzy, then the anger would crop up and she would storm off and leave without any type of conversation).

[Nala2020]

The other thing that I struggle with is - I know now that if I'd known she had BPD all along, I could have been more mindful in how I approached things/responded, but I usually responded in ways that made things worse because I couldn't understand why she wasn't being rationale.  I tried to talk about facts and that just made it worse - I was being defensive to her and not validating her and her anger escalated.  That said - I know I could have avoided certain incidents by learning some things to say or not say, but would that have made a big enough difference?  Can you manage a relationship with a BPD by awareness and learning DBT techniques on your own or was I just wasting time being hopeless because the BPD person will always find something no matter what?

I just can't believe she actually left the relationship just like that (more so because we've been friends for so long before we dated).

[grumpydonut]

Nala,

I know it's difficult. Allow yourself to process the pain and the loss of a loved one.

You just said that she took out a baseball bat on her ex. She creates chaos when she sees things from your exes.

This isn't someone you should invest your love into. I know it's difficult right now, but you will see that you are better off without someone like this in your life.

Wouldn't you prefer to be treated with respect, and have a mutual love and understanding, rather than living in chaos, confusion and with the knowledge that your partner could replace you in an instant? BPD partners do not love like you love. You can't move on in five minutes, they can.

You deserve better. Everyone does.

[Nala2020]

Wouldn't you prefer to be treated with respect, and have a mutual love and understanding, rather than living in chaos, confusion and with the knowledge that your partner could replace you in an instant? BPD partners do not love like you love. You can't move on in five minutes, they can.

You deserve better. Everyone does.

Yes, of course I would, and I do know that I deserve better. 

I'm just struggling to understand the emotions of it (even rationally knowing what happened).  I think the hardest part is that we were friends for 8 years before, and the dating relationship for 2 years, the bond was strengthened further. 

I've never enjoyed being around anyone as much, laughed so much with anyone, had that connection with anyone, ever (when it was good at the beginning and fleeting times in between).  I just miss that.  She said the same thing about the connection - that it was the deepest, most complete connection she had ever felt (no clue if that was real for her).  She wrote me these amazing letters.  It's just hard to believe that what she said wasn't real.  I know I was naive, but I really kept thinking she would go to counseling either with me or individually, she kept saying that she thought counseling was a great tool and that she thought everyone should go to counseling and that she would like to stay in counseling for the rest of her life, but never would commit to go (she'd take steps, like printing the paperwork, but that was it) - every time we would be close to going, she would find a reason to get mad at me and say I needed to work on myself first.  I know it was unhealthy, that's why I didn't let her move in (I did stick to that one boundary), but I lost my best friend and my partner all at once, and we share all the same friends.  I just can't make sense of it all.  Reading on here does help.

[Nala2020]

It just seems so sudden to me - I just can't understand someone saying I love you more than anyone I've ever known and I want a life with you, then they break up with you right after that - fast forward, 2 weeks later, I'm with someone else now and so very happy without so much as a word.  It's like it never happened at all.  She did call me earlier this week, but I didn't answer, perhaps to tell me about the new relationship before it was posted on FB this week.  Then, on top of that, even after the post on FB to establish this new relationship, she keeps "liking" my posts like we're still just great friends.  I'm not going to delete her off of FB, but I did hide her posts from my feed.

I know I sound like so many other people on here, and I know I also sound desperate and clingy, but I just have never felt like this before or so confused over how she could throw away the connection we had or why I couldn't figure out to interact with her in a way that worked.

[DJACJ5]

Nala,
one thing which comes through clearly in your posts is that you are rational and logical, and that you are seeking understanding on that basis. (Me too!)

However, BPD means that a person is driven by emotions, strong emotions, and the emotions constantly override and overwrite any logical or even sensible thoughts. People suffering from BPD are almost in a constant state of panic, similar to a drowning person who will illogically push their rescuer underwater.

If you are as rational as I believe from what I've read, can you accept the fact that your ex's brain is wired so differently to yours that you are not capable of modelling her thought processes, and that you probably will never understand "why" regarding her, as she probably doesn't have a "why", only an overwhelming primal "must do this now!"

I really feel for you, as I struggled to understand why, why, why in my relationship. Now I'm able to accept that it just happened, and that it will never really make sense to me.

I'm focusing on holding on to the good memories, and hope you soon are able to find your way to a better place than you are now.

Regards,
DJACJ5

[Nala2020]

DJACJ5,

Yes, I can accept that my ex's brain is wired differently.  I just wish I would have been able to have understood that sooner instead of thinking that her behavior was overreacting or ridiculous.  It would have at least saved us both a lot of turmoil.  I recognize that I couldn't have made it all go away or all different.  I guess I also just wonder if it would have made a difference if I would have known sooner and could have handled differently.  Could I have made enough of a difference in the way I handled the situations to make it peaceful enough or was I going to have to live like that forever?

[JNChell]

They are very fragile. They can become violent, but I believe that this is because of a comorbidity. I talked to a gal on here and she said that her husband had nothing but BPD. She said that he acted like a child and was in treatment. He wasn’t violent or manipulative. He had problems with depression, but he didn’t cause the problems that are talked about here. Most of what we talk about are comorbid things.

[Nala2020]

how old are you? This is totally violating policing.

I'm not sure I understand, what is violating policing mean in this context?

[JNChell]

Man, you just seemed really young. Just wanted to give proper advice. Sorry if I was off base.

[grumpydonut]

Nala, you definitely do not need to apologise ever for feeling clingy.

I remember when I was devalued and discarded all I wanted was a hug - and even asked her for one (the woman who had been abusing me for 9 months). Losing love sucks. It's a terrible feeling, especially when you believe you've found the ultimate connection.

In the months after I was replaced by the man she cheated on me with, I found myself questioning everything. "Could I have done something better" "is it my fault" "am I crazy" "did I cause her actions" etc etc. The answer was ultimately yes and no. But the yes isn't meant to be a gun to the head or blaming you! It's more "BPD is a mental illness that features a fear of abandonment, and that fear was always going to be triggered at some point". And what you usually find - from the stories I have read - is that the relationships that last the longest with a person with BPD are with the partner that never sets boundaries - which isn't healthy!

My ex partner's fear was triggered by little things like me not doing exactly what she wanted, or suggesting we develop seperate hobbies so we're not spending every moment together all the time!

I'm sorry you're going through all this. It is hard, especially when you're analytical (which you appear to be).

We are here We will read you and try to be support!

[Beth2468]

The other thing that I struggle with is - I know now that if I'd known she had BPD all along, I could have been more mindful in how I approached things/responded, but I usually responded in ways that made things worse because I couldn't understand why she wasn't being rationale.  I tried to talk about facts and that just made it worse - I was being defensive to her and not validating her and her anger escalated.  That said - I know I could have avoided certain incidents by learning some things to say or not say, but would that have made a big enough difference?  Can you manage a relationship with a BPD by awareness and learning DBT techniques on your own or was I just wasting time being hopeless because the BPD person will always find something no matter what?

I just can't believe she actually left the relationship just like that (more so because we've been friends for so long before we dated).

Hi Nala.
I can identify with so much of what you have written. From what I have read, the pw BDP has to have an awareness of their disorder, and want to change. Even then, if their partner puts applies all the strategies it is still incredibly hard and often doesn't work.
I know there are things I could have done differently but the end result (us breaking up) would have been the same eventually, longer down the line and my recovery would take longer. From some of the posts on here I think I was lucky he left when he did.
You can't be emotionally responsible for two people. Neither should you have to be. You shouldn't have to always put the other person's needs, thoughts, feelings ahead of yours.
You said that you are struggling to make sense of it all, that is normal in this situation and it is very fresh and raw. Also, it is not possible to make sense of this disorder, although our logical minds keep trying.
Be kind to yourself and take it a day at a time, or an hour, 5 minutes, whatever you need.
My ex moved on within a month and 7 weeks after leaving me he got engaged to her.
Try to think of your ex as a 5 year old child.  Unable to deal with the pain of you abandoning her she has had to find someone new.  She had to paint you black in her mind in order to cope. Your wounds will heal in time, hers will not.
I am still talking in circles to myself, 8 weeks on, things are  getting easier.  Although yesterday and today I have been really missing him, although I don't want him back - I am definitely not over him yet.
I tell myself that his feelings for me were real to him, at the time.  I appreciate the good times we had and I'm happy that I don't have to deal with the bad stuff any more.
Hang on in there and look after yourself.  Also, your good friends will listen to you, even if they have heard it all before.

[Nala2020]

Nala, you definitely do not need to apologise ever for feeling clingy.

I remember when I was devalued and discarded all I wanted was a hug - and even asked her for one (the woman who had been abusing me for 9 months). Losing love sucks. It's a terrible feeling, especially when you believe you've found the ultimate connection.

My ex partner's fear was triggered by little things like me not doing exactly what she wanted, or suggesting we develop seperate hobbies so we're not spending every moment together all the time!

Thank you.  I don't think this would be easy for anyone to go through, but the thing I keep coming back to is that we have been friends for 10 years, and very close friends for the 8 years before we dated.  I considered her to be like "family" to me even before we started dating.  Then once we started dating, she was most certainly my family.  I just thought things moved quickly with us because we'd known each other so long (like when she started talking marriage a few months in, I wouldn't have normally thought that was normal, but given that we already knew each other, I thought it made sense), but I had no idea that could be because of something else.  The last text she sent me in August she said that she still loved and cared about me, and always would, but she just wanted to be friends again at some point in the future.  So, now that she's moved on so quickly, she is acting like we're just friends like we always were, and I'm sure she would expect me to be happy for about her new relationship (I'm not - maybe I will be more selfless one day and actually be happy for her).

She actually in her mind, I think, thinks that I caused her all of the pain and that we didn't work out because of me - that I was stringing her along when I told her I wanted the same things she wanted (marriage, kids, etc.), but then still wouldn't let her move in after almost 2 years because I thought we should work on our issues first.  In her mind, I wasn't ready for a serious relationship and had lied to her.  She called me hysterically crying in August asking why I had done this to her when all she wanted was a life with me.  I didn't take her that seriously at the time and couldn't understand why she was so upset with me.  I've never threatened to leave her.  Now that it's over, I keep wondering if I should have just let her move in and see how things went.

Regarding what you said about triggering, the first things I ever noticed in the relationship were with small demands.  I was staying at her house a lot in the beginning because I can work remotely more than she can.  Sometimes I would stay at her house for 4 or 5 days at a time before coming back to my house.  She started in on me that I wasn't doing enough of the chores around her house, that I should be taking out the trash, doing laundry - essentially doing 50% of the chores at her house since I was there most of the week.  Not that I minded doing chores, but I had my house to also look after too, and I just thought that was a really odd thing to be that upset about/picky about that early into the relationship.  When I pushed back a little - she said I was selfish.  When I was there, I was working too.  It's not like I had all day to do things around the house.

Regarding a hug - I have almost called her twice and sent her texts this week tell her that we need to talk and I need to understand how she could have done this, but I've stopped myself every time.  I do think she'd actually meet with me, but only to tell me more about her moving on.  Maybe that would give me closure, but then would it make me feel more pathetic for having caved in and let her know that it got to me? 

One of the other things I blame myself about - I have extreme situational anxiety (hardly noticeable to anyone but me or unless you are dating me).  When the pandemic started, I was being on the far extreme conservative side - having everything delivered, only going out for drives - then I occasionally started going out to play golf and seeing friends in outdoor, backyard environments.  I wanted to have a conversation with my exBPD about how she was doing things to make sure I was comfortable being around her (because we don't live together) - that made everything fall apart.  She said that I was being controlling by asking her what she was doing, how dare I question her and then she also said that if I loved her, I wouldn't question her and my anxiety wouldn't keep me away from her no matter what.  On some level she might be right, but I didn't understand why we couldn't at least have a conversation about it to make me more comfortable if she did in fact care about how I was feeling.

But then there were moments where she could be the kindness, most giving, sweetest person you've ever met.

[Nala2020]

From what I have read, the pw BDP has to have an awareness of their disorder, and want to change. Even then, if their partner puts applies all the strategies it is still incredibly hard and often doesn't work.

You can't be emotionally responsible for two people. Neither should you have to be. You shouldn't have to always put the other person's needs, thoughts, feelings ahead of yours.

Try to think of your ex as a 5 year old child.  Unable to deal with the pain of you abandoning her she has had to find someone new.  She had to paint you black in her mind in order to cope. Your wounds will heal in time, hers will not.
I tell myself that his feelings for me were real to him, at the time.  I appreciate the good times we had and I'm happy that I don't have to deal with the bad stuff any more.

Thanks, Beth.  That was very helpful.

I'll give you an example of something that I could have done differently.  One of the things that we used to fight about was how much/often to talk on the phone (all of our fights were over dumb stuff like this).  My ex is not a phone person.  She would have been content to talk on the phone once a week, even when we didn't see each other on the weekend, and maybe a few texts throughout the week.  I am a phone person, but I didn't expect that we would talk all day or even every day and I tried to respect her lack of wanting to talk.  So, as a compromise, I asked if she would either call me or send me a text before she went to bed every night just so I knew she was okay - or just some type of brief communication every day.  She said yes, but then later, was mad that I had asked her to compromise (again, I was being controlling).  The thing that always bothered me more than anything was the hypocrisy - she was always asking me to compromise or sacrifice something, and also, if I didn't respond to her texts within 15 minutes, I was doing it on purpose to punish her, whereas she might not text me back for 2 days, and if I asked about that, she would blow up.  There was such a double standard.

Anyway, I had been telling my ex that I needed her to try to talk to me when she started to feel upset about something before letting it upset her to the point of anger and no coming back.  She agreed.  So, the next time she started to get upset about the phone issues - she texted me one night that she'd call me before bed and I responded that was great, but if possible, could it be before 10 pm.  Apparently, that hurt her because she thought she was being such a good gf by even offering to call me and that by me putting a stipulation on the time, I was not just appreciating how much of an effort she was already making.  I actually remember when I sent the text, after I sent it, that it would probably upset her, and that I should have said, "that would be great if you can call me before 10 pm, but if you can't, then we don't have to talk tonight and we'll just talk tomorrow when it's convenient for you."  Sometimes, I knew that what I was doing might possibly set her off, but I did it anyway thinking, surely I'm wrong and also because I really did want to talk to her.

So, she for once, instead of exploding, took 3 or 4 days to put together a "talk" for me about how much she didn't like the phone.  We sat down (on the phone) on a Saturday afternoon for her to walk through her presentation about how she felt.  Honestly, I didn't truly appreciate how much this meant to her (she said later it was a huge deal because she actually listened to what I said about coming to me first before getting angry, and that she had thought about it and prayed about it and that she had never put that kind of energy into communicating without getting upset as she did with me in this instance) and that I didn't take it seriously enough (I was listening but multitasking, which was true).  I didn't agree with a lot of what she had to say in her talk because I thought she was making assumptions on how I was feeling (or didn't think she was stating facts correctly) and I started to get frustrated because I feel like she was never listening to what I actually said.  In hindsight, if I'd known about the BPD, I should have just listened and validated her, and then waited until another time to bring up my own comments.  Instead, I listened but then I started to ask questions about how we could compromise and tried to correct some of the things she said - I didn't realize that this was me invalidating her.  Maybe if I'd understood that, I could have helped us both?

The other thing I wonder sometimes - was/am I actually too needy?  I've never thought of myself as too needy, but maybe I am.  I know I'm not from the perspective of wanting too much of someone's time or having to be around them all the time, but I wonder maybe if I'm too emotionally needy.  When I would be upset about something - I would want to call her and talk to her about that, and often times she would say that while she was happy to listen to me some, that really I should be happy just turning to God and that I shouldn't rely on her for emotional support all the time - that I should just be able to rely on myself and God without needing anyone else.  I don't know if I "need" anyone else, but I sure wanted the emotional support from her.

I do wonder if her feelings were real at all for me.

[once removed]

The other thing that I struggle with is - I know now that if I'd known she had BPD all along, I could have been more mindful in how I approached things/responded, but I usually responded in ways that made things worse because I couldn't understand why she wasn't being rationale.  I tried to talk about facts and that just made it worse - I was being defensive to her and not validating her and her anger escalated.  That said - I know I could have avoided certain incidents by learning some things to say or not say, but would that have made a big enough difference?  Can you manage a relationship with a BPD by awareness and learning DBT techniques on your own or was I just wasting time being hopeless because the BPD person will always find something no matter what?

i dare say that virtually all of us have struggled with this/these question(s).

its not unlike the parents on the Son or Daughter board.

"if only id known then what i know now".

im many years out of my relationship now, and i can tell you, matter of fact, that i could have been a better partner, and i could have improved things. thats both in general, and with a better understanding of bpd.

i can also tell you that im no longer the man i was at the time - that the relationship represented where i was at the time - and that ultimately, my ex and i simply werent meant to be, and thats something that (it took a long time) i eventually came to peace with.

it may both help and hurt to hear that bpd is not why you broke up. for sure, it was a major presence in your relationship, and in its struggles (you loved a person who was clearly difficult, and your relationship would always have struggled), and its going to help you to understand that, as a factor. all the same, it was also a major factor in why you were attracted to her, and what made the two of you click.

but it was never the end all, be all. there are members here who have been in their relationships for decades. some of those cases are healthier than others, to be clear. but bpd is not what makes or breaks it.

it also wasnt about letting her move in or not. the relationship was broken long before that. both of you, i suspect, had to some degree grieved the relationship, and trust had seriously deteriorated. impulsive propositions are just a hail mary, from a hurting and desperate person. its a little bit like if i were homeless and i told you that if you just give me 50 dollars to rent a hotel room for the night, ill be okay.

ideally, we all want to understand what went wrong in our relationships, and what our role was in that, and use those lessons when it comes to moving on to the next relationship. thats a worthwhile goal, and i encourage you, as you detach, to do so; it will bring you understanding, and better luck in life and love. i also know how hard it is when everything is so fresh and raw. its virtually impossible to separate "i could have done better in this area, and that will be useful to me in the future" from "i failed, im bad, its my fault the relationship ended, its my fault shes sailing off happily ever after, theres something wrong with me".

you want to do the self examination, but take your time in it. its stage three of recovery. youll revisit these questions many times, and your answers, your narrative of how things broke down, will change.