Adult child

[Shinta]

BZpD not been formally diagnosed. Our LO is in denial but for over fifteen years, my husband and I have struggled to find  a balance or meaning in our relationship.

No matter what we do, we can never do right.

I want to learn to create boundaries so there is some safeguard and peace in our own ( about to retire) lives while continuing support for our child.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Resiliant]

Hi Shinta,

Welcome to the group!

Boundaries can sometimes be difficult, especially if they are something new to our loved ones.  If it is a new boundary that they aren't used to there is a really good chance they will fight it.   The important thing I believe is to set realistic boundaries that you can stick to.

Have you seen the workshops about boundaries under Tools: Workshops?

Are there particular boundaries that you would like other members to weigh in on?

R

[Shinta]

Creating boundaries and breaking patterns

From the blame, raging, manipulative phase, she has emerged into a new phase.

The stressor could be: this: she has a job for the first time in her life ( we pay for her condo and car and cell etc) but since she is making some money, we stopped our weekly allowances.

The new phase is where she is  overtly soft and gentle.!but, extremely extremely extremely passive aggressive to the extend it has taken us a year to see this new pattern.

She makes promises, writes  brilliant emails with candor and amazing insight, makes appointments to meet is or call us or FaceTime us but Never shows up. Never follows through. For the last three months she has made numerous dates to FaceTime but she drops the ball. If we call her, she texts back. In five minutes, just finishing up something, May I call back in a few? Polite, always polite: but, she is yet to pick up the phone.

She made us drive nine hours straight to pick her up to come home got a few days( as she said she needed a break) but was not in the apt when we drove up and we couldn’t find her hit five hours:

Her future plans with housing, care for her pups ( she left them with us), her Heath issues are in a limbo and obviously we are eager to talk it over and help her but she is playing games with us by sabotaging communication with us,

We see this issue passive aggressive pattern now.

This is our (My husband and I) position: we wish to avoid conflicts and we care too much: So, we kept forgiving her.

Now, it is clear she is using “ sabotaging communication” as a way of controlling us.

How do we break this cycle?
Where do we start?

[Sancho]

This seems like a really unusual situation. Do you know where she is employed? Have you seen her in the past 12 months and if so how did she seem then? Has anyone moved in with her?

The change is pretty dramatic and it would be good to have facts about her life now to see if the change links to any concrete change in her living situation.

[Shinta]

Yes, we know where she is employed. I’ve seen her name and picture on the company website.

She has come home  a few times, for weekends etc,  but she tends to be very secretive and only gives us partial truths so we tend not to ask her too many probing questions.

Just since  Xmas alone, she has made over a dozen apts via text to talk “ about my future plans” as she puts it/ but she is yet to actually make a call. It is peculiar this switch and bait strategy - i don’t know why she does that or what she gets out of doing this.

It’s exhausting. It’s frustrating.

We want to keep the focus on the real issues  at hand-  and not get caught up on these shenanigans, but she seems hell bound on making this process as challenging as possible.

[Sancho]

If you call it out does she get angry then? For example, if you texted 'So far you have made over a dozen appointments to discuss your future plans, but you have not once called. We are available on these days at these times this week to discuss this. We will let you know what times are available next week.

I'm just wondering if you have called it in some way and what her response was?

[Shinta]

Thank you for your interest in this very confounding situation for us.

1. I’ve called her out on it.
2. I’ve nicely asked why she does this since it is in her best interest to communicate.
3. I’ve emailed her about the importance of following through with her promise as the issues we need to discuss are time sensitive.
4. My husband has even sent her an email saying that talking to us is an invitation for us to help her or else she may not like the decisions ( re : her pups or her condo lease extension or help with a move or help her rent another place etc etc),


( she has emailed us to say how  sorry she is and how she understands that she must come off as a flake and will certainly not do that again- ) but goes right back her to get old ways abs nothing changes.

I’ve wondered if she was using substances and hence this bizarre behavior but there have been no other signs- she is keeping up with her forty  plus hour work week.

It’s rude and disrespectful at best and cruel at worst-, my husband wants to just cut her off- he feels that this is her passive aggressive way of estranging  herself but I’m still at a loss to understand the behavior.

[Sancho]

You have certainly tried calling it out many times it seems - but no change. Have to say that some sort of substance use did cross my mind.

This is a really unusual and difficult situation for you. Has she used marijuana to your knowledge? I wonder if anyone else on this site has experienced a BPD son/daughter going from the raging mode to this type of interaction?

I would have thought passive aggression would be difficult for someone with BPD - the emotions are raw and trigger easily. The dots don't really seem to join up without some other factor.

If you know what you think the way forward from here is, could you just email that to her and give her a timeframe to respond?

You must be so frustrated . . . . .!

[Shinta]

Thank you, Sancho.

Until this unusual change, she has,  for fifteen years, expressed many many classic features of BPD.

During covid,  she says she is getting CBT help on line( “to cope with her anxieties “- she has never admitted she has anything the matter with her before - the world has been wronging her the whole time).

1. If true, is this the cause of the change in her Pattern of behavior?

 2. Is there a friend or a significant male “ companion” advising  her?


Either way, my husband and I have made  this 2021 resolve.

If she reaches out, we respond.
If she doesn’t, we ignore her and make  our own plans to move forward. She will have to take it or leave it.

For the past fifteen years, we have tried hard to stay above a (entirely unnecessary and uncalled for) tortured relationship with her ( by her choice).  It’s been punishing.

May be, this is our opportunity to heal from it and  take care of ourselves.

What say you?

[Resiliant]

Sounds like a good plan, Shinta!

R

[Swimmy55]

Good Plan and I suggest think through what you need for the part of the plan "If she reaches out we will respond".  What will this look like so you are not at her beck and call with her not following through with the reaching out?
Some suggestions:
 
Respond to her reaching out with  a healthy dose of lowered expectations.  Again, for the reason that you are not setting yourselves up for " this time the text will lead to something different". 

Maybe even resolve to not meet face to face for a while until she can carry through on meeting virtually with you.  This way you are not wasting another day of chasing her down. 

Put in some protections for you , your feelings, your time, etc..

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Shinta]

Great suggestions, resilient.

You are right but we needed to hear the sage-wisdom again and again. Thank you..

Onward...

[Shinta]

Thank you, Swimmy 55.

I’ll tattoo your words on my fore head. Much needed suggestions and advice.
Thank you,

[Sancho]

Both 1 and 2 could be possible. If 2 then the mystery is why the secrecy etc.

I think your plan to move forward is good and if it were me, I would probably move forward by email and in a formal manner ie

Email 1: We are looking to have our plans sorted in the next 3 months and would like to start by getting your input in relation to your plans. If you could just answer these questions we can move forward in our discussion:

(Insert the questions you want answers to)

If you could let us know by xxxxxx that would be a great help.

If date passes - one or two weeks after -

Email 2

We are getting closer to our deadline now so thought we would outline our plans:

a
b
etc

We will move ahead with this plan but hope to hear any comment from you by xxxx

_________________________________

I suppose what I'm saying is that if you find a way to give deadlines and to state what your plans are, it might open up the reasons for the change - so you can join the dots better.

Just a thought . . . . . .

[Shinta]

Sancho,

this is what we were hoping to accomplish with a back and forth dialogue on the phone, however, given her extreme reluctance to talk on the phone, I am sure your idea of laying it out in an email in a strategic manner is a great idea.

It gives us time to recalibrate ( even if nothing else changes).

I'm thankful for this forum and your help. Happy to return the kindness in any way I can.