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Author Topic: I'm back and struggling a little  (Read 2004 times)
Carguy
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« Reply #30 on: January 18, 2021, 11:20:17 PM »

Thanks Khibomsis!

When I first got there and asked if we could talk she said sure but as we sat down to talk I could tell she was still very angry at me. The way she would respond and her body language said it all. As we continued to talk I could see her eventually starting to ease up. As she would bring up other things though I could see her starting to get angry about those things. I just practiced empathy and some active listening and it seemed to diffuse things. By the end her anger seemed to have dissipated. We even hugged before I left. I think this is a good place to leave things. Now I can give some space and heal. It will be hard but I think it will be easier for me now where things are at. I feel like she doesn't hate me now and/or see me as completely bad. I can do this! I just need to keep telling myself this and focusing on other things like my projects. :-)
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khibomsis
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« Reply #31 on: January 23, 2021, 06:49:03 AM »

It gets easier Carguy. One day, even one hour at a time does it. And when she doesn't want to go into therapy it makes it difficult to believe the relationship would ever change. You could be doing the last five years over and over again, rinse, repeat. At least that my prognosis based on what we see on these boards.
What has changed is you. I am delighted to see that you have learned your lessons well, and that your mastery of the tools made a difference. I find even using the tools with other people (Nons) makes a huge difference to my interactions. I guess that is the blessing of BPD.
Still,  better to leave it there, on a high note. Because without treatment the next dysregulation is just round the corner. You don't need that.
What are your projects? Me, I'm painting the house and fixing up all those little dangling screws and loose ends. Nursing a BPD sure takes time from life stuff!
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Carguy
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« Reply #32 on: January 23, 2021, 02:32:12 PM »

It will get easier. Right now it is quite hard because I do miss her quite a bit still. She actually is a pretty incredible girl. The dysregulations are the hard part. I do have to say though, when she is angry at me, ignores me, and gets angry if I try to say anything to her, she still really isn't a mean person like some of the stories I've read. She never really insulted me or tried to tear me down. She has huge trust issues with others and a lot of typical BPD Behavior but underneath all that she really is a very caring sweetheart.

Another hard thing is I truly believe she wants to get better. She is undiagnosed and although she is aware something isn't right, she doesn't know exactly what it is. My therapist was the one that pointed out what it was to me. All the reading I have done on it, she meets pretty much all of the criteria. She believes she has social anxiety. She has bought many self-help books, goes to a retreat every year, and has gone to therapy. A few years ago she was going to therapy and I would go for some of the sessions with her. We broke up and apparently she quit going to that therapist. Eventually she started seeing another therapist but the last she told me several months ago, she quit seeing that therapist Last Summer. She had to pay for it out of pocket and could only afford to go once a month. She has been going back to school in psychology as well.

I really have changed! I have learned so much and even though I have my moments, I have learned to have more patience. To actually put myself in her shoes and see it from her point of view. To gain better understanding of things. It really does help me so I don't take it personally. Her and I even talked about that.

Yes, I think leaving it on a high note is good. It helps me to feel better about things. I will continue to work on myself. Where things are on a good note there is a possibility she might reach out to me. If she does I will be friendly and caring but I believe I need to be cautious as well.

As far as my projects, I have too many. LOL. Right now my main project is a hot tub. I picked one up from a co-worker last month and have ordered the parts to get it going. I'm looking at having a concrete slab poured and then move the hot tub on to it and set it up. Over the course of the summer I am going to build a building around it so it's all enclosed. By the time it is done it will be really nice. This spring I'm going to get back to work on my 69 Cougar and get it ready to drive. I've had it parked in the garage for years and miss driving it. Also this spring I need to start getting my little farm ready to replant. After that I have several other projects like finishing my basement and my garage among others. I keep myself pretty busy. :-)

Also I have been getting back to working out and weight lifting. My Scottish Highland games competitions begin in April and I am very much looking forward to that. I absolutely love the atmosphere! The people are awesome and very supportive and it is a very fun atmosphere! I am so glad I found this and started competing!:-)
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khibomsis
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« Reply #33 on: January 24, 2021, 10:27:55 PM »

Dear Carguy, if they weren't sweethearts we wouldn't put up with the moods, would we now ? Smiling (click to insert in post) Not a day goes past without I think of how my beloved expwBPD has inspired me to do better, and be better in this world. I am a stronger person because of her, and have more faith in my ability to surmount just about anything.
Your hot tub sounds delightful! Looking forward to hearing how it goes.
Yes, working out is my salvation too. Don't know how I would get by without it.
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Cromwell
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« Reply #34 on: January 25, 2021, 10:13:06 AM »

Hi CarGuy,

I hope this is not too off-topic, but ive found recently a lot of enjoyment in watching on youtube car restoration videos, are you involved in any of this? Its strange, I find it relaxing to watch and I imagine id quite enjoy doing in practice also. Keep up with the hobbies and maybe try new ones too, its working the brain into a different level of focus. Good to hear you keeping on track. Crom
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Carguy
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« Reply #35 on: January 25, 2021, 11:04:45 PM »

Khibomsis,

Good point! Reading some of the stories on here though, I feel fortunate that she wasn't as mean as some. There were bad times in this relationship too, however. I do feel myself missing her a lot though. It is hard.

That is one thing I have read in a few stories as well. Even with the pain we feel, being with a BPD person teaches us a lot as well. I can honestly say I believe this relationship has helped make me a better person today. I still have a long ways to go however.

I am excited about the hot tub. I think it will be fun. It will be nice to soak in after a competition. My youngest son is excited too. He wants to soak in it after his football games. :-) As far as working out, I need to discipline myself better to do it every night. My competitions start in April so I need to really get to it! I want to throw further and higher this year. I want to beat my personal bests from last year. :-)

Cromwell,

I actually do. I do collision repair/refinishing for a living and have a few of my own projects. I have done frame-off restorations in the past for other people and right now my big project in my shop is my 73 Mustang. I have it taken apart down to a bare shell and I am currently sandblasting it. When I get done with it I am going to paint it black and I want to put the 5.0 coyote and the 6 speed trans out of a new Mustang in it. Cars truly are my passion in life. I find it very therapeutic and relaxing. That's what I have always been good at.

As far as keeping on track, I am struggling with that. I did see her today and said hi. I guess I was feeling a little weak and told her I enjoyed talking to her the other day ( when we had that big talk a week ago) and that if she wanted to hang out sometime again I would be open to it. She told me "Sounds good."

She may have been telling me this to get rid of me but I think she was actually in a hurry because her lunch break was almost over. I guess I could look at it that she isn't angry at me like she was in the past. When she was angry at me she would have responded very angrily and told me she wouldn't or something to that effect.

Afterwards I questioned myself for saying that to her. I know I planned on staying away and I felt like I failed that. I guess I just need to take it one day at a time or even one hour at a time like Khibomsis said.
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khibomsis
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« Reply #36 on: January 26, 2021, 06:35:14 AM »

Carguy, don't be too hard on yourself! Guilt is such a useless emotion. We all backslide a little now and then.
I am not in a position to go NC because I am committed to a certain amount of caretaking. If I could go NC I would because it is always easier to become friends after a good period of NC. As Zenmaster Once Removed would remind us, we have to go through the grief. You missed her and wanted to speak to her, but you also wanted relief from the grief, not so?
Still, with time I find it gets better. I am beginning to discover what a nice person I am and understanding why she loved to spend time with me. Am really enjoying dipping into the pool of myself when I can, it is abundance. Maybe that trick will work for you too?
Painting my bathroom eggyolk Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #37 on: January 26, 2021, 04:25:13 PM »

Hi Carguy,
Cars truly are my passion in life. I find it very therapeutic and relaxing. That's what I have always been good at.
I hear you, it comes across to me when you are doing the work that you are "in the zone" so to speak?
Dont have to think much, sort of situation?
She may have been telling me this to get rid of me but I think she was actually in a hurry because her lunch break was almost over. I guess I could look at it that she isn't angry at me like she was in the past. When she was angry at me she would have responded very angrily and told me she wouldn't or something to that effect.

Afterwards I questioned myself for saying that to her.

Sounds like the interaction led to a lot of thinking, trying to figure out. Is this just a one-off or do you notice a pattern. Its just a bit strange to me because I notice when you talk about cars you come across as relaxed and when it is about the relationship its like fear and anxiety comes across, uncertainty. Sort of what id expect if you asked me to sandblast a panel for the first time Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) but after doing a few and then more, I reckon id get the hang of it.

I was 3 years with my ex, and each day felt like first day amateur, well the strange thing is, first 2 months felt as if I was an expert without having any reason to be.

Thanks for letting me share, also it took me a long time to get over my car attachment and I wish Id kept all of them, a few have became now classic high demand collectibles - VW mark 2 Golf and Peugeot 205 gti, but they are good memories I sort of forgot completley about you have "restored" them just by talking Smiling (click to insert in post)
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Carguy
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« Reply #38 on: January 27, 2021, 01:44:56 PM »

Khibomsis,

Very true. The thing I feel the most guilty about is I left work and pulled out onto Main Street. As I was going down Main Street a block from my work I seen her parallel parked on the other side of the street getting out of her car . A little while later I came back through and she was still there so I pulled up behind her but I wasn't sure what store she was in. I was pretty sure she was in the office supply store I was parked in front of so I sat for a few minutes debating what to do. Finally I seen her in there  getting ready to come out. I got out of my car and waited on the sidewalk. She said friendly like "Hey what are you up to?" I told her I just wanted to say hi and let her know that I enjoyed talking to her and catching up a week ago and if she wanted to I was good with hanging out again. I felt like I should not have stopped. I felt like I was being desperate. I'm sure she felt that way too. I feel stupid. I felt like I need to just disappear at that point. In our past  there have been times that she has told me she was glad I reached out. I guess I was justifying to myself at the time that I was reaching out to let her know I was okay with hanging out again. I was missing her a lot and deep down wanted some relief from the pain I was missing her and  being with her.

I know you're right about no contact. Last summer when she was so angry and negative towards me I went no contact for 2 months. She did not see or hear from me at all. I stayed completely away. I was surprised at how much it changed things. She went from being negative and cold to willing to talk and even wanted to get back together. I know I need to just go no contact again and work on my own stuff. It is hard. I miss her a lot and miss being able to talk to her.

Egg yolk will be bright and cheery! I've been Clearing off the one side of my yard with my little tractor and getting ready to have them come give me an estimate for concrete. It's getting kind of exciting! :-)

Cromwell,

You are very right about the difference of me working on a car versus relationship. When I am working on a car I feel calm and confident. I enjoy what I'm doing. I know my abilities and my skills and have faith in what I'm doing. When it comes to the relationship I question myself a lot. I question everything I do and wondered if I'm making it worse for pushing her away more. Fear and anxiety take over. I struggled a lot with anxiety. I don't have near the confidence that I do with other things when it comes to relationships. I also start feeling lonely and wonder if it'll be like that for the rest of my life. My logical side knows I can attract another woman. Last summer when we were apart and she wasn't talking to me I had four different women at one point interested in me. I must have some attractive qualities to the opposite sex. But I am rather shy when it comes to talking to girls I am attracted to. It's a struggle.

 There is a pattern with this relationship. She has always been the one to break up with me and almost all the time I have been the one to Chase. Very rarely has she been the one to reach out. When we are apart I struggle with my fear and anxiety of losing her completely. My logical side says that I should just live my life and not worried about it but my emotional side struggles.

I still have my car attachment. The cars I have I have had for years. I really do enjoy them. Yeah those cars are getting to where they are collectible now. It's funny to think that some of the cars when I was a kid are now getting to be collectible. That wasn't that long ago either!
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Lucky Jim
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« Reply #39 on: January 27, 2021, 02:00:53 PM »

Excerpt
I was missing her a lot and deep down wanted some relief from the pain

Hey Carguy, Right, which is why so many of us (including me) have engaged in recycles, often numerous times, only to end up in the same place farther down the line, except with more pain.

LJ
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    A life spent making mistakes is not only more honorable, but more useful than a life spent doing nothing.
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khibomsis
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« Reply #40 on: January 27, 2021, 03:12:59 PM »

Yup LJ, one would think it gets easier with every recycle but it doesn't. Look, ultimately it is up to us how many recycles we permit. I believe we allow recycles until we learn whatever it is we went into the relationship to learn. if the person doesn't come back we find another one just like them to re-enact whatever psychodrama it is we were going through. until we ourselves are healthy.
I hold on to the thought of becoming the person she was attracted to in the first place. Somewhere I feel I lost myself in the mix and I look forward to finding that person again. Grief is natural, when it comes I let myself feel it but hey, it is just an emotion. Can't kill me.
Went deep today I think it must be the paintfumes ...
Carguy maybe time to talk to therapist about if you might have any abandonment issues?
Not meaning to imply you should date again while you are still not over her, but I have a female cynicism about my gender. I find it hard to believe that you are not beating them off with a stick. Red blooded able bodied male your age will never stay single for long.  Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post) Laugh out loud (click to insert in post)  
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Carguy
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« Reply #41 on: January 28, 2021, 02:55:13 PM »

LJ,

I can see this. In fact, when we started talking last August I was a little reluctant to be in a relationship again. I gave it another try when she wanted to be back with me and it still hurts when it ends again.

Khibomsis,

You have a good point on recycling until you learn. It is truly hard when you still have a lot of feelings for this person. Like you I hold on to the thought of becoming the person she was attracted to again. I guess for me I want to feel wanted.

I have actually talked to my therapist in the past about my abandonment issues. Recently we started working on those things again. It stems from my relationship with my mother. When my ex BPD and I were together, my therapist and I would work on ways to better a relationship. When we're apart though I start focusing on my own stuff. Recently we're dealing with my animosity towards my mother again. I have huge abandonment issues and even talked to my ex BPD this last time about how deep they really ran.

Haha@paint fumes. I always joke that that's what's wrong with me. Spending all these years doing collision repair and refinishing I have been around paint fumes so I blame it on that. Lol

Sadly dating in my area is kind of hard. It's rural, there are few activities to go to to meet others, and there are more single guys than there are girls. Thank you for the self-esteem boost though! :-)
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khibomsis
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« Reply #42 on: January 29, 2021, 01:23:51 AM »

Dear Carguy, abandonment issues are the worst. I am sorry you are going through them! They are the most awful things, kept me in my first marriage years past its sell by date. It is a good thing that you are getting a chance to work through them in therapy. I smiled at your pattern of working through couple things when the two of you are together and your own issues when you are apart. Maybe it would make it easier for you to think of this time on your own as a privilege? As time that you have to sort out your issues. B53 advised me to let go of baggage, and when I think of the mountains I carried into my last relationship I can perfectly see why it ended. One would think that my expwBPD had enough to deal with without still having to handle my dysfunctions. So trying my hardest to take responsibility and declutter. Like oatmeal for breakfast it is plain fare but wholesome.

Yeah, paintfumes are legal drugs Smiling (click to insert in post) Am busy filling in cracks and sanding. Nice metaphor for the psychological work we need to be doing..  
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Carguy
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« Reply #43 on: January 30, 2021, 09:48:28 PM »

Khibomsis,

They truly are! I always knew I kind of had them but I didn't realize how much they affected me until this relationship. That would be a good way to look at this time on my own. Mine has a lot to deal with too. I I don't need to add to it.

That is a great metaphor!

I would like your opinion here if I could. Yesterday I had to go to Walmart to get my prescription filled. I was completely out of blood pressure medicine. I went on my lunch break but apparently she must have been taking a late lunch because her car was still there. I didn't realize they had her outside collecting carts and bringing them in. As I was walking towards the doors I looked up and seen her crossing the parking lot towards me. Almost like she seen me and started walking towards me but was acting like she was going to get more carts. She walked by me maybe 6 feet away and didn't even look at me. Pretty sure she was ignoring me. I said "Hey you." and waved. She half turned and gave kind of a nod and kept walking. In the past she has done this when she is upset at me. Basic acknowledgement and nothing more. Kind of cold like.

After we talked a few weeks ago I thought things seemed a lot better. By the end of our talk we were joking and being a little playful and even hugged before I left. Now it seems she's cold again. I don't get it. I've noticed in the past when she is angry at me,  It seems like when she seen me in public she would pop up somewhere so she was in my view. I have heard that they sometimes do that to keep you thinking about them. Does that seem Right? I also wonder if this is her trying to get attention? Acting cold to get me to chase her like I have in the past? What do you think? I'm a little confused here.

I know BPD people Are known to swing back and forth and their moods. Maybe She's back to being upset about the past? What's your opinion on this?

I was Going to Stay away And give her space. I was hoping I could have popped in there real quick and just get my prescription filled. I didn't anticipate running into her. I'm thinking I still need to disappear like I did last summer. Give her space and stay away and out of her sight so I don't trigger negative feelings toward me. Give her time to heal and move past her upset towards me. Give myself time to heal and work on my own stuff as well.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2021, 09:55:52 PM by Carguy » Logged
khibomsis
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« Reply #44 on: January 31, 2021, 07:11:06 AM »

Dear Carguy, I am sorry to hear that! It is a pity it could not have stayed on the high you two left it on. However, it is a small town and I guess inevitably your paths would cross. It is difficult to say why she responded in that way. It could be just the normal BPDish moodswings. She could also have been feeling some kind of way about you staying away for a few days or conversely having the temerity to show up at Walmart collecting your prescription. If it were Khib, I would be feeling shame that I could have treated you in the way she did. It could be hormonal. Who knows?
The bottom line is that from a nons point of view there is no saying why, and the most obvious way of finding out, namely asking her directly, is currently not possible for you.   I had this problem many, many times in my recent relationship. The standard advice is to wait until they have calmed down (are at baseline) and then attempt to communicate. Sometimes things stack up or they touch baseline so briefly and the air becomes thick with unresolved issues. Mostly I got by by not paying it too much attention. Life goes on, one day at a time.
I would add, maybe not attempt a lot of communication at work? PwBPD are easily stressed and trying to discuss serious matters at work is bound not to end well.
You have asked her would she like to hang out sometime, she has agreed. Give yourself your time to work on your abandonment issues and truly understand why her slightest look affects you the way it does.  In a few weeks call and invite her for a coffee. That is maybe a suitable time to broach that you don't know what to make of the hot and cold stuff. In the meantime my simple observation is that the less your paths cross the smaller the opportunity for the silent treatment to happen. It upsets you every time. Love yourself enough to spare yourself.
Hugs,
Khib
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Carguy
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« Reply #45 on: February 02, 2021, 09:05:54 AM »

Thanks Khib. This helps me.

I think that the other day when we talked I helped to calm her down and comfort her. In the past when she is upset I have done this. I have Learned a lot about Calming her. She has even said this. Maybe since then the unresolved issues have came back.  Also you bring up a good point with shame. Someone told me last summer that her ignoring me could also be because she is feeling shame. Like you said, who knows?

It really does affect me. I have noticed however, it doesn't affect me as much as it used to. In the past I would have strong anxiety and hurt. Now It's not so bad. It causes me to question more than anything.

I generally try not to communicate with her while she is at work. I don't want to get her in trouble or cause drama while she is at work. In the past (when she is angry at me) when I have tried to tell her something real quick she has responded in anger. Now the most I will do is say hi to her. Maybe ask if we can talk sometime when she has a free moment.

For now I believe I will keep my distance. Just kind of disappeared again for a while. That seemed to help last time. I don't know if I will ask her out the coffee or anything in the next few weeks. Maybe I should leave the ball in her court? If she wants to hang out let her come to me? I'm not sure on this because she has even told me she has a hard time reaching out and I have witnessed that. Also, I'm not sure if she really agreed to hang out. She just told me "sounds good." Maybe it's just me but it didn't seem like she was really interested.

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« Reply #46 on: February 04, 2021, 12:20:24 AM »

Carguy, you deserve a break. It wounds you too much when she behaves like this. Sending positive energy your way. Enjoy the break!
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« Reply #47 on: February 04, 2021, 01:02:01 PM »

Thanks Khib.

I've been struggling a lot yesterday and today with missing her. Last night I needed an item and I could tell my emotions were trying to bargain with me to go into Wal-Mart. As tempting as my emotions were I ended up going to the other grocery store in town and paying a little more. My resolve is to stay away for awhile so I'm not crowding her and work on my stuff. It is hard and hurts but I think it's for the best right now.

I talked to my therapist the other day about all this and he said my chasing is causing her to push away because of her BPD. I have read about that a lot as well. I kind of figured that's what it was. I mentioned to him how she seemingly  walked across the parking lot towards me and right past me within a few feet just to ignore me. He said it's basically a game for her in a way. I have talked to him before about little things like that that I have noticed. He said my chasing and reaching out to her makes her feel pressured like I'm trying to be controlling and stalkerish when in actuality I am just eager and trying to reach out to her.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2021, 01:11:58 PM by Carguy » Logged
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« Reply #48 on: February 05, 2021, 02:57:26 AM »

Well done Carguy! The few extra cents at the other shop were well worth it in terms of trial and tribulation.
Consistent distance is one of one biggest problems relating to BPD. When they push I try to stand firm, when they pull I stand firm again. Unnerves my ex but I feel it is the best choice . In the past  I ended up dancing push/pull with them. Then my life gets determined by crazy, whereas of course it should be the other way round.
Sorry, I'm rambling here but I hope you know what I mean?
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« Reply #49 on: February 08, 2021, 08:41:54 PM »

I get what you're saying. It makes sense.

Well I believe she is seeing someone else. I seen her in public with another guy. This is probably why I never heard back from her when I told her I would be open to hanging out again. Like I have read in the past with others about their BPD ex dating someone else, and as I witnessed with her, it never lasts. It's interesting that it lasted so long with me before there were problems. Of the guys I do know that she has dated they haven't lasted more than a few months. The guy she was dating before we got back together last August only lasted a month and a half. The guy she was hanging out with after we broke up in November must be out of the picture so that was pretty quick too.

It's hard but all the best to them. I'm just going to dedicate myself to myself. Working out and building my body for competition and working on my mental and emotional side.

What's interesting is the last time we talked for several hours she told me that when I get my past dealt with that I was going to be an incredible person. She said I have a huge heart and she looked at me kind of longingly with tears starting to well up in her eyes. Even though she's not in the picture anymore I'm still going to work on becoming that person.
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« Reply #50 on: February 09, 2021, 01:19:03 AM »

I am soo sorry, Carguy! It hurts like hell, I know.
I could see it coming but didn't want to say anything for fear of becoming a prophecy. It is the way BPD operates, push/pull/push/pull. It is great that you've stopped letting crazy run your life. Somewhere in her infant mind she may be thinking that making you jealous makes her more attractive. At least my expwBPD thought so, it took a lot of communication before she got it that triangles are not sexy to me. They just don't turn me on.

Indeed, sit this one out. It is the wise decision. You have been this place before, last year, and I think the year before.  At least you have the strength now to walk out of the cycle. You are choosing not to be back here next year this time.

Don't listen to her. You are a great guy already. Kind, caring and consistently patient. Give your self all those great qualities. Enjoy the peace!  It won't last. The same factors that made it impossible for the two of you to be together will destroy the current man as well. At the end of the day it is not her walking out with another that is the problem, what separates you is untreated BPD. I don't think her DBT training is working very well, and that is the bottom line.

When this one crashes and burns like all the ones before, she will be back for another helping of Carguy. Hopefully by that time you will be strong enough to just say no! to another cycle.  Don't know if you've read this one before but it was a really great help for me:
https://bpdfamily.com/content/surviving-break-when-your-partner-has-borderline-personality

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« Last Edit: February 09, 2021, 01:24:26 AM by khibomsis » Logged

 
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« Reply #51 on: February 09, 2021, 08:40:00 PM »

Thanks Khib.

I figured it would happen sooner or later to but it still hurts. To be honest I have really been struggling. The other day while driving I was listening to a song that I recently came to really like. The lyrics express a lot of what my emotional side feels. I was missing her a lot and the song brought tears to my eyes. I'm not someone who cries much either. I was overwhelmed with emotions loneliness, hopelessness, and missing her. I also know recently that my mind is trying to go to dark places again. I am trying to keep it away from those dark places but it's hard at times.

I don't think she was trying to make me jealous here. I just happen to be driving down the road and passed some guy's pickup getting ready to pull out onto the street and when I glanced over I seen her in the passenger seat. I do believe in the past however, those times that she has seen the in public and popped up in my view, I believe those are intentional. Like I was saying the other day, she crossed the parking lot to walk by me within a few feet and then ignored me. My counselor believe it's some game she's playing. Maybe in a similar sense to what you're saying. Ignoring me trying to trigger me to chase after her or something?

You're right. I have been in this place a few times with her. I hate being here again. It hurts. I hurt.

Thank you. I am a good, caring, big-hearted person inside. It is who I am. I like helping others and caring for others. I have a lot of my own issues from my past with my mother when I was little and other hurts from childhood with other kids. I am trying to work through all those things. Sometimes I have questioned if I am a good person but I think I have a good heart. She is untreated. In fact I'm pretty sure she is undiagnosed. My therapist was the one that pointed out her behavior almost two years ago and said he believed that's what it was. I started doing a lot of reading on it and she fits the bill. Pretty much all the criteria she fits. I know she has seen a few different therapist but I don't think she has ever had any DBT.

I actually have read that but it was a couple years ago. It was a good thing to reread for me though.

Honestly I don't think she will come looking for me when it doesn't work. From what I have seen in the past the only time she comes back to me when it doesn't work is if I reach out to her. Go talk to her, apologize for the things I did wrong, stuff like that. Last summer when we were apart for those nine months she dated a few different guys she said. It didn't sound like any of them got very far or lasted very long. I believe that she would just find another guy. When she broke up with me in November she started hanging out with that other guy and then I found out about his background. He's must be out of the picture and it appears there may be a new guy. I think she would just jump from relationship to relationship. She hasn't reached out to me very often. It's a rare thing.

Tell me what your thoughts are on this. I was thinking today that somebody recently mentioned that she knows my pattern. The past pattern has been for me to reach out every so often when I start to miss her. To pop up and say hi or try to say something to her. I started thinking about that and it occurred to me that she maybe possibly waiting and expecting me to do the same pattern again. Almost like a game so she can be chased and feel wanted? This could possibly go along with intentionally walking by me just to ignore me. When I thought about all of that I told myself "If this is what is happening don't play into it!"


« Last Edit: February 09, 2021, 08:45:25 PM by Carguy » Logged
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« Reply #52 on: February 10, 2021, 01:04:30 AM »


Tell me what your thoughts are on this. I was thinking today that somebody recently mentioned that she knows my pattern. The past pattern has been for me to reach out every so often when I start to miss her. To pop up and say hi or try to say something to her. I started thinking about that and it occurred to me that she maybe possibly waiting and expecting me to do the same pattern again. Almost like a game so she can be chased and feel wanted? This could possibly go along with intentionally walking by me just to ignore me. When I thought about all of that I told myself "If this is what is happening don't play into it!"




That would be a 100% correct assessment. I am going to rip the band-aid off here for a moment. Before you react to my words understand I am not doing a character assassination on you, but instead explaining what is going on in her head as she views you. You are predictable. You are safe. You are easy. You are always going to be the stand-by. You will never truly be option 1 because your role to her is the savior/rescuer. This is where I implore you to adopt the mind set that you are either option 1 or you are option NONE! Period! The most important part is that you learn the lesson not for her, but for yourself and moving forward. You are too damn nice and far too good of a person to get used and manipulated.

Now, I am 100% on your team and I am going to reassure you that yes your instincts are spot on and you should not play into it. Do not play her games. That is all it is. Any relationship with her will just be a game. Any attempts to draw you back in tell her to kick rocks. It is for your own sanity. Good, kind, caring people like you deserve to be treated better, but that will only happen when you send the message you are to be respected. If someone pushes and crosses your boundaries give them a warning and have the confrontation to say hey enough of that BS! If they do not comply then in your own way pull the plug on them and go about your business and save your good will and efforts for others who are worthy of your attention.

CG...you are going in the right direction. Keep your head up amigo.

Cheers and best wishes to you!

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« Reply #53 on: February 10, 2021, 01:20:28 AM »

To pop up and say hi or try to say something to her. I started thinking about that and it occurred to me that she maybe possibly waiting and expecting me to do the same pattern again. Almost like a game so she can be chased and feel wanted? This could possibly go along with intentionally walking by me just to ignore me. When I thought about all of that I told myself "If this is what is happening don't play into it!"

its obvious that she likes and cares about you as a person on some level.

if she feels chased or pressured, its natural that when that dies down, she might reach out. if she feels chased or pressured after that, she might then back off. thats not a game, Carguy, its human nature. we are all wired for bonding, but we try to avoid the things about people that we dont like or turn us off.
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« Reply #54 on: February 12, 2021, 01:39:01 AM »

Yes, OR, it is always important to remember that people are people, BPD or no. Some things are symptoms of the disease pattern and some are just things people do.

Carguy, I often battle with the notion of what is real. For instance, the abuse, I feel I can't blame my expwBPD because she is mentally ill. But it was real to me, I suffered it. And so one has to accept that there are two realities on one relationship, and of course in its turn inevitably will lead to conflict. I mean, there am I, battling to untrigger and calm down the PTSD, while she is merry as a cricket, a little tired but feeling good because the emotional energy which was building into a storm inside her is now released. Something is going to give after enough time. Because while we were doing all of that we were not communicating except in a very toxic way.

In the same way, I wonder if what was real to you was not real to your ex. The walking past and ignoring you stuff never failed to upset you. But maybe it did something for her that worked for her?  
Well, these are deep philosophical issues I have plenty of time to ponder these days. How's it going Carguy? Are you working out and shopping at the other store in the week? Don't worry, it gets better with time.
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« Reply #55 on: February 14, 2021, 10:03:29 PM »

Sinister,

I get what you are saying. Inside I know that I should take this mindset. Not accept being a backup. The girl I dated a little over a year ago I told her this. She decided to go back to her boyfriend but wanted to remain friends with me. I told her I would not be a backup. We remained friends but she broke up with her boyfriend a couple of times after that and would start chatting to me and throwing passes hoping to i would take her back. I didn't allow it. It was easier with her though. I had only known her a few weeks while dating. I believe I struggled so much more with my ex BPD because we have such a long history. There were a lot of good times so it tends to Cloud my mind. I am trying to work on these things though.

Once Removed,

You do bring a good point. I questioned mainly because when we have been apart before I have noticed some unusual things on her behalf that seem unusual and out of character.. My therapist mentioned in our last session that it seemed like games. The unusual things is what makes me wonder.

Khibomsis,

Good point. It might not necessarily be any BPD Behavior. I guess I have to look at it that everybody reacts differently. Here and there in the past I have noticed things on her behalf that seemed unusual while we were apart but it is hard to say for sure the reasons why. I guess I really am trying to gain better understanding of what all is going on. Partially to know how to react and partially to comfort myself?

I find myself fighting that same battle. What is real and what isn't? Is she really trying to stay in my view? Is she doing this for some reason or that? What does this or that mean?

In our relationship she would get triggered and through trial and error I found ways to calm her down. I used to get triggered but after much studying and counseling and reading here I learned to not take things personal. By actually staying calm and talking to her and looking deeper I found that looking at it through her eyes and gaining better understanding of where she was at helped me to not feel angry or upset. It was actually quite incredible. There was still a time or to that I did allow myself to be triggered. I did notice those times were a lot more rare than in the past though.

Maybe it did do something for her. Maybe attention? Maybe curiosity? Maybe reaction?

Other than that it has been going good. I have stayed away from Walmart while she is working. There has been a new development however. I will get to that in a minute. I have been going to the smaller grocery store for an item here or there and last Wednesday I went to Walmart for a big shopping trip. I went that day because I knew she had it off. I have stayed away however, this weekend she did text me. She asked if she could talk to me about something that happened in her life. I told her we could and I talked to her on the phone. I found out the unfortunate news that her nephew that she was pretty close to passed away in an automobile accident. He was in his early twenties. She was pretty upset and a few times I could hear her starting to cry. I just talked to her from a friend level and she was suggesting some things she could do as remembrance of him and I told her I thought those were good ideas. We then just chatted about things we have been up to and joked and laugh a little. She said it helped her to talk. The funny thing is while we were on the phone she reassured me that she had a great support group. I told her that was great! The thought did go through my mind that she has a great support group and yet still wanted to talk to me about it? I'm not going to say no because I do still care and will listen if she needs to talk about something like that. I'm still going to continue with shopping this way and keeping a distance however. I just feel that right now that is best for me. I am glad that we can still be friends but I think a little space is good right now.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2021, 10:08:55 PM by Carguy » Logged
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« Reply #56 on: February 16, 2021, 01:26:54 AM »

Carguy, I am so sorry your ex's nephew was in an accident! It must be shocking. Did you know him?
Yes, as to their behaviour, it helps to know as much as possible but we can drive ourselves crazy wondering what moves them to do what they do. Because at the end of the day it is BPD. If it made 100 % sense to us we would have to be BPD too.

What we do have is the behaviour. When you stay away you feel better and she feels comfortable to contact you. This is important to both of you. I am glad to hear that she has great support, but as you can see, you seem to form a vital part of that support group.

Wonderful that you are deciding to take care of yourself! Being a support in the friendzone can be hell on earth sometimes.  I am feeling some kind of way after my expwBPD decided to spend Valentine's Day with another person. This while FOGging me about not having a date with her. But then I told myself that at the end of the day I am only responsible for making myself feel better, and focused on doing things that made me feel good. It is nice to be able to step aside from the chaos.

Take care of yourself Carguy! It will be interesting to see what happens if you do that consistently.
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« Reply #57 on: February 18, 2021, 10:58:17 PM »

I did not know him. She had a sister that passed away of a brain aneurysm at the age of 25. This was that sister's son.

It does help and you have a very good point. I don't think I will completely understand her disordered mind and what everything she does means. I think the only thing I can do is be understanding and learn what I can.

So I talked to my therapist the other day. I mentioned the part about you saying that the space will help her feel more comfortable to contact me. He agreed. Last Saturday when she contacted me about this, later in the day I had to run to town for work so I stopped by her place to check on her and see how she was doing. We chatted for a little bit and then I left. A few days later I text her (Tuesday morning) and asked how she was doing. She said she was doing good and trying to figure out how to get donations to the family. I told her I would like to donate. She said she would let me know when she found out.

The next morning she text me to tell me she found out that he had been taking 18 credit hour classes in college and 12 credit hours is full time. She also said he was working so she thinks that he was likely really tired and fell asleep at the wheel in the middle of the night. Either that or slid on ice. She told me she just wanted to let me know that. It went through my mind that she was trying to reach out to me right there. It also went through my mind about what you said about space making it more comfortable for her to reach out. We text for a little bit more and even joked a little bit. To be honest I was surprised that she text me to tell me that. I haven't text her since then and I haven't seen her since last Saturday. Still keeping that space.

Another thing my therapist pointed out. I mentioned to him like you how she reached out to me but then told me twice that she had a great support group. He believes that is her starting to feel nervous and scared. He pointed out that in those moments she is probably feeling like I do. Scared to be hurt more. It made sense. Pointing that out also shows me that giving space is a good idea.
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« Reply #58 on: February 21, 2021, 08:52:49 AM »

Carguy, well done for keeping a safe distance! As you can see it brings its own rewards, she does not feel engulfed and contacts you.  I know it is not the close tight relationship you were hoping for, but as long as it is positive, right?

I am glad too that you are sorting your head out in therapy. People call it the gift of BPD, by the time  we are done learning how to handle them, we have done so much emotional work we change and grow ourselves. A pity we have to suffer so to do it, but certainly I have on many occasions been thankful to my expwBPD for jolting me out of my comfort zone and inspiring me to be more than I thought I could be.

Let us know how it goes? With a bit of luck you too are on an even keel now and things will go smoothly. One thing I find very helpful is to jot down notes as to how often things go south, it helps me to track our pattern and lets me know if I am doing better at not triggering her/calming down dysregulations.
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