My ex called me

[WhatToDo47]

Posting this because I know y’all will understand and also because it helped and helps me to read stories like this as the behavior can be so similar.

My ex called me yesterday. I was expecting it and me and my therapist that I see for my ptsd from her had been preparing for it, as the legal divorce is now done and the religious divorce will be finalized this weekend.

We spoke for about 30 minutes and it was very weird and sad. I could write many pages on it, but some highlights are her asking me to apologize that I made her do this (leave me for no reason, cheat, threaten, falsely smear me, etc). She says it was the “only way to get my attention” and that she didn’t think it would turn out like this. She apologized for acting mean and crazy but said it was either that or kill herself (she has a history of SI before, during, and after me). I said don’t kill yourslef and she said don’t worry I’m not depressed.

She asked if my therapist still thinks she’s crazy and told me she doesn’t see a therapist anymore because her therapist was a quack. She LOVED her therapist until he told her not to leave and cheat on me for no real reason.

She told me a bunch of victim stories about what’s happened to her lately which are probably exaggerated or outright false. A number of them don’t line up with other things she’s said since she left as far as timelines.

She cried for a long time and honestly I did too. I miss who I thought she was, but know she’s not really that person and can’t be any stable person for any length of time. I love her and miss her but don’t trust her at all. And she seems to have no insight into the consequences of her actions.

She asked about all my family members and said her family has wanted to reach out to me but that makes her angry because it’s not fair that her family wants to talk to me and mine doesn’t want to talk to her (they did until she insulted and threatened them).

The conversation ended when I told her that I never wanted to be in this situation either but we are and she said she never expected to be buying a book on becoming a realtor and then returning it, but she was so she had to go.

She then texted my mom and grandma that she misses them.

Thoughts or advice anyone?

[NotAHero]

Posting this because I know y’all will understand and also because it helped and helps me to read stories like this as the behavior can be so similar.

My ex called me yesterday. I was expecting it and me and my therapist that I see for my ptsd from her had been preparing for it, as the legal divorce is now done and the religious divorce will be finalized this weekend.

We spoke for about 30 minutes and it was very weird and sad. I could write many pages on it, but some highlights are her asking me to apologize that I made her do this (leave me for no reason, cheat, threaten, falsely smear me, etc). She says it was the “only way to get my attention” and that she didn’t think it would turn out like this. She apologized for acting mean and crazy but said it was either that or kill herself (she has a history of SI before, during, and after me). I said don’t kill yourslef and she said don’t worry I’m not depressed.

She asked if my therapist still thinks she’s crazy and told me she doesn’t see a therapist anymore because her therapist was a quack. She LOVED her therapist until he told her not to leave and cheat on me for no real reason.

She told me a bunch of victim stories about what’s happened to her lately which are probably exaggerated or outright false. A number of them don’t line up with other things she’s said since she left as far as timelines.

She cried for a long time and honestly I did too. I miss who I thought she was, but know she’s not really that person and can’t be any stable person for any length of time. I love her and miss her but don’t trust her at all. And she seems to have no insight into the consequences of her actions.

She asked about all my family members and said her family has wanted to reach out to me but that makes her angry because it’s not fair that her family wants to talk to me and mine doesn’t want to talk to her (they did until she insulted and threatened them).

The conversation ended when I told her that I never wanted to be in this situation either but we are and she said she never expected to be buying a book on becoming a realtor and then returning it, but she was so she had to go.

She then texted my mom and grandma that she misses them.

Thoughts or advice anyone?

 Glad your legal path is coming to an end.

 The emotional part will take time but you are on the right track. My advice is to try to move on, see other women, if you are not ready meet them as friends first. From the last conversation you described, sorry to be blunt but … your ex seems to be like a hopeless case. I wouldn’t waste any more time on her if I were you. Full blown disorder and there is nothing good left for your there, nothing.

[drumdog4M]

You survived the call that you had prepared for. Reading your account, I appreciate how painful it must be. You see the person you love but also see that she has not changed at all. It must validate your decision to move on.

I think it is really healthy to accept the dialectic of those conflicting emotions -- love but distrust. To recognize that you could not have a stable, fulfilling, reciprocal relationship with her when she is more concerned about her feelings than yours or the needs of the couple.

Thank you for sharing this with us. You are past the conversation now and can turn back to your own healing, hopefully secure in the knowledge that you are on the correct path forward.

[WhatToDo47]

Glad your legal path is coming to an end.

 The emotional part will take time but you are on the right track. My advice is to try to move on, see other women, if you are not ready meet them as friends first. From the last conversation you described, sorry to be blunt but … your ex seems to be like a hopeless case. I wouldn’t waste any more time on her if I were you. Full blown disorder and there is nothing good left for your there, nothing.

Good to hear from you and thanks for taking the time to read my post.

I appreciate the encouragement. I know it’s the right track even though it’s not what I ever wanted or thought would happen.

I want to have a happy and healthy marriage and family and kids. She can’t even keep herself together, she would never be able to give me that and it’s not even fair to ask it of her.

I haven’t really met anyone new because we are still technically married until the end of this weekend. It’s been a long 8 months but I have grown a lot and I’m very glad I didn’t just jump into trying to meet new people. It still feels like a betrayal of her and our marriage to meet someone else, but I think that’s just because I haven’t emotionally detached.

I appreciate your bluntness very much. It helps to hear others’ opinions of the situation and everyone here is very experienced and knowledgeable because we’ve all been through it.

You’re right - nothing good left for me with her. Her level of illness and behaviors became so normal to me over the years, but it’s been just long enough and I’ve learned just enough here and with therapy to know that she is indeed really mentally ill. That’s still sinking in. I knew she was mentally I’ll but thought it was depression and PTSD and anxiety from her abusive mom. I didn’t know about BPD, now I do and that’s what’s different this time.

[WhatToDo47]

You survived the call that you had prepared for. Reading your account, I appreciate how painful it must be. You see the person you love but also see that she has not changed at all. It must validate your decision to move on.

I think it is really healthy to accept the dialectic of those conflicting emotions -- love but distrust. To recognize that you could not have a stable, fulfilling, reciprocal relationship with her when she is more concerned about her feelings than yours or the needs of the couple.

Thank you for sharing this with us. You are past the conversation now and can turn back to your own healing, hopefully secure in the knowledge that you are on the correct path forward.

Thank you. It was very painful.  It definitely validated my decision to move on. She still appears as a scared toddler in a grown up world and I so desperately want to rescue her but now I know that I can’t and she would just take me down with her.

Love but distrust for sure. I told her I will always love her but can’t have this happen again. And I know with her it always will. She only really always cared about her needs, not mine or that of our marriage.

Thank you for listening. I will do my best to, as you say, turn to my own healing now.

Love but distrust.

I hope you know that your post, and all of these replies, are helping me so much and reminding me of why I must detach and move on.

Much love to all of you

[drumdog4M]

Letting go and accepting that we cannot save them is so very hard.

We also appreciate all the support you give to us, as well as the learning and validations from your experiences.

[WhatToDo47]

Letting go and accepting that we cannot save them is so very hard.

We also appreciate all the support you give to us, as well as the learning and validations from your experiences.

Thanks so much! The feeling is mutual. There’s something to be said for the validation that these forums provide. Ironically, having people validate my experiences makes it easier for me to realize it’s about the disorder, not her and not me, and humbles me.

Letting go and accepting I can’t save her is by far the hardest part. I was always rescuing (aka enabling) her, from when her parents kicked her out at the beginning of our r/s and mine took her in, to constantly supporting her financially and emotionally through psychotic meltdowns, impulsive spending and quitting jobs, her self harm, defending her against her family, bosses, etc.

She always promised that she would never leave me if I didn’t give up on her, and I promised I never would. In a sick way, she kept her promise.

How did you finally let go and accept you couldn’t save her? I’m getting there but my rescuing tendencies and fidelity to my commitments are definitely my kryptonite.

[NotAHero]

Good to hear from you and thanks for taking the time to read my post.

I appreciate the encouragement. I know it’s the right track even though it’s not what I ever wanted or thought would happen.

I want to have a happy and healthy marriage and family and kids. She can’t even keep herself together, she would never be able to give me that and it’s not even fair to ask it of her.

I haven’t really met anyone new because we are still technically married until the end of this weekend. It’s been a long 8 months but I have grown a lot and I’m very glad I didn’t just jump into trying to meet new people. It still feels like a betrayal of her and our marriage to meet someone else, but I think that’s just because I haven’t emotionally detached.

I appreciate your bluntness very much. It helps to hear others’ opinions of the situation and everyone here is very experienced and knowledgeable because we’ve all been through it.

You’re right - nothing good left for me with her. Her level of illness and behaviors became so normal to me over the years, but it’s been just long enough and I’ve learned just enough here and with therapy to know that she is indeed really mentally ill. That’s still sinking in. I knew she was mentally I’ll but thought it was depression and PTSD and anxiety from her abusive mom. I didn’t know about BPD, now I do and that’s what’s different this time.

 If you ever wonder about the future with someone like that take a look at those of us who have kids with them.

 My bluntness came from a place of experience and falling into the same trap again and again.  The call you described had lines my ex used word for word. Almost all of them. Now that I am over her emotionally  I can’t believe I wanted to live with THAT. I was not so lucky and I have a kid with her.  From what your ex said she is realizing she won’t find a suitable replacement of your stature and she will keep trying with you for a while.

 I cannot warn you enough not to give her another chance. I cringe now when I think how I missed her in the last few months.
  

[drumdog4M]

It is pathetic but eerie how they use the same lines.

I'm in the process of trying to accept that I cannot and could not save her. She left me, so someone else can try to save her now. In my clearer moments, I realize she did me a favor. It still hurts though.

I realized from this experience, research, and therapy that I do have "caretaker" instincts, likely due to my relationship with my mother. I do not think my mother was BPD, but she was emotionally unstable and placed me in the role of helping to manage her emotions and then support her financially.

I was perfectly trained to fall into the role with my ex-pwBPD. She first seemed like she would give me everything my mother did not and then revealed that she was more like a much more disordered version of my mom.

[NotAHero]

It is pathetic but eerie how they use the same lines.

I'm in the process of trying to accept that I cannot and could not save her. She left me, so someone else can try to save her now. In my clearer moments, I realize she did me a favor. It still hurts though.

I realized from this experience, research, and therapy that I do have "caretaker" instincts, likely due to my relationship with my mother. I do not think my mother was BPD, but she was emotionally unstable and placed me in the role of helping to manage her emotions and then support her financially.

I was perfectly trained to fall into the role with my ex-pwBPD. She first seemed like she would give me everything my mother did not and then revealed that she was more like a much more disordered version of my mom.

 Keep trying to approach it in new ways. You are smart and always offer great insights. I have no doubt you will get to the full realization you are looking for.

[SinisterComplex]

Posting this because I know y’all will understand and also because it helped and helps me to read stories like this as the behavior can be so similar.

My ex called me yesterday. I was expecting it and me and my therapist that I see for my ptsd from her had been preparing for it, as the legal divorce is now done and the religious divorce will be finalized this weekend.

We spoke for about 30 minutes and it was very weird and sad. I could write many pages on it, but some highlights are her asking me to apologize that I made her do this (leave me for no reason, cheat, threaten, falsely smear me, etc). She says it was the “only way to get my attention” and that she didn’t think it would turn out like this. She apologized for acting mean and crazy but said it was either that or kill herself (she has a history of SI before, during, and after me). I said don’t kill yourslef and she said don’t worry I’m not depressed.

She asked if my therapist still thinks she’s crazy and told me she doesn’t see a therapist anymore because her therapist was a quack. She LOVED her therapist until he told her not to leave and cheat on me for no real reason.

She told me a bunch of victim stories about what’s happened to her lately which are probably exaggerated or outright false. A number of them don’t line up with other things she’s said since she left as far as timelines.

She cried for a long time and honestly I did too. I miss who I thought she was, but know she’s not really that person and can’t be any stable person for any length of time. I love her and miss her but don’t trust her at all. And she seems to have no insight into the consequences of her actions.

She asked about all my family members and said her family has wanted to reach out to me but that makes her angry because it’s not fair that her family wants to talk to me and mine doesn’t want to talk to her (they did until she insulted and threatened them).

The conversation ended when I told her that I never wanted to be in this situation either but we are and she said she never expected to be buying a book on becoming a realtor and then returning it, but she was so she had to go.

She then texted my mom and grandma that she misses them.

Thoughts or advice anyone?

Thoughts...plenty. However, I think you can infer what I may say. Advice...don't fall prey to desperation and let her back in. The most important reason I am saying this has more to do with what you said...you cannot trust her. BPD or not when you cannot trust someone they are essentially useless and worthless (to you...adopt that mind set to empower yourself and protect yourself). Yes very tough and harsh words, but I don't sugarcoat things. However, keep in mind I am saying that as something you should adopt as a mind set. I am not saying they have no value in this world...just wanted to make sure I made that distinction for clarification. You have to move on and save your time for people whom you do and can trust. Life is finite and time isn't something you get back so do not piss it away on people who have hurt you and will continue to hurt you. Want Better, Expect Better, Do Better!

Cheers and best wishes!

-SC-

[WhatToDo47]

Notahero:


Wow, and thank you. I do consistently read the threads and posts of you who do have kids with them. I feel soo sorry for all of you. I was so close to that fate. We were literally just a few weeks away from starting to try for kids. God saved me. I know your bluntness comes from a good place and I appreciate it. One of my best allies helping me to detach is my cousin whose mom has BPD. Neither of us realized that until my ex left, but his mom has been a constant confusing and abusive presence in his life. His childhood was hell. My ex's mom also has (at least) BPD and her childhood was also hell.

Anything else you would do in my shoes other than 100% not take her back?

I have read so many posts on here that are word for word things that my ex said to me. Crazy to hear that my ex is using the same words that yours did. It helps me a lot to depersonalize it when I hear that.

I agree with you - her replacement search isn’t going as planned. I am not so easily replaced. I don’t say that from a place of narcissism, just knowing that I have been codependent and put up with a lot of abuse and nonsense that I shouldn’t have and that others won’t, especially as her looks are already failing.

Thank you for your warning. I will remember it when I am tempted to give her another chance. I can’t wait to be emotionally detached. I am getting there.

Drumdog:

Pathetic and eerie is a good description of BPD in general.

I’m with you. She left me and I know it’s a blessing and a favor, but it still hurts and we, as the ones who are capable of love, still feel the pain they should be feeling but can’t and won’t.

I have caretaker instincts as well. I don’t think that’s a bad thing, as long as we also develop boundaries and lose our naivety. Makes sense about your mom and how she primed you for your BPD. I’m still trying to figure out where mine come from. I trust and care WAY too much.

SC:

I do think I can infer what you and others here will say haha I must and will resist her desperation. I have no other choice really, she has burned every bridge with me and everyone here.

Trust is so important in life. BPD or not, she left me, cheated on me (and I suspect that’s not the first time she did), she threatened me, divorced me, cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars, and very well could have cost me my wonderful career that I love and put me in jail with her false DV accusations and calls to the police. Thank God I have true friends and family who know my integrity.

No sugarcoating needed here. I have sugarcoated everything for 6 years and it landed me here.

“Want Better, Expect Better, Do Better!”

I will! You’re right. Life is short and I have so many people who do love me. They have stood by me through all of this. I don’t want to waste my life trying to save someone who won’t let themselves be helped and pushes away everyone who tries.

I still love here and care about her, but I also love and care about myself and I matter, too. I will be happy to keep referring her to the nearest therapist when she asks me for help.

I appreciate all of you more than you will ever know. I will stay strong and resist this recycle. I know that I can do it and y’all can, too. When I feel the urge to reach out to her, I will post and help people here. EVERYONE deserves better than BPD, especially everyone here!

[WhatToDo47]

How long did it take to emotionally detach and was it a gradual or sudden thing? I’m curious as it relates to this thread and I think I might start a thread about that also

[Turkish]

After one joint session and two individual sessions with her, my ex abandoned our therapist when he told her similarly:

She LOVED her therapist until he told her not to leave and cheat on me for no real reason.

I didn't think much of therapy after my mom did something similar with me when I was 12, and our shrewd T observed that I had a "healthy disrespect for my profession." Tricksy! Saw what he did with the validating while taking my money.

I did it for another 2 years, spending a good down payment for a new car, because... screw her sending me to get "fixed!"

It took longer for her to detach then it did me, especially when her marriage to the young buck she left me for imploded, predictably.

That our ex's often remain attached, or need to detach themselves, is a point I've seen missing a lot in the years I've been here. I missed it myself.

[NotAHero]

Notahero:


Wow, and thank you. I do consistently read the threads and posts of you who do have kids with them. I feel soo sorry for all of you. I was so close to that fate. We were literally just a few weeks away from starting to try for kids. God saved me. I know your bluntness comes from a good place and I appreciate it. One of my best allies helping me to detach is my cousin whose mom has BPD. Neither of us realized that until my ex left, but his mom has been a constant confusing and abusive presence in his life. His childhood was hell. My ex's mom also has (at least) BPD and her childhood was also hell.

Anything else you would do in my shoes other than 100% not take her back?

I have read so many posts on here that are word for word things that my ex said to me. Crazy to hear that my ex is using the same words that yours did. It helps me a lot to depersonalize it when I hear that.

I agree with you - her replacement search isn’t going as planned. I am not so easily replaced. I don’t say that from a place of narcissism, just knowing that I have been codependent and put up with a lot of abuse and nonsense that I shouldn’t have and that others won’t, especially as her looks are already failing.

Thank you for your warning. I will remember it when I am tempted to give her another chance. I can’t wait to be emotionally detached. I am getting there.

Drumdog:

Pathetic and eerie is a good description of BPD in general.

I’m with you. She left me and I know it’s a blessing and a favor, but it still hurts and we, as the ones who are capable of love, still feel the pain they should be feeling but can’t and won’t.

I have caretaker instincts as well. I don’t think that’s a bad thing, as long as we also develop boundaries and lose our naivety. Makes sense about your mom and how she primed you for your BPD. I’m still trying to figure out where mine come from. I trust and care WAY too much.

SC:

I do think I can infer what you and others here will say haha I must and will resist her desperation. I have no other choice really, she has burned every bridge with me and everyone here.

Trust is so important in life. BPD or not, she left me, cheated on me (and I suspect that’s not the first time she did), she threatened me, divorced me, cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars, and very well could have cost me my wonderful career that I love and put me in jail with her false DV accusations and calls to the police. Thank God I have true friends and family who know my integrity.

No sugarcoating needed here. I have sugarcoated everything for 6 years and it landed me here.

“Want Better, Expect Better, Do Better!”

I will! You’re right. Life is short and I have so many people who do love me. They have stood by me through all of this. I don’t want to waste my life trying to save someone who won’t let themselves be helped and pushes away everyone who tries.

I still love here and care about her, but I also love and care about myself and I matter, too. I will be happy to keep referring her to the nearest therapist when she asks me for help.

I appreciate all of you more than you will ever know. I will stay strong and resist this recycle. I know that I can do it and y’all can, too. When I feel the urge to reach out to her, I will post and help people here. EVERYONE deserves better than BPD, especially everyone here!

  I want you to know that I deeply empathize with you and know your pain as a similar version of it is still fresh in my memory. Again count your blessing you didn’t have a child with her, because now that my ex can “sense” with her BPD  radar that I’m over her emotionally it seems that she is trying to use my child. I hope that I’m wrong but again count your blessings that is not something you will have to deal with. Once you are in my shoes emotionally you will be done !

 The detachment process was multidimensional. I wouldn’t say gradual per say.  At first I thought it was linear and gradual because the days when I woke up without not wanting to wake up gradually decreased. I thought that was how my moving in looks like. Then I hit a plateau for a couple months when the bad days stopped decreasing. Never relapsed but I started worrying if that’s my life now. If there are always days when I will wake up to ruminate and weep. Then in a short period of time I saw her in the rear view emotionally and all I care about now is the well being of my child and her not using him against me.

 I think the catalysts for me were the following :
1- New therapist gave me the opposite advice of my other therapist, go out there get intimate with someone you can like doesn’t even have to be a relationship for sure just don’t keep your ex as your sole source of intimacy thoughts.

2- Right after that I took a great trip to a wonderful place to see my buddy. I went with the intent of having fun and I did! I realized I can have fun in life being single. Some attention to the new fit me didn’t hurt. I got fit by a combination of mental/ emotional torture by my ex and some working out as a measure of self care !

3- Came back home went on 3 dates and behold….

These  women complement you, touch you, reciprocate, want to kiss you …they don’t devalue you ( at least not yet still paranoid of BPD mirroring & idealizing ).  Now I remember how normal feels like why would I want to go back to my ex whom in the last year did not once say nice thing to me or put me up? If you listen to her you would not recognize she is talking about me at all not even when it comes to facts. A lot of “love” for her turned into …disgust ? I think that’s the closest world.

 I’m sorry to say but I can no longer say I love her or care for her. That changed. She abused me and tortured me for 2 years. The last 6 months were daily torture, physical and mental abuse. If your ex did that to you I hope you get to my state of mind today. No one should “love “ their abusers no matter what the excuses are. The best I can do is move on without animosity or revenge for the sake of my child. But love ? Screw that.

[WhatToDo47]

Thank you both so much and for the thorough responses. That helps a lot! I am indeed so thankful that we don't have any kids. I hope and pray and am working hard to get to where you are one day. Getting there. Like you said, she was more my hostage taker/abuser toward the end than my wife. I don't miss that. I'll re-read what you all said a couple of times and it helps a lot. Thank you!