Friend with a Personality Disorder

[zachira]

Methuen,
The big question is: How can we stop enabling the behaviors of disordered people? I believe it is by working on our own self esteem to the point, that it becomes second nature to surround ourselves with healthy people and to automatically set boundaries with disordered people as soon as the disordered behaviors become apparent. I have struggled with acting like my disordered family members. I have welcomed people who helped make me a better person, become a person in my own right, with little in common with my disordered family members and their social circle. I feel sad for the situation with your mother, as you continue to enforce healthier boundaries with her. As you said, the silent treatment can sometimes mean peace and quiet. I have just come to the realization that my NPD sister is likely afraid of me now, after she hired the best law firm and lawyer to defend her against me and lost, I believe due to her narcissism and unreasonable expectations. There comes a point where accomodating a bully just leads to more bullying. We have to remember that the disordered people can only turn their venom on others who are available, like a young child or an adult who does not feel like he/she can just walk away from a disordered family member needing help. I am able to end the friendship with this woman, yet I am still stuck dealing with the legal problems with my siblings until I hopefully won't be. I am keeping my fingers crossed for you that at some point, your mother will be getting the care she needs and you will have a level of involvement that is healthier for you. It seems you are on the road to a healthier level of involvement with your mother, as you feel more comfortable setting healthier boundaries with her, which does not enable her, just makes her more responsible for her own decisions.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Methuen,

In all honesty, I think he only says that because he has never been through real abuse, if that makes sense. He hasn't dealt with anyone with a PD.

Also, I do think for men, between men, there is always an underlying threat of physical violence, and maybe this is why he takes a tough stance. For women, this isn't true. The underlying threat is more rejection from the tribe... That's how I feel it anyway. For men, there would be a fight, and then when the fight is over, even if you lost, you get to come back. For women, you are out. I sometimes think those dynamics, while not holding true in our current society, are still ingrained in our body.

My mother never dared have a tantrum in front of him, and I have honestly NO IDEA how he would really react.

I see the point about rejection though, about making someone feel shame by ignoring them, by calling them out when they critic us by asking, in a firm voice and loud enough so that everyone can hear :"what do you mean by that exactly?". Mostly, his advices are about staying firm and assertive, and putting a bully on the spot in front of everyone else, calling out the abuse in front of the "tribe". He says most bullies will back out and will not dare continue laughing or criticizing.  This would absolutely not work in private, with someone who has a PD.

On my end, I tend to stay calm and hold my ground the best I can. And I often try to defuse with a calm demeanor, while remaining assertive(ish). I just don't see the point in screaming and I am not a very convincing bully, . I've been through some serious trauma has a teenager, I was bullied heavily at school and I don't think I ever came back to normal after that. I have a very hard time holding my ground with intimidating strangers. It is a work in progress for me. Thankfully, there are not many of them in my current age range!

[lm1109]

This friendship thread has been really valuable for me! We have had a handful of get togethers with "old" friends these last few months. We also went camping for a full weekend with some friends this past weekend. I've had a lot of fun but I've also been aware/awake enough to recognize some of my OWN old patterns through these friendships. I'm also recognizing the balance in learning when to let go and recognizing that I also struggle with an amount of black and white thinking when it comes to others. With the friend I mentioned earlier on the thread..I feel it's time to gently let go. However, with the friends we went camping with this weekend...I had some real revelations. It's a couple and their son that my husband and I have reconnected with...they are good people...my husband is friends with the husband from work(I'll call him M) and I really connect well with his wife and the kids get along great. I noticed that M really tried to control the schedule all weekend, dominate conversations, etc. I'm a pretty go with the flow person so I was fine with doing whatever activities they wanted and follow their schedule, however, his controlling really started to wear on me by the middle of the trip. The real eye opener came when he began to criticize other peoples bodies at the pool. I sat there in shock because this is the EXACT way my Mom behaved. I sat in an uncomfortable silence(the way I did with my Mom when she did this)! The last straw was when we went to a barbecue for dinner. The campground held a funny contest...it was basically the opposite of a beauty pageant(sort of a spoof)...it was just for men and the men were not fit and they were  dancing to be funny, etc . It was just for fun...and the guys who signed up were amazing sports and everyone had a great time(everyone but M) At the end he began to say inappropriate things in a loud enough voice that others, including one of the men, could hear. I told him to stop and confronted him about saying hurtful things about other people in front of me and my children. To my surprise, his wife backed me up, and he actually apologized and was very genuine about it...he told me that I was right and that he shouldn't be saying those things. It was as if he genuinely didn't realize he was being so judgemental. The rest of the trip was smooth sailing, he calmed down, and we all had a great time.

I realized that if I hadn't stayed true to myself and confronted him, I may have "painted him black" and not wanted to hang out with them again(despite getting along great with his wife, kids getting along, etc) I would have judged him for being so judgemental.
 I also realized that one of my own biggest fleas in the early years of my adulthood was being judgemental and it was almost entirely unconscious. It's because I grew up in such a judgemental environment and I was made to believe that complaining/judging people and situations was "bonding" since that was the only way I got attention from my Mom. As I heal...I can recognize that when I start to get judgemental it is usually because I am putting up walls or feeling insecure about my own self.

So...what I learned this weekend is that, for me, friendship means being myself around that person. It means not feeling like I have to abandon myself to keep them happy. If something is not working for me...then I will kindly say so...if they respect that...then they are a friend...if they don't...then that "friendship" is not right for me. For me... everything keeps coming back to understanding my own worth in relationships. I'm no longer willing to abandon myself or my values.

However, I don't believe(at all) that M has a PD just some "bad" behaviors or maybe even "fleas" from his own upbringing and those behaviors were balanced out by other good/fun traits. With the other friend that I am choosing to let go...I believe she has a PD and...as you all have said...my lack of boundaries, empathy, and willingness to look past red flags led her to fully take down her mask with me. I am in the process of removing myself from being her "person"(great analogy) I am not going to confront her because our children have been friends for years and her children are all very sweet and I care about them...of course...I see my own child self in them(I was them) I have horrible memories in my own childhood of kids ending friendships with me because my mom would get into "fights" with their parents, behave badly around them, or my Mom would force me to end friendships because she wouldn't like them, etc. I will continue to be cordial to this woman but I will NOT enable or respond to  personal information anymore. To be honest, I think she already took that hint because when she tried to text about her issues with her son and forward emails, etc. I have sent back the same couple word texts in response(hope it's all resolved soon) I think Grey Rocking and being busy is key with her... I don't think she will want to waste her time on me if I'm not enabling...and hopefully we can get back to just being "mom friends"(being friendly at kids functions)

Thank you all for sharing on this thread. Navigating friendships has always been a difficult thing for me, but I recognize that it's time to put the energy into figuring out these dynamics and my own patterns. It really helps to understand that this is a common struggle for those of us who grew up with disordered parents. I am getting to the point where I am ready to find my "chosen family" and  I feel like I'm finally making healthy progress!   

[Riv3rW0lf]

I also realized that one of my own biggest fleas in the early years of my adulthood was being judgemental and it was almost entirely unconscious. It's because I grew up in such a judgemental environment and I was made to believe that complaining/judging people and situations was "bonding" since that was the only way I got attention from my Mom. As I heal...I can recognize that when I start to get judgemental it is usually because I am putting up walls or feeling insecure about my own self.


So...what I learned this weekend is that, for me, friendship means being myself around that person. It means not feeling like I have to abandon myself to keep them happy. If something is not working for me...then I will kindly say so...if they respect that...then they are a friend...if they don't...then that "friendship" is not right for me. For me... everything keeps coming back to understanding my own worth in relationships. I'm no longer willing to abandon myself or my values.

Yes, I also see that in myself. I also noticed, last time I spent time with my mother, that I started disliking myself because it is the same for my mother and I: judging and talking about others is how she bonds.

 And when I noticed that was what was happening, I stopped, and started to say nice things about the people she wanted to talk against, instead saying things like : "Really? That didn't occur to me that he would do this. He works a lot and I am genuinely happy for him and his current success."

Then when hit the fan, she told me she didn't think she could trust me because I probably talked behind her back like I talked in the back of others. I simply answered: "I could say the exact same about you, mom."

And so I realized, recently, that the further I am from her, the less judgmental I feel toward others.

My profound nature, which I feel like I just met, is one that likes to stay within myself. For me, this means raising my self-esteem, focussing on my own emotions toward things, and being very careful about my projections. And when I do : I realize the need to judge disappear as I myself start taking my rightful place in the world and stating who I am.

To paraphrase you : in the end, I am also truly not interested in being friends with people who would reject the real me if they knew her, so might as well be me.

And interestingly enough, the more me I am, the less critics seem to affect me, and ironically, the less critics I seem to get from other's and the more I feel people value our time together, and the more I value them.

As I am feeling more and more comfortable with myself, I can also see that a lot of the critics I received were projections of others on me, of their own guilt, their own shame, and therefore not my responsibility to carry, so I can more easily shrug them off. I know who I am, I know when I am in the wrong, I trust in my empathy and my genuine care for others to let me know when I am truly at fault. And I now refuse to carry undue blame, or to change because someone doesn't like me, or even to hide who I am and not say what I think, like and mean. If they don't like who I am: they can leave the friendship, it is ok. I feel good enough with myself that I don't need a friend that only want to be friend with me if I change. I'd rather be with myself, gardening or reading a book, than with someone like that.

I also recently realized that I do not have to be friend with everyone... A bit like dating, really. I wouldn't marry any men, so why would I befriend everyone? I have a right to choose who I want to be friend with, just like they can decide if they want to be friend with me or not. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. The important thing is : I can also say no.

I met a woman recently. She is nice, but she started texting me an awful lot. Saw her twice, and she would send me pictures and videos of her children every day, telling me all she did with them almost by the hour. It really put me off. I had no interest in validating her days and parenting decisions all day long. I tried to keep on going, sending signals that it was too much but I think this is the kind of friendship she was looking for, while I was looking for a bi-monthly get together and not necessarily anything in between? I value my independance...

So I gently eased out of the relationship and I don't think I will see her again. It just wasn't a match, and I am coming to peace with the fact that : I don't have to like everyone. She was nice, but we just don't see friendship the same way. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. And it is ok.

[lm1109]

 I value my independance...

I totally understand this. I also really value my independance. I've had a few similar friendships over the years and also ended up ending them. At the time, I beat myself up a bit and I questioned wether it was a problem with me. But after a little reflection I can see that not everyone values independance the same...and that's ok. I am someone who likes to make a plan ahead of time and I don't enjoy surprise visits or spur of the moment plans... especially when my kids were babies/toddlers and they had naps/routines because those were the times of the day that I got things done... or ya know bathed, worked out, had some coffee, or took a breath...

It makes sense to me that I am so put off by anyone encroaching my independance...because my independance has always been my means of survival. I didn't have a family to rely on, so my independance is what got me through and going inward is the only way I thrive and feel "guided" and I know now...that this is a good thing...at least for me. Some people are constantly needing/wanting external validation or constant interaction with others... I don't need that...because I never had that.

I'd rather be with myself, gardening or reading a book, than with someone like that.

I feel this same way... finally getting to this point really feels like a big healthy shift for me. I used to be terrified of judgement and feared that others wouldn't like me...as if someone not liking me was somehow proof that there was something inherently wrong with me...proof that my parents were "right" I won't pretend that I am fully healed here...but I can honestly say that the more that I embrace who I truly am rather than people pleasing the better I feel...even if someone doesn't like me or a friendship isn't a match. I'm able to walk away knowing that Id rather be with me...like you said...reading, doing yoga, etc then waste my time trying to make someone like me(which coincidentally is exactly what I did with my Mom my whole life)

"You cannot be lonely if you like the person you're alone with."
Wayne W. Dyer

[Methuen]

Methuen,
The big question is: How can we stop enabling the behaviors of disordered people? I believe it is by working on our own self esteem to the point, that it becomes second nature to surround ourselves with healthy people and to automatically set boundaries with disordered people as soon as the disordered behaviors become apparent. It seems you are on the road to a healthier level of involvement with your mother, as you feel more comfortable setting healthier boundaries with her, which does not enable her, just makes her more responsible for her own decisions.

There's a lot packed into this paragraph.

You are right about the "big question".  Honestly, I think we all end up with slightly different solutions because each of us and our pwBPD is unique, therefore unique solutions, or "tweaks" on common solutions are needed.  Looking back on my past 3 years, I would have to say the hardest has been boundaries.  To have to put boundaries in place with a mother is beyond the comprehension of probably 95% of the population ( guessing at the %). Almost nobody except family members of other pwBPD and psychiatrists/psychologists/clinical counsellors can understand.  

You mention that for us to stop enabling their behaviors we have to work on our self-esteem and boundaries.  I agree.  My question is what comes first?  Or are they concurrent?  I wonder if this is a chicken and egg question.  Do the boundaries come first because that gives us the space to finally start working on "ourselves"?  Or does the self-esteem come first, so that we have the gumption to set boundaries and see them through without caving when the extinction burst comes? Personally I think we have to find a way to do both.  This is very hard as it takes time, energy, $$ (T), and a whole lot of grit.  It's exhausting.  But so is the alternative of being the doormat and slave of our pwBPD.

It's sounds like you have made progress disentangling yourself from your friend.   And it sounds like the silent treatment from your disordered family members lends a more peaceful feeling than their abuse. 

[zachira]

Methuen,
I learned a really valuable lesson when I had to hire an attorney to defend myself against my NPD sister's lawyer who was top notch and from the best law firm in the region for the legal issues involved. I went through a couple of lawyers before I found the right one, after many recommendations from local people and other respected local lawyers, and after having learned to ask the right questions. I realized my challenges involved being trauma bonded to narcissists and not valuing myself enough to do the deep dive to find the right lawyer and really communicate with the lawyer to let him know how to best represent my interests. The more we value ourselves, the easier it becomes to set boundaries, even though we face having the abuse increase for awhile, known as an extinction burst, to get us to go back to the old ways of enabling the abuser/abusers. I have struggled considerabley with gaslighting myself because of all the flying monkeys my sister has cultivated since we were children, and the family's unwritten rule that everyone has to fall in line in worshipping the golden children and using the scapegoats as dumping grounds for the family members' internal frustrations. I think working on boundaries and self esteem are done at the same time, and one cannot do one without the other, and they reinforce each other.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Yesterday, I met with my neighbor (the woman, not the man who did all those comments about me having nothing to do because I was a stay at home mother). She is home right now, had a baby two months ago or so, and she wanted to get together with her oldest and my kids. Have some company. I said sure, we usually have nice small talks and she seems genuine in who she is.

So we hung out and had some good discussions, really. She confided in some of her current struggles, how she doesn't really like where she lives and is looking for ways to feel better here, how she had anxiety, did psychotherapy. About her father, her mother... So I opened up a bit too about my mother, what I'd learned. It seems precipitated, but then, we have been talking with each other a few times a week, 15 minutes here and there for three months... And I didn't go in details, wasn't laying it all out, wasn't in a victim tone... More like a casual : hey this is me, kinda talk, I said something about how I value my independance because she was asking about a stay at home mom group I created... I was honest about my journey and who I am. We talked about our kids, parenting. We differ, but I didn't sense any judgments on her part.

So I felt it went well. I felt grounded and honest, and I don't really care how I looked. I was myself. And I know she had a good time too, and enjoyed the realness of our talks... But here's where it gets weird...

I still feel there is maybe something up, something unhealthy about the whole thing. And I don't know if it is just me and my trauma, or if there really is something that is triggering my intuition. Like something tells me I can see her BUT should keep a safe distance. The problem is : I have no idea how to keep a safe distance?

Also... Is it that I always think I should keep a distance, or is it a genuine intuition because my unconscious is seeing signs that my conscious mind cannot yet put into words? Has anyone else experienced this?

The only thing that comes to mind is:
- when her husband comes out of their house, it seems to me she acts threatened. It is true that her husband and I have the same profession so we do have a similar mind and things to talk about, but I make conscious effort in talking to her more. I have NO interest in her husband and am happily married. And something feels off.

- at the end of our meeting yesterday, she mentioned she liked the authenticity and couldn't tolerate someone playing behind her back. And it was said with a weird tone, like some kind of warning? And I just said: yes well.. who does? Wished her a good day and left (I was leaving when she said that anyway). It's not so much what she said but the way she said it, but then : I truly am sensitive to those mood switch, so I am just not sure if the mask lifted a second there, and if it even is a cause for concern. I just don't want to end up a weird triangle dynamic between her husband, her and me that I am unaware of. It happened before with a couple of friends and I hated it.

- I did notice a tendancy they have for perfection. And I see it as the flight response, I recognize myself in those behaviors. I am learning to let go, and I don't know that they are but I don't care. It is not my business nor my life, I can just observe that something about me triggers them (but not always, they still seem to act nice and to want to talk to me?). It sometimes feel like there is some kind of competition sneaking it, upon which I will not embark, because like I said : my main goal right now is to stay WITHIN. I am turned inward, and am trying to keep the outside buzz OUT. I am taking care of my needs, my feelings, my thoughts, and striving to be myself, which I do feel I am achieving more and more.
 
- I do not feel the same dynamic with my other neighbor, at all. But I saw her less often and it's more chitchat than anything else.

I don't know... I hoped writing this would help me see more clearly and come up with some protective boundaries. And maybe it did...

Do you agree that looking inward, keeping the noise out, should be enough to protect me from any disordered behaviors, should they turn out to be real? I am still keeping the door opened to the fact that I see it as worst than it is, or will get. But I can't help but think there really is something off... Intuition VS projection. This is my challenge here.

And also that it seems to me that all friendships must come with some kind of struggle or challenges?

[zachira]

Riv3rW0lf,
One of my biggest lessons has been when I feel something is off with a person it usually is. I have noticed I feel comfortable being myself and have better emotional boundaries around people who are healthy to be around. With the disordered people there is always that underlying feeling that something is off. The biggest red flag for me, is that the disordered people really never see me for who I am or have anything genuinely nice to say about me that is true. I have had what I thought were friendships start with too many personal disclosures that are things one would only share after developing a close friendship over time or were things that really would only be safe to discuss in therapy.  

[Riv3rW0lf]

Riv3rW0lf,
One of my biggest lessons has been when I feel something is off with a person it usually is. I have noticed I feel comfortable being myself and have better emotional boundaries around people who are healthy to be around. With the disordered people there is always that underlying feeling that something is off. The biggest red flag for me, is that the disordered people really never see me for who I am or have anything genuinely nice to say about me that is true. I have had what I thought were friendships start with too many personal disclosures that are things one would only share after developing a close friendship over time or were things that really would only be safe to discuss in therapy.  

I have to say that she is a family doctor. So part of her profession is to hear people talk about them, and using her as a therapist. I didn't do it, I didn't open up on anything deeply personal, nor talked about anything I struggle with. I was feeling pretty well and grounded and I didn't confide anything that felt like exposing my vulnerability. She did most of the talking... I am thinking maybe because her relationship with people is so straight to the point most of the time in her career, that she may find it easier to open up and talk about real things straight away? Maybe she struggles right now and have no one to listen to her too. I didn't feel like she was acting like a victim either, just healthy venting really.

Basically it was fine and dandy until that comment about playing in her back and the weird dynamic with her husband. Maybe I am just picking up on something between them that has nothing to do with me... But it is steering me the other way, because I am not interested in being in the middle of it, whatever "it" is.

She was telling me how they started running because he found himself fat and uncomfortable in his body. I simply said (my favorite phrase it seems to avoid traps nowadays): don't we all?  

But come to think of it, maybe it was some kind of unconscious fish, like having me say something like: really? I don't see why!

See, now I am overreaching, lost in superanalysis mode... Gonna drive back to healthy adult  

My husband says I think too much about those things. I think he may be on to something. But then, his vision is maybe not as blurred as mine is. He asked me : do you feel good when you see them? I said: not really, neutral/bad vides. He said: there you go, that should be enough to stand clear of them.

But part of me just have to dive deep and understand the dynamic and what is happening.. to grow probably. 

[zachira]

I am wanting to make and keep healthy friendships, and let the ones go that are more about where I was before I faced how trauma bonded I am to certain kinds of people.
I was thinking today about this friend with the PD and how on several occasions throughout the years we have known each other, she got upset with me for talking about a former colleague who clearly had Asperger's who was demoted from her job, and viewed as incompetent by the whole staff except for my ex friend who defends her. I was perplexed as to why she could not see what everybody else gets about the woman with Asperger's and her inablity to do her job. I also recently ran into a woman I was once friendly with who constantly complained about her boyfriend. It seems a big part of having healthy friends is listening to how they talk about other people and being aware of what kind of people they choose to surround themselves with and whether they get people or not. The friend with the PD does not want to be criticized in any way, so she refuses to acknowledge the obvious with the former coworker with Asperger's who was a nightmare to work with, as all the employees paid way less than she was did her job for years. It seems with the second woman that she is unable to let go of relationships she is unhappy with.
The healthy peope have a positive regard for others, until there is some genuine reason not to, though their healthy boundaries usually turn off the wrong people early on, and attract and keep the right kind of people in their lives.

[Riv3rW0lf]

The healthy peope have a positive regard for others, until there is some genuine reason not to, though their healthy boundaries usually turn off the wrong people early on, and attract and keep the right kind of people in their lives.

I want to agree with this, but I sometimes worry I will myself never reach this point.

I have moved around my whole life and never had any real friendship that lasted. When I did make friends, I would end up changing school and would have to start all over again, and so, it seems to me I could never learn how to make long lasting healthy friendship.

As a result, I find myself both on high alert, scared of people and also craving connection, something real, a tribe of my own. Alas, it seems I can never find it. There is always something tipping me off.

I open up too much, too fast, then I feel uncomfortable with myself in front of them. I open up too much too fast because I crave connection. I feel uncomfortable with myself because I acted in a socially awkward manner that might result in them not wanting a friendship with me because it is too "heavy".

A lot of healthy people do not want drama. They want things to be light and casual. To laugh and be happy. And I can achieve that maybe one time out of five. .

I am socially very awkward.

I just spent a weekend at a couple of friends house with my children. Our children love each other very much. And I had nothing to say. But when I said nothing, I started thinking they will think I am weird or too serious. So I put pressure on myself to speak more, resulting in awkward conversation I really didn't want to have. I found myself overanalysing and feeling bad about the whole weekend, only to realize I probably also put them off with my social anxiety. It wasn't them. I was the issue. Focusing on them instead of talking about me would have likely made all of it much better. I just opened up too much, looking for safety, validation, and those are both things I have to provide myself with.

I've come to the realization that I have no idea what a healthy friendship is and how to develop one.

The truth of the matter is : I know I am healthy to be around for friends. But I feel I come accross as someone who isn't? My husband himself often tells me : "I love how awkward you are." And it is not meant to be mean. I see what he means. I always end up losing myself in philosophy, science, theology, and those subjects repulse many people. I have a hard time with sustained small chats or happy chats. I can do it, but not on a continuum. I end up feeling tired and nervous and overall uncomfortable.

I find it hard to connect with most people and then I hate myself for it. Maybe I am just not meant for friendship. Maybe some of us are meant to walk a more lonely path in life. I am not unhappy, I have a loving husband and two wonderful children, and I can stand on my own. But I sometimes wonder where my friend went, if that makes sense. Like I am supposed to have one, but we lost each other when we entered the world.

I can only belong when I filter myself.

As I finished writing this, my company partner wrote me to have coffee via webcam, since I've had to move away in January, and yet another healthy friend whom I loved stayed behind. Story of my life it seems! And even with her, I filter myself. But she is one of the rare ones who never seemed put off my it.

Anyone else always filtering themselves? About what they truly love and think?

[zachira]

Riv3rW0lf,
It seems the challenges you have with making friends are more common that you might believe. Do you know if you are an introvert or extrovert? Introverts need alone time to recharge and are drained by being around people. Extroverts recharge with people and feel something is missing if they have too much alone time.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Riv3rW0lf,
It seems the challenges you have with making friends are more common that you might believe. Do you know if you are an introvert or extrovert? Introverts need alone time to recharge and are drained by being around people. Extroverts recharge with people and feel something is missing if they have too much alone time.

I am an introvert. But I think my struggle goes beyond that of introversion. And I know it is related to the exclusion schema... Like  I am not fitting in and the fact that I have most probably more mirror neurons that some, making me deeply aware when I triggered someone with what I said, or when they don't agree but won't say it... And I'd rather they say it, because it makes it unbearable for me at times to know I messed up and it staying in the covert world.

[zachira]

Riv3rW0lf,
You might want to try meditation. For a few years, I have been doing meditation. It seems when I made my decision to leave my family, it freed up a lot of energy. I am finally calmer, and no longer an emotional eater. I find doing at least an hour of meditation around four times a week helps me to process my over the top emotions from being abandonned, and abused by my family and their flying monkeys, and healthier people are more interested in being around me and the disordered people lose interest in me more quickly.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Riv3rW0lf,
You might want to try meditation. For a few years, I have been doing meditation. It seems when I made my decision to leave my family, it freed up a lot of energy. I am finally calmer, and no longer an emotional eater. I find doing at least an hour of meditation around four times a week helps me to process my over the top emotions from being abandonned, and abused by my family and their flying monkeys, and healthier people are more interested in being around me and the disordered people lose interest in me more quickly.

Yes Zacchira, I can see how doing meditation one hour daily would help in being more centered, and less impacted by the emotions of others, or at least less triggered and less confused...

I find it helpful only to learn that you know what I am talking about. What you call the emotional eating. It is a good way to phrase it.

[Riv3rW0lf]

Ha ! I just realized what you meant by emotional eating. I had something else in mind.. like eating the emotions of someone else. My bad.

But I am glad and happy to hear you are doing better. It takes a lot of discipline to practice self-care, and it sounds like you really took yourself in charge. Thank you for sharing your experience here. I  have to remind myself that growth comes in wave and that what feels like "steps back" are really only new wisdom and knowledge about myself that become conscious.

[zachira]

Riv3rW0lf,
You are right that the growth comes in waves. Sometimes the pressure to grow and change can be overwhelming, and it can feel like we have hit rock bottom. Somehow we get to a point with the disordered people in our lives, that we can't take it anymore, and the only choice is growth so we don't attract more similar disordered people, and start to feel worthy of having healthy relationships, despite having to grieve so many lifelong losses.

[lm1109]

I find it hard to connect with most people and then I hate myself for it. Maybe I am just not meant for friendship. Maybe some of us are meant to walk a more lonely path in life. I am not unhappy, I have a loving husband and two wonderful children, and I can stand on my own. But I sometimes wonder where my friend went, if that makes sense. Like I am supposed to have one, but we lost each other when we entered the world.

I really relate to this and it does make sense to me...I recently wrote in my journal and told my husband about something I had never spoken about: As a child I would catch myself thinking "I want to go home" VERY OFTEN. I would be in my bed or somewhere "at home" and would think it...so of course I was confused by it...but it never stopped and I thought it ALL of the time. Looking back it's as if I always, at some level, knew that I wasn't "home" and that I wasn't with "my people" and I longed for "them" and I longed for "home"

For me...it didn't help that my brother, who was 4 years older, seemed to easily make friends everywhere he went. He was loud, funny and the life of the party. He had tons of friends and I felt left behind by him and I felt very inept because I never had the ability to be that way. I was extremely introverted(into art, writing, and music) and was socially awkward when I was young. This led to my eating disorders and marijuana use...I just wanted to "fit in"  It never occured to me until later in life that my brother's need for everyone to see and love him was ALSO a defense mechanism. I only say this...because I realize now that just because other people may be better at social situations doesn't mean that they are better off emotionally. A few years ago my husband and I lost his cousin to suicide(like my brother) and she had a similar outgoing social personality as my brother... outwardly she seemed absolutely perfect...and it was shock to everyone who knew her. It made me wonder if maybe sometimes certain people get really good at being around others because they are afraid of being alone with themselves?

I also open up too much and I am reaching a level of acceptance that I may never find another friend who is truly willing to swim alongside me in the deepest end of the pool. I probably wouldn't want to "go there" either...but that's where I was thrown into in this life...and so I will swim...deeper and deeper until I find the answers and closure that I am looking for and need.

My husband gets mad(jokingly) when I say that my theme song is Green Day's Boulevard of Broken Dreams...it came out when I was in highschool and it helped me after my sexual assault and hardest teen years at "home" with my parents. And although I feel like I am making positive strides...to this day...it secretly runs through my head when I feel like I've had a failed attempt at a social situation or feel "alone". I find it comforting...because "alone" is not so bad when I am kind to myself and my inner child self...it's not so bad when I feel peaceful and at ease.

Riv3rW0lf,
You are right that the growth comes in waves. Sometimes the pressure to grow and change can be overwhelming, and it can feel like we have hit rock bottom. Somehow we get to a point with the disordered people in our lives, that we can't take it anymore, and the only choice is growth so we don't attract more similar disordered people, and start to feel worthy of having healthy relationships, despite having to grieve so many lifelong losses.

I know that this was meant for Riv3rwolf...but this really hit home for me! Well said!