Setting boundary

[captain5024]

My wife has occasional BPD traits.   Recently I was assigned a work trip and my wife accused me of having an affair.   She became very angry and passive aggressive.  I did not like her behavior.

I did not have an affair.  I have not had an affair.  An emotionally healthy spouse would not think an affair was taking place. 

My wife attempted to control, I told her again her behavior was not acceptable.   She got more upset and told her the recent vacation we were planning on would not include her, because of her behavior.   I told her when she behaves like this I will temporarily leave and I will not be around her.

I did not invalidate.  I did not validate either, because she was never direct with her fears and asking questions causes even more anger.

The only thing to do is not be subject to her behavior.   Life goes on. 

She even texted a mutual friend, accusing him of encouraging me towards divorce.   He has not.   I am currently not considering divorce.

Any other tips?   

I will not be subject to behavior approaching emotional abuse.  I will not allow my life, job, plans and other (healthy) relationships to be disrupted.

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[kells76]

It would be so hurtful to hear your spouse -- the person closest to you in the world -- accuse you of infidelity when you've been faithful. That's really painful. These are not easy relationships to navigate; there can be a lot of hurt built up.

I did not have an affair.  I have not had an affair.  An emotionally healthy spouse would not think an affair was taking place. 

She has real and serious emotional limitations. Trying "normal" ways to resolve conflicts may not be effective.

My wife attempted to control

What exactly did that look like?

I told her again her behavior was not acceptable.   She got more upset and told her the recent vacation we were planning on would not include her, because of her behavior.   I told her when she behaves like this I will temporarily leave and I will not be around her.

It sounds like telling her that her behavior is not acceptable -- is not effective and doesn't de-escalate things. There may be more effective ways of dealing with false accusations -- you're not alone here in dealing with them.

I did not invalidate.  I did not validate either, because she was never direct with her fears and asking questions causes even more anger.

That's a really important insight to have. I'm glad you shared that observation.

BPD is a real and serious mental illness that can show up with profound relational and emotional impairments.

We would never expect a spouse who was missing legs, or who used a wheelchair, to go on long hikes with us, or to reach something from the top shelf for us. If we had those expectations, that would be an "us" problem for not accepting reality, not a "them" problem for the impairment.

If you believe BPD is in the mix, then expecting your wife to be direct about her fears is a "you" issue, not a "her" issue. It's a feature, not a bug, of BPD, that pwBPD aren't going to express their fears/feelings skillfully. (I'm not saying "it's healthy/good/fine in a relationship not to be direct" -- I am saying "what is real in your relationship right now is that she is not direct")

The only thing to do is not be subject to her behavior.   Life goes on. 

She even texted a mutual friend, accusing him of encouraging me towards divorce.   He has not.   I am currently not considering divorce.

Any other tips? 

What would you say your goal is in that situation?

What are some overall goals you have in your marriage?

[captain5024]

Attempting control...

"I am not allowed to go to certain places for work.

I better not come home tonight. 

I better find a lawyer."

Yeah, whatever toots...

In the past I've attempted to deescalate using various methods.  I have never been successful.

Goals in marriage...not to have these episodes disrupt my life significantly, change my plans significantly.   If they continue and/or are permanent, divorce is a possibility.

If I could deescalate I would.   I've tried validation, but it has not worked for me.  Minimizing contract with her during these times is the only way to escape.   These episodes have occurred throughout the 4 year relationship.   I sometimes may be months without issues.   They usually last for one week or less if I don't respond.

[captain5024]

What are some other options at dealing with false accusations?

I've leaned not to JADE. 

In this scenario when she made the accusation I said, "I am at work and nothing more". 

Didn't seem to deescalate.   

The other thing is my work can be stressful and demand my full attention, so if she can not control herself I have learned to just say "I do not like your behavior, or your behavior is unacceptable".

[kells76]

Attempting control...

"I am not allowed to go to certain places for work.

I better not come home tonight.  

I better find a lawyer."

So does she text this to you? Call you on the phone and say it? Say it personally to you? convey it some other way?

Is she blocking doorways, blocking your car, threatening violence?

Just getting a better picture of what this usually looks like.

In the past I've attempted to deescalate using various methods.  I have never been successful.

What would deescalation look like to you?

Goals in marriage...not to have these episodes disrupt my life significantly, change my plans significantly.   If they continue and/or are permanent, divorce is a possibility.

Tell me more specifically about how these times when she has communicated "don't go to ____ for work, don't come home tonight, get yourself a lawyer" have disrupted your life/changed your plans. Is she threatening suicide if you do those things, is she standing behind your car as you try to leave, etc. Or is it more the flavor of "she's going to yell at me when I get home if I do _____ when she said not to".

This isn't minimizing this kind of stuff -- it is so, so difficult. Again, it's more for me to get a better idea of where the hurdles actually are. Sometimes the hurdles are inside of ourselves, with our own discomfort and fears; sometimes it's that plus DV; sometimes there are frightening threats, etc. Sometimes a safety plan is called for first, sometimes not and instead we work with ourselves first. Just depends.

If I could deescalate I would. I've tried validation, but it has not worked for me. Minimizing contract with her during these times is the only way to escape.   These episodes have occurred throughout the 4 year relationship. I sometimes may be months without issues.   They usually last for one week or less if I don't respond.

Can you give an example of when validation didn't work?

Sometimes we think we're validating but we're actually inadvertently invalidating .

[kells76]

What are some other options at dealing with false accusations?

I've leaned not to JADE.

That's really good. You've probably read here somewhere -- before we can start making things better, we have to stop making things worse. Ending JADE-ing is a great move to stop adding fuel to the fire 

In this scenario when she made the accusation I said, "I am at work and nothing more". 

Didn't seem to deescalate.   

I'm not surprised that the response didn't de-escalate the situation.

To be frank, she felt unheard.

Listening for the feelings behind her words will be a good next skill to build.

Put yourself in her shoes. If you really believed -- if it really felt true -- that your spouse was having an affair, how would that feel? I'm not saying what is true or what anyone is actually doing. I'm really getting at -- how would it feel, if it were happening (which it isn't)? This is a critical distinction for having a chance to have effective communication.

I know that if I believed my husband were being unfaithful to me, I'd feel: betrayed, wounded, discarded, and alone, to name a few.

What might be happening is that because pwBPD struggle to connect how they feel to what is actually going on, they may have a feeling, not really identify that it is happening inside themselves (as they struggle to have a sense of self), and try to look out in the world to see what might be "making them" feel that way. My hunch is that your W is feeling lonely, alone, and/or afraid, doesn't have the skills or sense of self to say "this feeling is coming from inside of me", and tries to come up with a scenario that would make sense of how intense the feeling is. What could possibly make someone feel so alone, so abandoned, so betrayed? Well, an affair, right?

Can you imagine living a life where huge feelings came up inside of you, you had no idea why, and it was hard to identify that it was your feeling? It would be a terrifying and destabilizing existence, and you'd be deeply driven to find external (stable) reasons for your feelings.

I suspect that's going on (likely subconsciously) for your W.

When she says "you're having an affair, aren't you", she's expressing feelings behind those words. When she hears "I'm at work and that's it", her feelings haven't been heard and she escalates.

What are some other options at dealing with false accusations?

What if you responded with a validating question or comment?

Remember that validation is not:

-agreeing with her no matter what
-making her feel better
-appeasement
-saying the words to check a box/move things along
-being positive
-saying "I hear you, but..."
-you having to believe the same things
-giving the correct information
-correcting misperceptions
-having your say
-patronizing her
-smiling and nodding, but seething inside
-etc

True emotional validationis putting yourself in her shoes, thinking of how you would feel if you really believed what she says, and finding common ground that way so that she really feels like you heard her feelings.

Validating questions and responses to "you're having an affair, aren't you" could be:

"Oh babe... you think I'm cheating on you?"

"That would be so painful to think I would do that"

"Even though I'm not, that would be frightening to believe I was"

"Yeah, sometimes people do worry when their spouse is away"

"You think I'm having an affair? Are you worried that I don't love you, or might leave?"

(Body language and tone are really important here, too -- these are genuine questions that pay attention to her, not sneering/sarcastic "I can't believe you actually think that").
...

If you believe she struggles with BPD, then your task is to be the emotional leader in the relationship. It's a lot and it won't feel fair -- but she's "emotionally blind" and cannot lead the two of you out of where you find yourself: you're deeply hurt by her accusations and defend yourself; she feels unheard/blown over and increases hurtful low skill moves to get a hearing. Someone has to end the cycle; if she has BPD, then it's time for you to emotionally take the lead and set the tone.

Hard stuff. Any thoughts?

[captain5024]

Thank you for the replies.  They both got me thinking, a lot.

There has been a lot of hurt built up.  I do feel this pattern has occured enough where I am beginning to lose interest.  I certainly don't have the "passionate" reactions to it (a good thing) like I did in the past because I think I'm beginning to get tired.  Each episode chips a little bit away at my desire to be creative or try to assist, to be present.

My wife will text these things, phone call, say them personally.  In the past she prevented me from leaving and became violent -- this has not happened in the last several years and I don't think will happen again (progress?).  She will block me from her phone and lock doors (tonight).

What does de-escalation look like to me?  Maybe slight self awareness on her part, at least enough where she can acknowledge her anger, fear, where the 6 year old behavior stops, the abuse/neglect, angry words, etc.  Acting like an adult (a little bit, at least).  She can be angry, she can even not want to talk to me very much...but de-escalation would be having a little bit of control over her behavior.  A little bit of awareness of her surroundings.

In the past these events have totally disrupted life.  At times, our relationship has ended with no-contact by me for a series of months.  I am partly to blame for these escalations, being in the drama triangle and responding in ways that made the situation worse (invalidation).

It's though to validate with her, at least for me...because she won't say at all why she is upset...yet she clearly is...a switch is flipped and her personality changes.   So, initially I have to guess why (or if) she is really upset.  "Are you angry at x, y or z?  I feel you might be depressed, or anxious...is something bothering you?  Do you feel I did something wrong?"   These don't seem to work, because she will get so offended and upset she will end up blocking me, not allowing me to talk, hanging up the phone, storming into another room, locking the door, etc.  However, in her rage the truth may come out why she is so upset.

I had a lot of issues with hypochondria in my life.  That is similar to BPD because they are illogical feelings that are out of control and destructive, but it is rage inward.  I do not understand the treating a significant other so poorly -- or not going to therapy even when it has been strongly encouraged.  I do see a therapist periodically and have been in great therapy in my life -- because treating people poorly is really PLEASE READty, whether or not it is intentional.

She has never been suicidal or threatened it.  While she does drink too much at times, that seems cultural.  She stops/abstains when it is required.

She is Latin American, and this behavior seems somewhat common in her country -- which is why I'm hesitant to call it BPD.  However, when she engages in this behavior with me, not only is it something I've grown tired of dealing with (life is hard enough and short enough as it is), it makes me very unattracted to her.  It takes a long time to get back into the swing of things -- it is an extreme rupture in the relationship.

It is difficult to validate when someone isn't willing to listen at all -- in fact, I find it impossible.

[captain5024]

A mixture of good and bad the last 24 hours.  I've come to the realization for any hope of significant improvement there must be a long-term commitment with a qualified professional. 

So, she has been given an ultimatum out of love and caring, although she sees it as revenge and hatred. 

Maybe she will come around, but in the interim I've decided the status quo is unacceptable.

[kells76]

So, she has been given an ultimatum out of love and caring, although she sees it as revenge and hatred. 

What did that look like?

[captain5024]

Similar to taking a bottle of vodka away from an alcoholic. 

Time will tell.   It will be addressed at her next MD appointment next week.   The MD is already notified.  PwBPD wasn't happy about that -- sometimes life is disappointing.

[kells76]

I think what I'm curious about is more like who said what, kind of like a movie script:

You: blah blah blah
Her: response
You: blah blah blah

Etc.

   It will be addressed at her next MD appointment next week.   The MD is already notified.  PwBPD wasn't happy about that -- sometimes life is disappointing.

What do you hope the outcome will be at the doctor appt?

[captain5024]

Me: For the relationship to function properly I'm requiring we involve professional psychological help and make a long term commitment to changing our dynamic.

Her: You are stabbing me in the back, this is revenge, control and manipulation. 

Me: I love you.   This requirement is from love and I want us to be better.  To help.

Her:  I hate you.  I can't believe you did this.  I want a divorce.   Get out.

Me: I love you and I'm not leaving.   Therapy is a requirement for our relationship to continue, we've tried to change this on our own and the pattern repeats.   

(Snip, etc. etc. same comments all day, same response all day).  Eventually exhausting and reluctantly agreeing to therapy.   She came down at the end of the day and moved on with daily chores.

The MD appointment I'd like the doctors assistance in recommending a qualified professional, although I can get a list as well.  The MD is from my wifes originating country and speaks the same language... I'd like the MD to hear a couple of our stories and agree that professional help is needed.   Her opinion carries quite a bit of weight with my wife.

Things I want to improve:

1. Being the stable rock, the supporter.  But not becoming/being a caretaker.

2. Stand my ground.   There is simply no way the relationship will continue without professional help.   Repeat in a loving yet firm manner this is out of love and caring and respect for the relationship. 

3. Improving my validation skills.  It is very hard for me when the mental state is built on such delusions and her mouth is so vile and harsh.   

So, we've had some success the last few days.   I can see validation work, I can see my wifes need for emotional direction from me...sometimes I get and fail.  Other times I try and it works.    I really need to be aware 100% of the time what is going on in her head behind the scenes before I can give my best response.

It's a delicate dance, but the script that plays out is textbook.

[captain5024]

She has agreed to therapy and I think we have found a therapist that seems to be a good resource for the problem at hand.   I’m happy and for now I see some significant process towards a better future.