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Author Topic: Does Splitting Black turn Back, to White?  (Read 36998 times)
lurchlookalike
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« on: February 08, 2010, 01:15:11 PM »

I understand that par for the course when involved with a BPD goes something like: 1) You can do no wrong; 2) Inevitable conflicts begin to ensue; 3) You're eventually assessed as completely evil and can do nothing right (for long). I think this is referred to as splitting black, or black & white thinking, with the non-BPD partner always ending up as the "bad guy" in time. You start out as a knight in shining armor, and gradually become the devil himself in their eyes. Unless they get help, this is the typical way it goes.

This seems to be the course I've observed although it's hard to say how much I'm reading into it. Question is once you have been "split to black", does their perception ever reverse itself to being perceived as white again? Or, is this "split to black" a more or less permanent mental verdict?

Thanks again in advance!

x
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movingon1

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« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2010, 01:36:54 PM »

My experience is that you are split black for a long time.  I have not seen my BPD ex wife in 9 months but any email contact we have had has been negative.  She just blames, blames, blames.  It does not get any better until they find themselves dumped again by whomever they were with after you and they might try to get you back.
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lurchlookalike
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« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2010, 04:56:19 PM »

Yep, that's how it looks to me too. It's like when this rigid stereotype sets in, while there may be minor remissions, that's it. You're labeled as bad.

Gracias Amigo.
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unknown
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« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2010, 06:08:41 PM »

this is something ive been wondering since i started learning about BPD, and from all the research ive done, it seems that there is no permanent split. because if they can split you permentaly black, wouldnt they be able to split you permentaly white as well?  it seems like the split and how long it lasts depends on many differnt thinigs such as how close you are with them, what stressor happend in the person with BPDs life that made them split you,  who there seeing instead of you at the moment... .etc. it seems like it all depends on whats going on in THEIR life and dosent have anything to do with you even if you try as hard as you can to make them like you again. like movingon1 said, if her new relationship with the person after you dosent work out, i could imagine her seeing you as all good again because she would be abandonded by her new guy. but while shes with the new person, what reason would she have to seeing you as all good when somone else is in that place? untill she starts splitting him too... .

i know it sucks but thats how it seems to work.

i know that its hard to find logic to borderlines actions, but thats the best i got from doin alot of research on splitting.  

if anyone wants to correct me on anything i said, feel free  because im still learning.
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lurchlookalike
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« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2010, 11:04:01 PM »

Thanks unknown, I can see that too. It may in fact key in on another party even if that would be a

family member filling the "all good" void. That's really perceptive on your part and even though I think I am in fact "split black", there is another "split white" that is likely filling that particular need. I'm just guessing though.

Your analogy is very logical. Thank you!

C







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GodofNietzsche
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« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2010, 08:26:46 AM »

It does not get any better until they find themselves dumped again by whomever they were with after you and they might try to get you back.

I agree, I think my ex has recently started to paint me white again.  We went over a year with NC between us.  Before that, I did try to reach out to her to bury the hatchet, only to get stepped on.

But out of nowhere she wants to be friends.  After some thought, I decided to talk to her.  She sounded excited to talk to me.  She also informed me she hasn't had a boyfriend since me, and wants to go to dinner if I'm in her area.

Strange, after over a year, you'd think they'd just detach even more.  Now she wants to re-engagement, and even see me.  nothing's changed between us, only her own perception.  Oh, and the no boyfriend thing is a big clue to me.  I love playing second fiddle to her inability to find someone else.  Unless she's realized that I was a good boyfriend and I did everything in my power to make it work.
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unknown
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« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2010, 07:29:30 PM »

^ thats pretty suprising
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jalk
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« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2010, 05:05:17 PM »

I feel once you're black you're black. In the event that the new found love of their life doesn't work out... .and that is always the case in an untreated Borderline... .she/he will be looking to attach onto someone else, immediately. My ex, she's something. She looks for the next victim while still in the relationship so she doesn't need to skip a beat. She wanted to have a friendship with me after she left me but in reality, she wanted to lead me on... .I know that. I don't need a friend like her. She lies and cheats for starters. Who would want that in a friendship? Not me. So, my feeling, I'm black. She is probably curious to know what I have been up to or if I have a new love... .let her wonder. Just know this, if by some small chance you become white again, you will become black in the future. Do you want that? Ugh!
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unknown
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« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2010, 05:43:22 PM »

I feel once you're black you're black. In the event that the new found love of their life doesn't work out... .and that is always the case in an untreated Borderline... .she/he will be looking to attach onto someone else, immediately. My ex, she's something. She looks for the next victim while still in the relationship so she doesn't need to skip a beat. She wanted to have a friendship with me after she left me but in reality, she wanted to lead me on... .I know that. I don't need a friend like her. She lies and cheats for starters. Who would want that in a friendship? Not me. So, my feeling, I'm black. She is probably curious to know what I have been up to or if I have a new love... .let her wonder. Just know this, if by some small chance you become white again, you will become black in the future. Do you want that? Ugh!

well your only speaking from whats happening to you in the present. you dont know what will happen in a couple years. right now im completly hated by my BPDxgf and it feels like she will never ever split me white again. but after reading all about re-engages, and how splitting works it seems completley possible for her to try to get you back at sometime in the future. ive read about a BPD women who broke up with her boyfriend, got married to someone else for 4 years, divorced him and had a couple other boyfriends then tried to contact the first guy again

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atwittsend
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« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2010, 05:54:12 PM »

my ex paints me black and then white again all the time. 
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unknown
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« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2010, 05:58:02 PM »

my ex paints me black and then white again all the time.  

yeah thats how it seems to work. its just the time limit of how long a split lasts seems to depend on certain things. if a split was permanent, and i mean PERMANENT. like untill you die of old age, then there would be stories of BPDs splitting people white permanently too and dating a borderline would be a 50/50 shot at you getting the PERFECT girlfriend or the WORST

splitting is a defense mechanisim to deal with certain situations. but life is ever changing, and situations can change at the blink of an eye.

saying that a split can be FOREVER just dosent seem logical to me.

once again, this is just my opinion after reading about BPD for the last couple of months and getting lectured by a physchologist about it too.

if anyone wants to correct me, feel free.
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« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2010, 06:16:54 PM »

I agree with you.  I never thought about it in terms of any absolutes though.  like permanent splitting black doesnt mean they are capable of permanently splitting white to me. 

you are viewing this with too much logic brother!  there is no place for logic in insanity.   ;p

"splitting is a defense mechanisim to deal with certain situations. but life is ever changing, and situations can change at the blink of an eye."

this is right on man... . 

all my opinion! 
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jalk
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« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2010, 06:27:13 PM »

I've been with the understanding that the way a person becomes white is when the Borderline person NEEDS something from you. In other words, whatever they need at that moment in time ... .you fit the bill, you got the job. In my case, I feel the only way she would paint me white is if she has no other options. I would be sloppy seconds until someone else comes along, and then she will leave. Push/pull; push/pull.
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unknown
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« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2010, 06:27:47 PM »

I agree with you.  I never thought about it in terms of any absolutes though.  like permanent splitting black doesnt mean they are capable of permanently splitting white to me.  

hmm i dont know. ive heard alot of stories where people said that the splitting white and splitting black are both extremes. they both are part of the disorder. didnt you find it weird how much they LOVE you in the begining?

i was pretty shocked when my BPDexgf treated me like God. it was almost to the point where it felt uncomfortable haha. it seemed like she was actually obessed with me at one point.  but now she seemes to be the COMPLETE oppisite. so if one way could be permeanent, why couldnt the other one be permeanent too? there both part of the disorder.
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atwittsend
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« Reply #14 on: February 10, 2010, 06:33:31 PM »

but there is no norm or consistency.  its all whimsical to them.  its like a plastic bag floating in the wind... .it could be heading north but at any moment the winds change and it goes west.  and this wind can be any one or more of a thousand different things... .  (work, kids, news, stubbed toes, cant find a website) i dont think permanent belongs in the BPD handbook... .the only way away from them is stone cold NC established and enforced by the non.  I am scanning my brain to find one person who has been painted black permanently in here.  lets say even five years... .  gods example of one year sounds pretty extraordinary to me.  that tells me she was distracted for an entire year which boggles my mind.  mine cant stay focused for ten minutes.   
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unknown
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« Reply #15 on: February 10, 2010, 06:39:41 PM »

but there is no norm or consistency.  its all whimsical to them.  its like a plastic bag floating in the wind... .it could be heading north but at any moment the winds change and it goes west.  and this wind can be any one or more of a thousand different things... .  (work, kids, news, stubbed toes, cant find a website) i dont think permanent belongs in the BPD handbook... .the only way away from them is stone cold NC established and enforced by the non.  I am scanning my brain to find one person who has been painted black permanently in here.  lets say even five years... .  gods example of one year sounds pretty extraordinary to me.  that tells me she was distracted for an entire year which boggles my mind.  mine cant stay focused for ten minutes.   

yeah exactly. i dont think there is a permeanent at all in BPD. if there was, she would have loved me FOREVER like she said   

but yeah, it seems like anything can change it. and for the people who say that there ex split them black permenantly, you dont know the future. mabye at the moment shes not talking to you, but who knows what could happen down the road when one of her other relationships is failing or failed.
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atwittsend
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« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2010, 06:40:29 PM »

yup... .  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)
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GodofNietzsche
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« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2010, 08:38:59 AM »

I've seen others who've been re-engaged after a  year.  Actually i've seen two others posted recently about that.

You could say mine was distracted.  But truth is we had a really bad falling out, so that probably kept me black for a very long time.

If it was distraction it's because she got her first job out of college and moved to NYC.  I think that is definitely enough to kept an attractive, young girl distracted for a year.  But, she hasn't had a boyfriend yet, so maybe she's realizing something, like "how come I can't get a boyfriend?"

I think its possible to return to white.  But, I believe it would be hard to maintain being white for long. You'd constantly have to be on top of your game for that to happen.  So, the cycle will probably just return.
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« Reply #18 on: February 11, 2010, 08:46:40 AM »

To be honest, once I have made the move to totally disengage, I will be past caring if he thinks in black, white or technicolor! I will no doubt be the evil one, so I might as well keep that attitude!
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GodofNietzsche
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« Reply #19 on: February 11, 2010, 09:10:44 AM »

To be honest, once I have made the move to totally disengage, I will be past caring if he thinks in black, white or technicolor! I will no doubt be the evil one, so I might as well keep that attitude!

I think that's a great place to be, beyond caring how he feels about you.  I think I take being painted black way too personally.  It was just a matter of time before it happened.  It just sucks when you try so hard and as a result, they label you as evil/bad.  I used to think, wow, I must have done some bad things to deserve this.  It took a while to question whether I really deserved it or not.
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unknown
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« Reply #20 on: February 11, 2010, 07:22:46 PM »

To be honest, once I have made the move to totally disengage, I will be past caring if he thinks in black, white or technicolor! I will no doubt be the evil one, so I might as well keep that attitude!

I think that's a great place to be, beyond caring how he feels about you.  I think I take being painted black way too personally.  It was just a matter of time before it happened.  It just sucks when you try so hard and as a result, they label you as evil/bad.  I used to think, wow, I must have done some bad things to deserve this.  It took a while to question whether I really deserved it or not.

im sort of in that stage now =(  thats why ive been researching so much about BPD latley haha. its the only thing that helps me really keep my sanity.     

sad isnt it?  im only 19 
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atwittsend
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« Reply #21 on: February 11, 2010, 07:40:22 PM »

I look at it as a positive unknown.  when I was 19 I was an idiot.  you have an advantage getting in and out of this quickly and relatively intact.  if you look at yourself and your choices you can avoid this in the future.  keep your head up bro! 
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jalk
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« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2010, 09:21:53 PM »

I think my ex has me black and you know what? I don't care! If she wants to make me white? I still don't care!

I know what happens when you become white... .you get black all over again. Who needs this? Who has this kind of energy to want this kind of person in their life? I really don't care what she thinks after what she has done to our relationship. The deciet is too much to bear. Unreal!
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unknown
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« Reply #23 on: February 12, 2010, 12:21:02 AM »

^^^yeah really. she may split you white again... .but then what? you become black again? who want ssomeone in there life where all sudden your completly hated by them and nothing you did was ever good enough?

so stupied. thats one of the main reasons ive been trying to avoid this girl. i dont need someone like that in my life.
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« Reply #24 on: February 12, 2010, 08:11:47 AM »

To be honest, once I have made the move to totally disengage, I will be past caring if he thinks in black, white or technicolor! I will no doubt be the evil one, so I might as well keep that attitude!

I think that's a great place to be, beyond caring how he feels about you.  I think I take being painted black way too personally.  It was just a matter of time before it happened.  It just sucks when you try so hard and as a result, they label you as evil/bad.  I used to think, wow, I must have done some bad things to deserve this.  It took a while to question whether I really deserved it or not.

OH gosh, you know I still question things all the time. All I can think of is 're-engagement, re-engagement, no!' I still feel like I have done something bad, but then I think of the abuse and the pain and the lies I had to tell people about the marks on my body. It takes time to leave, and to be brave enough to leave, but you have to think about YOU! You will still think about anything bad you have done in your life and link it to the way that you have been treated in your BPD relationship, but you have to remember that NOTHING you have done should make you believe that you deserve the crap that you no doubt are getting/have been subjected to. Good luck with everything!  x
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lurchlookalike
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« Reply #25 on: February 12, 2010, 01:11:08 PM »

I hear all of this.

I was used to people liking me, and over time this negative treatment may have taken a subtle psychological toll. I'm a guy so don't have to worry about the physical abuse in this case, but verbal in some ways is worse. There's a saying in the Bible, and I have no idea why I remember these things, but it goes something to the effect: Don't fear those that kill the body, but those that kill the spirit. That is what I think we are dealing with here.

You know, I went to a class reunion after many years of no contact and what struck me as odd was how much my old classmates appeared to love me. I was shocked. It was all smiles, talking about funny things we used to do, nothing phoney and no forced conversation. It seemed so authentic and real that I was absolutely dazed for weeks.

Constant accusations that you are bad may take its toll with time, even on a strong positive person, and possibly even if you don't believe them. It's difficult to assess that from the inside looking out.

Happy Valentines Day & Thank You!



lurchlookalike
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« Reply #26 on: February 12, 2010, 01:52:41 PM »



I thought i was painted black completely and forever, but in the back of my mind i wondered if come January, would he follow his usual pattern and be ready to quit whatever relationship he was in now and perhaps appear on the radar again.  I seriously didn't think he would, but wondered... what if!  Almost a year to the date he broke up with me in a semi-permanent fashion, he pops up on the 27th January speaking to me on msn.  He broke up with his ex on the 20th jan 2007, me on the 22 jan 2009 and appears on 27 Jan 2010 while in a new relationship.  Completely bizarre behaviour.  It seems my ex never paints anyone black forever, they are always in some way, painted white or at least a creamy shade of eggshell!  The chronological pattern is weird and i don't know if he simply has a good side/bad side... end it attitude to relationships and it somehow ends up coincidentally happening in the same months or if he is a weird ritualistic relationship annihilator.
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« Reply #27 on: February 12, 2010, 02:23:51 PM »

I dont know if ya necessarily get "split white" again, but I dont think theres a time beyond which, you can say " well, I guess shes got me completely out of her system."

The woman who made me look into BPD, was someone I went through the complete cycle with twice . It made no sense till I found this place. I've been split black over 3 months now. At first it about made me crazy. It gets easier with time.

Looking back over my life, I've had one other relationship I'd describe as  very deep and intense. we were on and off for years. With the knowledge i now have about this disorder, Ive in the last few months come to think she may have BPD to some degree. alot of the behavior seems in retrospect to fit. about 24 years ago, she and I were togther again, she wanted to meet me to talk at a resturant, we met, we were going to go for a drive and talk. She said to me, " just a second, I wanna go back in and get my jacket. I left it inside. " She went back inside... .and left through a back door, I never heard from her again... .UNTIL... .

Guess who I got a one line email from recently?  Yup, her.

Dont really know if this one is BPD or not, but if she is, I guess it would prove that ya dont really know how long they can stay out of sight and then pop up again

Very strange... .
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lieslieslies
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« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2010, 01:24:40 AM »

this is something ive been wondering since i started learning about BPD, and from all the research ive done, it seems that there is no permanent split. because if they can split you permentaly black, wouldnt they be able to split you permentaly white as well?  it seems like the split and how long it lasts depends on many differnt thinigs such as how close you are with them, what stressor happend in the person with BPDs life that made them split you,  who there seeing instead of you at the moment... .etc. it seems like it all depends on whats going on in THEIR life and dosent have anything to do with you even if you try as hard as you can to make them like you again. like movingon1 said, if her new relationship with the person after you dosent work out, i could imagine her seeing you as all good again because she would be abandonded by her new guy. but while shes with the new person, what reason would she have to seeing you as all good when somone else is in that place? untill she starts splitting him too... .

i know it sucks but thats how it seems to work.

i know that its hard to find logic to borderlines actions, but thats the best i got from doin alot of research on splitting.  

if anyone wants to correct me on anything i said, feel free  because im still learning.

hi "learner",

I think what you have learned so far is absolutly right, congrats.

3L
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lieslieslies
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« Reply #29 on: February 14, 2010, 01:32:38 AM »

It does not get any better until they find themselves dumped again by whomever they were with after you and they might try to get you back.

I agree, I think my ex has recently started to paint me white again.  We went over a year with NC between us.  Before that, I did try to reach out to her to bury the hatchet, only to get stepped on.

But out of nowhere she wants to be friends.  After some thought, I decided to talk to her.  She sounded excited to talk to me.  She also informed me she hasn't had a boyfriend since me, and wants to go to dinner if I'm in her area.

Strange, after over a year, you'd think they'd just detach even more.  Now she wants to re-engagement, and even see me.  nothing's changed between us, only her own perception.  Oh, and the no boyfriend thing is a big clue to me.  I love playing second fiddle to her inability to find someone else.  Unless she's realized that I was a good boyfriend and I did everything in my power to make it work.

hi g,

personaly I would not take that for granted, as it is just when they say that they havnt been together wirh someone, they have, sorry.

3L
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« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2010, 07:44:13 AM »

I just wanted to add some things about permanently being painted black or white. The splitting thing, and with the extremes, is the pattern, but I don´t think it is as easy as to say that black or white is just opposite things to one another in a person with BPD. As I have understood a person with BPD have core feelings of fear and shame as a root to their behavior and because of that I think that a non could get painted black forever but not white since painting someone white forever wouldn´t be possible in connection with the deep-rooted shame and fear, but panting someone black for ever might be possible. As written by jalk, when they feel they need something (attention, drama, sex, whatever... ) they might go from black to white, but since the fear and shame is still there it goes back to black again. And also there have been many posts here that tells the story of increasing of splitting over time, the closer you get the harder they have to cope with their feelings. What I mean is that the splitting is connected to their core feelings of fear and shame, and to the trigger of intimacy.
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iwillsurvive
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« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2010, 08:40:03 AM »

BPD have core feelings of fear and shame as a root to their behavior and because of that I think that a non could get painted black forever but not white since painting someone white forever wouldn´t be possible in connection with the deep-rooted shame and fear, but panting someone black for ever might be possible.

This is interesting, Stargirl. So, in your opinion, do you think that they could paint you black forever because they got so close to you that the fear and shame were so great that they disappear forever?

I'm about 4 months NC and my exBF has not tried to contact me once.  We were getting soo close (after 6 years on/off together) and seriously talking about moving in together.  I often wonder if this has painted me black forever.  Would he be that fearful forever to never contact me again?
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« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2010, 09:16:07 AM »

posted before but same thing, hoe to get shiny white again ?

hi all,

I would be so happy for your input concerning my endless years of

lying about my amphetamine missuse, as that is a part of the illness

with that drug, "oh no dear, me, no I haven´t taken any", but that was

my only lie to her in accordance with hers flooding lies, cheating etc.

and she always used that against me as a feder to do her lying to me,

as "if you lie about that I can lie back to you".

after some years I gave myselff an ultimatum, and believe it or not (true),

I succeded to get out of it, AND HERE COMES the quiz, then she call us of,

when her point earlier to everyone has told them she made it to get me sober

and I even spend time in jail for her, with the "purpose" of straighten me and

my drugged brain clean. but when that actually happened it seems like her

efforts was only a cover-up and good to have as an "exchange" to hers going

round my back with all her hit_-lying. and finally I ask you all, who probably asked yourselves, WHAT had happen if I had made my deal earlier, would we lived happily ever after ? that is the hardest of all questions after relation ends... .or... .

pks give your point of view on this subject.

a bit traditionell maybe, as if WHAT HAD HAPPENED IF I CHANGED THIS AND THAT... .GAGA GAGA

but still, I loved her then and I miss her due

3L wish for the   Idea
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« Reply #33 on: February 14, 2010, 09:19:33 AM »

Hi iwillsurvive.

I think that that´s possible, yes. Of course, people with BPD differs from person to person, as the rest of us, and also things like how the relationship ended, and if they have someone (or many... ) new to hang on too would play a part, but yes, I think it´s possible to become painted black forever because of getting too cloose. I would guess that a non can become like a walking trigger to a BPD, and then I guess having that person splitted black would be the "safest place" for a BPD to be in. But I think it´s importent also (for our own healing... ) to not read too much in to not beeing contacted again because of the lack of object constancy/"out of sight out of mind" (yes, I know, it hurts like hell!... ).
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« Reply #34 on: February 14, 2010, 09:38:41 AM »

Thanks, Stargirl.  I'm trying to not read too much into it, but I have a lot of free time on my hands lately (unemployed) and I tend to think about this situation with my ex WAY more than I should, even though I do tend to keep myself quite busy.

He abruptly left me one day.  No explanation.  I don't think the object constancy would apply in my situation because we are neighbors.  So... .I'm not really out of sight/mind to him, even though I haven't seen him face to face since October.  (well, one time when we were driving down the street and he waved fanatically at me and I just kept on driving).

Anyway, I now he is disordered.  I know something isn't right.  But, I do miss him.  Especially on a day like today. 

Thanks for your insights.  Always great to read this board and get a different perspecive.

Happy Valentine's Day!

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« Reply #35 on: February 14, 2010, 10:14:20 AM »

I know what you mean iwillsurvive, it´s easy to think about it way too much...    I´ve been 7 months out from a one year relationship with an unBPDbf, the ruminating was horrible in the beginning... it´s much better now but sometimes, especially when something else is hard or when some special day comes up (like new years eve, or like now, when both mine and his birthday are just around the corner... ), then it´s hard to keep the thoughts away... .

In my case it was I who ended the relationship, and that at a point when we where "working on our problems" (I put the " there because I can see now that he wasn´t working on any problems, I guess he was mostly occupied with getting a new woman hooked... ). I think he felt soo much that I betrayed him and not the other way around (I´m black = he´s white!). I also live cloose to my ex but not like neighbours, I find it hard that every time I walk out the door it´s a real risk that I could bump in to him. I feel with you and your situation, it must be hard to be as cloose as neighbours. I think you did a really good thing when you just drove on when he waved at you. Stay strong and take care!

And happy Valentine´s day to you also! 
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« Reply #36 on: February 15, 2010, 12:37:02 AM »

Well, I guess this thread is about dead so let's end it on a positive note (but by all means keep it going if you like).

You know the old saying: "Once you go black, you never go back". In my case at least, I'm afraid that is true.

Bought her a box of of dark chocolates last night after she said she never wanted to see my ugly face again. Now who could say a thing like that? Look at my picture gosh damn it! I always thought I was slightly cute, despite the marginal dental work. I think Dad did pretty darn good for a veterinarian.

Hey, Happy V-Day

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« Reply #37 on: February 15, 2010, 01:15:04 AM »

im still sure that one never stays perminent... .thats the whole point of splitting but whatever haha (that it switches from loving to hating)
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« Reply #38 on: February 15, 2010, 06:15:07 PM »

ever* hah
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« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2010, 03:46:41 PM »

I think you are likely quite right about that unknown. I am in effect permanently "blacklisted" but if I ever bought into the dysfunctional dynamics I possibly would be returned back to white. I just can't quite do that though, so black I'll probably stay.

Thanks for all the replies. Good ones.

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« Reply #40 on: June 14, 2011, 05:53:28 PM »

Hey Everyone,

I made sure I found the trigger to have myself painted permanently black! Don't get me wrong I loved my wife, or maybe just the hopes and dreams, but I finally got her to hate my guts because my health was falling apart.

My wife is a field RN, so I wrote a nice letter to the doctor she works with in order to see if he might be able to convince her to seek professional help if she may need it. I put in a little explaination to how she mentally abuses her 12 year old daughter, and to do it for the child if not for my BPDw. You see, my BPDw use to try to make me jealous by talking about him all of the time. She would tell me how he says she looks very stunning the way she dresses (and get a load of this one) how good her butt looks in the jeans she wears when they go on patient visits.

I thought about that she may try and sue me for libel, but I didn't say anything malicious; only concern. I also didn't write that she has the disorder, but may have the disorder. I basically did it for the child that is my stepdaughter. Her daughter is becoming just like her mom, and I'm concerned she is going to grow up and go out to ruin other men like us and herself. I know this made sure she hates my guts now because she will become embarrased even though she will distort the facts!
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« Reply #41 on: June 14, 2011, 06:02:33 PM »

I've been split both several times.  Oddly it seems that when get thoroughly fed up and I leave him in an extreme way, I'm split from black to white immediatly.  But as soon as he gets me back I'm black again (well as soon as the first thing he doesn't like happens, within a week I'd say). 

When we're appart we can be great friends, but as soon as we're back together he suddenly thinks he's entitled to the world and completly forgets the promises and how 'perfect' I am.  Back to Black.
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« Reply #42 on: June 14, 2011, 08:13:22 PM »

I think they can go back and forth with the splitting. I am basing this on my exuBPD and her "friends" which consist of 2 people. She split both her friends black and they stayed black for years. Then, because she felt she had no friends, she would split them white and start contacting them again. I am sure I am back as cole to her. I did not allow her to keep coming back into my life after she left. I ignored her completely. NC. She called me "mean and nasty". Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #43 on: June 15, 2011, 04:30:03 AM »

Im not sure what to think of this as my exBPD said to me that the only thing that would make them happy is for me to stay out of their life, I don't see a reconciliation to this one, I've been tared and feathered. What possible reason would he have to contact me again after all the nasty things he said and he lives in another state. ?
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« Reply #44 on: June 15, 2011, 08:45:42 AM »

You know, I don't even care anymore.   Smiling (click to insert in post)  And I like that I don't care.  What he thinks of me is not even a blip on my radar.   He is nothing in my life now but a mistake which became a profound learning experience.  I fell into a black hole and I had to climb out.  The end.   Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #45 on: June 15, 2011, 09:10:20 AM »

My wife made her 2 daughters BPD. Her daughter that is 12 years old and her older daughter that is 28 years old. I lived with the younger daughter for 2 years, and she use to paint me black when I tried to bring her up in the right manner (which her mother didn't want me to do) then paint me white when I was going to get her ice cream, or take her to the movies etc. My BPDw's older daghter is painting her husband black right now probably because the 12 year old is there for the summer, and trying to get her 28 year old sister to give her all of the attention because she is attention starved by my BPDw. When I went to visit the older daughter on our first Christmas the 12 year old got me alone in a room because she wanted to talk to me about how I'm giving her nephew more attention than her. You see, when my BPDw and I lived together the 12 year old would ask me for hugs every 5 minutes of the day because her mother only gave her minimal attention. It was purely sad. I think my BPDw's older daughter is going to break her marriage of less than 2 years with 2 kids. From the way she is talking on facebook it sounds as if she found someone else. It's a shame!

BPDs are breeding out there, and I wish we could put a stop to this, but I think the population is going to continue to grow. Ouch!
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« Reply #46 on: June 15, 2011, 09:49:36 AM »

Excerpt
She looks for the next victim while still in the relationship so she doesn't need to skip a beat. She wanted to have a friendship with me after she left me but in reality, she wanted to lead me on... .I know that.

And this is why many of them (as in the case of my ex) would be flirtatious with scores of men on facebook, so that she could easily secure a date when things inevitably go wrong with her and her latest shiny object. And not to mention doing this to p!ss her boyfriend off, keep him jealous and on edge, and make him work harder for her affections.

And true about the post friendship deal: I saw where she was trying to lead me when she tried to friendzone me, and it wasn't a pretty place at all. By trying to friendzone me, she was telling me in code speak, that I wasn't worthy enough to be her boyfriend, and I was going to be thrown in her man servant dungeon to suffer as she rubs her new rebound r/s in my face.

Seriously twisted stuff, but hey, they're seriously twisted people who need to be avoided like the plague.

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« Reply #47 on: June 15, 2011, 04:17:23 PM »

I've been split both several times.  Oddly it seems that when get thoroughly fed up and I leave him in an extreme way, I'm split from black to white immediatly.  But as soon as he gets me back I'm black again (well as soon as the first thing he doesn't like happens, within a week I'd say). 

When we're appart we can be great friends, but as soon as we're back together he suddenly thinks he's entitled to the world and completly forgets the promises and how 'perfect' I am.  Back to Black.

My ex does this too.  He seems to push me away and if i go after him, he pushes further.  If i leave him to it or walk myself, he comes after me.  no sooner has he got me back on side, he starts a fight out of nothig and blames me, then tells em he wants nothing more from me etc.   He split me black for a year (during which time he was seeing a new girl) and only contacted me again 2 months before his new gf broke up with him, so he must have known it was coming and was basically lining me up again to take her place.  1 year and 4 months on from contacting me again, he's split me black again, same process as previous, same old words, same old behaviours, same old ignoring and becoming more and more distant... .same old swearing he's not seeing anyone new.  This time though, i'm not crying and pleading for answers from him, i'm leaving him to it.  On one hand i'm thinking he'll tire of waiting for me to run after him and he'll apologise and pull me back in, or, he'll find someone new, if not already linig them up and move on for another year.  Who knows. 
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« Reply #48 on: November 16, 2011, 01:50:42 AM »

Ok I'm an idiot.  Spent $4,000+ on stupid psychics just begging for insight into this woman.  (No I don't have faith in those things), but nobody understands what I'm dealing with either - except you guys. 

I realize every person with BPD or not is different.  The black-splitting is unbearable.  To see/feel someone you love unconditionally hate you (esp when you're never even given a valid reason as to WHY), is a living nightmare.  You don't wanna see this person as a "stranger", but its hard to face the fact that THIS is a part of them too. 

I'm very ego-driven & was almost intimidated by the "white times", trying to remind her I'm NOT perfect, but she wouldn't hear it.  She'd say "maybe you're not perfect but you're perfect for me".  Boosted my ego sky-high after coming out of a marriage where I was cheated on like a schmuck.

I know we NONs can't fathom their logic, nor can they ours.  That's why we stand at opposite sides of the walls & neither knows how to breach into the other.  Its the NON who keeps trying while they slap our hand away, making the struggle even worse.  Do any of you know if BPDs want us to "chase" them or not?  I've asked her this myself many times & no answer.  Also, something was mentioned here abt how they sometimes never give your material stuff back.  Much of mine has been destroyed (only bc it meant so much to me & I found out later).  Do they keep certain items as "trophies" like some serial killers or what?  This is a legit question.

I also believe our concern is wanting to be painted white again bc we know we did nothing wrong to become the dreaded black, hoping for a chance to redeem ourselves (though we often have no real guilt - just perceived by their unfair trials they've placed us on).  BPDs are judge, jury & executioner while we are held prisoner by their emotional shackles.  There is a known stat out there somewhere that describes the psych behind how some kidnapped ppl or actual prisoners develop some "attraction" to their captors, simply bc they come to rely on them for things bc of their situation.  Use this metaphor to see these shackles that are invisible to anyone who's not involved with a BPD S/O.  How do we take the paintbrush out of their hands?

In my case, I'm totally addicted to this woman.  I genuinely love her for all the times she can elate me & return my love.  Yes I know "addiction" is a strong word & I understand the implications of it. 

Its depressing to read other ppl who are stuck doing this same dance I am.  My heart & spirit break not only for myself but for her.  Yes, I am a prisoner, but how do you love the queen without becoming one of her subjects?  I've invested so much & lost so much but this isn't a business of win/lose.  Its the desire for fairness, to be treated equal, respected.  Most of us hold onto hope to one day be fulfilled by this person.  The odds are against us but I think we're all strong ppl & good communicators here on these forums.  The biggest part I hate reading abt BPD is the hopelessness concerning what we're all looking for:  a fair chance to become "white" again. 

Does anyone have realistic suggestions for provoking a white spell again?  Since the splitting, I've been black for 8mo, with only slight glimpses in between.  Relationships shouldn't require strategizing tactics, but I feel helpless not trying something each day.  So each day that passes, I feel like I've failed.  Thanks
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« Reply #49 on: November 16, 2011, 02:10:23 AM »

Well, I'm sorry you're in that place WF, I understand how you feel.

I've found that YES they do want you to chase them, whether they allow you to catch or not. Also that I can't really have a serious healthy relationship with the woman I married. I can listen to her, ride the waves, watch her turn vindictive at the drop of hat, come in laughing a few minutes later, etc., etc. on and on.

In order to really engage in conversation there has to be an understanding between the two of you, in my case it just is not there. She has no idea what I'm about even after decades of marriage.

To have a relationship and to be painted "white" again I would have to join in the dysfunctional dance with her, and I just can't do that, not for very long anyway. It's a big acting out game and truly like a rollercoaster with vicious outbursts always right around the corner, spaced by periods of relative calm. I get the feeling she prefers the rage and is naturally drawn to destructive patterns of dialect, no matter how many times it produces a negative outcome.

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« Reply #50 on: November 16, 2011, 09:33:11 AM »

my ex paints me black and then white again all the time. 

Mine too, currently he is in love again so I'm Satan's daughter.
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« Reply #51 on: November 16, 2011, 09:43:32 AM »

It goes in one-two week cycles with my STBX. She has me split black right now... .Telling me how great her life is without me in it and filing bogus harrassment charges and whatnot. Give her two weeks, and she'll call me and start begging for a reconciliation.

Always the same, always predictable, like clock work. I hope she finds a new target soon and gives me a break!
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« Reply #52 on: November 16, 2011, 10:27:15 AM »

CANTALOPEZ - describe the "dance" you refuse to do & does not participating prolong her crappy behavior - simply bc she doesn't get what she wants?

I agree:  it takes 2 willing participants for conversation.  However, "silent treatments/ignoring" is NOT an acceptable method.  They have the power to p1ss us off thru LACK of participation.  For me, this is worse than being yelled at or smeared.

Been a wk since mine suggested a call.  I have a busy schedule & when I've inquired abt potential times for this "call",  she's "busy not ignoring", "phone died", "sick", "at the ER", "working", etcetc... .Tries to make me feel stupid for asking.  I used to let her promises affect what I was doing all these miles away, but not anymore.  Its confusing, but the reason she avoids talking it bc she's seldom able to treat me "in person" the way she does hiding behind written words.  Real emotion is in her voice & its like a totally different person.  I've told her this makes me feel really stupid, then I get angry, next thing ya know, I'm. A "stalker".  Told her a million times if she wants me gone forever, she doesn't have to tell me twice.  Only been asking for 8mos now.  Longest we've been with NC is 2 days.  In fact, there's a pending NC agreement that's supposed to commence following this "call" she's supposed to make first.  Yeah right... .doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that one out. 

So for those who've been engaging in these relationships a long time (who've learned the "patterns", can you give us some time frames for how long the black/white phases last for you?  Do you feel anything gets "accomplished" during the white, when you have a better chance at talking to them abt what's important? 



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« Reply #53 on: November 16, 2011, 10:34:56 AM »

Mine, will bring me back to white in her mind, but then when she sees me, Im the trigger to her shame, so I go to black ... .and the conversation doenst end well.  On the phone isnt to bad, but its the in person thing that is her trigger. 
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« Reply #54 on: November 16, 2011, 11:19:49 AM »

Do they keep certain items as "trophies" like some serial killers or what?  This is a legit question.

one of two things or both, from what i gather.

1. object constancy issues. it's a way of remembering you, and/or feeling connected to you.

2. often, keeping those belongings is a door they leave open to reconnect. mine, whenever we'd "break up" (happened 10,000 times) she'd demand all her things back with this huge list, and she'd want it all in pristine condition, and i'd tell her to shove it. it was really strange to me that after our breakup, she didn't seem to care about her things at ALL. she always claimed her mom would want her to get those things back. things like a tv screen/computer monitor and a playstation. when i learned about BPD i instantly decided this was a door she was trying to leave open, and i tried to force the exchange of our belongings, which never happened, which, now that i mention it, brings me to reason number 3.

3. the exchange of belongings triggers their abandonment issues. they're also usually terrified to see you or run into you, and have no idea how to act. so... .this would best be avoided for them.
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« Reply #55 on: November 16, 2011, 11:47:22 AM »

Strange thing is, I am sure not whether I have been painting black ever. My ex was a waif. Sure she gave me silent treatments and the hurtful 'jokes', but that could be more about control. She never spoke bad about me to others (AFAIK). Even after our final b/u she never spoke bad about me. It seems though that after the final b/u she has erased me completely from her memory. She has not mentioned me to anybody, not even our b/u. I had to inform her friends when I met them about our b/u. Also right up until the end the (intense) idealization continued, it never stopped.
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« Reply #56 on: November 16, 2011, 01:53:45 PM »

Do any of you know if BPDs want us to "chase" them or not?  I've asked her this myself many times & no answer.  Also, something was mentioned here abt how they sometimes never give your material stuff back.  Much of mine has been destroyed (only bc it meant so much to me & I found out later).  Do they keep certain items as "trophies" like some serial killers or what?  This is a legit question.

   Although the illness shows many simular traits, they are all somewhat different. Just as our levels of codependency are different. As far as chasing, its the same, some do, some dont. In my case, narcicism seems to be in play. Not coming to me, but dangling carrots, in front of me, in the oddest ways, and times. Just makes me go ?, and laugh. How bad do they need to fill thier hole. Whose available. Whats going on. Its exhausting, just trying to think of all the different scenerio. Logic into crazy, once again. Yes they seem to keep memorabilia, but dont alot of people, BPD or not ? It all seems to make just a little more sense (not much) when you relate it to a 5 yr old. Or maybe my 1 yr old dog. Many more parallels in thinking, than an adult.

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« Reply #57 on: November 16, 2011, 02:03:49 PM »

CANTALOPEZ - describe the "dance" you refuse to do & does not participating prolong her crappy behavior - simply bc she doesn't get what she wants?

That's a good question but I don't know if I can describe it in a few words. It's like I can tell where the conversation is leading (argument, ambush, triangulation (read definition) with kids, etc.). When I see it going there, which is often, I just cut it off, leave if I can, change the subject, walk away. After years of experience it's easy to see this coming. You can't really be honest, you must watch what you say, when you say it, how you say it, and more often than not just don't say it at all. For me, it's more agreeable to disengage when I see the trigger of rage about to be pulled. And yes, this disengagement will piss her off too, just not quite as explosive (usually).
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« Reply #58 on: November 16, 2011, 08:03:14 PM »

One week after my exBPDbf broke up with me out of the blue, I saw that he and his ex girlfriend who was previous to our r/s became friends on facebook. I was not cyber stalking him, but rather I saw the friendship pop up on the live feed... .I was SHOCKED! It only took ONE week after breaking off our 3 year r/s to befriend his ex? This is the girl that he claimed hurt him, that he despised, who was "troubled", who supposedly cheated on him, stole from him and was basically "no good" according to him. He also said that their r/s was an "on again, off again" and that she was bi polar... .Hmmmm kinda sounds like the pot calling the kettle black!  In retrospect, I realize that all of the horrible things that I had heard about this woman, was a result of splitting her black! And now, I am the one who is probably split... .I know for a fact that she had contacted him during our r/s and because for the first year, I felt very  secure (he was idolizing me at that stage) I did not feel strange about the fact that she had contacted him. I later found out that she was probably texting him and "keeping in touch". NOW, I truly wonder what else was going on and if he had her lined up prior to breaking up with me... .It makes me sick to my stomach to feel so betrayed. The fact that he even considered becoming "friends" with her doesn't make sense with all of the negative things that he told me.  It makes me feel like my r/s with him was nothing but an illusion.

So, to give my opinion on splitting black then back to white... .yes! I saw it happen right before my eyes. I'm sure that if my ex hooks back up with the "psycho exgf" that it will eventually turn sour again, and then he will have another reason to say "poor me". That will be the time that he will possibly reach out to me. As of now, I have not spoken to him since our breakup aside from a few text msgs that he sent to "reminisce" about the "good times" that we had... .then he tried to get flirty with the texts and sext me... .seriously what the heck? 
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« Reply #59 on: November 16, 2011, 09:20:24 PM »

Hi,

Its been 9 months.

It had been 4 months total NC on my part ... .

In those 9 months after finding out she had moved on ... .one day I love you and want to get married and the next she loves someone else ... .like most its been a dance of being painted from black to white.

I had no idea about BPD till about 2 months post RS when i sought help from a doc and T.

In the 7 months since then I have initiated contact zero times. She on the other hand has done it and I fell for it about 7 times ... .not recently mind you. Other attempts even beyond this after 4 months of blissful silence two in the last 2 weeks and numerous other ones to just run into me.

Anyhow ... .total attempts on her side 15 plus.

I know from when i didn't know what I was dealing with I was like many being painted from black to white ... .she loves me she hates me and back again. All of this with zero interaction at all.

Right now ... .again the attempts at contact ... .phone calls with hangups ... .emails ... .turning up where she knew I would be. List goes on and on. Last contact I was actually painted white as her saviour ... .prior to that it started out this way only to end up being the son of satan and painted black again. Again and again.

Honestly I don't care anymore and just wish my ex would stop contacting me in any way shape or form. I just don't care ... .DON'T CARE. Yes I sound like someone with BPD saying this but its a boundry which allowed me to be in an unhealthy relationship in the first place.

All of this is about contact ... .and who cares honestly if your ex in her mind is now painting you white ... .or black. It does not matter. Eventually you will be painted black again as we all were time and time again during the RS.

My experience like most who sadly have had some contact post relationship is yes ... .you go from white to black and back again when their needs are met ... .or if you refuse to be the doormat again... tag your in and black again  Doing the right thing (click to insert in post)

NO CONTACT.


Dont worry about what someone who is menatlly ill thinks about you.

If they are very lucky and seek treatment and keep with it ... .for about 5 years they may actually get a bit better. This was the call on my own ex with 8-9 out of 9 of the BPD traits. Since she is high functioning despite this 8/9 score and see's and accepts zero fault for any problems she will never seek help.


Bottom line ... .NO CONTACT

Sorry but some very painful memories caused post RS by this sort of stuff.

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« Reply #60 on: November 16, 2011, 09:59:30 PM »

It does not get any better until they find themselves dumped again by whomever they were with after you and they might try to get you back.

I agree, I think my ex has recently started to paint me white again.  We went over a year with NC between us.  Before that, I did try to reach out to her to bury the hatchet, only to get stepped on.

But out of nowhere she wants to be friends.  After some thought, I decided to talk to her.  She sounded excited to talk to me.  She also informed me she hasn't had a boyfriend since me, and wants to go to dinner if I'm in her area.

Strange, after over a year, you'd think they'd just detach even more.  Now she wants to re-engagement, and even see me.  nothing's changed between us, only her own perception.  Oh, and the no boyfriend thing is a big clue to me.  I love playing second fiddle to her inability to find someone else.  Unless she's realized that I was a good boyfriend and I did everything in my power to make it work.

Be extremely wary... .My BPD ex of course swore up and down that he hadn't seen anyone during a 3 month split, that he was just focusing on getting better so one day he'd have a shot with me again.

Then I ended up with an STD from one of the girls he was doing drugs and sleeping with.
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« Reply #61 on: November 16, 2011, 11:10:11 PM »

Every person in his world, when I was with him, was horrible -- he said such nasty, hurtful things about them, like his daughter gaining weight and "looking fat" - let's forget that he told me he has always had to fight putting weight on himself.  And then, voila, every person in his world was miraculously okay again.  No one I knew was painted black forever - he couldn't accept anyone was gone for good.
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« Reply #62 on: November 17, 2011, 02:14:06 AM »

It really is that simple for a person with BPD to cut someone out of their life suddenly and harshly and move on to their next victim. They have a brain disorder. Think of it like their mind is wired differently. They feel very little if anything about who they were just in a relationship with. We (us nons) are simply nothing more that a disposable resource for them that provided some service (feeling safe, comfort, sex, money, drugs, whatever) for them for a specific time period. They don't really care since in their mind, they most likely have painted us black, blamed us, twisted and distorted the truth in order to project any and all responsibility for the failed relationship on us. If it's all our fault for not living up to their ridiculous fantasy of us being a shining white knight - then we got what we deserved. Shame on us nons for not being able to be whatever they wanted us to be when they wanted! The reality of course is that no one can fill the void in their lives which is why they quickly move on. If they kept us around, they would then have to deal with us trying to make them feel accountable, take responsibility for their own poor choices and abusive behavior. In my case, my exBPDgf told me she "couldn't bear to hear what a bad person she was". The crap she did to me I wouldn't do to my worst enemy!

Do they miss us? Paint us black then white? Short, blunt answer is WHO CARES? IT DOESN'T MATTER! Enough time with no contact and you'll come to realize that. Seriously - I think they miss some of what we provided at times. I think they miss the attention, sex, drama, challenge, etc. etc. They usually have a long list of other ex-soul mates/non's that they can poke in and out of their lives whenever they feel a bit lonely or needy. The reality is that they don't miss us the way we miss them. I really don't think they give a crap about missing the relationship - just missing having some soul mate being available to fill in their endless, needy pit of despair.

Do they hurt? Of course - their life is one great big never ending pit of misery, drama, neediness, and poor choices. I suppose I should only speak about my own exBPDgf. She lives in a vicious cycle of stupidity - constant btching, always hurting, depression, controlling, mad about little things, etc which makes her hate herself and her lives even more. So what does she do to fill that great big empty void? Find some new unsuspecting non to hook up with. My exBPDgf painted me black but still contacts me in different ways of social networks and cell phone. From what I know she is banging her douchebag boss and he is in the seat of a bad storm coming up and she will realize that she should never dip her pen in the company's ink. Thats even worse with a person with BPD. Sure - this new soul mate will be the one and understands them. And within a few weeks/months, the cycle repeats itself. Paint them black, carry more and more baggage on to the next bad relationship, blame the last soul mate for everything wrong in the world, find new people that don't know her so she can play the victim. 

Life moves on. You can't change them. It's very hard to even understand them without having enough time away from the situation. Keep posting. Resist the urge to contact them - trust me - NOTHING good will happen. You didn't cause their issues - they were there way before you & they will be there most likely long after. Focus on the one thing you can change: yourself!

Best of luck in your journey!

BT
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lurchlookalike
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« Reply #63 on: November 17, 2011, 08:47:06 AM »

It really is that simple for a person with BPD to cut someone out of their life suddenly and harshly and move on to their next victim. They have a brain disorder. Think of it like their mind is wired differently. They feel very little if anything about who they were just in a relationship with. We (us nons) are simply nothing more that a disposable resource for them that provided some service (feeling safe, comfort, sex, money, drugs, whatever) for them for a specific time period. They don't really care since in their mind, they most likely have painted us black, blamed us, twisted and distorted the truth in order to project any and all responsibility for the failed relationship on us. If it's all our fault for not living up to their ridiculous fantasy of us being a shining white knight - then we got what we deserved. Shame on us nons for not being able to be whatever they wanted us to be when they wanted! The reality of course is that no one can fill the void in their lives which is why they quickly move on. If they kept us around, they would then have to deal with us trying to make them feel accountable, take responsibility for their own poor choices and abusive behavior. In my case, my exBPDgf told me she "couldn't bear to hear what a bad person she was". The crap she did to me I wouldn't do to my worst enemy!

I believe you are right on target with that Brad. If you're the man in the relationship it's like living with an alpha male in a woman's body, and a crazy one at that. She wants to be in charge (of me) and it just won't work unless I become dysfunctional too.

It took quite a while to realize what is going on here, but now I do. There are periods of calm but it's not long until the rollercoaster ride begins once again, over what would be such minor events in a normal persons life.

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« Reply #64 on: November 17, 2011, 11:53:02 AM »

Yeah, I know lurchlookalike, it was a hard pill to swallow for me. I was engaged to my exBPDgf and she left me for her boss. But we have to remember, they do tend to come back when their new relationship doesn't work out... Why? because they fear abandonment. I know my ex will be back but I moved on and with someone else now. I still love her yes but she disrespected me in the end. I was good to her and her best friends hate her new man but love me to death. My advice is to move on but if you decide to take your ex back. Take it slow and let her come to you. I would advice her to DBT as they cannot help themselves or a non can help them. They need therapy to do that and sadly... many of them refuse to get help because they dont realize that they have BPD. But if the situation of PUSH/PULL keeps going. Back off and let her come to you and keep it short n kind.

Good Luck!

I joined this because I understand how it worked because I studied my past and the hell she put me through in the last 2.5 years and I didn't full realize it til after the break up and saw all the red flags. In my situation, Im not worried about my ex cuz my revenge on the boss is coming and it through my ex. I will kick back and have my popcorn ready. It be in a few months because my hell didn't start til 3 or 4 months into the relationship so my revenge is coming Smiling (click to insert in post)
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« Reply #65 on: November 17, 2011, 06:36:35 PM »

I studied my past and the hell she put me through in the last 2.5 years and I didn't full realize it til after the break up and saw all the red flags.

I agree with what you say Brad. It wasn't until my breakup with my BPDbf that I found this site and began to put the pieces together... .Then all of the Red flag/bad  (click to insert in post)  that started to really add up over the course of my 3 yr r/s. For most of my r/s I kept looking within myself for something that I had done wrong, or said, or reacted to, to cause the constant dysregulation and push pull behavior. But the abrupt way in which he "dumped me" left me to wonder how deeply disturbed and ill he really was... .The way that he so easily discarded the "love of his life" made me question how anyone in "their right mind" could just do that... .Sometimes it takes some distance from the situation to truly see how ill the pwBPD is and how toxic the r/s was. So many things that ocurred with his behavior now at least makes sense because it is exactly what everyone on here is talking about and has experienced. I know that I am wounded from this experience and r/s but with the support and help on this site, I will be ok.

The sad part is that in the beginning when my ex began to display some strange behavior and mood swings, I thought he was depressed. He was open about having suffered from depression throughout his life so I just thought he was suffering bouts of it. But there was something MORE than just depression. The thought processes and the constant switching his opinions and feelings towards people that changed so drastically from like to hate. I joined a depression supporters support group a year into our r/s because I thought that was the issue... .but he is definitely a pwBPD. I don't know that he is being treated for it or has been officially diagnosed. He fits the majority of the characteristics.

All of that being said, I just wanted to agree that it has taken me some distance to truly see how ill he is and I am sure that in time, once his next r/s fails (and it will) that he might contact me. Sadly he also split me black with his children... .I do not know what he has told them, but his daughter, that I was extremely close too began treating me differently just weeks before he broke up with me. It was strange and yet know I understand why. Because he split me black and made sure his kids were on the same page before he broke up. That way he wouldn't have to do any kind of explanation about why he broke up with me if I was a "bad person"in their eyes... .
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« Reply #66 on: November 17, 2011, 08:13:39 PM »

mermaid8, Im sorry that you went through that. I feel sorry for everyone who suffered from the hell that their exBPD put them through. My ex was not horrible but with 3 to 4 months, she got clingy and controlling and got mad if i was out with friends or with my own mother! She started to blame and tell me I didn't love her and that I would leave her and never take her back. In the end I wanted her back but I realized that I deserved better. I worked in the same building as she did but different design firm and the drama became too much and I end up quitting a great job and moving back to my hometown to get away. She soonly started to blame that I was the reason the relationship ended and that she is with her boss now. My ex has no clue that she has BPD. She suffers greatly in depression and eating disorder. She was on her meds and in therapy when we were together and I supported her 100% with them. after we broke up. she stopped taking her med and quit therapy and depending it all on her boss. She painted me black but still contacts me because she says that I was the best bf she had but when I realized that she didn't respect me and betrayed me in the end. I painted her black and moved on. It is still eating her alive and I met a great gal that loves and respects me much more than my ex did. I still love my ex but I had to move on because I found out Im much happier now and I know she will never be truely happy without therapy.

Don't beat yourself up on it. Learn from it and move on. Life moves on and trust me, you sound like a great person and there is someone out there waiting for you and you will find him someday and you will get the love and respect you deserve. I did and Im telling you that you will. I didn't think I would for few months after she broke it up. You have a big heart and use it to someone who deserves your love.

I can understand what your saying about his children. To me it sounds like they are used to it and that they switch their mind into because they were basically trained to. A good example will be "Monkey see, Monkey do". I feel sorry for them that they have to see that but Im not saying that all BPD parents are bad or that all children of BPD do that but what I mean is that from what you say, it sounds like that.

Yes, My ex never went back to an ex of hers but that was because they treated her like crap and I treated her the best. she might come back but I have moved on and the question you will have to ask yourself is if he comes back and wants another chance. ":)o you want to go through the hell he put you through again and will he do it again and paint you black?" That what I would do if my ex came back if I was single at that time.

I never got an explanation about why she broke it off and left me for her douchebag boss but I have accepted the lost and moved on. They don't know why they end things fully because their mind is like a child. From what I read, you are a wonderful person for supporting him and expecting nothing in return but got betrayed. You deserve better my friend. Its really not your lost, its theirs. You could been the best thing they ever had and they could lost it forever. We know that we were the best and ever will be. Keep in mind. Nothing is ever enough for them. Its how their relationship cycle works. (Sweet/Controlling/Black)
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« Reply #67 on: November 17, 2011, 08:33:50 PM »

And I also realized that we (nons) work harder on a r/s with a BPD than in a normal relationship. That is another thing to think about as well. Stay Strong! Best of luck in your journey!
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« Reply #68 on: November 17, 2011, 08:58:30 PM »

Bradt, thank you for your kind words of encouragement. It is really uplifting to hear from someone who has been able to find happiness and love after such a toxic r/s. I am sorry that you had to go through your r/s with your ex as I know that it must have been painful. I am glad that you are in a good place now.

I think that for me what I must work on is being able to trust again before I get into my next r/s. Just about everything that my ex told me was contridicted as some point. He contradicted his decisions and his feelings. If he said he loved me and couldn't get enough of me, then another time, he would say that he felt smothered and could't feel anything and was "no good" for anyone.  I trusted that he really  loved me unconditionally and let my guard down and let him into my heart because it felt "safe". I know everyone on this board has been there. Looking back, I don't know what was real and what wasn't with regards to what he said to me.

Another thing my ex did which was completely confusing, is he would be very insecure and believe that every guy was looking to hit on me or had the hots for me when it was not true at all! He was very jeolous for no reason at all! He even claimed that my business attorney was hitting on me when I would tell him various details of my meetings. It was ridiculous! If there was some reason that I might be too tired to meet him, he would get concerned that it was because I "stopped loving him". How juvenile is that? This is why it was so hard to believe that someone who was concerned that I would leave the r/s that He was the one to leave me... .

I am still scratching my head and trying to "make sense" of what happened... .and I know that in time that will go away. It is still somewhat fresh, as our break up occurred 2 months ago. Just about 3 or 4 weeks prior to the break up, he had nightmare that woke him up in the middle of the night. when I asked what was wrong, he told me that he had a bad nightmare that I broke up with him. Certainly doesn't make much sense that after hearing that that he would be the one to dump me with little explanation or shall I say, some really lame-ass reasons that didn't even make sense. If HE was afraid that i would break up... .then why did he do that to me?

Just like your ex, My ex also suffers from an eating disorder. He once weighed almost 350 lbs. I did not know him then. I met him after he shed his weight and was very fit and trim... .But he gained about 60 lbs back during the last year and it threw him into a bad frame of mind. The up and down with his weight has been a constant battle. More so than just someone who has to watch their weight. There is something more behind his reason for eating... .and now I realize that it is BPD.

As for the kids, you made a good point. They are probably used to it. I am the third longterm r/s he has had since he divorced their mom 10 years ago. It breaks my heart that the bond that I had with the kids is now gone. I am just one more female role model that has been yanked from their lives so abruptly. I am sure the kids must be majorly confused because I was pretty much like "part of the family". We even went to Disney together as a family this year. Not to mention their mom lives on the other coast and they only see her a few times a year.

It was good to read your words about finding someone else somedayl Right now I am feeling somewhat hopeless.I thought I had found "the one" finally when I met my ex. This disorder really can do a mind f*** on the nons like us.

If he came back to me asking for another chance, I would have to really sit down and have a talk with him to find out why he wanted to come back. I know that someone does not get cured from this disorder and that it would end up being a repeat of what I have already experienced. So I know that I could not do that. I could not live a lifetime of push pull. I DO deserve better. At this point I don't know if he would eve try to get me back. I do miss him terribly even though it was not a perfectly healthy r/s.

You have given me hope Bradt! Thank you for coming on the board to offer your encouragement for those of us dealing.   
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LifeIsOn
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« Reply #69 on: November 17, 2011, 09:27:24 PM »

Thank you. It was a hard pill to swallow at the end. I felt the exact same when I met my ex. I thought she was the most beautiful girl and the one. Thats why I asked her to marry me. I was looking forward to the wedding that never happened. I was miserable for about 2 half months. Its ok to still feel hopeless, I did as well. Its perfectly normal. I still miss my ex today still. I miss the kisses, the laughter, the time we spend together. We went to europe together last year and that was the best week we ever had. My ex used to get jealous about girls talking to me but I was not a flirt at all. The boss is a womanizer and a big time flirt. But I moved on and took it slow with my gal and she respected me for that and I slowly trusted her and opened my heart to her.

The reason that he ended it is because when you end it with a BPD, they cannot stand that because they fear it so they end it with the non so they don't have to suffer the feeling of abandonment as greatly as what they would felt if you ended it. You have to remember that they fear abandonment.

My ex was skinny when I met her but she lost a few pounds (115) and when she moved and started to hang with her boss before I moved up there. she gained up to 135. From what I have heard she gained even more now but I dont keep a track of her. Her friends do because they want me back with her.

It will take time to recover. Just stay strong and positive. Hit the gym, change your appearance, make yourself proud and feel good about yourself.

I can gladly give you an advice of what I did. I wrote a short list to remind me why I needed to move on and I kept it in my pocket in case I needed to read it.

MOVE ON BECAUSE THEY ALREADY HAVE

STOP HOPING BECAUSE THE HOPE IS GONE

DONT DWELL ON THE PAST. FOCUS ON THE PRESENT AND FUTURE

YOU CANNOT CHANGE THEM

ITS ALL ABOUT ME NOW

I DESERVE BETTER

LIFE IS BEAUTIFUL

I AM FREE NOW

Stay positive and True Love is out there waiting and god has set a path for you to find it. It will take time and it will be worth it in the end. Life is full of mysteries.
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« Reply #70 on: November 18, 2011, 02:47:19 PM »

Thanks again Brad, your words helped. It even made me cry a little because I felt hopeful when reading.  Smiling (click to insert in post) Your list is a great idea. I have done something similar by listing the things that were difficult to deal with in regard to my ex's behavior... .those things, I won't ever miss. Your last line on your list that says "I'm free" really touched me because even though I have been extremely sad, I also have a sense that I am free from ever having to "worry" about his mood or his reactions or how he will make me feel bad about myself for doing nothing except being myself. What is hard is that as time goes on, I tend to "glorify" the good times and reminisce. But those times became less and less and as the r/s progressed, I felt anxiety each time he would text or call because I didn't know what kind of mood he would be in... .and that is not a sign of a healthy r/s. Later in the r/s I felt that my reaching out to call or text became intrusive if he was in a funk and instead of my bf being happy to hear from me, I could sense distance and annoyance in his voice and tone. It really made me feel bad about myself. This man who used to love me so much was feeling annoyed by me... .Those are the things that I won't miss.

I started back at the gym today and will begin my journey as a new beginning. I will always love my ex, but I won't be controlled by him, and I truly wish him the best. THAT is unconditional love. He stabbed me in the heart, but because I can see his dysfunction as something that has a hold on him, I can only hope that he can someday feel ok inside. Deep inside, I know he didn't mean to hurt me. I was the best that I could have possibly have been for him.

Thank you again Brad. Please stay on this board to continue offering your optimism to all of us "nons". It really helps!   
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« Reply #71 on: November 18, 2011, 05:09:17 PM »

Im not going anywhere. Im here to help the others that are struggling and I am here to do my best to give them advices because I did the same on this and it was a big help to move on.

Looks like you are making progress here. Keep it up and go into NC (No Contact) it was a big help for me. It ate my ex up and still is with NC but she knows that I have moved on. I still treasure the good times I had with my ex and I carried that to my new journey with my new girl and making new memories to it. You all will in time. You are free from his leash like I am from my ex's. The memories are painful because that was when you were the happiest and your heart misses that. But the hope that I can advice you is that your heart will be happy again down the road. I know my ex misses the old memories too but she changed into a different worse person than b4 and I realized that she was not the girl that I fell in love with. One other thing I learned was that when they meet someone else, they mold themselves into what the other person likes and gets tire of it and move on to the next and sometimes they switch back to the old way with the other ex. I have seen it happen but we cannot keep the hope of that happening because right now its gone. Remember that life moves on.

My ex stabbed and shattered my heart into million pieces and I had to rebuild it again. I know my ex doesn't understand how it feels to have her hear broken like mine was. Never will. They dont mean to hurt their exes because they dont know how much the damage they have done because they dont feel the same way we do about it. They feed on the love you offer. Yes they do love you but not how we love them. That was one of the hardest pill for me to swallow when I found that out.

Just respond to this and I will help anyone in anyway I can

Keep it up and good luck!
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« Reply #72 on: November 18, 2011, 05:14:06 PM »

I also think this to myself as well. I denf dodged a bullet and you all did and it will take time to get out of the fog. I concerned my rebuilding was getting out of the fog. That is another way to think of it as well
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LostProphet
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« Reply #73 on: May 05, 2015, 02:16:08 AM »

After reading all the comments,even though no one has commented in over 90 days,i had to leave my experience.I have been on and off with my BPD ex gf 5 times over 4 years and every time she has split me black only to split me white again after so much time apart.Although every time its gets longer and longer between being painted white again.The last time we got back together she had been engaged to someone else and tried to start things back up with me but i wouldn't allow that as i don't care if she was my gf first,she was in a serious relationship with someone else and i don't wreck anyone's relationship,so i stopped talking to her and stayed away from any accidental run ins.I think that drove her even more crazy because a couple month's later she had broken it off with her fiance and was doing anything she could to get my attention.I didn't do anything to change anything about myself or act any different than i always do.She just needed me at that time so i was useful to her and therefor was split white again.So what i'm trying to say is that almost with complete certainty,being split black is not permanent and you cant really put a time limit on it,but you can almost guarantee they will come back to some degree when they either are alone,needy or bored.You will get another chance to show them you learned your lesson and don't need them in your life anymore or get split black again.No matter what,you aren't going to make it work unless they get therapy.I know i have my issues for going back with this woman 5 times and thinking it would work somehow this time,actually that's the definition of crazy,I'm pretty sure,but I've always been a person who sees the good in everyone and always believes that miracles happen every day,I love and trust to a fault and i often don't like to give up even when it's in my best interest but I've been able to do things that others couldn't because i didn't give up and like i said,i'm loyal to a fault sometimes.So,don't beat yourselves up or be too hard on yourselves as with most of you,there is no reason to blame yourself just because you loved these people with all you had and they turned out to be liars and cheaters and just horrible people.You can never regret giving something,especially love,all that you had and it didn't work out.Atleast you know what real love is and know how sad it is for that other person who left you as they will never truly know what real love is.That is something i can hold my head up high through all this,yeah,i got hurt bad and i should have known better but i gave them everything i had and loved them with every ounce of my being and they still rejected me in the end.Better to have loved and lost than never loved at all,i will love again and so will you but most likely they will never know that feeling and to me that's the worst punishment you could ever have to live with!Good luck to all who have to experience the Bpd relationship and i hope you the fastest and easiest recovery,Godspeed!
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Ashwin
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« Reply #74 on: April 21, 2016, 02:56:45 AM »

Hello folks I just went thru thus thread feeling puzzled kindly look into my posts and give me ur valuable opinion tq
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« Reply #75 on: April 21, 2016, 05:23:08 AM »

Ashwin... .where are your posts?
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« Reply #76 on: April 21, 2016, 05:28:03 AM »

I do not have much hope for ever being permanently white again -- not that I particularly care.

I am the blackest black right now, and so is anyone who took my side in the breakup.

I got painted white for an afternoon back in October.  It was fascinating, and odd for our mutual friends to watch, but it didn't last long at all.

The long and short of it is that you are an anxiety trigger.  All you have to do to be painted black is slightly resemble someone or something that hurt this person before.  It is a lot like having PTSD -- and entire way of being defined by PTSD-like symptoms and actions.  Once you trigger that fight or flight response, they are pretty much compelled to act.  They run away from you and stay away as long as you are a trigger.  Eventually, either the anxiety of your triggering wears off, or something triggers them worse that makes you look "safe" in comparison.  That's when you're painted white.

The only way you'd be permanently white is if you could somehow keep from triggering that PTSD-like feeling, which is near impossible.

The individual with BPD is just as much a prisoner of the cycle as you are, if not more.  They do not consciously do this or probably even think this is an acceptable way to behave.  Their fight or flight responses that are triggered are so strong, however, that's difficult for them to make a different, more rational choice in the situation.
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MapleBob
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« Reply #77 on: April 21, 2016, 05:01:00 PM »

my ex paints me black and then white again all the time. 

I'm not in touch with mine - but when I was, it was like that. It was almost like she had two wildly differing takes on me and that that was what drove her dysregulation and push/pull behavior. I was white from this angle, but black from another angle - ultimately she couldn't decide which one was real to her, so she just bailed.
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SummerStorm
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« Reply #78 on: April 21, 2016, 08:19:30 PM »

My BPD friend goes back and forth all the time with pretty much everyone in her life.  Some people don't get painted black; they just sort of fall to the wayside for a few months.  But people she has an emotional connection to go back and forth between white and black all the time.

Last year at this time, she refused to talk to her dad and refused to even acknowledge that her stepmother exists.  She even told her mom that she wanted to kill both of them.  Two weeks ago, she ate dinner at their house and acted like everything was wonderful.  She also went to their house for Easter and gave her stepmother a big hug. 

I was split black last June and then briefly went back to white in August, before being split black again a few weeks later.  I was white again at the end of November, but that only lasted for six days.  Then, it was back to black until December.  I've been white ever since, but that's mostly because I'm barely in contact with her.  I haven't even seen her in almost a year.

Her mom was split black back in January.  It didn't last long, and she started talking to her again a few weeks later, but her mom was blocked on Facebook for two months.  I was blocked for almost four months.

Her ex-boyfriend was split black for four months and then got a friend request from her on Facebook.   
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So when will this end it goes on and on/Over and over and over again/Keep spinning around I know that it won't stop/Till I step down from this for good - Lifehouse "Sick Cycle Carousel"
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« Reply #79 on: April 21, 2016, 09:06:47 PM »

My experience is once they feel they have reasons to "hate you, and I use the word hate because it's a word my ex used nearly daily... .is that once those reasons exist- justified or not- they will not be forgotten.

They will be reused and recycled in arguments, never left in the past. And new arguments, they compound. Fights, additional fights, the ammo that was thrown, at me at least, of course created hostile situations where I might say something I shouldnt have (out of utter frustration), or being given silent treatment, perhaps I'd say or do something I shouldnt have (out of being hurt or just so upset); those new things build and are added into the arsenal of which they use to determine whether you are good or evil.

My ex operated solely on a light on light off basis. I thought of her much like a light switch, and that switch flipped just as fast as an actual one.

She would tell me one day how much she loves me. The next, I am a monster, hated.

So I think, once you begin down that road where they turn on you, where you begin to feel like you are made out to be bad, its only going to get worse.

I honestly don't know how I could have turned it around. Even if I had never made an additional mistake... .they never let you live it down.
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« Reply #80 on: April 21, 2016, 09:18:40 PM »

My experience is once they feel they have reasons to "hate you, and I use the word hate because it's a word my ex used nearly daily... .is that once those reasons exist- justified or not- they will not be forgotten.

They will be reused and recycled in arguments, never left in the past. And new arguments, they compound. Fights, additional fights, the ammo that was thrown, at me at least, of course created hostile situations where I might say something I shouldnt have (out of utter frustration), or being given silent treatment, perhaps I'd say or do something I shouldnt have (out of being hurt or just so upset); those new things build and are added into the arsenal of which they use to determine whether you are good or evil.

My ex operated solely on a light on light off basis. I thought of her much like a light switch, and that switch flipped just as fast as an actual one.

She would tell me one day how much she loves me. The next, I am a monster, hated.

So I think, once you begin down that road where they turn on you, where you begin to feel like you are made out to be bad, its only going to get worse.

I honestly don't know how I could have turned it around. Even if I had never made an additional mistake... .they never let you live it down.

I second this
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« Reply #81 on: April 21, 2016, 09:43:58 PM »

My personal experience, I was white for months. To the point it started making me uncomfortable then bam, one day I was the enemy but it didn't stick. It would flip back and forth by the week, by the day or by the hour. I was black more often then white after the first black incident.

I still work with ex BPD and today I was white. He came to me to ask a question because he "knows I'm so smart and I know everything"  Smile smile smile. A month ago I was in HR because he painted a completely different picture.

It's just crazy... .
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« Reply #82 on: April 26, 2016, 08:07:04 AM »

In 20 years I have been split black several times, split white several times, its exhausting.  Currently, she has been served with papers so of course I am evil incarnate to her.  But, this is a BLESSING right now, because her daughters are watching her devalue me at the same time she weeps when she is around them and I am not there, even asks them "does Dad cry?"  As I am finally done with this nightmare I can tell you her splitting, her false accusations, and her devaluation are devastating her in this court and custody process, and will continue to do so.  It would be much harder for me to do what I need to do if she were trying to paint me white right now, she is making this tolerable for me in a weird way.
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« Reply #83 on: April 26, 2016, 08:26:19 AM »

Split black five times, split white four times. Last black-splitting was two years ago. I know he does split people white even after a number of years, but I think he's only done so with his family, not ex partners. He never maintained friendships with any of his exes and never had a good word to say about any of them, so I guess partners can be black for good.
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« Reply #84 on: April 26, 2016, 03:43:03 PM »

Just adding my 2 cents.

I met by accident my ex uHPD/BPD-gf after 13+ months of absolute NC.

Mind that she's a "cut-off" type and the breakup was psychologically terrible for me; we didn't have any sort of contact after we instantiated NC and I wasn't expecting to see/hear from her anymore.

Anyway, some weeks ago I met her completely by accident in a bar (we live in two different cities, and I was there for a friend's birthday - I stopped by that bar to buy a pack of chewing-gums); I was shocked (and her as well)... .she asked me to sit at the table and have a talk.

So, we talked for about 40 minutes, and overall it was a very nice and relaxed talk; I clearly noticed that she painted me white again (at least this is what I perceived from the way she talked, her body-language and the facial expressions).

Hence, in my experience, yes, they can paint you white again - and remember you fondly - even if they don't contact you anymore (due to the way they treat you towards the end of the r/s).

Obviously, it remains absolutely true the fact that if you decide to "play the game again", odds are that everything will go south again... .
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« Reply #85 on: April 26, 2016, 05:02:12 PM »

I don't think my BPD ex gf of 6 years will ever split me white again. On Thanksgiving i arrived at her mothers house with my daughter. I had been in tears over her rage on the 40 minute drive to meet her there. She was in a complete rage over the pickup time for my daughter being changed.

I had stepped onto the back porch for a few minutes to clear my head once i arrived. My ex BPD's brother stepped out and asked if i was ok?  He saw my eyes were red from crying. I told him point blank,"no, i'm not ok, i can't take the constant abuse from your sister anymore from being called a piece of sh-t, sc-mbag,c-cksucker and everything else one could imagine constantly" Her brother looked me right in the eyes and said" she's bipolar, why do you think we called her sybil growing up" he said she s screwed up every relationship she s been in and you are the most stable guy she s been with, the last one was a drunk. He said his mother was the same way and she's also bipolar and growing up was pure insanity with her.

After the breakup, she apparently confronted her brother about our conversation that day. The brother is not one to mix words and must have let her have it about what i told him had been transpiring. She so often would tell me she doesnt tell her family anything about her private life because she doesnt wanna be judged. I told her brother i've offered this woman the world and it's constant fighting and jeoulosy and emotional and verbal abuse. She told me in one of her break up tirades was that she could never be with me again because i talked sh-t about her to her family. I' m sure to make herself look good she 's concocted some story that i either cheated or i was abusive to make herself look good.

The bottom line is this was an extremely toxic relationship. She was an extremeley verbally abusive woman and does not beleive she was at all. I would tell her i had her voicemails saved of her tirades and she would tell me that i kept them to blackmail her. She will never be able to have a stable relationship because the calendar changes they don't.
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« Reply #86 on: April 28, 2016, 03:36:24 PM »

To be honest, once I have made the move to totally disengage, I will be past caring if he thinks in black, white or technicolor! I will no doubt be the evil one, so I might as well keep that attitude!

This. Who Cares if I Painted Black.  I know who she is. I could care less now.
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