For parents of adult children with BPD

[somuchlove]

From all I have read it seems we are not to telling them the have BPD.  Boy I wish I could hand her a book and tell her to not be scared and this will explain why she feels the way she feels.  I just keep wanting to tell my daughter that.  It is so hard when she says things and I just can't tell her,  talk to someone,  they can help you sort things out.  etc etc etc.

If you find a book or someone feels it might help to talk to them about it I am all for it.  When I get so tired of this I want to write,  What are we doing? ARe we just working on ourselves and our well being... .instead of really telling them like it is.  (of which I know that is not how they would hear it.)   hugs to you and I know your pain.  When I have a few more min. i am going to read more of this thread.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[qcarolr]

I was just wondering if there has been a book written that I could hand over to my daughter that will gently but clearly let her know that she suffers from BPD... .Its so hard to watch her suffer . The other day she broke down about her inabillity to hold a relationship. At that moment I wish I had a book I could have handed her so that she can find out what it is that wont let her be happy so that she can then at least get the right help in life... .I do want to see her happy.

She is seeing a therapist at the moment but I have so little faith in therapists nowadays... . Therapy has become so "production line".

Dona

Here are a couple links to a workshop and thread about this subject. You can respond by posting a reply on the link after you open it by clicking on the blue text. I may ask if we could have this on the parents board for comment for a few days. Do you think there would be interest?

Workshop on pros and cons of talking about BPD dx.  TOOLS: Telling Someone That You Thing They Have BPD;  https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=76633.0

Thread discussing to tell or not to tell about BPD.   https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=107693.0

My DD was informed of the dx after her neuro-psych testing led to the dx a couple years ago. Has not made much difference in her resistance to doing any kind of treatment - even when accepting this dx and getting treatment could lead to her getting off the street homeless. Very frustrating for dh and I. Have to just keep reminding myself it is up to her to choose her path at this point in her life. And we have to take care of ourselves, and gd5, as there is no one else to do that for us. If we are gone, or sick, then even the small amount of support we are able to get through to her (and it is in a good place right now ) would disappear for her.

Hope these links help you all in understanding this complex and distressing disease.

qcr

[FMJ]

Thank you, thank you, QCarolR for this! My 34 yr old uBPD daughter is all but unbearable to me at times. She divorced 4 yrs ago... has 2 children ages 9 and 6... .boy and girl.  Left them for 5 months for relationship w/crazy abusive guy.  Came home after nearly beaten to death... .everyone forgave her... even her ex. Moved in w/us ... .swore off relationships... which didn't last long.  Now is a relationship w/great guy... .but she is the problem in the relationships... .whether the guy is good or bad. Same type of stuff... .almost obsessing w/relationship while kids are put on back burner.  kept them out until midnight last night at the bf's house... .got up early this a.m. and had to go get something from the guy's house... .Just infuriates me!  Oh... .and just spend money on breast augmentation... .mind you, she has virtually nothing and little money... spent what retirement she had accrued at her last job.  Laid around all week here complaining about the pain.  I have my mother's home that she and kids lived in previously... .she is preparing to "move out" and go back there again... .because I think she senses my disapproval at how she is handling the relationship, etc.  She can't stand if I don't just love and jump for joy at everything she does!  I would love for her to move, but worry about the kids... .at least I have a bit of control over the stability they may have.  If it weren't for the kids I could have no contact I do think.  It's all about the grandchildren now for me.  Thank you so much for this thread... .sometimes we just need to vent!

[heartbrokenmom]

Hi everyone

You all are my new family.  You get it.  My daughter is a classic Sybal with the rotating head one minute and the loving daughter everyone wants the next.  No reason or explaination.

For years I have dubbed her Katie Kaboom from the cartoon on Y TV when she was little.  Not too many people remember or relate to this short lived cartoon for children and it did't last long (probably because it scared normal little children)  I found her on U-tube and watched her again years later.  It is unbelievable just how right on Katie Kaboom is.  To check out on a little humour I have sent you all a link to watch this very short clip www.youtu.be/RWcNcJuTHVo

you are going to love it  I promise.

heartbrokenmom

(who still enjoys a giggle)

[qcarolr]

Hi everyone

You all are my new family.  You get it.  My daughter is a classic Sybal with the rotating head one minute and the loving daughter everyone wants the next.  No reason or explaination.

For years I have dubbed her Katie Kaboom from the cartoon on Y TV when she was little.  Not too many people remember or relate to this short lived cartoon for children and it did't last long (probably because it scared normal little children)  I found her on U-tube and watched her again years later.  It is unbelievable just how right on Katie Kaboom is.  To check out on a little humour I have sent you all a link to watch this very short clip www.youtu.be/RWcNcJuTHVo

you are going to love it  I promise.

heartbrokenmom

(who still enjoys a giggle)

WOW - that was pretty scary for me and I am 55 ... .But them guess I am a little PTSD from my years in the 'trenches'. And then she shrinks back to size, thanks in a sweet voice - as if nothing ever happened. YIKES.

Thanks for sharing. qcr

[picturelady]

[I think we all struggle with this. I have a different situation (different pwBPD in my life), but also face the question of what to say, to whom. It's a balance between not wanting to overstep the relationship/situation by providing disturbing or too-intimate information on the one hand and being real and open on the other. I also want to balance my need for support with protecting relationships from family chaos. I have some loose guidelines for myself:

• I don't share about my situation in a work context, except with a long-term colleague with whom I also have a friendship.



• If I get questions about my family from casual acquaintances or strangers, I have a few stock answers that I use that are truthful but not too revealing.



• With close friends, I am more open. If they seem genuinely interested, I will share about my situation.



• I discuss if asked, and if I want to initiate, I ask permission. "Lots  been going on... .is this something you'd like to hear about?"



• With close friends who are interested, I tell the story as it is, warts and all. Yes, I think it is shocking. I try to summon my balance when talking about it, but if I'm still processing something that happened, with a couple of good friends who know the story, I simply tell them and get their feedback.



• My DH is a good sounding board, but I also ask his permission and let him know that it's okay to stop discussing. Sometimes I say "Okay, let's think about something else for a while" and move us back to daily life. I don't want family stuff to take over our lives.



• I have a good therapist, so that gives me an outlet and I don't need to process too much with others.

I'm not sure if others have guidelines for yourself? If so, what are they?

 

B&W

AWESOME advice, thanks, B&W!

PictureLady

[Thankful]

In response to NowIKnow's question about the tantrums, my BPDd started the tantrums very young. It was so hard to even take her to the grocery store. She would misbehave so badly, and if I corrected her she would start screaming like I was torturing her. She was always throwing tantrums. When she got a little older and was playing sports, if there was even the slightest injury she would hit the floor and start wailing. Sometimes it was faked to get the attention of people. So the tantrums were part of her behavior in childhood and even continue to this day, if she doesn't get what she wants. I noticed her behavior was unusual starting about the age of three. It's been a long difficult road.

Thankful,

BPDd43

[shoshana]

Is this something weird about me to need to share this - is this inappropriate for me to be doing? I think it is part of my coming out of 'isolation' after the past few years as gd5 has started riding the bus to kindergarten and playing with the neighborhood kids. I feel like I need to learn to censor myself somehow.

I've found that I need to talk to someone about my D22 w/BPD and so I choose from a close circle of friends.  Sometimes I feel embarrassed to discuss the problems with people I don't know well.  But I also feel a need to protect my daughter's privacy.  I guess that comes from living in a small town. 

I can understand anyone wanting to "censor" what they say about an adult child w/BPD. A lot of people just don't get it.  And if there's a grandchild involved, his privacy is important, too.  No matter what his mother is like, I think it's important for him to have good thoughts about her.  He should also be made aware of his mother's illness, but I think it's tough for a child to think his mother is a mess.  He might think that makes him a mess, too.

[qcarolr]

Is this something weird about me to need to share this - is this inappropriate for me to be doing? I think it is part of my coming out of 'isolation' after the past few years as gd5 has started riding the bus to kindergarten and playing with the neighborhood kids. I feel like I need to learn to censor myself somehow.

I've found that I need to talk to someone about my D22 w/BPD and so I choose from a close circle of friends.  Sometimes I feel embarrassed to discuss the problems with people I don't know well.  But I also feel a need to protect my daughter's privacy.  I guess that comes from living in a small town.  

I can understand anyone wanting to "censor" what they say about an adult child w/BPD. A lot of people just don't get it.  And if there's a grandchild involved, his privacy is important, too.  No matter what his mother is like, I think it's important for him to have good thoughts about her.  He should also be made aware of his mother's illness, but I think it's tough for a child to think his mother is a mess.  He might think that makes him a mess, too.

shoshana, I appreciate your comments on my quote.  Respecting privacy is an important value, and I have been keeping this in my mind as I am learning to be less impulsive with sharing too many details of my life with others. This is one reason coming here to vent is so valuable for me - it feels safe. And with my Al Anon meeting friends also. I am starting back with a personal T this week too. Toughing it out on my own is just not working ;p  infact it is quite crazy making - how did I get back to this place anyway  

I have always been very cautious with how i talk with my gd6, now a first grader, about her mom. At this young age try to use words and ideas she can relate to. The help of the child T in our lives has been a great help with this develpmental perspective. There is a great thread for this on the 'Coping' board found at this link:

Discussing mental illness with children

I always try to respect that gd6 loves her mom, even when the mommy is not available (physically or emotionally). I am grateful for all the loving adults that are a part of gd's life - my dh and I, aunts/uncles, neighborhood parents of her littel friends. We are very fortunate to have a lot of support and understanding with this limited group of people. Now we are adding teachers and coaches (she started soccer with the city rec center program) and summer camp counselors. All these good role models of grown-up behavior are priceless for gd6.

She seems to be starting to figure out when her mommy's behavior is out of line - and can ask me about it when DD25 is not there. This gives me an opportunity to share how hard her mommy is working to figure out her 'adult stuff' and learn how to manage her angry feelings better. And her mommy is having lots of success with this lately.

qcr

[whiletheseasonspass]

Hello,

I have not posted for a while.  I am glad to see this post for parents of Adult BPD children is still alive.  Of course it would be nice if we were writing on a website about our favorite dessert or how to grow roses successfully instead of what we write about.

Well an update on my daughter.  She is sicker than ever.  I find it hard to believe that she is still living.  She has many ways that she stays sick.  She still has the partner and group of "enablers" that I have written about in past posts -and referred to a "cult-like" group who endorse/ egg on her ways of operating.  I have never been able to post fine details of her story- i.e. exactly what her belief system is that keeps her getting sicker and sicker- and maybe there are a few beliefs that keep her ill or thought disordered behaviors- but I never post the fine details as they are so bizarre and offbeat it would give my identity away- and hers. 

One is that she gets benefit from being ill.  There are other issues.

My daughter is gone.  Someone else lives in her body.  I think I saw another heartbroken mother post that said something like this recently.    DD is in really bad condition and still refuses help for her reasons- that we cannot break through.

I have been able to get past so much in my life- so much that has brought me heartache but not this.  I will never be able to be consoled.  My only child has been missing from my life.  I miss her so much in spite of this wild long journey.  It is like she has been abducted and  I don't know where she is... .yet I do know where she is really... .her body at least - the one with the stranger living in it. 

I look at pictures around the house where she is laughing- at a birthday party or a holiday or about  something - nothing in particular and my heart breaks- I want that daughter back.  I go out somewhere and get triggered by the healthy mothers and daughters and I want that.  Lots triggers me. 

I think once I realized more and more that I cannot save my daughter- the more it got inside of my bones - this reality... .the more depressed I have become.  I find myself lately in a store or in my car or anywhere and my eyes fill up with tears.  I cry at so much.  I did not cry like this at the drop of a pin until maybe a month or so ago.  Something changed with our daughter... .for the worse.  It was like one last possible loophole on my pipe dream list to save her was scratched out of existence.  So it felt terrible.  It feels terrible... .like the last door shut... .on the light at the end of a terrible tunnel. 

I watched the 9-11 ceremonies and cried along with the people who have lost loved ones... .and if was a child who was lost- I cried harder.

It occurred to me- that instead of continuing to read books about communication skills etc although I have read them all along- I would start reading books about grieving.  I need to grieve and am already doing it anyway - I feel like I am.   

I have a book I started reading called THE WORST LOSS.  It is about the death of a child.  I found the chapter on suicide even if it so morbid ( Chapter 14) particularly interesting for much of what author who deals with mothers who have lost children describes- i.e. how the mothers feel- is exactly what I feel.  My daughter is slowly committing suicide - her body is still alive but she - the real her is gone.  But the descriptions in this book- this chapter- how the author words the emotions felt by the grieving parent is just how I feel.  Even the shame.  The feelings of failure as a parent to keep my daughter on the right path.  I know that lots of this is genetic but I see where I could have done things differently... .and I can't go back.  That not being able to go back- is tough. 

The book describes a father who agonizes over his son who he could not save from his drug habit.  The way it felt to know his son was living on the street.  He said his son would come to his house when the son was sick or broke and asks - "do you know what it is like to see your son like this?" he asks.  He says he - the father - and his wife tried so many things for years.  He still felt after his son death O.D.  that he - the father- should have been able to do something nonetheless in hindsight to have prevented his son's death.   He believes the O.D. was intentional based on things his son had been saying. 

I know how he feels.  There are other accounts in this book that I can relate to how the parents feel.  And yet my daughter is still breathing.  Still I can relate to the pain. 

By writing here I am doing one thing that the author recommends and that is talking about how I feel to those who would understand and not try to shush or invalidate me. 

I feel as if my real daughter has died.  The laughing, bright, funny, beautiful, intelligent daughter who once brought me joy is no longer there.  She hasn't been for a long time.  But the degree to which she hasn't been there- I never knew it could be deeper.  That she is more deeply gone.  Not quite sure how to word this.  Express this. 

And my dh who had his head in the sand is now out of the sand- wc not only makes me feel less alone- but now that I don't have to deal with his denial- I can focus on the realities... .as my emotional energy is not being sapped by his ways.  Believe me when I say that when one parent is in denial and your child is in the shape our child is in- it is terrible.  But now the at least his head is out of the sand... .to a degree.  That helps some.  But it does not bring my daughter to life- it does not get the stranger out of her body.  Yet I am not so alone in this at night when he comes home from work.  That said.  I hate to see his so grim and sad.  He is this way and also mirrors how I feel. 

dh was the one who started reading "I Don't Have To Make Everything All Better".  He described 4 emotions.  Glad. Mad. Afraid. Sad.  ( I think these were them) .   I feel Sad.  I feel Afraid.  I am mad at the situation but not at my dd.  I am mad that I could not prevent this result. 

Meanwhile- all of the above said- whatever life is left in the stranger in my dd's withering body - is still being used to emotionally blackmail and manipulate.  If only the stranger  would use whatever threads of energy she has to get the right kind help instead- i.e. to try and get well but... .she will do this dance because she is stuck in in and the crazy music in her head is too loud to hear anything sensible.   It is so hard to put up boundaries when her long, very bony fingers seem to be metaphorically reaching out of the grave she is digging for herself to pull us in to her "desires"... .to get us to say yes to crazy things. We try so hard not to enable. 

I wish I could report what some of you have reported... .over time... .success... .and I am happy for those of you who have reported success... .I think it all depends on how much is wrong to begin with. IF my daughter had never gotten this physical illness- her brain would not be so haywire.  If only... .that is a phrase I catch myself at now... .and steer myself elsewhere... .which is a habit that is hard to break- but at least I see when I do it.

IF ONLY's get you nowhere!   Nowhere.

IT sounds like I am grasping this perhaps but I must say I still have trouble grasping something so incomprehensible  :'( :'(. 

I still can't understand why there is no help for adult children who need saving instead of their rights protected.    I can't understand.   

I don't whether to press Post as this is such a sad sad post  :'( :'( and I don't want to cast such sadness here... .I don't know what to do... .?

Well it came to me that  maybe I will just in case my post helps someone else even if it is one person or maybe someone who has not joined the website but just reading as a guest.  I know that would've helped me somehow.

wtsp

[qcarolr]

wtsp  :'(       :'(      

:'(

Can I cry with you for a bit? It is always nice when I find somone that will hold me and let me cry - no other words may be needed.

Thank you for the courage to click the 'post' button and share your despair here with us. This is my greatest fear, to lose my DD25. I am glad the book you shared is helping you in this grieving process. I cannot imagine the painfulness, and pray that you can find the support to lessen the suffering, guilt, shame. It is good you and your dh can lean on each other - what are the ways you can build on this?

I will continue to keep you in my thoughts and prayers my friend. Keep coming back to share as you are able - for yourself and for the rest of us.

qcr

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[qcarolr]

Hi, I'm new here, trying to figure out how to post and all. I have read all of your messages, and feel that I can relate to everything you all have shared. I introduced myself on the main board, but I'll try to briefly do so here. I so need help right now.

I have a 30 yr. old DD who I am convinced has BPD, with a 9 yr. old GD, although DD was never diagnosed. In one of her moments when she was reaching out desperately for help, my husband told her he thought she might have BPD. Well, big mistake! She has never forgiven us for that or for 'the way we raised her' or telling her in high school that we thought she had a chemical imbalance. She has rejected all of that. She is smart, delightful, and functions well, holds down a good job in the medical field, but with her close relationships it can be terrible. The family has fractured because of her, esp. me. I bear the brunt of all of it. Now we are having trouble with GD because she has turned against her mom. She thinks her mom is a bad person now and nothing anyone says or does seems to be able to convince her otherwise. DD really has done remarkably well with GD, I think because she wants so badly to succeed at parenting, but an unfortunate behavior that GD saw her mom engaged in on the 4th of July has made her believe her mom is bad and a bad example. GD is staying with us now because she is so angry at her mom that she is acting out violently whenever with her. Her anger overflows to me sometimes too. We don't know what to do. We have had GD for over 2 months now, going to therapy, etc etc trying to find a way to get her back with her mom, all to no avail. This is putting even more stress on our relationship with DD who has now started back into her grievances against us and how she can't stand us etc etc and telling us not to stifle GD like we did her. Not to label GD. We've walked on eggshells, we her parents and 4 younger siblings, for all these years. Two siblings are estranged from her, the other two are still allowed to have some kind of relationship with her. It is such a mess. The worst of it right now is knowing what to do with GD. I don't know if I can make it through this. My life is nonexistent now and I have isolated myself from friends and family because it is too hard to protect DD's reputation and because I don't want to have to explain to everyone the 'why's'.  I am in a trap with no way out.

Thanks for listening, and as I have more time, I plan to read a lot of the material here.

livelove,  Hi!  

Thank you for sharing this part of your story with us. It is indeed distressing when our gkids are involved. I struggle so to balance this with my gd6 and BPDDD25. I am always working to try and put the needs of the child first. When I can focus on this it gives some clarity to the decisions that I need to make. So very often their needs/desires clash. Currently things are going better with DD25 again living in our home with dh, gd6 and I. Dh and I have had legal custody of gd6 since she was a baby.

It sounds like you are doing a lot for your gd right now to give her support in making choices to take care of herself. Do you have legal standing to allow you this protective relationship with her? This can be helpful in reassuring your gd that you are there to love her and help her be in a safe, secure place to figure this all out. Is the T helping you with the boundaries needed to also take care of yourself - the closest, safest adult is often the object for projection of emotions just too intense and scary to own. This is certainly true for each of us, certainly a very big issue with your D30, and becoming one with your gd.

Keep reading - on validation, boundaries, radical acceptance. These are the areas that have helped me the most. There are many other grandparents here is situations similar to yours. It may be good to start your own topic thread so others will find you more easily to lend support. You can do this when first opening the board - click the 'topic' button on the top right of the index page.

Keep coming back - we care.

qcr

[justwantedafamily]

dear wtsp,

I'm so, so very sorry for what you are going through with your dd.  It struck such a chord with me-when you said you are grieving for her.  A few weeks ago, I told my physician the same thing; I feel like I'm beginning the grieving process for my daughter.  I do not know how much longer she can last with the way she's leading her life, and it is torture for my dh and me to watch it all unfold before our eyes.  I never thought about reading books about that process to prepare myself, or to even help us deal with what we are having to deal with now.  Thank you for the courage it took to express what your family is going through.  Please know you are not alone in this hellish nightmare of BPD.

My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family, wtsp. 

[whiletheseasonspass]

Thank you qcarol and justwanted a family,

It has been so long since I posted.  It felt correct to write my feelings down.  I did not know whether to press "post"... .but now I can see it was the right thing to do. 

qcarol- you are full of compassion     .  I may not have posted here but I do read sometimes.  I have followed your journey and can see that you have great reason to hope.  Way more than when you first joined.  I have always said that you have lots of wisdom and great instincts.  You do.  You asked me how can my husband and I build on him pulling his head our of the sand somewhat- well that is a good question and I never thought about that - except for taking it for what it was - so thank you for posing that question.   Meanwhile, thank you my dear friend for replying to your friend- me.

wtsp

justwantedafamily,

I think your name is very appropriate and it could easily be mine as well.  That is what I only want more than anything.  I see that you are new at writing here but have read for a long time before you joined.  I am glad you joined and wrote in.  I went back and read your posts.  I can understand your fears about your daughter in so many ways.  With my daughter being ill and reckless- I can relate to what you see in your daughter and the helpless feeling you have.  My daughter does not believe that she is mentally ill.  Not one bit.  She is very very mentally ill.  I always thought that it was important for her to know but now I see your daughter knows but says nothing helps.  That must be very frustrating to hear her blow that off.  I know how that feels as my daughter blows off lots or twists the realities into other things to keep up her ways.    My daughter also will go NC if we challenge her in the least possible way so it is a tightrope all the time- trying to stay one step ahead - using communication skills to not let her slip away again into NC.  She went there recently for about a week because of reasons that are wayward to the normal person. But alas she is back.  This website is what taught me the skills to communicate- knowing that she is BPD'd etc.  But in our case we can't reach her in ways she needs to be reached- like to save her life- no matter how good we have become at communication skills.  I want you to know I understand your plight so much- although I do not have gchildren but I understand your concerns about your dd. I feel for you  .  And I wish you the best.

   

wtsp

[livelove]

qcr-thank you for your kind words.

wtsp-I weep for and with you as I read your story. I can relate to it, as I (and I'm sure all here) have grieved the loss of their afflicted children. We see their misery, and we are a part of it. I have said from the teenage years, when d30 would batter me verbally for hour after hour with her foul language, that I still believed that was not really her, that the real her was still there somewhere. I still believe that, but don't know if I'll ever get to be a part of that again. I too remember vividly one moment that I deliberately fixed in my memory of d30 dancing and spinning around the room with her then 3 yr. old daughter, just two beautiful free spirits having fun. It didn't last, but that is the image I will always hold onto. It was a beautiful moment.

Don't feel bad at all for grieving with us. We all have to have some outlet for our grief, and I'm glad I once again looked for a place of support. I tried another site a few years ago, but there wasn't enough regular traffic for it to be of much help.

I have done a fair amount of reading off and on over the last 12 yrs. or so, and have just not found anything I could apply successfully that made any difference. Most of it is not too encouraging. I hear that some of you have kids who do not believe they have a problem. This seems to be common, maybe it's the disorder that makes them think their reality is the one that's right. We get caught up in this conversation about realities a lot. Whenever I try to defend us, d30 takes offense that I'm saying she is wrong, wrong wrong. All I'm saying is that her perception of our actions/motives/words is not how we meant them. But she rejects that.

Do any of you struggle with a constant state of anxiety about what the next day or moment will bring? I feel my whole life has been a series of one crisis/event after another with no end and that it would fill up a book already. How do you handle your anxiety about what's around the next corner? Recently, besides losing my appetite, I am having a lot of heart palpitations which seem to be related to my degree of anxiety. I'm planning to go have the Dr check me out, although everything seemed fine with my health a year ago.

Again, thank you for the warm welcome! 

[livelove]

Follow up-

qcarol-we do not have any legal custody of our gd9. We have been trying on our own to be there to lend support to BPDDD30 from the time gd was born. She is with us on average 50% of the time, I think. I have tried to be extremely careful to not say anything to gd that might get repeated to her mom that would alienate DD any more than she already is, because I am fearful that she will take gd away from us. I think gd needs the stability of our support. She seems to like being here and does respond to my husband well. I feel she needs this influence in her life. So I try not to address her mom's 'problems' with her at this point, because I'm still hoping dd can handle life with her daughter. GD must know there are problems, or she wouldn't be so adamant to the point of being out of control angry that she doesn't want to be with her mom. I do want dd to have every chance to succeed that she can have. I feel we teeter on the edge of the cliff all the time with whether DD's going to make it or not. I don't want to be responsible for tipping us all over the edge! The topic has come up with DD of whether we should have some type of custody of GD since she won't stay with her mom and so far nothing has helped to convince her to go back with her mom. When we have insisted she ride with her mom or anything at all, she acts out so terribly that we are all reeling. DD and I have taken her to crisis intervention 3 times because she is so angry and can't even be transported safely. So she stays with us for the indefinite future. She has a short fuse right now, even with us GP's.

[whiletheseasonspass]

livelove,

Thank you for your kind words to me        while you are going through you own non-ending crises.

I read your posts and agree that it sounds very difficult.  It all is affecting you greatly if you have lost so much weight.  It sounds like your gd would like to stay with you and freaks out when she might have to go and live with her mother.  I wonder if there are things besides the inappropriate observation gd made of her mother- that are going on or that went on- that makes your gd so upset to imagine going to be with her mother. 

What I recognize from your story is so similar to mine and it is clear that your BPD dd does what our dd  does which is using manipulation and using emotional blackmail to get what she thinks she needs or wants or doesn't want and/or to get you to feel horrible about yourselves when you have done so much for her. 

Your gd must be a very very sensitive child and thus is like a sponge internalizing the chaos.   

I feel for you livelove- and for your gd    as your dd is using your gd as a pawn and that is another way she can manipulate you and use emotional blackmail.  My dh and I have had to get therapy together to learn about how to not be used but it is not easy at all to pull off.  The progress we have made esp. my dh who had his head in the sand is that we can recognize it when it is happening. AND when our dd is being "loving" we wonder what THAT is leading up to... .and it feels terrible to not be able to just embrace the "love"... .although sometimes we do- just to have the "feelings" between us... .even if we are suspicious.  I know that sounds horrible but we have been though so much... .YET we feel for our dd so much and we know she suffers and has abandonment issues - and it is not just about us... .we can't bear to have her suffer- yet she brings so much strife to her life because of her personality disorder which we KNOW is not her fault.  It is all so circular sometimes... .and extremely painful and extremely heartbreaking. 

It is so hard to live this way for sure and she is our only child- and meanwhile you asked if anyone struggles with day to day uncertainty and anxiety... .yes.  I can speak for myself- yes.  Big time.  You are not alone in this.  Sometimes it feels like an ongoing nightmare that keeps on worsening and I think I should be "used" to expecting the always increasing worse-ness of it all- but that is not something that anyone could get used to... .not a mother - that is for sure.  Nor a grandmother who feels responsible for her gd either... .

Take care, livelove.

wtsp

[justwantedafamily]

dear livelove,  you asked if others feel constant anxiety and what to do about that.  I can definitely say I do feel that and wish there was a way to turn that off in my head.  My BPDd30 went NC with me for several weeks-she still allowed us to have the 3 grandchildren for overnight visits, but I wasn't allowed to come to their home. We had to arrange a meeting place in a parking lot near their home.  Just writing this down-it's insane, really.  She finds herself right now in a position where she has no friends, so she started emailing and texting me again.  Never said a word about the weeks before; just started her long litany of how horrible her life is.  I have no doubt in my mind that it is, indeed, horrible and it turns my stomach to hear about it, knowing there's nothing I can do to help her-she has to do that herself.

Anyway, every time I hear the "ping" of my cellphone, my stomach tightens up.  Or when the phone rings, and caller ID shows it's their house, I know it's never going to be anything good-it's going to be a crisis situation.  My health has suffered thru the years because of this, too.  I do not have any of the risk factors for high blood pressure, I'm not overweight, I don't drink, never smoked, etc, yet without medication, my blood pressure is off the charts.  I cannot sleep at night.  I dread waking up at 4 AM when you're left alone in the dark with your thoughts and fears. 

What I've done to try to help myself handle the stress (and sometimes it does help, sometimes not)  I do relaxation yoga about 20 minutes in the pm, I try to get outside and run or walk, and that really helps to clear my mind.  If the weather's bad, I have a treadmill I use at home.  Trying to keep myself physically strong makes me feel like like I have a little more control over my life. I keep a gratitude journal which reminds me I do still have some wonderful things going on in my life, not just the bad, and I try not to talk about my fears with my husband every time I have them.  I try to limit how much I talk with him about that so that our whole relationship isn't based solely on the bad stuff.

I would love to hear what others do to help with the stress that BPD causes in their lives.  I've learned so much from this website!

[justwantedafamily]

Oh, and this is just a small practical thing that's helped me:  if I find myself obsessing about it, where I cannot turn my mind to something else, I have a notebook where I've written down chores that would take only 15-30 minutes to do, like "clean and organize the medicine cabinet" or "clean out the desk drawer" or "weed the front flowerbed"- easy things where you don't have to make decisions but it keeps you busy.  It just helps me to turn my mind in a different direction.

[livelove]

jwaf-your description sounds oh so familiar. I too dread the sound of my home and cell phones. I finally got caller ID on home phone so at least some of the time when I hear the phone ring I will know it's not her and I can relax before I answer. That sounds sick when I say it!  :'(   Sometimes I wonder what people would think if they only knew how my every waking moment is consumed by thoughts of anticipating what might happen and the best way to handle it, rehearsing over and over in my head how I can respond so it will not set her off and I will pay for any wrong answer by having to listen to her for another hour. I think it is interesting how similar our BPD DD's behaviors are.  I get a lot of that 'I have no friends' too, bemoaning every thing bad in her life, and blaming me and my husband. Maybe I should say that during some of the last 10 years things have been quite dark, DD being suicidal and barely able to get out of bed. This was the period of time she visited counselors and was diagnosed as having anxiety and depression, but no one figured out what it really was. She tried a number of different anti-depressants, all of which had side effects she could not tolerate, so she decided she would just have to pull herself out of it by sheer force of will and has learned to help herself in some ways, such as yoga, eastern meditation, exercise, getting facials... .this has all helped her to self-soothe and manage her own emotional dysregulation better. I am glad that she can function at least, even if it is by disengaging from  people and things emotionally. She says if GD chooses not to be with her she's going to just go on with her own life. She often says she's done with this.

wtsp-I don't really think there are any major things going on with DD30 that are harming GD seriously. She doesn't like the yelling or bad language she hears, (and has done some repeating of that herself when she is acting out towards her mom-painful to my ears to hear my sweet GD9 yelling those things at her own mom). She thinks the people her mom is around are not the greatest people, and I also think part of it is that she feels insecure about how her mom looks at others in the family. GD loves my other kids, her aunts, and her mom is estranged from them, and doesn't want GD around them. This has not been hidden from GD. Her mom says she doesn't have anything to hide, and GD should know that her  mom thinks her sisters are bad people to be around. (They aren't, and GD knows this). Doesn't help DD in her relationship with GD. Can't she see that? There are a few other things GD thinks which make her case against her mom. She is mistaken with some of the things, but will not believe any of us, she has decided for herself that her mom is bad and that seems to be that. Sigh. Anyway I appreciate all you said! This is all so frustrating, crazy-making, and like you said, circular, painful and heartbreaking. Stressful on a marriage, too, although like dh says we've made it 30 years now, we can continue to make it. Sometimes I feel I just don't care what happens anymore. I came to that a few years ago, I had to say whatever happens will happen. I can't do anything about it, it's out of my control, even if she takes her own life. I can relate to wanting control over something when there is so much not in control.

jwaf-I'm sorry about your bp issues. But it's good that you are proactive with the exercise and doing whatever you can to keep yourself healthy. I try to do the same with my dh, to try to not let this dominate every conversation, but right now that's hard. DD gets bad when she feels dh is being distant, because to her that means he is disapproving. Even he has to walk a tightrope, and he is not wired to do that. As a man he gets disgusted with it.

Well I'd better get to bed, and see if I can get some always much needed sleep. Thank you all for being here! I don't feel so alone.

[Grammy57]

Reading these posts is helping my soul a bit.  Though making me sad as well.  To know that others are experiencing what I have these 26 years of my DD life makes feel connected, but sad that so many of us deal with it.  I have not considered going no contact, mainly because of the two precious children in that home.  they live in same town as we do, and often drop by.  But close proximity also breeds manipulation.  When we get a phone call or text that "I'm losing it, please take kids" - when in reality all she wants to do is go out.  But my concern for those children takes over.  Now with walking through the second divorce with her, and footing the bill, we are drained in money, husband at age 70 continues to work because we need the income, and he refuses to believe that she won't change.  I'm worn out, I'm only 57 but feel 90- I fear the phone ringing, because it never comes with a "Hi Mom, how are you?" It is always a crisis and I'm the first one she goes to.  I'm losing me in all of this.

Our objective is to better understand the struggles our child faces and to learn the skills to improve our relationship and provide a supportive environment and also improve on our own emotional responses, attitudes and effectiveness as a family leaders

[Hope4]

I know this conversation is old but I found it useful as someone with an adult DD.  I understand the pain expressed in many of these posts. My pwBPD was an angry baby/toddler/child who didn't sleep much and who constantly wanted my full attention. (Now I understand why!) I don't know what I could have done differently if I had known about her diagnosis other than been more understanding.

As my DD became an adult I stopped talking about her to others to protect her. I hope that one day she will settle down into a more comfortable life but I also know that that may never happen.  I expect to get a phone call one day that something terrible has happened to her but I try to put it out of my mind.

I mostly share with family members... .who understand what I am talking about... .Thank goodness for them.

In the meantime I am working on being supportive and learning about values and boundaries.

[bluek9]

Hi everyone,

   Great thread. I'm so glad I read it. Well here goes. I'm 60 and my BPDD is 35, my grandson is 6, I'm raising him. We all live together. What a mix we are, both of them D, GSN are on the Autism spectrum, both high functioning but not without challenges to say the least. As I scanned and read through this thread I saw someone say they didn't talk about family at work. And someone else talked about being at the bus.
    Well I stand there every morning and night to get my JJ on and off the bus. I do talk about my life, whenever it comes up. Not that I go out of way to blab but, if I'm asked I share. I make no bones about how challenging my life is. I tell people freely the effects of living with mental health issues. Usually I get "oh I'm sorry, or I feel bad for you, or how do you do it"? I take my time and tell those who will listen it's mental illness not the plague. It's not a terminal disease, it's something everyone should know about. One of the reasons I feel comfortable talking about it is that for so long I was isolated by it. I mean really how do you broach the subject of your BPDD behaviors?
    While I am raising my JJ it's because his mother could finally come to a place in her therapy to realize that she couldn't take care of him. He has just as many needs as she does, DR's, school. All that takes life management. I told her how proud I was of her for being able to ask for help from me. While I parent him I am always working on finding a way in which my daughter can add some input. Teacher conferences are too much for her, so I share the basics of what happened when I get home. There are times that are rough, she won't spend time with him, play with him. So I just take him places, we do things together. I know he misses his mom in this but, I tell him to share all with her when we get home.
     I often read of parents who go no contact with their children. That must be so hard, I can't imagine. My daughter would never make it on her own, she has tried. Of course it ended in disaster. While I have one child who is on his own with his own family, I also have my daughter who will require a life long commitment. I'm sure like everybody I have my good days and my bad. Mostly I'm just thankful that I have the stamina to keep up with both of them.

[FaithfulHope]

Dear all... .I just can relate to so many of these comments.  I have been trying to 'figure out' my DD26 since she was 8 years old.  I knew something just wasn't right.   I knew she was just very different than other kids... .but I didn't know what it was.   She was diagnosed with BPD at 18 but her whole life has been one crisis after another and endless drama... .and our family has been trying to help her and encourage her to grow and mature.  Basically we want her to be a good,honest, and kind human being - and not what she is today... .a liar, a thief, and a manipulator.   I am so thankful to all of you who get it... .because unless you live this life you just cannot understand all we go through day to day.   It is very hard to love someone so much who seems incapable of loving you back.