I feel I can't talk to her or go on this way

[dennissather]

Friends I am at a loss. I feel that I am losing my sanity, living with a wife who has BPD. I am frustrated as of late, my wife is cheerful and outgoing with anyone who is not me. I am her personal whipping boy. I am blamed for everything wrong in her world. She dictates, when we talk about things, what we can talk about it and how it should be talked about. She would rather me just tell her how wonderful she is and never have feelings of my own, never say that things she has hurt me by way of her actions. I recently went through some serious medical stuff. My wife could not be bothered by this because the stuff did not revolve around her. She is so self absorbed that unless we talk about her and the wonders of her, we dont talk. It gets frustrating LIVING THIS LIFE ON A DAILY BASIS. My therapist has told me i can not live like this I must share how I am feeling, for my own mental stability.I am in a catch 22. if I try to talk about this, my wife behaves like a spoiled child throwing a temper tantrum. Either that or she says i dont want to talk about this. If I dont bring it up it eats at me inside to the point I feel like I will break. I  never knew being married to someone with BPD could be so difficult. I do not know if I can stay in this kind of marriage or if i should stay in this kind of marriage. there comes a point when i need to look out for me. Anybody out there with similarities let me know. I need help with this!

[RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING]

RELATIONSHIP PROBLEM SOLVING This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members are welcomed to express frustration but must seek constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[Rhymes w/Orange]

dennissather,

I know. I know the feelings you are feeling. I know how deeply you long just to be able to talk to her. About normal stuff, just anything. Just have a relaxed conversation about stuff that's interesting, and enjoy the peace of knowing everything is ok and you have a spouse who cares how you feel, is your best friend and your favorite person. And that the spouse is feeling the same about you. I can guess that maybe it used to be that way, once upon a time.

The hope that it can be that way again is so wonderful. It can sustain you for a long while.

I got to the end of my rope, I knew I was going to crack if I stayed around any longer. I had a very complicated situation to deal with on top of the BPD. The stress was literally killing me. I didn't want to leave but I did because I had to. I am still gone and I still want to restore my marriage. But my boundaries are in place now and I know that I cannot remove them. I love him just as much as ever and I am fully in love with him. This time away has deepened my love because I have had a much needed break to recover a bit. However it seems to have done the opposite for him, as in his feelings of anger toward me seem to have intensified. Only God knows what will happen.

Bless you, my friend. I will pray for you, and your wife too. Draw near to God, you are not alone.

[Faithdriven]

dennissather,

I know. I know the feelings you are feeling. I know how deeply you long just to be able to talk to her. About normal stuff, just anything. Just have a relaxed conversation about stuff that's interesting, and enjoy the peace of knowing everything is ok and you have a spouse who cares how you feel, is your best friend and your favorite person. And that the spouse is feeling the same about you. I can guess that maybe it used to be that way, once upon a time.

I'd say this sums it ups beautifully for most of us!  I still am in awe that there are so many people out there who are going through what we've been going through.  I had no idea, living in the fog for so long.  My nerves were shot,,ALL the time.  I blamed his behavior over the years on this or that,,knowing that it wasn't normal and i knew deep down i wasn't to blame for everything (especially the little day to day stuff)  But i never knew what was really going on until i found this website.

Do you have children?   How long have the two of you been together?  It seems so unfair, i'm sure, to feel like you have to "decide" the future of the marriage on your own.  Stay posting on the boards and read the tools.  They REALLY do help.  I had been unknowing doing some of them over the years through trial n error in dealing with my BPDh.   But there is so much GREAT info here, that i hadn't considered.  You are NOT alone:)  

[tired-of-it-all]

What you describe is text book BPD.  Many of us have lived the same life.

First, give up on the hope that she will understand and behave toward you the way a spouse should.  It ain't gonna happen.  The sooner you let go of this fantasy, the sooner you will start to feel better.  I know that this is a great loss but it is the reality of this disease.  Giving up on this will require grief.  Grief of the loss of a dream.  And yes the dream is not unreasonable unless you are dealing with BPD.

Second, develop a support structure for yourself and don't be shy about using it.  Use this forum, find a counselor, find a support group.  I go to alanon.  It is for family and friends of alcoholics.  I went there because my wife is an adult child of an alcoholic and has many of the alcoholic characteristics; however, since then I have found that she is BPD.  The support group still works for me.  It contains healthy coping mechanisms that work in this situation.

Third, be good to yourself.  Living with this will make you think that you are crazy.  It is what BPD people do to their spouses.  Do things that are good for you.  Find things that you enjoy.  Recognize the things that you do to harm yourself; that you are doing just to appease her.  I needed to lose weight and get in shape.  I realized that I wasn't doing it because it would be a threat to her.  Yes that is right, a threat!  When I finally recognized this, I went on a diet and lost 40 pounds.  I exercise daily.  She was mad as hell but that is just too bad.  Take trips without her, see friends without her, join clubs or church organizations, do things that you want to do.  Take time for you and take time to figure out what you really want.

Good luck and hang in there.  It will get better.

[pk]

I feel your pain my friend.  When I was facing Cancer, chemo and Radiation, my BPD husband decided this was the time to have an affair with a teenager half his age for over 6 months until she showed up Christmas eve to tell me that he was in love with her and  . . . well never mind- lets get back to you.  Just wanted to let you know I understand the pain of living with a BPD.

Sounds like she is painting you black for some reason (not that they need one)

Perhaps you should go ahead and tell your wife your feelings.  You do need to get those feelings out but it is like BPD's have no emotional skin and get quickly emotionally overwhelmed.  Over the years I have found that the more I express my emotions to my husband the more he is able to understand and validate but still don't expect sympathy but it definitely does feel good to vent your feelings.  I have to be very careful first to talk with no emotion in my voice, very monotone , calmly and slowly.  Sounds crazy I know but they respond to emotion by amping up emotion.  Then you just get into a shouting match and that is no good. 

Read the lessons on this site as well to give you the tools you need.

It is important to take care of you! Focus on you! They do plenty of focusig on themselves for everyone!  Eat well, do things for yourself, pursue hobbies, exercise, move forward with as normal of a life as you can make it.  This is as important for your BPD spouse as it for you.  Even though they fight and scream against it they need the stability and strength that the Non's living a normal life gives them and it is crucial for our sanity.  You must have a great support system.  Surprisingly some of my best supports are also BPD's but they sometimes make great friends just crappy spouses, . 

Hang in there.

[dennissather]

Each day I end of exhausted. My wife has had so many mood swings it is scary. She has taken dbt and been in a adult partial class, and yet she reacts the same way she did before. She is nearing the end of DBT and I am scared because there has been no real change. It amazes me how she can not show this around friends, but i see it constantly. I am to be blamed for everything that goes wrong with her life. I get emotionally run down listening to this every day. I also hear her talk about herself non stop, yet my things I need to deal with, are not discussed, because they do not revolve around her. I love my wife, but I now find myself wondering if I should have married her. I have, found a support group as I have mentioned because I was starting to think I was going insane myself. This disease is terrible for it robs you of the energy and desire to love your significant other. Has anyone out there had similar things let me know or email me. I am exhausted

[Kelsie]

I can relate to a lot of what you're talking about.  My SO will talk about some things not related to her, but the mood swings and emotional override of any type of logic is so difficult for me to handle.  I'm a pretty logical person and I used to be very passive and chill, but this relationship has definitely changed me (or I guess I have allowed myself to change?).  I am now very anxious and engage in the eggshell walking on a daily basis.  Last night, she had 3 serious mood swings/outbursts within about a 15-30 minute period.  She blew up at me, then apologized after a few minutes, then immediately blew up again, then apologized, then did it again.  Anything she feels is true and is reality, even if it has little or no basis in reality.  She isn't quite as controlled as your wife sounds like (other people have seen her blow up/blame/deny/etc) so I do get some support from others because of that, but it's still so hard to deal with day in and day out.

From what you've said, it sounds like you really struggle with the lack of stability (which I do, too).  You never know exactly what's going to trigger an outburst/mood swing so it's not like you can prevent them from happening and when you're blamed for everything, you start to feel like you could have done something about it (which it seems like the pwBPD thinks you can despite any evidence otherwise).  She is responsible for her behavior, not you.  Even if she won't accept or admit that (been trying to get mine to for quite awhile and those times are few and far between) she is still the only one who can control her behavior.  You can also reassure yourself that she is in control because she DOES control it around everyone else.  That takes a good bit of restraint on her part but you suffer the consequences for it because it all comes out at you.

I don't have any real helpful advice, but there is plenty available here.  You are definitely not alone.

[dennissather]

My friends it has been awhile. things have not gotten better. Things have only gotten worse. I am exhausted each and every day trying to deal with the emotional instability of my wife. I am attending a support group for family members of BPD people. This is a blessing for me, since I was beginning to think i was the problem (as my wife insists). This group helps me see that i am not alone in this fight against this terrible disease. My wife is constantly blaming and downgrading me about so many things. I feel I am loosing my identity, because if I say no to her for anything activity for us, money situation etc, she reacts. In many cases I say ok just to avoid the inevitable drama. At the same time, i feel like her servant, I do whatever she wants, and meet her needs of affirmation. i do all the chores, do basically everything for her, let her set our agenda, take on full responsibility for our money (she believes money grows on trees). i am overwhelmed, yet tell her how i love her and how wonderful she is constantly to help battle her insecurities. At the same time, I get virtually none of my needs met. We were at our marriage counselor yesterday, and she asked what needs of mine my wife could meet. She had no idea what my needs even were. She had a deer in the headlight look. this is because everything is about her and making her life easier. It frustrates me that our marriage is so one sided. We picked up a prescription at the pharmacy yesterday and during the ride over she said it is ok for only 1 person to be giving in a relationship. this scared me. I am sorry for being long winded but i needed to say what was on my mind. I can see why 90 % of marriages with a BPD partner ends in divorce. My mom who i loved very much died at the end of June. I have not even had the chance to grieve her because, i have been so busy catering to all my wife"s needs and wants. Could anyone out there offer me any solutions to help ease the stress. Thanks my friend for letting me vent.

[Tyrwhitt]

One of the earlier replies was very good - you should grieve for your dreams of how you thought your marriage would be and then move on.  Once we nons figure out that it is all about them, it's not about us, and our needs are met outside of the marriage (friends, support groups, just plain old activities), we become happier.  BPDs simply are overwhelmed with themselves, their emotions, their anger, their constant inability to control themselves.  Their ability to portray themselves to the outside world as fabulous people comes from the need to validate who they are, to be seen as 'good, caring' people - because the key is that they fear abandonment, can't regulate their emotions and have a need to control (whilst accusing their loved one of controlling).

I see my H as two people.  The well one, who I enjoy time with, and the ill one, who is energy-consuming, frustrating, demoralising and I don't enjoy being with him.  I don't look to him for support, it's like hitting my head against a brick wall.  If it's on offer at a particular time, I inwardly feel surprised and take it at face value with grace. 

Our expectations of marriage are often unreal - especially when with a BPD partner.  We feel that that person should meet our needs, be equal, think how we think.  some people achieve that but not with a BPD partner.  Our world is different but you have to dig deep into strengthening your own soul.  You have to understand, learn to live with and love yourself first.  Then, educate and understand your wife's illness.  There's a good book I'm reading called 'When Hope is not enough', which has some very interesting 'tools' to staying with a BPD r/s and understanding of the illness.  It's well written and easy to read. 

One further thing, take what your friends say with a pinch of salt.  They're not living your life and have no real understanding.  Most friends will tell you to leave, and maybe you should (only you can answer that one).  Can you cope with such a marriage?  Yes, you can.  With different expectations and a massive dose of 'sticks and stones'.  Build a shield - words of blame will only wear you down if you give them room.  Bounce them off - you're okay, you know that, build your self-esteem.  When your energy is low, take time out and go out and do something, clear your mind of the confusion and pain.  You'll experience it all the time, you're human and we all feel overwhelmed at times.  If you have a bad day, it's fine, you'll wake up another day and feel strong.  Build your life around you, don't question yourself.  Accept that your marriage is one-side (remember it's all about them,that's the illness) but love is a complicated bond and you can grow from the experience. 

Lastly, losing your mum is a major loss.  Create your personal space, you're not your wife's lackie, be strong and let her deal with herself for a while.  She can, she just chooses not to and you don't need to meet her needs all the time. 

[daze]

I am so sorry for what you are going through.  I cannot imagine going through a serious illness with a BPD partner.

Whipping boy.  I used the same term with my husband. 

[dennissather]

Well, here i am writing again. I am taking a class that teaches me about how to deal with a BPD partner. I am learning about validation and radical acceptance etc. many things taught in DBT. It is tough for me to adjust my way of communicating to meet the other persons coping needs. I sometimes feel like it is a lot of work but worth it for a partner I love. In the process I feel many times that my needs are going unmet. My wife and i have discussed this with a therapist. It seems that sometimes (learned not to say always) that the whole topic is of her needs and she is not concerned if I have needs or not. My wife was asked what My needs were and, she got a deer in the headlight look. I am many times exhausted at the end of the day. I have to think what can I say, when can I say it , and how should I say it. I also must figure out how to go without my needs met, and making sure everything for her is. Then there is money, my wife believes that we have an abundant supply of money. I  constantly must be the villain and say we can not afford something. She can say can we afford something. i can say no and 15 minutes later she will ask about something else at even a more expensive price. I am constantly worrying about finances, her reaction etc. Living with this is a struggle. Does anyone else out there experience this money situation? I am feeling exhausted, as i must change so many ways of living, and it seems like she stays much the same. She will then complain or blame me if things are not the way she wants them to be. Sorry for the ramble, but this is so frustrating and exhausting, and it never stops. HELP!

[waverider]

You need your space to be you independent of her. This allows you to think and make decisions more subjectively.

What you say, your decisions and actions must be driven by what YOU consider to be the right thing, they must not be driven by reactions to what she may say, or you think she may say, or do. That is reactive thinking and undermines your own sense of self worth.

[real lady]

What a great discussion; I am so sorry that you, like many of us, experience the daily crazym-making circular conversations, over sensitivity to EVERYTHING we say and do, lack of reciprocity in kindness and affection but I am very glad that YOU have gotten help for yourself. Of all the things that a pwBPD can take or try to take from us, they can't take ourselves unless we allow it. They can't take our clarity; once we find it and keep it.

As far as the money is concerned, my pwBPD is a "collector" and "geek" and HAS TO HAVE the very newest, trendiest, updated electronic, tv, game player, etc... .YET he limits me on groceries and any BIGGER items that I would personally like or like for the house is responded with "we don't have money for that" and I don't see this changing at all. I cook for him and tell him that we are "low" on items and when we have the last egg, etc. (I keep things up since I have a child and I purchase my own items but I have been "adding" MY items to the grocery cart; a bottle of wine, hummus, stuff that no one else in the house eats)

My pwBPD will ask me "what is wrong" when he sees tears in my eyes and I KNOW that 'my hurt' will be "put down" since HE MUST BE THE VICTIM (quoted from another thread) and my pain, sorrow and grief. (personal illness and loss of my mom, I am sorry to hear of your mom's passing too... .I got "sympathy" for about a month... .that was IT).

I entered counseling and talked about "being depressed" since he has nearly sucked ALL the life out of me before I said "STOP". I am now on the path of replenishing my life and hope to get into a BPD support group in my area. I am interested in hearing how that is helping you and wish you well... .welcome to bpdfamily.com; it is a truly remarkable place with truly remarkable people.

HAPPY THANKSGIVING by the way... .hugs   

[dennissather]

It has been awhile since I wrote. My wife has become totally out of control. Everything seems to be my fault, and i am not paying attention to her 24/7. My life basically does not exist, I am to do everything for her to make her life easier. I am to blame for everything i her life that goes wrong, and she tells me I have to handle everything because she is emotionally fragile. She does nothing around the home. Cleaning, cooking, laundry, money situation. If I do not do it then it doesnt get done, and it must be done to her precise way. When I confront her and the like she says, I am badgering her and she can not deal with it due to her fragile emotional state. Am I a fool for being there for whenever she needs me?  Dr appointments (physical and mental). On the money front she would rather put $130 for a new phone to replace the phone she lost, then to pay for groceries, when are refrigerator is nearly empty. Try working a budget with her, she feels my money is OUR money, but her money is HER money. I can not remember the last thing I got for myself. Why do I stay? Why do I allow myself to be a doormat for her instability? I am afraid of the reaction she will have if things dont go her way. Will it be cutting, temper tantrum,etc. What should I do? I thought after she took DBT things would be better. They have not. I am afraid sometimes I am the one going crazy. It is like a merry go round that never stops. Can anyone give me some ideas out there on how to cope. Thanks! :

[Depression_or_bpd]

Dennissather,

Can I say ditto to your last post? 

My wife says she has depression and I understand some things that can be related to that. Like you, I do most of the chores, handle finances and everything else. When I get back from work I go straight to the kitchen to cook and then when I finally sit down with her she expects me to have all the energy to show my love every minute. If I try to go to sleep at 10:30pm, she says you are only thinking about your sleep and she's been suffering from depression alone all day. So we go to sleep at 12 or later. Then she expects me to make her sleep by massaging her back, it soothes her. So I only sleep after she sleeps at 1 and I have to get up at 6am. My concern is she doesnt feel bad the next say and therefore, its been continuing for 4 years now.

I cannot discuss anything with her. I cannot watch any sports channel. I cannot pick up calls without asking her. She expects me to share every decision i make, like what i will have for lunch when i am at work. She has a special problem with my parents and have really alienated me from them.

It's been a similar story for 4 years and I am really tired physically and mentally. I  trying to cope by using some of the communications tools here but that doesn't seem to work. I am still in very early stages to change myself, so I guess it will take sometime.

[real lady]

My wife has become totally out of control. Everything seems to be my fault, and i am not paying attention to her 24/7. My life basically does not exist, I am to do everything for her to make her life easier. I am to blame for everything i her life that goes wrong, and she tells me I have to handle everything because she is emotionally fragile. She does nothing around the home. Cleaning, cooking, laundry, money situation. If I do not do it then it doesnt get done, and it must be done to her precise way.

WOW... .  

When I confront her and the like she says, I am badgering her and she can not deal with it due to her fragile emotional state.

Sounds like she is using a bit of emotional blackmail on you... .  have you read about that?

Am I a fool for being there for whenever she needs me? 

I think many of us "do all that we can" because we love them but I think "there comes a time" when we realize that they are "using us" and our knowledge, understanding and compassion toward them to control our lives, if we let them.

Why do I stay? Why do I allow myself to be a doormat for her instability? I am afraid of the reaction she will have if things dont go her way. Will it be cutting, temper tantrum,etc.

VERY LIKELY she might dysregulate but that doesn't mean that you HAVE to be held prisoner by her. I have "let my uBPDso sit alone" when I am tired of his constant BPDness.

What should I do? I thought after she took DBT things would be better. They have not. I am afraid sometimes I am the one going crazy. It is like a merry go round that never stops. Can anyone give me some ideas out there on how to cope. Thanks. :

You can control yourself, not her... .  TAKE GOOD CARE OF YOU and say "no" when YOU need some time for yourself... .  you will see that she will "not allow" you to take care of yourself and will be able to see clearly that she is the one who is sabotaging your relationship with her by NOT taking responsibility for her own behavior... .  I am so sorry to hear that you think that you are the crazy one... .  you aren't. Have YOU thought about counseling for yourself or some time apart/separation from her? Hope things will get better for you ((Dennis))

[dennissather]

I have not written in a long time. Things our spiraling out of control. I have watched my wife try DBT, Adult partial hospitalization, inpatient and now a trip to the Mayo Clinic, i have been by her side on everyone of these journey"s. Despite this the results seem to be the same. I am getting tired of the effort of trying to be there on a daily basis for someone who verbally abuses me at every chance, and talks about themselves constantly and acts like my only role is to serve her. I have vanished as a partner in the marriage. Sometimes I think Oh my God what have i gotten myself into. If I had known the magnitude would I have made different choices. I know I do love her, but the day to day grind sometimes is overwhelming. I am constantly asked why I look exhausted, but people have no idea what living with a person with this diagnosis is like day in and day out. If anyone has any wise advice let me know. thanks I need help.

[briefcase]

Hi dennissather,

I am sorry things are still out of control.  We all know how tough these relationships can be.  

I am going to suggest that you read our Lessons and spend some time participating in some of the discussions here.  

Her recorvery from BPD is out of your control.  She has to be sincere in her desire to change, and even then it is a loong process.  You have no impact on this.  None.  You can't make her better by being her doormat, by rubbing her back, checking with her before you answer your phone, or by cowtowing to her demands.  In fact, doing these things is bad for both of you (she will disagree with this, but its true).  

People with BPD are not strong and powerful (although it feels that way when we start).  They are weak and needy.  If you love her, and if you want to stay, you must be the strong one.  You have to be the emotional leader.  

What does strength in this relationship look like?  Being able to say no.  Not being afraid to speak your truth.  Taking care of your own needs.  Having strong boundaries, and enforcing them. Detaching emotionally and lovingly from her emotions - both the ups and the downs.  The members practice these things everyday, and support each other in their journeys. It can be done.  You can do this.

But, there is a whole lot more to your membership here than just popping in every few months when things get bad.  There are no quick fixes.  This takes dedication, and practice.  We can't help you if you aren't here.  

Are you ready to do this?

[waverider]

I will second what briefcase says on this one, you need to talk and post more here the more you hear and repeat what advice, the more the reality of what this really means sinks in.

You need you space to concentrate on you and not toally focus on fixing her, or meeting your needs. You sound far to enmeshed.

There are basic things she cannot do, because she has a mental illnes. In your case that sounds like showing genuine interest, empathy and care about your view. THIS WILL NOT CHANGE in the immediate future, you cannot change it. You need alternate sources for empathy and validation, and here is a good source to start with.

You need stronger boundaries and physical space from time to time. Yes this will cause dramas at first, but that is what boundaries are for, to protect your rights to be you, the individual.

Do not get hung up that she is civil and interested in others, this will probably be a facade and only on a superficial level. What she is doing is presenting an image to them, it is about how others perceive her, rather than her really caring about them. She is selling her image so that they will like her in effect, it is still about her.

She saves her dumping for you because she believes you wont abandon her. If she lets it all out with outsiders they will walk, it is the same effect as a boundary. They wont put up with it, you will, hence you become the outlet where she can let that mask down and she can stop pretending to care.

I know at times the desire to "expose" her to others so they will empathize with you is strong, but it is frustrating and destructive to you,. It is a complete waste of energy and achieves nothing.

It does come down to you rebuilding yourself as a stand alone individual. Believe me if you can achieve this you will get more respect from your wife and you will grow closer rather than apart as a result. It will substantially reduce resentment.

Pull away, if you want to become closer.

[yeeter]

Hi Dennis,

A big part of helping her is to take care of yourself.  If people are noticing that you look exhausted, it's because you are.

So take a break regularly. Connect with your own friends and family and support group.  Establish some boundaries that give you space and control.

It's a marathon. You need to be strong emotionally and physically to survive it.