Finding out what they really think.

[mssalty]

Electing to make peace for someone else  by taking my own lumps, I watched my SO turn a discussion about that someone else into a discussion about all of my horrible faults.  My SO spent an hour detailing all of the issues they have with me, including mocking very personal things about me that I hold dear.   

There's something surreal about watching the person who is supposed to love you give you a detailed listing of reasons why you're unlovable, without ever really grasping that what they're saying could be hurting you.   It's also surreal to watch them talk about how they won't stand for people being mean or having drastic mood sings and yet... .

I stood there and listened and didn't feel crushed, or sad, or even anger.   I just felt empty.  I was listening to a walking contradiction who desires extreme empathy in others, but has none of their own.  Someone who cares desperately what everyone thinks except those closest to them, and someone who can find a thousand criticisms for you and others but cannot hear one inkling of one about themselves.   

I know what BPD is.  I know what I need to be doing.  And I've been trying.   But watching the person I've tried so hard to love so easily find ways to hate me just let me cold inside.    I know if someone was watching it, they'd take my side.   And I know that my SO would say they didn't say anything mean or horrible.   

It's amazing how aware of others they claim to be, but how unaware of themselves they are.   

Not looking for advice.   Just wanted to let off a bit of sadness. 

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[hellokitty4]

I know what you mean... . it also hurts how they can talk about other people, give them praise, like they're special yet they have a hard time saying nice things about you. And talks and talks as though what you are and what you do for them is never going to be enough for them. I don't think BPDs realize how hurtful their words are... . spoken as truth or just to inflict hurt... I'm not sure.  I know who I am and what I am yet these words affect me like no other. I often feel taken foregranted, like whatever I do is not good enough.

[HealingSlowly]

 

There's something surreal about watching the person who is supposed to love you give you a detailed listing of reasons why you're unlovable, without ever really grasping that what they're saying could be hurting you.   It's also surreal to watch them talk about how they won't stand for people being mean or having drastic mood sings and yet... .

I stood there and listened and didn't feel crushed, or sad, or even anger.   I just felt empty.  I was listening to a walking contradiction who desires extreme empathy in others, but has none of their own.  Someone who cares desperately what everyone thinks except those closest to them, and someone who can find a thousand criticisms for you and others but cannot hear one inkling of one about themselves.   

I know what BPD is.  I know what I need to be doing.  And I've been trying.   But watching the person I've tried so hard to love so easily find ways to hate me just let me cold inside.    I know if someone was watching it, they'd take my side.   And I know that my SO would say they didn't say anything mean or horrible.   

It's amazing how aware of others they claim to be, but how unaware of themselves they are.   

Wow Mssalty... . this is so clear, as is the empty and yet sad feeling watching/seeing this. Thank you, and agree hellokitty4. We all get it. Wow. I guess the empty feeling is "good" finally. And the sadness also a testament to our enduring empathy but knowing too... . it is sad... . All best!

[eeyore]

 

I'm sorry mssalty.  Prayers for you.  I just wish it worked that all the BPD's were with other BPD's so the nons would be left with each other.  Life is difficult enough, human relations are difficult themselves, then add an illness like BPD and it's a recipe for disaster.

[downandin]

Oh my, I could have written the exact same thing.  My wife has absolutely no idea how the way she often berates me when talking about me, especially to or in front of our kids, just leaves me feeling like an empty shell.

She really does not know that she is hurting me.  Telling her does nothing.  I have finally come to understand that when she is berating me, she is really talking about herself in a 'projecting' way.  She needs someone like me to place all blame on, because she is incapable of handling any blame herself.  I understand this, but for me, I really don't know how much more I can take. 

I remember a movie that had creatures called 'Soul Suckers.'  I can't remember which movie, but this is exactly the way I feel in my life.  My wife is the 'Soul Sucker,' even though she doesn't realize it or mean to.  I am the victim, and I will only survive as long as I have a little 'soul' left.  I don't know how long that will be.

[Scarlet Phoenix]

I get what you're saying, it can certainly feel like they're not connecting the dots between their own behaviour and the effect it can have on us nons. And being berated, or put down, has the potential to crush us.

So what can we do to make a change? How can we get the message across to our partner in a non-threatening way that this is hurting us?

[eeyore]

I get what you're saying, it can certainly feel like they're not connecting the dots between their own behaviour and the effect it can have on us nons. And being berated, or put down, has the potential to crush us.

So what can we do to make a change? How can we get the message across to our partner in a non-threatening way that this is hurting us?

Everyone is different but I found when a good friend in kindness makes mention of similar scenario that is what helps the most.  My pointing anything out usually doesn't have good results. 

[briefcase]

That "empty shell" feeling is a symptom of verbal abuse.  I lived that way for a long time.  I could actually feel myself sort of being swallowed up by something.  Remembering it still gives me a chill.   :'(

Fortunately, stopping verbal abuse can be done and our members here have a lot of success using boundaries to not stick around for verbal abuse in any of its forms from rages to silent treatments.  There is a lot of good information about this issue in the Lessons. 

Basically, you end every conversation that becomes abusive - personal attacks, name-calling, swearing, throwing objects, screaming, etc.  Just take a time out and leave.  Every time.  You don't tell them to stop, you don't react and yell back, you just exit stage left for a defined period of time. 

[waverider]

That "empty shell" feeling is a symptom of verbal abuse.  I lived that way for a long time.  I could actually feel myself sort of being swallowed up by something.  Remembering it still gives me a chill.   :'(

Fortunately, stopping verbal abuse can be done and our members here have a lot of success using boundaries to not stick around for verbal abuse in any of its forms from rages to silent treatments.  There is a lot of good information about this issue in the Lessons. 

Basically, you end every conversation that becomes abusive - personal attacks, name-calling, swearing, throwing objects, screaming, etc.  Just take a time out and leave.  Every time.  You don't tell them to stop, you don't react and yell back, you just exit stage left for a defined period of time. 

i agree with Briefcase here, you wont directly change them but you can substantially change the way it affects you. Boundaries can reduce your exposure to it. Understanding and Acceptance will substantially minimize, and put into perspective, what you can't avoid.

Dont get me wrong you wont eliminate it, but periodic outbursts, and the occasional snide remark, will still annoy you and frustrate you a little. But the build up of resentment, and the soul draining effect won't be there.

It's all part of separating "their stuff" from "your stuff". That sounds simple to say, but it is hard to do. You find that this sort of evolves with time as a normal (and healthy) way of thinking. Its part of regaining a strong sense of self.

I find I can get as angry and wound up as ever, sometimes even more, as I now feel I have a right to be and dont have to be the martyr, and I am not afraid of the consequences the same. Now though I come back down very quickly without the resentment of having to bite my tongue. At first I thought I was failing to do a better job, but then realized i was being "normal" and not afraid of it anymore.

This is what normal folks do when they get annoyed at someone, they let it out, then its gone. We have been taught by our pwBPD that there will be serious, and on going, consequences when we do this. They have taken that right from us. We have to learn to take it back. fear of self expression is what really sucks your soul

[dreamer321]

mssalty-

I hear you. I feel it with you. I too am going through something very similar. I can't win for losing. Feeling pushed from the beginning of the relationship-and somehow unconciously knowing something is not right-and yet allowing myself to get all on cloud nine because of the flattering way he made me feel-to this. An empty shell. Pushing me to the limits-and when I can't take it anymore-I have to remove myself from the situation. But above all remember that you are not alone. You are brave-intelligent-and you can handle your emotions. All we can do sometimes is just love ourselves first so that we can take care of things in a healthy way, nurturing ourselves and indulging in the things that give back to us when we seem to be looking for it in a place that just isn't there. I do feel your sadness. Lori