The Simple Stuff Confuses Me

[Aletheia]

Despite my increasing awareness and growing sense that I am truly, slowly, beginning to get over this ghastly affair, I am prone to 'crash' over the most trivial of thoughts.

Eg: I can understand technical articles explaining the psychology of BPD behaviour, but then I fall apart when I recall how we would make the bed together.

What's going on here? Where was her mind during those moments? We could laugh, enjoy the moment, I (at least) felt relaxed and content we were building a deeper bond.

Then, as we know, the whole relationship could be over 30 hours later.

Was she clinging then? Manipulating me in another way? Just having a normal moment?

Any insight is welcome.

Thanks!

[eeyore]

you can't make sense out of crazy.  So why are you trying?

[Ironmanrises]

You have been in a traumatic relationship.

I have had similar issues.

Your brain is on overdrive... .

Trying to make sense of... .

Things that really have no sense... .

At least in terms of logically... .

Because they originated from... .

A disordered person... .

Whom you fell in love with.

It sucks.

Beyond.

I know.

Hang in there.

[DragoN]

you can't make sense out of crazy.  So why are you trying?

This is the truth. Accepting that the hardest part. There is no logic and every time you take them back after every beautiful promise that it won't happen again, and he is "sorry" you pay the price over and over and over of having your heart and trust betrayed beyond anything you can imagine.

Feeling compassion and empathy towards your partner , understanding their pain, practically feeling it for them , will only cause you more horrific grief and agony. Once you are in the PD Matrix, it's extremely hard to get out. The damage is really remarkable. Fortunately, logic and reason does help the non. Feelings are not Facts, your feelings are real in this moment, now and they will pass and come back to haunt and one day, they will not have quite the same sting and pain attached.

[Octoberfest]

Hi aletheia-

Two things.

1) In reference to how the articles make sense but you fall apart at the memories... .your mind and your heart are fighting a battle here.  It is love vs. logic... .and it is very hard when they are saying two different things.  Our hearts, the part that loves them, wants desperately to believe a truth different from the realities of our situations.  So it is incredibly hard.

2) To continue off what eeyore said... .you truly can't make sense out their actions and their thoughts.  They are considered disordered for a reason... .think about that word for a second.  Disordered.  It means quite frankly that they DON'T make sense.  This is also incredibly painful because as we try and make sense out of their actions we feel like we are reading a book and someone ripped out about 40 pages in the middle and we are left with no idea how the story got from point a to point b.  The sad truth is that no matter how long you think about it and try to make sense of it, you can't get those 40 pages back. 

Sorry you are hurting.  The memories and the habits are hard... .but feel them.  The only way to heal is to go through, not around.

[Escaped 30.Sept.2013]

I think one of the most practical, useful things I've learnt in here is that the BPD reacts as a 4-year-old emotionally.

And although I'm not a parent, I've babysat and have younger family members, I've been around 4-year-olds enough for it to help me.

And yes, you can make a bed with a 4-year-old, and work together co-operating in a common aim, laugh and have fun, play silly games while you're doing it, feel warm affection linking you... .and shortly afterwards when the child has to go to something they don't want, like playgroup or the dentist, or you have an appointment and the child has to sit bored waiting for you, then the tantrum explodes and they hate you and they hope you die.

It has really helped me to remember I've been dealing with someone who is in his 40s for work, for colleagues, for neighbours, for FB-friends, for every other aspect of his life except the most crucial and emotionally-important one: me.

For me, he is 4, not 40.

For me, he has no impulse control.

For me, he grabs hold and pushes away.

For me, he craves attention and will do pretty much anything to get it, but also needs desperately to stand on his own away from me.

For me, he loves and hates me, in words and deeds, although I believe he basically loves me.

For everyone else, he's a 40+ year old professional man.

I just have the pre-schooler... .

[Ironmanrises]

I think one of the most practical, useful things I've learnt in here is that the BPD reacts as a 4-year-old emotionally.

And although I'm not a parent, I've babysat and have younger family members, I've been around 4-year-olds enough for it to help me.

And yes, you can make a bed with a 4-year-old, and work together co-operating in a common aim, laugh and have fun, play silly games while you're doing it, feel warm affection linking you... .and shortly afterwards when the child has to go to something they don't want, like playgroup or the dentist, or you have an appointment and the child has to sit bored waiting for you, then the tantrum explodes and they hate you and they hope you die.

It has really helped me to remember I've been dealing with someone who is in his 40s for work, for colleagues, for neighbours, for FB-friends, for every other aspect of his life except the most crucial and emotionally-important one: me.

For me, he is 4, not 40.

For me, he has no impulse control.

For me, he grabs hold and pushes away.

For me, he craves attention and will do pretty much anything to get it, but also needs desperately to stand on his own away from me.

For me, he loves and hates me, in words and deeds, although I believe he basically loves me.

For everyone else, he's a 40+ year old professional man.

I just have the pre-schooler... .

In bold.

Lets rephrase that to... .

I just have the pre-schooler... .

From hell.

[DragoN]

An adult primary r/s that emotes at the level of a 4 year old and the behaviors that concomitant along with the abuse:

Women in abusive relationships may experience high levels of dissonance resulting from their negative attitude towards the abuse in the rela-tionship and their inability to leave the relationship. If they feel ―trapped‖ in the relationship, they may be inclined to change their negative attitude pertaining to the relationship or the abuse, whether they know it or not. While changing their attitude to be more positive towards the relationship and the abuse will reduce any experienced dissonance, a newly positive outlook on abuse could be more dangerous - leaving the relation-ship may become more difficult if the abused woman has a positive outlook on the relationship and/or abuse. Once the woman commits to an attitude change that results in her adopting positive feelings towards the abusive relationship, she will continue to have those positive emotions due to the human nature of wanting to remain consistent with our thoughts and actions; therefore, reducing dissonance. For example, a woman who gradually becomes exposed to violence may justify the abuse as much as necessary to make it seem less dangerous. These justifications may lead her to unknowingly change her attitude of abuse over time.

Journal sur l’identité, les relations interpersonnelles et les relations intergroupes

Journal of Interpersonal Relations, Intergroup Relations and Identity

Volume 6, Hiver/Winter 2013

47

Commitment: The Key to Women Staying in Abusive Relationships

www.osil.psy.ua.edu/pubs/DareGuadagnoMuscanell_2013.pdf

[fromheeltoheal]

Also, BPDs do have fleeting moments of contentment and happiness, maybe those happened making the bed, or maybe she was mirroring you still to cement the attachment bond, a subconscious motivation on her part mind you.

I found remembering good times like that especially painful because they were like a tease; why couldn't the whole relationship be like that?  Because a BPD has labile moods, as I'm sure you know; mine could be happy one minute and raging the next.  And then of course I would look for reasons it was my fault, and of course she would provide them if asked.

Why can't those tease moments be full time?  Because BPD is a serious mental illness, and acceptance of that is key to our healing.

[eeyore]

Journal sur l’identité, les relations interpersonnelles et les relations intergroupes

Journal of Interpersonal Relations, Intergroup Relations and Identity

Volume 6, Hiver/Winter 2013

47

Commitment: The Key to Women Staying in Abusive Relationships

www.osil.psy.ua.edu/pubs/DareGuadagnoMuscanell_2013.pdf

Interestingly this article suggests that the abused slowly or in steps devise a way to leave the abuser. 

[Aletheia]

I once heard it said that, "Unhappiness exists in the gap between perception and reality."

As ever, I think when we have these moments, ie. my bed-making moment with my ex-gf, we are once again seduced by our perceptions of what we want/need to be going on rather than the reality of what is actually happening.

Everyone's thoughts here have grounded me once more... .

[eeyore]

Can you describe (list) things you are doing that are making moving on easier?  Can you add ideas to that list?  I'd appreciate if you would share them. 

[Aletheia]

Hi eeyore

There are many things that went on and are going on in inside me. I'll try and summarise as best I can. It won't be succinct!

• Although my ex-gf officially ended the relationship (by text!), I already knew that things were not right. I'm not saying this was fully conscious, but the 'something is not quite right' feeling had me in its grip and I'm now certain that my responses to her effectively triggered her abandonment fears and made her hit eject before she perceived I would. I don't believe I would have ended the relationship this time around.

• In this vein, when we had our final argument, I left her house. I was angry that she had flared up when I'd tried hard to talk to her like an adult. I sent her a text as I left, saying I did not know how we would survive if we could not resolve something like this.

• When I got home I sent a text, that truly I did not remember sending until I was reminded about 10 days later. It said:

"I went to Newmarket races yesterday. It was reasonably fun, expensive and wet. Had planned a lazy day today and a ride around Rutland Water tomorrow. I can't see that happening as I can't see this relationship lasting. I'm fed up of being on the wrong end of her self-defending, wounded soul. It's a big turn-off for me to be unable to talk openly about what's bothering me, without receiving a tirade of countering blame instead of an adult answer.  I feel as if I'm walking on egg-shells and can't be myself. She is so sensitised and her mood changes with every nuance of my own. I can't have a glum moment without her own mood altering and her becoming distant and impenetrable. I've nearly had enough as this isn't stuff that changes in a hurry and I don't have the desire to hang around to see if it does."

• So, it's possible to see that I was, on some level, acknowledging that the relationship was in deep trouble, before it was ended by her. AWARENESS!

• When she ended it, I did not feel a sense of panic, instead I was able to read between the lines of her text and see a reactive, scared woman. Not to forget that a few hours earlier she 'loved' me. She used my reasons for dissatisfaction as her reasons for termination. Therefore, absolutely no sensible thought or maturity on her part. It helped me hold it together.

Once it was over, I began to feel bad and blame myself as is my acknowledged pattern. I FELT AWFUL and lost about 10lbs in as many days. These situations always trigger  feelings of low self-worth, loneliness, failure, 'I should have tired harder', 'It's my fault', 'I'm useless'... .However, I know this and have attempted to work on them in therapy before.


The things that have really helped me are:

1: Analysing the hell out what happened in the relationship and what was wrong with someone who could say they loved you one minute and hate you and never want to see you again 30 hours later. To a degree, one is not going to fathom this but I have managed to get close enough to understanding how deeply disordered her thinking is to begin to understand that I can't change that. This process is always circular in that however much I improve my understanding of her it always leaves me with the pain of me. This tells me I must look at me and ask, 'Why was I attracted to her?'

2: Sitting with my pain and letting it flow over me. It's GHASTLY! I lean on all if my friends... .! However, as much as understanding what happened is important I also acknowledge that I mustn't use that process to keep me from feeling my own pain. The answers are in me NOT HER. I know that I will be less drawn to her if I instil some of the healthy feelings that would have protected me from being attracted to her in the first place. In this respect I see a psychodynamic psychotherapist and continue to understand that for me, I have become thought led at the expense of my feelings. The denied feelings that I stuffed away all those years ago as a child are those that weren't there to stop me as I happily marched through every red flag on my way to this world of pain.

3: I read this article. It helped me, tremendously, to understand her behaviour and START SEEING HER ACTIONS, RATHER THAN MY FANTASY, AS REALITY.

   

Re: BPD women who lead men on

« Reply #34 on: September 08, 2010, 05:58:43 PM »

https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=127464.0;all

4: I started to differentiate between my neediness and her dysfunction. I then began to see that my hurt was about ME and not her. This provides a focus for talk in therapy. She wanted an ANYBODY not a SOMEBODY. I have begun to see that I overlooked so many selfish, controlling, emasculating actions on her part, in order to follow my fantasy.

5: I journal my thoughts and record those details when my unconscious talks to me with those transient but oh so important nuggets. I take those to my therapist.

6: More and more when I see her in my mind, I try to see her as tragic, disordered and pitiful. I allow myself to feel negatively towards her. She hurt me and I am protecting myself now because I didn't know how to before.

7: There's no magic. I read this forum and contribute and learn from other's insight, just as you are.

8: I remember IT'S ALL ABOUT ME NOW.

9: Recovery is a process and we must trust it. Understand that it may be me falling apart tomorrow! In which case I will review this post and try to march on!

My best wishes to you, friend.

[fiddlestix]

I have come to believe that most of the time my ex was thinking about her next "fix."  She could not tolerate boredom or discomfort of any kind.  If we entered a hot car she would usually say, "Turn the effing AC on now!"  If I had a radio station on that she did not like it had to be turned immediately.  No tolerance for discomfort. (odd, since she heroically birthed three children with minimal pain meds)  Immediate gratification is her MO.  If an activity is fun in the moment she is "happy."  As soon as boredom sets in she is done and moved on to something that will gratify her.

In our recent recycle I was "fresh" to her because we had been 98% NC for a year.  Within a month I was "old hat" and she moved on to her boy toy.  I believe that all things around a pwBPD, including people, are like game pieces to be moved around for their pleasure. I know this is not a very complimentary assessment of my wife, but after 25 plus years I know her best. 

Fiddlestix

[Aletheia]

Just to prove myself right, I've just emotionally crashed. I re-read a WhatsApp chat history of our final conversations, following the huge row we had, during which she was vile.


Is this a 'recycle'... .?

It sounds so much like she is trying so hard to get me to come back to her, to talk. She tells me she loves me, I am her missing piece, she has never met anybody like me, she has never opened up to somebody like she has to me, that normally she shuts down at this point, would I like to go for a walk, would I like to talk, she knows she has issues and she will get the dealt with, she realises she has been a complete nightmare over the past couple of weeks. I mean it's just about every scenario covered.

I feel I sound distant and cold as I ask for space and time to get my thoughts together... .I was very upset by her and untold her I was not confident about our relationship any more.

It's the fact that she sounds so hopeful and so willing to make amends and so contrite that is making me feel like I missed a big opportunity to reconcile. I notice, though, she doesn't ever refer to the row we had 40 minutes earlier in which she was a bhit.

It's very apparent how cool and calm she is compared to how raging she was only a few minutes earlier.

Have I been a fool or is this a 'recycle', an attempt to win me back at all costs.

What happened next is that when I didn't respond how she wanted she ended the relationship.

One minute she was so pleasant and trying to be nice and the next day it's all over. All so calm and matter of fact. It doesn't make sense to me. I did feel distant and angry with her but I feel if she really loved me she would have given me time and stayed close.

Her communications after this point became terse and unemotional.

Surely, if she really had loved me she would not be able to change so rapidly and would have responded favourably or even politely to my subsequent requests to meet and talk?

I've spooked myself by re-reading the texts. Even as I write this I can feel my resolve returning.

It's the way she wrote those texts. I hadn't realised, due to my own feelings starting to shut down, just how honest and emotional SOUNDING they were; perhaps the most honest words for many months from her.

I'm anxiously awaiting your opinions.

[DownandOut]

Her communications after this point became terse and unemotional.

Surely, if she really had loved me she would not be able to change so rapidly and would have responded favourably or even politely to my subsequent requests to meet and talk?

I've spooked myself by re-reading the texts. Even as I write this I can feel my resolve returning.

It's the way she wrote those texts. I hadn't realised, due to my own feelings starting to shut down, just how honest and emotional SOUNDING they were; perhaps the most honest words for many months from her.

I'm anxiously awaiting your opinions.

I know how you feel. One of the main reasons I finally said goodbye forever to my exBPDgf was the way she reacted when I spilled my guts to her. Wrote a lengthy letter about all the reasons I loved her and I got an "awww thanks honey." Finally, when I decided to break it off for good I wrote another lengthy letter outlining all the crazy-making and contradictions that lead me to my decision. Her response was to become a martyr and out of all the things I said she got that I was calling her a mistake in my life. Although she might have been correct, at the time I was NOT trying to imply that whatsoever. Cold and unemotional doesn't comport with the person I am.

[winston72]

Hey DownAndOut... .you succinctly summarized so many of my interactions with my ex.  Brilliant.  Thank you.

Alethia, your next to last post to eeyore (gotta love all these names!) is super helpful.  I read it a few times and will read it again.  Thank you.

As to your most recent post, perhaps it would be more helpful to look at her behavior and her communication as it is, without laying a broader meaning on top of it.  I find that it takes a lot of work for me to distill the facts from the confusion and that is liberating, but when I try to interpret my ex's words or actions through the lens of my rationale it gets me a bit twisted... .and l am then prone to projecting my thoughts on to her.

She is, at the same moment, frightened, angry, lashing out, wanting to be close to you, wanting closeness, aware of the good in your relationship, hating you, wondering how to move forward, bullying you, wanting you to forget her recent outburst, wanting to forget it herself, feeling lucid, feeling out of control... .on and on.  I have actually just elaborated on what you said, "One minute she was so pleasant and trying to be nice and the next day it's all over."  There is turmoil within her.  That is an amateur way of describing BPD, but it does not require any diagnosis, it is just words to summarize what you are describing.  It is so tempting to apply reason to it all; to think that if only you said this or that or said it differently or with a different tone or if the timing had been different, but if you accept that there is turmoil within her that is not created by you (and it is not) than reflecting on how you might have directed the interaction to a different place is just not helpful.

I am not sure as to the origin of the name of this web site, but one of the name is bpdfamily.com.  You have them all before you.  The path forward is to face them!  You don't need much more than that.  And, when I type this, I am not precluding that this means you should leave her.  It means to look at her, look at you, look at what it all means, reflect, think... .and then move forward with what is best for you. 

[Aletheia]

Erudite words from you both, Downandout and Winston72

I agree that we don't need a name for it really because, regardless, it is apparent that there is chaos and instability and disorder in the thinking.

My feelings were piqued by discovering the chats in an email which I thought had been deleted. Info hasn't looked I'd be fine. As it is I did look and I panicked. I felt I'd messed up.

The facts are as they are. It's confused and messed up. She probably felt all of the things you say, around that time, but he still binned the whole thing through what I believe was panick and fear that I would leave her.

If she had been stable and able and I had been a little stronger she would not have done that because the situation would not have arisen because we would both have been in a healthy relationship!

[eeyore]

If she had been stable and able and I had been a little stronger she would not have done that because the situation would not have arisen because we would both have been in a healthy relationship!

The key is she's not stable and most likely never will be.  Aletheia don't second guess yourself. 

[toomanytears]

Yup Escaped, you've hit the nail on the head with this observation

I think one of the most practical, useful things I've learnt in here is that the BPD reacts as a 4-year-old emotionally.

And yes, you can make a bed with a 4-year-old, and work together co-operating in a common aim, laugh and have fun, play silly games while you're doing it, feel warm affection linking you... .and shortly afterwards when the child has to go to something they don't want, like playgroup or the dentist, or you have an appointment and the child has to sit bored waiting for you, then the tantrum explodes and they hate you and they hope you die.

It has really helped me to remember I've been dealing with someone who is in his 40s for work, for colleagues, for neighbours, for FB-friends, for every other aspect of his life except the most crucial and emotionally-important one: me.

I've found it easier to cope with my BPD husband walking out by imagining him as a little boy who has flounced out of the party because he lost the game. He's run down the lane, not too far, but far enough to feel safe and out of reach. Right now he is peaking out from behind a tree (a little bedsit in the next door town) just to check that people are still missing him. Every now and again he pops home when I'm not around and checks how things are, leaving little signs that he's been back. Last time he came, he removed all his paintings from the walls and took them away with him. He sent me texts and emails to see how I reacted to them being gone. (I just replied that they would make his new place look nice). When I last saw him a few weeks ago he was talking about coming home for Christmas.

I don't know how long this situation will last. He's still paying the bills, which is a relief, because I just can't cope with the idea of moving on yet. We've been married 31 years and have two wonderful children who are shattered by the destruction of their family. He's just stopped believing that happiness is here with us and thinks the grass is greener somewhere else.

Just like a little boy... .

I ache that I can't help him and make him see sense. But I know that it's pointless. I'm just waiting things out for now. I guess if the little boy finds someone else to play with he won't need to come home anymore. I'll have to cross that bridge.  Meantime, I'm going through therapy, seeing friends, working on my career and supporting my children as best I can. It's been agony but with NC every day is easier. For now, the little boy can stay down the lane.

[winston72]

HeyTooManyTears!  That is a beautifully written post.  Thank you so much.  The image of someone with BPD as a child has never helped me, until I read your post.  Also, I see myself with behaviors similar to that sometimes.  Your post was very insightful.

I hope your little finds a path to seek help... .or you are find your path to a bigger boy (okay, a full grown man!).