BPD/NPD Traits - I found this list really helpful for waking me up

[Discovery]

My former partner I believe is very high-functioning uBP/NP... .and b/c he didn't do extreme things I have found it hard to know if it was "all in my head" or if there really was a pattern of dysfunctional behaviors. 

I'm not sure if this is elsewhere in the boards because there are so many pages, but I wanted to share this checklist which I found really helpful. I found many, many matches. I got it from the free preview of Margalis Fjelstad's book: Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist, p. 9 - 11  (there is a link to it in the Books section of this site in the thread about the book)

Traits of BP/NP

Emotional Instability

- Emotional neediness, which may be covered up by a facade of independence

- Sudden emotional outbursts of rage and despair that seem random

- Belief that the emotions of the moment are totally accurate and will last forever

- Inaccurate memory of emotional events, even changing the meaning of the events after the fact

- Seeing their emotions as being caused by others or by events outside themselves, with no belief that they have any sort of control over their emotions

- Believing that the only way to change how they feel is to get other people or events to change

- Ongoing intense anxiety or fear

Thought Instability

- All-or-nothing thinking (ex. loving  you so intensely and then just as quickly reversing to hating you or thinking that they are a total failure, or conversely immensely superior)

- Intense belief in their own perceptions despite facts to the contrary

- Their interpretation of events is the only truth

- Cannot be persuaded by fact or logic

- Do not see the impact of their own behavior on others

- Deny the perceptions of others

- Accuse others of saying or doing things they didn't say or do

- Deny (even forget) negative or positive events from the past that conflict with current feelings

Behavioral Instability

- Impulsive behavior (ex. sexual acting out, reckless behavior, gambling, going into dangerous situations with little awareness

- Physically, sexually or emotionally abusive to others

- May cut, burn or mutilate themselves

- Often have addictions or other compulsive behaviors

- Create crises and chaos continuously

- Can go to suicidal thoughts when disappointed or disagreed with

Instability of a Sense of Self

- Intense fear or paranoia about being rejected, even to the extent that they need to be approved of by people they don't like

- Often change their persons, opinions or beliefs, depending on who they are with

- Lack of a consistent sense of self of who they are, or may have an overly rigid sense of self

- Often present a facade. May be fearful of being seen for "who I really am." Automatically assuming that they will be rejected or criticized.

- Out of sight, out of mind... difficulty realizing that they or others exist when not together

- Simultaneously see themselves as both inferior and superior to others

Relationship Instability

- Instantly fall in love or instantly end a relationship with no logical explanation

- Hostile, devaluing attacks on loved ones, while being charming and pleasant to strangers

- Overidealization of others (difficulty allowing others to be less than perfect, be vulnerable or make mistakes)

- Have trouble being alone even for short periods of time,yet push others away by picking fights

- Blaming, accusing and attacking loved ones for small, even trivial mistakes or incidents

- May try to avoid anticipated rejection by rejecting the other person first

- Difficulty feeling loved if the other person is not around

- Unwilling to recognize and respect the limits of others

- Demand rights, commitments and behaviors from others that they are not willing or able to reciprocate

[GreenMango]

Thanks for posting this.  That list would makes for a pretty unstable relationship.

[strikeforce]

Excellent list, Sums it up nicely.

If that doesn't make you want to run and meet someone better I guess nothing will

[toomanytears]

Excellent list, Sums it up nicely.

If that doesn't make you want to run and meet someone better I guess nothing will

It's hard to do when you love them... .

[HarmKrakow]

Excellent list, Sums it up nicely.

If that doesn't make you want to run and meet someone better I guess nothing will

It's hard to do when you love them... .

Isn't the whole ordeal of the supposedly love for a BPDer, the case of loving yourself? Due to all the mirrorization and projection?

[strikeforce]

Excellent list, Sums it up nicely.

If that doesn't make you want to run and meet someone better I guess nothing will

It's hard to do when you love them... .

Indeed it is.

It broke me when I walked away, but I knew it was for the best.

I am now completely over that nightmare.

Its time to love ourselves and go on to meet people that wont treat us like dirt.

[toomanytears]

Excellent list, Sums it up nicely.

If that doesn't make you want to run and meet someone better I guess nothing will

It's hard to do when you love them... .

Isn't the whole ordeal of the supposedly love for a BPDer, the case of loving yourself? Due to all the mirrorization and projection?

Sigh. thanks for the reality check HarmKrakow 

[Turkish]

My former partner I believe is very high-functioning uBP/NP... .and b/c he didn't do extreme things I have found it hard to know if it was "all in my head" or if there really was a pattern of dysfunctional behaviors. 

I'm not sure if this is elsewhere in the boards because there are so many pages, but I wanted to share this checklist which I found really helpful. I found many, many matches. I got it from the free preview of Margalis Fjelstad's book: Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist, p. 9 - 11  (there is a link to it in the Books section of this site in the thread about the book)

Traits of BP/NP

Emotional Instability

- Emotional neediness, which may be covered up by a facade of independence

- Sudden emotional outbursts of rage and despair that seem random

- Belief that the emotions of the moment are totally accurate and will last forever

- Inaccurate memory of emotional events, even changing the meaning of the events after the fact

- Seeing their emotions as being caused by others or by events outside themselves, with no belief that they have any sort of control over their emotions

- Believing that the only way to change how they feel is to get other people or events to change

- Ongoing intense anxiety or fear

Thought Instability

- All-or-nothing thinking (ex. loving  you so intensely and then just as quickly reversing to hating you or thinking that they are a total failure, or conversely immensely superior)

- Intense belief in their own perceptions despite facts to the contrary

- Their interpretation of events is the only truth

- Cannot be persuaded by fact or logic

- Do not see the impact of their own behavior on others

- Deny the perceptions of others

- Accuse others of saying or doing things they didn't say or do

- Deny (even forget) negative or positive events from the past that conflict with current feelings

Behavioral Instability

- Impulsive behavior (ex. sexual acting out, reckless behavior, gambling, going into dangerous situations with little awareness

- Physically, sexually or emotionally abusive to others

- May cut, burn or mutilate themselves

- Often have addictions or other compulsive behaviors

- Create crises and chaos continuously

- Can go to suicidal thoughts when disappointed or disagreed with

Instability of a Sense of Self

- Intense fear or paranoia about being rejected, even to the extent that they need to be approved of by people they don't like

- Often change their persons, opinions or beliefs, depending on who they are with

- Lack of a consistent sense of self of who they are, or may have an overly rigid sense of self

- Often present a facade. May be fearful of being seen for "who I really am." Automatically assuming that they will be rejected or criticized.

- Out of sight, out of mind... difficulty realizing that they or others exist when not together

- Simultaneously see themselves as both inferior and superior to others

Relationship Instability

- Instantly fall in love or instantly end a relationship with no logical explanation

- Hostile, devaluing attacks on loved ones, while being charming and pleasant to strangers

- Overidealization of others (difficulty allowing others to be less than perfect, be vulnerable or make mistakes)

- Have trouble being alone even for short periods of time,yet push others away by picking fights

- Blaming, accusing and attacking loved ones for small, even trivial mistakes or incidents

- May try to avoid anticipated rejection by rejecting the other person first

- Difficulty feeling loved if the other person is not around

- Unwilling to recognize and respect the limits of others

- Demand rights, commitments and behaviors from others that they are not willing or able to reciprocate

I  started reading this book.  the traits she lists here  are far more comprehensive than the 9  trait summary I've read elsewhere.  this list makes me even more sure that my X  is BPD.  scarily sure!

[Discovery]

the traits she lists here  are far more comprehensive than the 9  trait summary I've read elsewhere. this list makes me even more sure that my X  is BPD.  scarily sure!

Turkish, this list cemented it for me too - YES for everything except the extreme behaviours/acting out. It really helps to see it all in writing with the label ":)YSFUNCTION" attached to it.

If that doesn't make you want to run and meet someone better I guess nothing will.

That list would makes for a pretty unstable relationship.

I agree... .I'd be appalled to see any of my friends or my daughters in a r/s with someone who fit the list.

It seems UNBELIEVABLE then to realize that I tolerated a r/s with this stuff in it. I was totally MESSED UP in my brain by all this crazy-making s*** and had NO ROAD MAP to understand it. It really does help to see how the puzzle pieces fit together.

Early in our r/s, my former partner had a mini-rage at me about not trusting him on which aisle to find something in the drugstore. I started crying when we got outside and he stormed off, leaving me in a public park crying alone (he eventually came back... .a long time later, but didn't apologize). Another time he had a mini-rage at a bus stop over my challenging the way he read the bus timetable. I was so shaken I had to sit alone in the bus and soothe myself until we reached the destination. I was telling a friend about this today and said these were some of the "little things" that happened. She said: "Little? That's not little."

I'm learning now in my therapy that because in my childhood I also experienced a volatile and unpredictable emotional climate, with a mother who was easily emotionally upset and would storm off and leave me hanging (and return and never explain or apologize) that I was unconsciously *used to* this kind of treatment... .used to seeing adults behave very selfishly and immaturely and never own their upsets... .used to a feeling of anxiety and inconsistency, used to people who "loved" me having no awareness or concern about how THEIR behavior and acting out impacted me at all. So my learned role was to (1) contain my anxiety and desperately self-soothe and (2) try to placate the other person so I could feel safe again. I was used to putting up with unacceptable reactivity and hurtful behavior with people I loved and who supposedly loved me (part of my dysfunctional love map). Scary how much I put up with from my former partner with this abusive edge ever present. My love map would have drawn a line at physical abuse, but the emotional s*** was so familiar I didn't register it as abusive and abnormal. Just had that familiar edge of stress mixed with love.

[starshine]

Wow, reading this list sure did make me glad to be living alone, peacefully by myself.  Going down the list I was like, check, check, check.  I'm not sure how I got to the point where I allowed my last 2 significant relationships be with someone so dysfunctional.  I mean, I can trace the dysfunction up from childhood, through all of my significant relationships with men in my life.  My children's father is dangerously crazy but walks the straight white man business owner walk.  He still scares me, as he has done so much parental alienation to damage my relationship with my children.  I'm guessing ASPD/NPD/BPD.  I was single for 8 years, working on myself.  Then... .my last boyfriend was BPD/NPD.  My ud19 may be BPD/NPD.  My daughter has ganged up with her father more times than I can count, and I don't trust her- cruel, than sweet.  Predictable though.  These relationships are so painful- it's just awful having my most intimate relationships be the ones that are most devastating to me emotionally.  I wonder if I will ever be able to open with trust to anyone again.  This list is great.  I want to print it off and hang it on my fridge, so every time I go to nurture myself nutritionally this stuff is soaking in- subtly and powerfully, imprinting in every cell and fiber of my being.

[toomanytears]

This list says it all... .

[UmbrellaBoy]

Yup definitely this: "Belief that the emotions of the moment are totally accurate and will last forever."

When he felt good, then that was reality. But when he felt bad, then everyone bowed to that. No consistency of action beyond the whims of the moment.

[MangoMadness]

" Hostile, devaluing attacks on loved ones, while being charming and pleasant to strangers."

That. That is what made me so spiteful of my ex. That right there. She succeeded in making her friends just love her, to the point where if I felt they were in danger, I'd try to warn them and they'd laugh me off.

"Have trouble being alone even for short periods of time,yet push others away by picking fights."

This happens a LOT with her and her friends. She goes on about how smart and talented they are, and then one day they aren't friends because she picked a fight. Even worse, she tells everyone else that the ex-friend picked the fight, and she was strong for leaving a "toxic relationship". Bein such a good manipulator, she succeeds.

With her most recent ex, she blatantly lied to him, saying she didn't throw a fit about the break up on social networking---when she did. I had taken a screenshot just in case, and it came in handy when trying to warn these innocent people. I showed him the screenshot, where she claimed he left her and was going to commit suicide.

When in reality, she left him because she "didn't love him anymore". She broke his heart and had the gall to claim he broke hers. She's far beyond sanity, I think she truly believes her outrageous lies. Going so far as to give herself a huge bruise, send pictures to two different people, claiming someone had broken in and she'd fought them off.

In one story, it was a black man she fought off with a fork, in the other, it was just a man she fought off with cutlery under her bed. Another example was when she claimed to be working a bad job and homeless, in one story she worked at mcdonalds, in the other she worked at a pizza place.

I don't understand WHY she lies about the most trivial, stupid things. She loves pity and being worshipped for being so "mature". She went so far as to claim she helped her brother commit suicide, and people still believe her. I think that's what pisses me off the most, is how stupid people can be. Eating up her lies and giving her undeserved pity. I'm almost positive that she believes every lie that comes out of her mouth.

With her last ex she claimed she was pregnant, then had a miscarriage. In the following months, she told everyone she was born with testicles where her ovaries should be, which is a big fat lie, she wouldn't have been able to get pregnant. I don't understand why she weaves these webs. I want people to realise how ridiculous she is, I used to try and contact them.

I would offer my ears to listen, and whatever I could to help them realise that she's no good for them (I was not insulting her or talking crap), I would clarify the stories she told them and counter the new claims with past ones. I never tried to get them to hate her, I just wanted them to be safe from that awful spiral of lies and hurt.

Right now, she has one friend who sends her hundreds of dollars weekly. She keeps this friend roped in by claiming to be in love with her and putting on her charm. I haven't checked in a few weeks, though. Anyways, sorry for this, I got out of hand. Thank you for the post.

[babyducks]

Oh that is a great list,  Thanks for posting it Discovery.

What I like about the list is how accurately is explains almost all over my EX's behavior.

Seeing their emotions as being caused by others or by events outside themselves, with no belief that they have any sort of control over their emotions

- Believing that the only way to change how they feel is to get other people or events to change

That in a nutshell... .how many times it was "all YOUR fault".   Which often times was interwoven with the equally infamous "if you really loved me you would... ."

and the other one that leapt off the page for me... .

- Their interpretation of events is the only truth

- Cannot be persuaded by fact or logic

- Do not see the impact of their own behavior on others

- Deny the perceptions of others

that was literally every argument we ever had.  One time in a heated discussion I got "you are angry", and I said "no I am not I am hurt."  She replied "no you aren't, you aren't hurt you are in such a raging temper I can't talk to you."        Really?  What was I going to do with that?

[ucmeicu2]

She's far beyond sanity, I think she truly believes her outrageous lies. Going so far as to give herself a huge bruise, send pictures to two different people, claiming someone had broken in and she'd fought them off.

In one story, it was a black man she fought off with a fork, in the other, it was just a man she fought off with cutlery under her bed.

nod nod... .my xBPDgf made a lot of claims too... .some quite outrageous... .  i loved her and believed at first, then i wanted to believe, then i hoped to believe, eventually i just couldn;t believe anything she said.  if everything she said is true then she is a freak-of-nature Abuse & Rape Magnet.

in bold, lest anyone think maybe Mangomadness is embellishing, let me tell you my experience.  my xBPDgf often had bruises, and she would talk about how she'd been abused by some tom dick or harry, or had fallen, or whatever.  then one night i went to her house and when she didn't answer the door  i did what she'd always told me to do:  go around to the back, it'd be open.  well since it was dark outside i caught a glimpse in the window b4 i got to the door and i couldn't believe what i saw.

she was on the floor, seemed drunk, then raised up enough to reach the counter's edge and banged her forearm as hard as she could against it multiple times. i almost puked on the spot.  i was so sickened by seeing that, that i left.

of course she was bruised there for a week!  after that whenever she'd try to get sympathy for bruises i knew it was probably self-induced for attention.  once, i tried to tell her what i'd seen, but she got so freaked out i backed off and didn't mention it again.  the out of control chaos was so bad at that point it hardly mattered, just a drop in the bucket.

yes virginia, some people really are just that batsh~t crazy   

[santa]

Too many things on that list are resonating with me. You forget a lot of this stuff being away from your ex, but this list sure is a good reminder. BPD people are non-stop crazy. They never ease up. It's just all of this stuff over and over and over again... .constantly. It feels good to be away from it.

[TakingWingAtLast]

Discovery,

That's quite a list there.  And I was posting in my head almost all of those characteristics attaching specific times and instances where those characteristics occurred in our relationship.   Thank you for the clarity once again.

D

My former partner I believe is very high-functioning uBP/NP... .and b/c he didn't do extreme things I have found it hard to know if it was "all in my head" or if there really was a pattern of dysfunctional behaviors. 

I'm not sure if this is elsewhere in the boards because there are so many pages, but I wanted to share this checklist which I found really helpful. I found many, many matches. I got it from the free preview of Margalis Fjelstad's book: Stop Caretaking the Borderline or Narcissist, p. 9 - 11  (there is a link to it in the Books section of this site in the thread about the book)

Traits of BP/NP

Emotional Instability

- Emotional neediness, which may be covered up by a facade of independence

- Sudden emotional outbursts of rage and despair that seem random

- Belief that the emotions of the moment are totally accurate and will last forever

- Inaccurate memory of emotional events, even changing the meaning of the events after the fact

- Seeing their emotions as being caused by others or by events outside themselves, with no belief that they have any sort of control over their emotions

- Believing that the only way to change how they feel is to get other people or events to change

- Ongoing intense anxiety or fear

Thought Instability

- All-or-nothing thinking (ex. loving  you so intensely and then just as quickly reversing to hating you or thinking that they are a total failure, or conversely immensely superior)

- Intense belief in their own perceptions despite facts to the contrary

- Their interpretation of events is the only truth

- Cannot be persuaded by fact or logic

- Do not see the impact of their own behavior on others

- Deny the perceptions of others

- Accuse others of saying or doing things they didn't say or do

- Deny (even forget) negative or positive events from the past that conflict with current feelings

Behavioral Instability

- Impulsive behavior (ex. sexual acting out, reckless behavior, gambling, going into dangerous situations with little awareness

- Physically, sexually or emotionally abusive to others

- May cut, burn or mutilate themselves

- Often have addictions or other compulsive behaviors

- Create crises and chaos continuously

- Can go to suicidal thoughts when disappointed or disagreed with

Instability of a Sense of Self

- Intense fear or paranoia about being rejected, even to the extent that they need to be approved of by people they don't like

- Often change their persons, opinions or beliefs, depending on who they are with

- Lack of a consistent sense of self of who they are, or may have an overly rigid sense of self

- Often present a facade. May be fearful of being seen for "who I really am." Automatically assuming that they will be rejected or criticized.

- Out of sight, out of mind... difficulty realizing that they or others exist when not together

- Simultaneously see themselves as both inferior and superior to others

Relationship Instability

- Instantly fall in love or instantly end a relationship with no logical explanation

- Hostile, devaluing attacks on loved ones, while being charming and pleasant to strangers

- Overidealization of others (difficulty allowing others to be less than perfect, be vulnerable or make mistakes)

- Have trouble being alone even for short periods of time,yet push others away by picking fights

- Blaming, accusing and attacking loved ones for small, even trivial mistakes or incidents

- May try to avoid anticipated rejection by rejecting the other person first

- Difficulty feeling loved if the other person is not around

- Unwilling to recognize and respect the limits of others

- Demand rights, commitments and behaviors from others that they are not willing or able to reciprocate

[CdnSunrise]

Wow, this list really nails it. Thanks Discovery.

I felt a bit guilty about "diagnosing" my soon-to-be-exBPDh with a serious mental illness that I read about in a book and on the internet. But the more time I spend here and read/learn, I know I'm dead right about him. I'm so thankful for all the insights and advice on this site re. how to recover from such a toxic relationship -- especially one that lasted 15 years. Lots of damage done, and healing yet to come.