Did you write a list of why you had to leave? If so, could you share it?

[Family Court Strategies: When Your Partner Has BPD OR NPD Traits.]

I read on here that writing a list of the reasons you had to leave was helpful and so far it has been. I think it would be helpful to read other people's lists too, if you are open to sharing. Here's mine:

1. Baiting—would lure me into a fight.

2. Sleep deprivation—fights lasting way too late at night

3. Name calling

4. Moving things really fast (talking about moving in together, marriage)

5. Forcing decisions on me

6. Making me participate in proving myself bad.

7. Blaming things on me.

8. Getting mad at me for doing other things that didn't involve her

9. Getting mad at me when I couldn’t talk

10. Saying she’d only get help if I promised to stick with her

[kc sunshine]

I read on here that writing a list of the reasons you had to leave was helpful and so far it has been. I think it would be helpful to read other people's lists too, if you are open to sharing. Here's mine:

1. Baiting—would lure me into a fight.

2. Sleep deprivation—fights lasting way too late at night

3. Name calling

4. Moving things really fast (talking about moving in together, marriage)

5. Forcing decisions on me

6. Making me participate in proving myself bad.

7. Blaming things on me.

8. Getting mad at me for doing other things that didn't involve her

9. Getting mad at me when I couldn’t talk

10. Saying she’d only get help if I promised to stick with her

[raisins3142]

Not on me, but I know it by heart.

1. odd relationship with male attention (like thirsty for it)

2. would ignore me/embarrass me/flirt with other men in public

3. had no affection for my pet or children in my family (and would stare ominously at them), also did not try to interact with any of my family members except when wanting to make an impression

4. extreme privacy to the point of paranoia and caught her acting weird on her phone all the time

5. defensive

6. lied about small things all the time, but maybe they were big (ex. she'd say one day she'd been to a restaurant and the next day she had not, so maybe she had met a man there)

7. devalued me and blamed it on stress but when the stressful thing ceased she remained sullen and withdrawn

8. drank more than I was comfortable with, and in the past abused heavy drugs and was a black out drunk

9. cheated on previous boyfriends but lied to me about it, but I found out

10. had an STD and lied and said she was tested and clean

11. nearly all male friends and did not get along with women, but most of these men were orbiters or past flings and she stayed in contact with them and I knew nothing of their history or any interactions whatsoever

12. faked orgasms and lied and said she did not

13. incredibly murky and contradictory (lie filled) past history to the point where almost nothing would surprise me, for example I would be saddened but not surprised if she had been a call girl at one point

14. no idea what actual intimacy is between two people and avoided intimacy during sex (no eye contact, wanted to be roughed up)

15. likely highly promiscuous in the past

16. said she was not physically attracted to men, but the men she was attracted to all looked like he-man (she had computer files with gladiators and such), so I felt inadequate

17. I felt that I had to be the strongest man in the world 24/7 or she would lose interest and probably cheat on me

18. poor assertiveness and boundaries to the point that if I were not present and a man said "hey, let's go have sex", I think she would not want to be mean and so would go along with it

19. was either sullen, drunk, or fake... .and her fake people pleaser mask was seductive and flirty (she was only good at talking to men that were attracted to her and pursuing her somewhat)... .which drew men and several asked if I was a swinger based simply on her demeanor

20. kept having to explain obvious relationship or social awareness stuff to her and she would disagree most of the time or be defensive

Really the biggest thing is that early on she appeared to be the type that would have trouble being faithful just based upon me knowing what behaviors match (lied easily, could not be alone, was in a ton of relationships, seemed to use sex, experimented a lot despite claiming to not be that sexual, would drink and change/lose inhibitions, thirsty for male attention/validation, flirty, poor assertiveness/boundaries, did not seem to understand social interactions or claimed not to, said she had been cheated on a lot and that her family members cheated so it seemed normalized to her).  Later I found out she had cheated on her 2 most serious past boyfriends at least (so my suspicions were confirmed).  So, I had zero trust in her.  I considered her an infidelity grenade, and that is an absolute with me: cheat and it is over.  So, I was a nervous wreck and lost about 10 pounds and barely slept.

[fromheeltoheal]

Yes, we have mixed feelings after these relationships end, obviously, otherwise this site wouldn't be necessary; the heart and the head don't agree and we can be very confused, trying to make sense of things, and torn; do we go back?  Do we stay away?

Making a list of all the unacceptable crap we tolerated when we were in it can help shift the focus to our head, away from our heart, so we can do what is right for us as our heart heals.  And the list will probably grow as we come out of the fog and remember more things.  It's important to not only remember and list the behaviors but also how they made us feel at the time.  My list got pretty long after a while, and reading it and fully associating to how her actions made me feel made me disgusted and about to vomit when I got to the end of it, mostly disgusted at myself for putting up with it like I did, which is good, it gives us motivation to dig deep to look for why, the real gift of the relationship.

[Tim300]

I am now more than 4 months out.  I would say that she forced me to leave, but then made some subtle attempts to get me to return or otherwise maintain contact.  I did not return and I blocked her on Facebook.  Here is my list for why I went NC:

1. fear -- fear that she would try to kill me, otherwise physically hurt me, attempt to psychologically destroy me, destroy my career, or disrupt my social network

2. realization of her severe mental illness -- that her irrationality was pathological in nature and that there was no point in trying to have any rational, adult conversation with her in the context of a romantic relationship or even a friendship

(I have additional complaints along the lines of the lists above, but none were complete deal-breakers on par with my 2 items above.)

[kc sunshine]

Yes, Tim's 2 and Raisin's 20 seem really clear and really important-- thanks for sharing them. I also had fears like Tim300's #1-- I was never sure whether I was more fearful than necessary but the fact that I had the fear at all perhaps is enough.

[antonio1213]

1. Impossible to have a truly rational conversation

2. ANGER from hell that exploded from within her over the simplest stuff and sometimes out of nowhere.

3. rude to me in front of family/friends.

4. Very poor in restraining herself from her impulses, some very dangerous

5. Very seductive to men, craved male attention.

6. COMPLETE inability to control her emotions. She had things she called "mental breakdowns" were she would cry and have a temper tantrum like a toddler.

7. Bad impulsive spender.

8. I had general anxiety about going out with her and felt like I had to parent her.

9. Too much PDA. I loved how much she "needed" me, but sometimes it got to the point where it was too much especially in front of others.

10. Constantly ___g over things

11. Walked on eggshells most of time. Similar to number 8.

12. Her drinking was out of control.

13. Everyday was an emotional roller coaster. Extreme highs and extreme lows

14. Constant complaining about her life and her looks (She is very beautiful has an army of guys after her and has an almost perfect life)

15. Couldn't calm down over things. Once she got upset I would have to take an hour or two just to calm her down a little. Which I didn't mind doing except at one point this happened almost every day over seemingly nothing.

16. She just picked fights, and seemed like when times got good she had to have chaos.

17. Couldn't enjoy the simple things.

18. NEEDY. Always needed something (always her way, presents had to be perfect) Last year valentines day I got her roses and took her out on a date. SHe got me a good bit of presents like candy and stuff. (Ill admit I slacked off a little) She got mad I didn't do as much for her so she ripped up the roses and said really hurtful things to me. She told me she was a catch and I had to treat her right.

19. Inconsistant stories

20. Didn't get social cues and social situations.

These are some of the main things.

[seh77]

I'm a little over 8 weeks out of the relationship. So my list is still growing

1.  Moved Way to fast in the relationship even when I tried to put the breaks on.

2.  Always changing what she wanted me to do.  I never could make her happy.

3.  Had to argue with her for her to attend my Grandmothers funeral (My Gran was my world)

4. My nephew was killed in a drunk driving accident... .again had to argue to get her to go (And other arguments surrounding that incident)

5.  She hated the fact that I wanted to attend all of my son's games.

6.  SHE DIDNT GO WITH ME TO MY FATHER's MEMORIAL SERVICE.  (SHE again argued with me)

7.  I always gave gave gave and she just mainly took took took with little to no give.

8.  She was on online dating sites and even went out on a date while I thought we were still together.   She even knew I was under that impression then tried lying to get out of it.

9.  I spent EVERY penny I had saved on her.

10.  She wanted to get married and I told her I did to but after we go and talk to a counselor.  She took that as I didn't want her.

11.  I noticed she would tell small lies about things to her friends and family... .makes me wonder if she did the same with me.  (had caught her in some but she would always turn it back on me.)

12.  She's very smart and manipulative with everyone. 

13.  She would complain how I dressed... .after 4 years of us being together.

And the list is still growing as the FOG lifts... .

:'(

[Copperfox]

Making these lists is incredibly helpful and therapeutic in my opinion.  I certainly have a lot of general traits on my list: needy, weird past relationships, victim mentality, fake, glassy eyed stare, crying during/after sex, inappropriate anger over minor things, moving way too fast.

One thing I also found helpful was to add specific instances (e.g. rage moments at specific places/events) and weird phrases they said ("I can be difficult" or "I'm hurt" or "I'm really needy" to the list.  Those things really jar my memory to specific moments that, in hindsight, were really bizarre.  Moments that really illustrate the questionable-ness of the relationship.

Also, as an aside, all these lists would make great "red flags" lists ... .

[kc sunshine]

For me, realizing that my list hit a lot of points on this list of what constitutes psychological abuse helped me realize I had to get out (and helped to lift the FOG):

Psychological abuse can look like:

Humiliating or embarrassing you.

Constant put-downs.

Hypercriticism.

Refusing to communicate.

Ignoring or excluding you.

Extramarital affairs.

Provocative behavior with opposite sex.

Use of sarcasm and unpleasant tone of voice.

Unreasonable jealousy.

Extreme moodiness.

Mean jokes or constantly making fun of you.

Saying “I love you but…”

Saying things like “If you don’t _____, I will_____.”

Domination and control.

Withdrawal of affection.

Guilt trips.

Making everything your fault.

Isolating you from friends and family.

Using money to control.

Constant calling or texting when you are not with him/her.

Threatening to commit suicide if you leave.

[hope2727]

Yup here are a few of mine.

1. Lying to my face. Even when given a chance to come clean looking at his feet with shame filled eyes and either bold faced lying or saying "I don't remember".

2. Cheating both physically and emotionally. Triangulating me with other women and other people in general.

3. Changing his position or opinion on things 180 degrees within days and claiming to not have had the original opinion.

4. Fiscal irresponsibility. He blew through an entire divorce settlement within 6 months and has nothing to show for it. I work hard (and earn more than him) and I will not support random crazy spending.

5. Putting his fiends and acquaintances and everyone else ahead of me. IE did major renos for 3 friends for free or $500 but won't help me change a door or sink.

6. Telling me he loves me then abandoning me whenever he is stressed out.

7. Begging me to take him back and then telling me he didn't beg me.

8. Proposing marriage and then breaking up by text message without warning.

9. Lying about me. Claiming I was unfaithful. Calling me names. Telling me I was fat and old and lucky to have him. (he is a year younger than me)

10. Accusing me of molesting him when I hugged him from behind and kissed his neck.

11. Refusing to speak to me or attend counselling and when we did counsel looking at his feet and refusing to participate.

12. Telling me he didn't want to go to counselling because I would just act like the victim. Bahahaha yup I told him I was the victim.

13. Not being able to put him on my mortgage or credit because I would undoubtedly come home to him holding a bag of magic beans one day.

14. Telling me I was depressing and needy when my mom was on deaths door.

15. The massive double standards about pretty much everything. Flirting, money, friends, family, drugs, alcohol, counselling, marriage, children, lying, time, homes, holidays and everything else.

Ok thanks for listening. I kind of needed to post that today. I am feeling really stupid and lost. I really did love hims and believe in him. I still want to but in truth I believe in myself more. His actions are all that matter. Diagnosis, labels, words whatever don't matter only actions. And his actions are not honourable. God I hope I met someone like who I thought he was. And soon pls god soon. I am tired of struggling through life alone.

[Tim300]

3. Changing his position or opinion on things 180 degrees within days and claiming to not have had the original opinion.

7. Begging me to take him back and then telling me he didn't beg me.

I experienced this too.  I wonder if pwBPD have very bad memories, perhaps especially of things said during some form of dysregulation; or if this is done just to hurt you; or if it's done to protect themselves from shame.  Mine explicitly yelled at me and called me "cruel" for not putting the ring she had selected on her finger within a month of her having selected it, so I responded by proposing a couple weeks later, but then at the very end of our year-long engagement she said "I was surprised that you proposed to me," as if to say that it was all my idea and she was never really interested.  I think she said this at the end just to hurt me because she felt like I had the upper hand on power in the relationship for some reason.  Who knows! 

[icom]

Not a list, but I have kept an active daily journal of my life for the last seven years.

Regarding BPD, what emerged from my journal was truly revealing: I, too, was distorting reality.  I, too, would reconfigure reality to accommodate my fantasy.

What I found was that I had little or no recollection of the injustices, offences, and humiliations I endured.  Reviewing my journal was my ground-breaking moment, as I finally had to acknowledge not only the hopelessness of my BPD venture, but also the tremendous harm I was subjecting myself to. 

[Gonzalo]

I'm going to do one of these myself later, because I think it will help, but the fundamental thing for me was that I realized that I was putting a ton of myself emotionally, mentally, and financially into the relationship, and getting back... .constantly rarer good times, with no real hope of that changing. When she told me she was breaking up with my, the profound sense of relief told me a lot.

[cloudten]

Well... .I have been thinking about this for 2 days and thought it would be good to put it up here. So here it goes.

*1. Verbally threatening to burn my daughter and I (or other physical threats of harm)

*2. Obnoxious/socially awkward behavior

*3. Dishonesty to the point that he believed his own lies

*4. Cheating, love triangles, sexual promiscuity

5. Also lied about an STD... .or simply failed to tell me for 9 months. Lied about how many people and who he had been with. He originally said he had been with 53. Then less than 10 (Big difference!)... .but I am sure the number was more like 20.

*6. Painting me black to family and friends behind my back

7. Drank and smoked pot entirely too much for healthy standards

8. Impulsive with money

9. Poor judgment with regards to behavior and social boundaries.

10. Mean to his employees

11. Poor assertiveness

12. Poor goal completion

13. Poor work ethic

14. Would force me to pick something (restaurant, food, clothes, etc.) and complain about every aspect... .yet would be mad if I refused to pick something.

15. Could never be alone- including unhealthy attachment to cat. Not able to be alone with just me at home for an evening watching a movie. Always had to invite 15 friends. As time went on, his friends dropped off... .I think he only has 3-4 friends anymore... .and they are dwindling as they see what he has done with love triangles and such.

16. unable to prioritize relationships

*17. Mostly female friends- mostly inappropriate- or other mentally ill people.

*18. No rational adult conversation - he would never hear my opinion or consider my point of view.

*19. Major problems with pornography, looking for sex on craigslist, web-camming with porn girls

*20. Wanted to get me involved with group sex. Then projected that I was the one who wanted it. Definitely no. Especially after this relationship, I want ONE MAN who only wants me. period. forever.

21. ignore/embarrass/be rude to me in public or in front of important people/family

22. Anti-religion- and would rage at me for being a Christian- yet claimed he is a good Catholic.

23. cheated in previous relationships

*24. Lied about having a girlfriend (triangle), but raged at me for having even talked to another man.

25. Zero PDA... .anti-PDA completely. Would push my hand away if I tried to hold his walking through the mall. to the point of accusing me of molesting him.

26. Cold, impersonal hugs, kisses, etc. - blank stares- never blinked

*27. DRAMA - if it didn't already exist, he would create it.

28. Unable to enjoy simple things

29. inconsistent stories

30. change mind and viewpoint constantly.

*31. Incapable of apologies, remorse, or empathy

* = most important reasons to me.

[Madison66]

I have a different kind of list of why I had to leave.  It all centers around me and my values.  Here it is:

I had to leave the r/s because I could no longer allow myself to not live my values.  Those values include: self love and acceptance, love for others, honesty, kindness, trust, family, self respect, respect for others, transparency, etc.  I could no longer allow myself to participate in the r/s where I was not being true to myself.  I had to take care of myself first so I could be the best father, brother, friend, lover, partner, employee, etc.  My gut told me something was very wrong and to leave the r/s.  Yes, she did a million things that were abusive or were red flags.  Doesn't matter.  I finally listened to my gut and there was no turning back.

So, my list really could have been: I had to leave the r/s because I had to leave the r/s!

[cloudten]

I have a different kind of list of why I had to leave.  It all centers around me and my values.  Here it is:

I had to leave the r/s because I could no longer allow myself to not live my values.  Those values include: self love and acceptance, love for others, honesty, kindness, trust, family, self respect, respect for others, transparency, etc.  I could no longer allow myself to participate in the r/s where I was not being true to myself.  I had to take care of myself first so I could be the best father, brother, friend, lover, partner, employee, etc.  My gut told me something was very wrong and to leave the r/s.  Yes, she did a million things that were abusive or were red flags.  Doesn't matter.  I finally listened to my gut and there was no turning back.

So, my list really could have been: I had to leave the r/s because I had to leave the r/s!

OOH... .LIKE THIS! I need to rethink my list when I'm a little more out of it!

[JohnLove]

I experienced this too.  I wonder if pwBPD have very bad memories, perhaps especially of things said during some form of dysregulation; or if this is done just to hurt you; or if it's done to protect themselves from shame.

I believe you are correct but I suspect it has more to do with diassociation. That is my current theory.

And you can't rewrite history if you recall it accurately.

[propunchingbag]

Not a list, but I have kept an active daily journal of my life for the last seven years.

Regarding BPD, what emerged from my journal was truly revealing: I, too, was distorting reality.  I, too, would reconfigure reality to accommodate my fantasy.

What I found was that I had little or no recollection of the injustices, offences, and humiliations I endured.  Reviewing my journal was my ground-breaking moment, as I finally had to acknowledge not only the hopelessness of my BPD venture, but also the tremendous harm I was subjecting myself to. 

I agree! I am on year 4 of my journaling and I read through it the other day and it made me feel sick. If any of this was happening to a friend of mine I would tell them to run far away. I wish I could leave easily, the timing has to be right.

[kc sunshine]

"If any of this was happening to a friend of mine I would tell them to run far away. "

I totally know what you mean-- I thought in the middle of it "if this was happening to my daughter, I'd advise her to let the relationship go."

[Copperfox]

This is from a different site (and not specific to BPD), but an excellent list of red flags.  It echoes many of those listed here.  Really hit home for me:

www.enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=203028&page=2&p=1964938&viewfull=1#post1964938

Smarter. Wiser.

[propunchingbag]

This is from a different site (and not specific to BPD), but an excellent list of red flags.  It echoes many of those listed here.  Really hit home for me:

www.enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=203028&page=2&p=1964938&viewfull=1#post1964938

Smarter. Wiser.

Thats really great thanks for sharing it.

[antelope]

I endured pretty much the same things you all did: compulsive lying, cheating, spending, irrational anger, gaslighting, lack of empathy, etc etc... .

why did I have to leave? 

one reason: realizing all that ugly stuff I mentioned above was NEVER going to change

[apollotech]

I endured pretty much the same things you all did: compulsive lying, cheating, spending, irrational anger, gaslighting, lack of empathy, etc etc... .

why did I have to leave? 

one reason: realizing all that ugly stuff I mentioned above was NEVER going to change

Yep, exactly what antelope said! There was NEVER going to be any change. I boarded the first train out of Chaos, and disembarked at Peaceful.

[mrwigand]

This is legitimately a list I wrote up on my phone for me to reference if I was ever getting doubts about my decision to leave the relationship.

1. She could be going to jail (yep... .She and her ex boyfriend were caught shoplifting over $1000 worth of stuff from the mall. Still waiting to see how that will play out).

2. Even if she doesn't go to jail, she's made it clear that she wants to move at some point. There is most likely an expiration date on the relationship.

3. She doesn't show an active interest in my work and creativity.

4. Sometime she lacks empathy

5. Her ex-boyfriend... She was still texting him as of today (She had this toxic relationship with an ex, whom she told me was emotionally and physically abusive to her.)

6. She has relationships with a lot of guys who clearly want to be with her. Just would cause awkwardness. Sometimes she seems to push these issues.

7. She has alienated all of my good friends. There is no way she could have a positive relationship with them.

8. She doesn't acknowledge me as much as I would like when we're with others.

9. She has poor communication skills. When she wants emotional support, she withdraws and behaves coldly. Then she gets angry you don't intuit her state of mind later.

10. She's not good at personal accountability.