Were they all lies?

[Indyan]

The love, wanting a baby and to marry me, to spend his life with me etc.

The closeness, the tenderness, all the gorgeous times... .were they real or an act?

Or maybe he "wanted" to believe this so he did, and just stopped suddenly when he decided I wasn't worth his love anymore?

I can't help wondering and it truly hurts still.  :'(

I have no idea what to tell my 1,5 yr old son when he grows  :'( 

[Remiman]

Maybe those in the know will shoot me down, but this is what I choose to believe. My exBPDgf wanted a life with me. She wanted marriage. She wanted us to have a baby. She wanted us to be together. The problems came because she just did not know how to behave in a relationship or could not deal with it properly.  Her lack of empathy, respect, and inability to stop lying made me leave her. I choose to believe that her dreams, and mine, were real, but as a couple we were unable to fulfil them. I think this belief will allow me to find closure and ultimately move on. And btw, I am not forcing this belief, it is what I actually feel. I don't know if this will help, maybe I am still caught up in romanticising everything.

[Indyan]

Hi Remiman,

Maybe I'd be able to believe that too if I'd chosen to leave him, but he's the one that decided to leave abruptly just when he said he was going to seek medical help, and then blamed me of everything.

To then finally destroy EVERYTHING, lying, harassing me etc.

His so-called endless love for me (and our little family) just *vanished* almost overnight.

I just don't get it.

[Remiman]

I read your other thread after posting - maybe our situations are a bit different in the way it ended. It might just be the case that my "spidey-sense" kicked in early and I made the moves to get out (which made her cling harder)? Maybe I would have experienced the same as you if I'd tried to stick it out? I don't know. I still think when she said all that stuff, she did believe it. Whether it would have held true six months later is another question I guess

[Remiman]

I guess in a way I am fortunate to be good friends with my exes step dad - it helps that he can sense check her bs - I think that has saved me so far from some of the black painting at least in some circles. But still, she went from desperation to have me back, to seeing someone else within two days. That is hard to get my head round. And before I broke contact would mention it whenever she could. She new it tore me to bits and I find it very hard to understand why someone would do that to someone they supposedly loved so much. So I guess to some extent I understand where you are coming from

[jhkbuzz]

Maybe those in the know will shoot me down, but this is what I choose to believe. My exBPDgf wanted a life with me. She wanted marriage. She wanted us to have a baby. She wanted us to be together. The problems came because she just did not know how to behave in a relationship or could not deal with it properly.  Her lack of empathy, respect, and inability to stop lying made me leave her. I choose to believe that her dreams, and mine, were real, but as a couple we were unable to fulfil them. I think this belief will allow me to find closure and ultimately move on. And btw, I am not forcing this belief, it is what I actually feel. I don't know if this will help, maybe I am still caught up in romanticising everything.

I think you're looking at it the right way, Remiman. BPD is a disorder of emotional dysregulation; their fear of abandonment and fear of enmeshment triggers maladaptive coping skills that are emotionally destructive to the non-disordered partner. I do believe that many pwBPD desperately want to be in a happy, successful r/s - just like we do. But the disorder makes it very difficult to achieve that goal.

[rotiroti]

Remi, I agree with what jhkbuzz says. There's an article by a BPDer in remission that says how the love she felt was indeed very sincere and real at the time. It's not a manipulation play:

https://bpdfamily.com/content/my-definition-love-i-have-borderline-personality-disorder

It's an interesting read and you'll see something similar over on the psychforum (forum for BPDers by BPDers)

[zundertowz]

Remi, I agree with what jhkbuzz says. There's an article by a BPDer in remission that says how the love she felt was indeed very sincere and real at the time. It's not a manipulation play:

https://bpdfamily.com/content/my-definition-love-i-have-borderline-personality-disorder

It's an interesting read and you'll see something similar over on the psychforum (forum for BPDers by BPDers)

Yes and that articles says exactly what i feel... .that the love is not a healthy one its based on need not based on caring!  Which is a selfish love and not really about you. And BPD in remission gave me a chuckle thanks!

[SummerStorm]

When mine ended the romantic part of our relationship just weeks after we looked at a house, I asked what happened. I said, "But I thought you wanted all those things.  Why didn't you say you didn't want that?" She replied, "I did want those things... .sometimes."

The sweet, romantic kisses I gave her just fascinated her.  She really, really wanted them, but she just couldn't handle the intimacy of them.  Even me lying next to her and gently running my fingers over her cheek and through her hair was too much.  I am way more romantic than her boyfriend is, and I really do think she wanted that.  She wanted to come home to me pouring a glass of wine for her and giving her a massage and running her a bubble bath.  But she just can't do that.  It's quite sad.

Her boyfriend even said to me, after she attempted suicide, "I should have been more open to her.  I didn't see how things were affecting her.  I was working so much and barely saw her." He saw nothing.  I saw everything.  He's moving across the country with her.  I've been painted black. 

[apollotech]

... .and just stopped suddenly when he decided I wasn't worth his love anymore?

Hi Indyan,

I am sorry that you and your children are going through this. I understand your confusion and need for answers. It's a terrible place to be. Can you relate what was going on in the relationship at the time that he just cut off everything? Did a significant emotional event occur around that time such as a move, wedding, anything like that? Was there a disagreement or something of that nature which might have been misinterpreted as you possibly leaving? Something triggered him.

[rotiroti]

Remi, I agree with what jhkbuzz says. There's an article by a BPDer in remission that says how the love she felt was indeed very sincere and real at the time. It's not a manipulation play:

https://bpdfamily.com/content/my-definition-love-i-have-borderline-personality-disorder

It's an interesting read and you'll see something similar over on the psychforum (forum for BPDers by BPDers)

Yes and that articles says exactly what i feel... .that the love is not a healthy one its based on need not based on caring!  Which is a selfish love and not really about you. And BPD in remission gave me a chuckle thanks!

hahaha right? it just sounds ridiculous.


And yes, you are totally right about the selfish love! that's why as hard as it is to accept, whoever provides the attachment is who the BPD will attach to. There's another thread where posters are discussing if there's a physical guideline for attraction... .i'm sure there is some to a degree, but it's secondary to filling in that need

[antelope]

for me, radically accepting that everything was essentially a lie was crucial in my detachment... .

half-truths, outright deception, whatever... .everything had an element of 'false-ness' to it

what cemented this idea for me were her actions

the words are very nice, but they are parroted and manipulated to the situation and circumstances they find themselves in... .the actions, and the overall patterns, are what tells the real story... .and the real story is that their words are just words, and their actions are who they really are

[FannyB]

Indyan

Here's my take on things: At the time when she said that she wanted us to be together 'forever' she told her kids this, her parents and her best friend.  What I experienced with her wasn't a lie - more an unsustainable truth. If she didn't truly believe what she was saying at the time there is no way that I'd have believed it either.

Fanny

[jhkbuzz]

Indyan

Here's my take on things: At the time when she said that she wanted us to be together 'forever' she told her kids this, her parents and her best friend.  What I experienced with her wasn't a lie - more an unsustainable truth. If she didn't truly believe what she was saying at the time there is no way that I'd have believed it either.

Fanny

"Unsustainable truth" - that's a very good way to phrase it.

[FannyB]

Indyan

Here's my take on things: At the time when she said that she wanted us to be together 'forever' she told her kids this, her parents and her best friend.  What I experienced with her wasn't a lie - more an unsustainable truth. If she didn't truly believe what she was saying at the time there is no way that I'd have believed it either.

Fanny

"Unsustainable truth" - that's a very good way to phrase it.

I know!  Came to me tonight in a flash of inspiration. It describes that nether world between truth and lies which many people, not just borderlines, tend to inhabit!

[jhkbuzz]

Indyan

Here's my take on things: At the time when she said that she wanted us to be together 'forever' she told her kids this, her parents and her best friend.  What I experienced with her wasn't a lie - more an unsustainable truth. If she didn't truly believe what she was saying at the time there is no way that I'd have believed it either.

Fanny

"Unsustainable truth" - that's a very good way to phrase it.

I know!  Came to me tonight in a flash of inspiration. It describes that nether world between truth and lies which many people, not just borderlines, tend to inhabit!

But an "unsustainable truth" is still truth when it is uttered. I have no doubt that my ex wanted our r/s to work and that she loved me, in her way, to the degree that she was able. She just didn't have the ability to sustain her side of the r/s because of the BPD.

This is what we need to remember; it's a disorder. dis-order. chaos.

When we view them through the same lens that we view ourselves, we become angry because we feel their behavior is personal. It's really not - they're just trying to survive and their maladaptive behavior is an effort in that direction.

[Schermarhorn]

I believe that her dreams were the real, but the person (ie me, or anothe guy) didn't matter.

[findingmyselfagain]

I don't think they are lies... .that it's more or less the black/white nature of the disorder. I believe mine loved me,thought I hung the moon, wanted to marry, have a family, all of that during the honeymoon phase. It was an intense love. But the black part is just as intense. I've come to believe that lasting love is more boring and mature. We're taught by society that falling in love, the passion, sparks are what we should be looking for and should feel. What I'm looking for now is maturity, stability, and commitment. Great feelings are great, but they aren't everything. Does that make sense?

[Duder]

I often struggle with this as well. My ex promised me the world,we looked for a house together,then she left me,then recycled me and I moved in with her and her kids. She promised me a baby,marriage. She would look into my eyes and tell me that she was truly happy,that I was her life,her soulmate. Then finds out her ex husband is getting married, starts devaluing me,kicks me out,blames it on my dog.then she grieves her divorce to her ex,not our relationship. It's all lies. Sucks but its true.

[valet]

Now they are lies, but then they were truth.

There is a thread here on the boards that might benefit you with many firsthand accounts and distant reflections on a similar question: 6) Clinging to the words that were said

[zundertowz]

I believe that her dreams were the real, but the person (ie me, or anothe guy) didn't matter.

exactly... .that's why its so easy for them to move on... .truth hurt's... .I understand why people refuse to believe this

[Indyan]

... .and just stopped suddenly when he decided I wasn't worth his love anymore?

Hi Indyan,

I am sorry that you and your children are going through this. I understand your confusion and need for answers. It's a terrible place to be. Can you relate what was going on in the relationship at the time that he just cut off everything? Did a significant emotional event occur around that time such as a move, wedding, anything like that? Was there a disagreement or something of that nature which might have been misinterpreted as you possibly leaving? Something triggered him.

Thanks Apollotech,

I guess the trigger was the birth of our baby... .although he had huge ups and downs before, and kept leaving me and coming back.

After baby was born, he went from bad to worse, and just when he finally went to seek medical help starting to really feel persecuted (by me, and at work also).

Then there was no turning back. 

[Indyan]

... .and the real story is that their words are just words, and their actions are who they really are

That's what I tell myself too.

He used to promise and say loads, but in the end everything beautiful in the r/s was my input. He then claimed I'd forced him into everything and so on. What a b... .!