Do they really not have any emotion when they dump you?

[seang]

I mean seriously.  Do they honestly just move on as if that past relationship didnt matter a fudge?  Do they never think, regret, miss or have any feelings whatsoever?  I find that hard to accept.  Mental illness or not, how can they just shut out a year of a close relationship overnight.

Guess Im just wanting to know she has some thought for me.  Some sense of loss.  Some regret.  Kinda hope she does sit there at times and think fondly. 

sigh   

[Beach_Babe]

Nope no emotion whatsoever. All they care about is us exiting at that point. We are split black and all bad, a cancer they are glad to be rid of. I'm so sorry you are experiencing this. I can relate, it's quite painful.


How long were you two together ?

[fromheeltoheal]

Think about when we have a falling out with someone or something bad happens in our lives.  We think it over in our heads, feel the emotions around it, reframe it, change what it means to us, get busy integrating whatever it was into our lives and making peace with it, remaking sense of the world.  Now take that to the extreme.  Someone who feels emotions intensely and can't regulate them might use the skill of compartmentalizing everything having to do with someone or a situation, maybe some projection, maybe some denial, whatever it takes to make those bad feelings stop, just stop.  So if someone does that to you, realize they might have done it because it's the only way they can find to deal with the intense emotions around it, and also that those emotions are intense because you meant a great deal to them and they're dealing with it the best they can.

[Sadly]

That is a clever and comforting reply.

[Beach_Babe]

That may be true for standard BPD, however I have not found that to be the case with NPD or any kind of cluster b comorbity. No one means anything to a narcissist, we are just objects to be used. Its a reality that shocked (and still shocks) me to my core, but perhaps a growing pain necessary to start moving forward.

[Sadly]

I guess we and they are all different despite the obvious traits. I know mine feels guilt for the way he has left me feeling. I have seen him struggling to express it, then it all becomes too much and he goes off on one again.

[Beach_Babe]

That's interesting, Sadly. What do you mean "goes off"?

[Suspicious1]

I haven't found that to be true; I think NPDs do feel things very strongly but deal with feelings of extremely low self-esteem by focussing on being "better" than everyone else (in what ever areas their low self esteem is) and surrounding themselves with people who will endorse that. Anything that challenges that perception is extremely unwelcome because it forces them to confront something that's too painful to face. They look for, and use up, sources of narcissistic supply, but I don't think that means they don't feel, don't hurt, don't miss people.

When both BPDs and NPDs exit a relationship I think it's the opposite of feeling nothing - I think their feelings become overwhelming and unmanageable. They push it all away as hard as possible as a result.

[Beach_Babe]

Mine felt nothing for anyone's pain but his own. At the same time,  he took delight in hurting others who "deserved it."   If he hurts now frankly I'm glad.

[Sadly]

I think you are right. Mine would never let me see much of how he was feeling, couldn't. His father is a very harsh controlling man. I think thats why the idealising at the start of a relationship is so amazing. He truly believed he had found in me what he had been wanting. The sad thing is he did but couldnt allow it to happen. Goes off on one is an english expression. It means he would go off on a rage/anger when he couldn't cope with the emotional stuff, to me that shows that they do truly feel emotion and remorse however briefly. I have seen him cry over his 17 year son who cuts himself and has I believe antisocial disorders; who he is estranged from and is not allowed to see, however he would soon push me and my comfort away. His favourite saying used to be "it doesn't matter". He once admitted to me that he didnt mean it, of course things matter, it was the only way he had of dealing with it. That was a huge admission from him, even though I already knew it I never said so. He doesn't make any sort of admissions now though. He doesn't trust me, calls me a liar, all that stuff.

[Mutt]

Hi seang,

I understand how it can be hard to accept. I think that you have some pretty good examples of the perspective of a non / a pwBPD from fromheeltoheal and the perspective of a pwNPD from Suspicious1. We're all different and have our own thoughts, feelings, values and some people are wired differently.

To answer your question about your ex feeling a sense of loss, a pwBPD have "inhibited grieving" and suppress their emotions , the person can't grieve what their defense mechanisms won't allow them to feel, "inhibited grieving" is unhealthily directed through acting out, anger and self sabotage.

[seang]

Christ!  Im all over the place.  I love her, i hate her, i miss her, i feel for her, i want her, im thankful shes gone!  What the heck.

I just cant get my head around the fact (or maybe i dont want to) that they can just shut down.  I mean wheres the compassion, grief, empathy.  The loss.

And to top it all of.  Im on a news channel that shes on.  Comments are rife there.  Theres obviously your few trolls that always frequent.  And i see shes warming up to this one particular prick.  Hes def of Narc tendencies, or at least on there to deliberately provoke.  And she seems to love it.  All over his posts, liking ___.  No, im not stalking, like i say, im on the same news channel and comment myself, he usually is in every post.  Not long till you see it eh!   Spose Ive gotta leave that site too.  The sacrifices are unreal we have to make.  And they merrily carry on, fukin playing with peoples feelings and self validating whilst leaving carnage behind with no regard.  A person youve spent so much time with, planed so much together.  It all doesnt seem real anymore.  I feel conned.  Ripped off.  A waste of 15 months of my life with this, dead inside, destructive person.

I Hate it.  I have a strong urge to monitor this ___ as it pans out.  i know thats so wrong, so unhealthy.  And i should close ALL things that connect us.  But in a way im kinda hoping to would make me hate this person.  Get her out of my life and head for good.  If that makes sense.  Or maybe Im just scared of letting go of every little bit of her i have left.  Sad huh?  Im not a weak person.  This has made me feel weak!

[JohnnyShoes]

Mine felt nothing for anyone's pain but his own. At the same time,  he took delight in hurting others who "deserved it."   If he hurts now frankly I'm glad.

I've went with a girl for 5 years, turned out she was an N ( almost a psychopath if not one thru and thru)

I agree... they do NOT feel anything... .what you THOUGHT were feelings, was your partner Mirroring... .or Showing you what you wanted to see/hear.

Yes... all an act. Their entire life is an act. Their real self is hidden, buried... .since childhood, as a result of some possible trauma or serious neglect.

We often make the mistake that our partner Thinks the same way we do, and thereby feels the same way or processes the experiences that we shared with them the same way... .

But THIS is the stumbling stone.

They constructed a character based on your desires, likes, dreams etc. They portrayed this character to you in hopes of receiving Love, Adoration, Desire... .it is those emotions that make them feel they exist.

They are like a CAR... .but running off YOUR battery!

They walk away when your 'juice' is all gone.

It was all YOUR emotions in the relationship... .

She/He just copied them and displayed them back to you.

It is the worse experience to have to go through as a Non .

[seang]

Thanks guys.  But this is the killer for me.  like you said, i get the trauma element in childhood.  And whilst I dont really know about her childhood, i dont think she went through anything bad?  I mean ive met her folks, no issues.  She seems to have had a good upbringing.  Shes grounded on values.  So i dont quite get that.  Can you develop BPD from anything else.  A ___ past relationship, another traumaitc moment.  Or does it have to be during childhood in order to "freeze" the brain?

[JohnnyShoes]

p: Not long till you see it eh!   Spose Ive gotta leave that site too.  The sacrifices are unreal we have to make.  And they merrily carry on, fukin playing with peoples feelings and self validating whilst leaving carnage behind with no regard.  A person youve spent so much time with, planed so much together.  It all doesnt seem real anymore.  I feel conned.  Ripped off.  A waste of 15 months of my life with this, dead inside, destructive person.

Ok. First off... .What you 'stepped in' is not your fault and you are Not the first this has happened to AND you won't be the last unfortunately.

Yes... .you Were Conned! Conned out of your emotions for one thing. Its how these people live and survive.

Read up on psychopaths... do your homework... learn... .you will educate yourself and gain strength.

Right now all your emotional chaos is coming from fighting denial.

Your mind wants to keep you safe by not believing the horror of this experience... .but over time AND NO CONTACT ( that means staying away from ALL contact... .including that news site) your denial will pass slowly like morning fog... .and brother, you will begin to feel your old self coming back.

You will begin to see the truths.

But... .you need to go NC and give it time.

You've been bitten by a clever master manipulator, but you WILL survive bud.

[JohnnyShoes]

Thanks guys.  But this is the killer for me.  like you said, i get the trauma element in childhood.  And whilst I dont really know about her childhood, i dont think she went through anything bad?  I mean ive met her folks, no issues.  She seems to have had a good upbringing.  Shes grounded on values.  So i dont quite get that.  Can you develop BPD from anything else.  A past relationship, another traumaitc moment.  Or does it have to be during childhood in order to "freeze" the brain?

I dont believe its developed in childhood, could possibly be early adolescence.

I'm sure someone more qualified than me that can answer this Q.

Dont believe I know for 'sure'

[Mutt]

Christ!  Im all over the place.  I love her, i hate her, i miss her, i feel for her, i want her, im thankful shes gone!  What the heck.

I get it and many members here can relate with how that feels like. We can get peace.

Have you taken a look at our lessons to the right of the board, the five stages of detachment?

Attachment Leads to Suffering.

Detachment Leads to Freedom.

--------------------------------->

[seang]

Yeah, ive read them.  Ive read a ton of over the last few months.  I think im pretty clued up on this now.  Just swinging in and out of if its her?  Im pretty sure it is.  Just gutted.  Just can not believe there are people out there capable of being so fuked up!

And you right,  Ive got to go ghost on this.  As hard as thats gonna be.  I think its just dragging ___ out and creating more questions. 

[Mutt]

I think that's a wise choice to go ghost, that way it gives you space and self protection and like you said your swinging in and out, some members call it FOG and the FOG will start to lift.

[apollotech]

Thanks guys.  But this is the killer for me.  like you said, i get the trauma element in childhood.  And whilst I dont really know about her childhood, i dont think she went through anything bad?  I mean ive met her folks, no issues.  She seems to have had a good upbringing.  Shes grounded on values.  So i dont quite get that.  Can you develop BPD from anything else.  A  past relationship, another traumaitc moment.  Or does it have to be during childhood in order to "freeze" the brain?

Hi seang,

The base for BPD was laid before the age of three, before she/he developed an autonomous self. It's an attachment disorder; something went wrong in the very early attachment/detachment process, before recoverable memories were formed. Stories that you may have been told about child abuse, sexual assault, etc. are not the basis trauma(s) for BPD.

[Beach_Babe]

I take it back they do feel emotion when they dump you. That feeling is contempt, disgust and hate. Yuck.

[SGraham]

I know my ex feelt guilty about discarding me because she didn't have the nerve to tell me to my face. I think despite how cold they appear, they really do feel. That's the whole point, they cant handle the emotions so the harder they push you away, the more you meant to them.

[Dutched]

Agree with Mutt and FHT.

The emotionas pwBPD experience at that time will set in a coping mechanism, a mechanism to survive.

Survival for pwBPD means shutting all emotions down.

In fact as for all humans a natural response for a live threatening situation.

For us, yes, as all experienced on the Board, it is the most cruel way to dump in a blink of an eye the one they expressed their love to, even moments before.

Dumped as a material object as it didn’t function as ‘expected’ anymore.

I take it back they do feel emotion when they dump you. That feeling is contempt, disgust and hate. Yuck.

Beach_Babe for me there is no need to take back your words. You expressed exactly what most of experienced and felt with a normal set of mind without considering any explanations for some odd behaviour. 

[Dutched]

I know my ex feelt guilty about discarding me because she didn't have the nerve to tell me to my face. I think despite how cold they appear, they really do feel. That's the whole point, they cant handle the emotions so the harder they push you away, the more you meant to them.

PwBPD feels deep shame. That is why they don't have the nerve to tell you (being disposed off in a blink of an eye after more than 3 decades, I experienced it too.)

Shame is a primary reaction, which can’t be controlled by the body.

Guilt, as you speek of, is secondary. Feeling guilty implies the ability to self reflect one actions and take steps in order to improve one selves.

That is not the case, in general, with pwBPD, as they are and stay in denial.

As for your last sentence, I fully agree.

[Dutched]

Thanks guys.  But this is the killer for me.  like you said, i get the trauma element in childhood.  And whilst I dont really know about her childhood, i dont think she went through anything bad?  I mean ive met her folks, no issues.  She seems to have had a good upbringing.  Shes grounded on values.  So i dont quite get that.  Can you develop BPD from anything else.  A past relationship, another traumaitc moment.  Or does it have to be during childhood in order to "freeze" the brain?

I dont believe its developed in childhood, could possibly be early adolescence.

I'm sure someone more qualified than me that can answer this Q.

Dont believe I know for 'sure'

Scientific survey shows a genetic cause of a 42%.

We have scientific results that the hippocampus (by 22%) and amygdale (by 13%) are smaller than average

Psychiatry Res. 2003 Apr 1;122(3):193-8. Schmahl CG, Vermetten E, Elzinga BM, Douglas Bremner J.

Department of Psychiatry and Psychotherapy, University of Freiburg Medical School, Hauptstrasse 5, D-79104 Freiburg, Germany. christian_schmahl@psyallg.ukl.uni-freiburg.de

[Suspicious1]

Thanks guys.  But this is the killer for me.  like you said, i get the trauma element in childhood.  And whilst I dont really know about her childhood, i dont think she went through anything bad?  I mean ive met her folks, no issues.  She seems to have had a good upbringing.  Shes grounded on values.  So i dont quite get that.  Can you develop BPD from anything else.  A past relationship, another traumaitc moment.  Or does it have to be during childhood in order to "freeze" the brain?

I dont believe its developed in childhood, could possibly be early adolescence.

I'm sure someone more qualified than me that can answer this Q.

Dont believe I know for 'sure'

Scientific survey shows a genetic cause of a 42%.

We have scientific results that the hippocampus (by 22%) and amygdale (by 13%) are smaller than average

Psychiatry Res. 2003 Apr 1;122(3):193-8. Schmahl CG, Vermetten E, Elzinga BM, Douglas Bremner J.

Department of Psychiatry and Psychotherapy, University of Freiburg Medical School, Hauptstrasse 5, D-79104 Freiburg, Germany. christian_schmahl@psyallg.ukl.uni-freiburg.de

Is that due to genetic factors, or because those parts of the brain don't develop properly in childhood due to trauma? The study suggests the latter.

[coletown11]

When I was dumped, the initial part of the convo (the actual dumping) was detached and cold and emotionless.

Just a few minutes into it, however, she called me by my pet name that she liked to call me. I told her she cant call me that anymore, then she started bawling.

Then she got cold again, then when I said I was leaving she started bawling again.

Kind of all over the place.

[CharWood]

 This is really an interesting question.

My ex discarded me after I let her know that I am fed up with her behavior and she has to either get help or leave our home. She discarded me and left. went replacement seeking... .keeps in contact with me (though, I am not certain how long it will last before she goes radio silent and gives me the big 1-2 FU. ) and has for the duration of the 5 weeks we have been broken up... but, she is very cold at times saying this like "I don't really care about you", "four years is not that long. its in the past. move on with your life" "I wasn't happy with you for a long time (when just 2 weeks before we broke up, she seemed over the moon happy about our future and intimate with me), "If I find out you still have feelings for me, I will never talk to you as a friend ever again", "I lost all of my feelings for you" "we will never get back together" "I am never coming back"... .but she also does things like: get jealous over who I hang out with and of other women I hang around; call me old pet nicknames; stare almost longingly at me; compliment my body; wear my shirts when I see her, will not give me the house key back, still asks me for advice and support with big life events or questions... .its weird.

Does my ex feel emotion? Do BPDs feel emotion when they break up? I think every BPD may be a bit different. But, I am sure they feel LOTS of emotions... I am sure their head spins with emotions... are they selfless emotions or selfish? who knows. I think the longer a relationship you have with a BPD, the more attachment to you they have. BPDs don't generally tend to stay very long in relationships... .so, if they do, it pretty much means, with their limited abilities to connect emotionally, they have made more of a connection with you than any other... .some non BPD ex's even become their primary. They are not able to really express what they feel because they themselves don't understand and it can change at any minute... but what they feel at any given moment may not be reality, it may just be what they feel at the moment... .trust me when I say this: there will be times when your ex is by his or herself and have nothing but quiet and are forced to face themselves for a moment in time... .BPDs hate being alone because they fear reality, they fear facing their own thoughts... they fear feeling... I am certain that, when my ex is alone in bed at night, living in the crappy reality she has built for herself after leaving... .I do believe there is a feeling of extreme discomfort and, for a moment, I believe she realizes what she threw away. Do I think she misses me? sure. she misses what I was to her, what I provided for her... she misses the safety of having me in her life. Will she ever admit it? Probably not. Unless she is very desperate.

Here is a little proof for you that BPDs do feel something: Yesterday, my BPD ex drove an hour and a half away to visit with her loser replacement and posted some stupid post about how that f-tard washed her car for her. I did not know anything of it until today... because, I too was with a lady friend spending some quality time surfing and hanging out with her. My ex and I deleted eachother off of facebook, but she did not remove me from instagram and actually still has pictures of me up and of us and of our home and in her profile info., still shows she has out pets and suggests she lives in our home (weird, right?) but, for some reason, I believe my ex found out that I was with another woman yesterday and saw the picture of her somehow on my facebook. I get a text from a friend this morning telling me to check my instagram... on it, I see a picture of my ex she posted at 6am. My ex has not posted anything on instagram since before she left and we broke up, though she still uses it to like pictures and surf the pictures. In this picture, there was no caption. My ex was just standing there, expressionless... with an angry/depressed look. no smile. no grin. nothing. she had bags under her eyes. they were red. and she looked almost pained... .it looked like she either did not sleep that night or had been crying.  Coincidence she posts this the day after I first publicly acknowledge that I am hanging out with another woman? I don't think so. She posted on an account she has not used, where she knew I would see it. She reacted. See. She felt something.

Also, my ex has been going back and forth between gaining and losing weight. She only gets 4 to 6 hours of sleep per night. She always looks broken out and tired every time I see her. Her eye has been twitching from what I think is lack of sleep... .it has been affecting her. Though she is not expressing it emotionally to anyone, the toll our breakup has taken on her physically is very telling.

[Beach_Babe]

Dutched: oh I know the explanations, I have more education and background in this area than most people.  I simply dont care anymore. Some people simply lack the capability to care; some people, as in the case of my ex and cluster b parents, are malignant narcissists. Those are the folk who actually enjoy watching another suffer. It positively DELIGHTS them (yet they never miss the chance to cry victim for themselves). Sure I know the "why" of this but at the end of the day the result is the same. No explanation takes away the harsh, sometimes cruel reality of things.