On giving up hope

[Beware of Junk Psychology...]

I'm sorry I'm on and off this site - I'm going to make an effort from here on to be around more consistently, especially for new people and especially over the holidays.  I want to give back.

As i've said, very recently ended a 30 yr. friendship (that was sometimes a romantic relationship) with a man with BPD.  I'm struggling - having periods of terrible anxiety, sudden crying, phases of anger and, above all, a feeling of surreality.  As in, how could I have been so wrong about this person?  This relationship?  How could I have done this to myself?

Today, I was debating whether I should contact a mutual friend and ask her to let me know if my ex is in an accident, gets really sick or dies (his lifestyle makes all three of these sort of expected outcomes).  I'd nearly convinced myself this was a reasonable thing to do.  Then it hit me, all at once; I'M STILL HOPING.  Hoping he'll get better, hoping he'll say sorry, hoping he'll realize, at the end of his life, that I was one of the best things in it.  Hoping for some kind of (creepy) deathbed conversion in which I'm finally able to help him and he's finally able to let me.  It hit me like an elbow in the  chest.  I couldn't breathe.  As weird as it sounds, the only hope I have is to give up all hope.  Do you know what I mean?  I have to accept that that's never going to happen.  How the hell do I do that? 

That's today's dilemna... .thanks for listening.

[wakingfirst]

I'm sorry I'm on and off this site - I'm going to make an effort from here on to be around more consistently, especially for new people and especially over the holidays.  I want to give back.

As i've said, very recently ended a 30 yr. friendship (that was sometimes a romantic relationship) with a man with BPD.  I'm struggling - having periods of terrible anxiety, sudden crying, phases of anger and, above all, a feeling of surreality.  As in, how could I have been so wrong about this person?  This relationship?  How could I have done this to myself?

Today, I was debating whether I should contact a mutual friend and ask her to let me know if my ex is in an accident, gets really sick or dies (his lifestyle makes all three of these sort of expected outcomes).  I'd nearly convinced myself this was a reasonable thing to do.  Then it hit me, all at once; I'M STILL HOPING.  Hoping he'll get better, hoping he'll say sorry, hoping he'll realize, at the end of his life, that I was one of the best things in it.  Hoping for some kind of (creepy) deathbed conversion in which I'm finally able to help him and he's finally able to let me.  It hit me like an elbow in the  chest.  I couldn't breathe.  As weird as it sounds, the only hope I have is to give up all hope.  Do you know what I mean?  I have to accept that that's never going to happen.  How the hell do I do that? 

That's today's dilemna... .thanks for listening.

[C.Stein]

I know exactly what you mean and I am having almost the same exact thoughts as you.  While my relationship wasn't anywhere near as long as yours, I still feel a deep bond with my ex and I just can't shake it.  I want her to realize she made a mistake giving up on me, that she gave up on the best thing that has happened to her with regard to relationships.  Sadly, I don't think I will ever hear from her again.  She is likely in the full on idealization/fantasy stage of a new relationship and I am the furthest thing from her mind.  I am certain she has convinced herself how much better off she is without me in her life and that really hurts a lot.  I can almost hear her talking about it now, blaming me for everything that went wrong, how bad I was for her and how much better this new guy is.  Sigh ... .  :'(

[Itstopsnow]

You can always have hope in life, I believe that hope is a virtue given to us by God. But I agree hope doesn't apply to a mental ill person who doesn't take ownership of their issues. I'm sorry about the 30 years. You have proof right there that time and age doesn't fix these people. It's one of the more difficult of mental illnesses to deal with, because it affects their whole life and everyday. It's part of their personality. That encumbrances their thoughts, actions, emotions, it's such a complex disorder. The best thing to hope for is to finally walk away and don't look back. I'm sorry to say that. But it will heal you in the long run. Maybe in a few years you can hear about him, I'm hoping I find out too in a few years. But their lives won't change, people in it will, but circumstances will be the same for them. We are the lucky ones to be free! We just have to realize that and let go. For good! I need to do that too! 

[Michelle27]

I held onto hope for years longer than the evidence presented to me should have allowed, so I understand that hope.  I hung onto hope even while insisting on a separation last spring and presenting it as a therapeutic separation.  I wanted/needed him to genuinely want to get help and I needed some space to heal.  During the time apart, I dug deep while seeing a therapist and realized that hope was all I had in the relationship anymore.  I was going through the motions because I thought I "had" to with marriage and children involved.  It took a lot to see that I was actually "done" and had been for a long time.  That after 5 years of hope and listening to the words rather than the actions, I was in serious denial and it was time to take care of me.  It wasn't easy.  But for me it was a very gradual dawning of realization, not a sudden one.  And even when I began to tread lightly on those thoughts, I'd push them away thinking to myself that I'm not one to give up that easily.  My therapist was instrumental in helping me realize my faulty thinking patterns and figuring out what I truly wanted without factoring in what HE wanted. 

[joel6242]

I woke up in the same situation. I feel very strongly this morning that I need to send an email to my BPD to let him know that I do love him. I know that I need to work on me right now and he needs to get help. I really hate using this but "let go and let God", I am not a religious person but this seems appropriate. I will not be sending an email today, I have many things that I need to work on this afternoon. My goal is to reach out to friends about their weekend (no BPD drama), watch football, and give the dogs a bath.

[C.Stein]

That after 5 years of hope and listening to the words rather than the actions, I was in serious denial and it was time to take care of me.  It wasn't easy.  But for me it was a very gradual dawning of realization, not a sudden one.  And even when I began to tread lightly on those thoughts, I'd push them away thinking to myself that I'm not one to give up that easily.

I can so relate with this.  I also held onto to hope, allowed myself to be blinded to the truth of what I was faced with.  Even now I struggle and I don't know why.  My ex had discarded me with ease, like I never existed.  It is beyond painful to accept that and exceptionally hard to let go of the hope that things aren't what they really are.

[patientandclear]

Wakingfirst -- I really relate to your story.  I think the only major difference between our storyline is that each stage of yours lasted longer (and you were much younger when you first got close to your BPD guy).  In particular, we have in common the protracted "friendship" that was really an unacknowledged romantic partnership; and being super close emotionally only to have the guy with BPD withdraw without even acknowledging that doing so was a big deal, when he met someone new.  Only to want it back later.  Only to do that AGAIN after you offered him your best stuff again.

You haven't said on these boards what happened a few months back that felt like such a betrayal to you.  Only that you wrote him after he did something really hurtful, said you couldn't do it any more, and then he disgorged a bunch of bile about how you had inappropriate expectations and you ruined everything.

I think the insight, from your earlier threads, that he reacted badly to the idea that you were shutting things down, when you said you "absolutely can't do this anymore," is almost surely right.  It's super hard on the BPD guy in my life when I draw lines that sound like all meaningful interaction between us is going to cease.  He then behaves poorly, but I'm sure it's nothing compared to internal rage he feels.  It is really hard for them to face the loss of someone deeply important.  I don't think there is any doubt that you are deeply important to him.

And yet, somehow, even though it's deeply important, they can't always take good care of it.  Or they don't.  It does get taken for granted and it does really hurt.

It seems to me that in many ways the crucial pattern in your r/s with this guy got set long ago when you proposed a real relationship and he demurred and you decided it was too painful to just have part of that.  In many ways that is still playing out.  He wants the tenderness and closeness (who wouldn't? you sound like a remarkable pseudo-partner to him) but he doesn't want the commitment, obligation, complete exposure, complete vulnerability, that comes from more.  Yet for most people, the intimacy and tenderness come along with those other things.  When you're giving in that way, there's a natural tendency to feel that certain other expectations go along with it -- some sort of mutual commitment.  When it turns out that is not the case, it really hurts.

When I force myself to admit the cold hard truths I know, they are that my ex wBPD loves being intimately connected to me, in partner-like ways, and would probably do that for a lifetime if I would participate, but will never do that exclusively with me because he flees from the vulnerability, the debt, the feeling of needing a particular person.  And instead, he is in constant pursuit of the perfect person, The One, with whom that will not happen.  He still hopes to find someone with whom he can be completely intimate without having his feelings cave in on him.  With that belief system, his behaviors toward me make sense.  They just don't work for me.  Those are not the terms on which I open myself up intimately to another person.  It's sad, but he is not at work on any attempt to get to the bottom of this or change it so far as I can tell.  He is going to continue to be himself, and this is how that goes.  I have bargained and bargained and been hella creative and flexible, but I keep bumping up against an integrity line for me, and I can't do what he wants, and he can't do what I want, or stick within boundaries with me that don't present this problem.  It sucks.

I suspect for both you and me, we have resorted to a lot of creative pretzel twisting in order to avoid this loss because it feels like such a terrible waste.  But maybe our need to be respected and valued is just in inherent tension with their need not to feel obligated, to come and go, to explore comparable connections with others.  I don't know that there is a way to get around that problem.

You may already have arrived at that very realization and that's why you're working on "giving up hope" as you titled this thread.  It's really tough for me to give up, too, because it hurts him, it hurts me, and that formula suggests that there should be a different ending.  I haven't been able to find it though.

 

[wakingfirst]

Patientandclear -- thank you so much for that rich and emathetic response.  It means a great deal to have someone understand.  For years, I felt like such a weirdo because I was part of this relationship that was neither-this-nor-that.  I've done a lot of inner work in the last few years to understand why I participated in that for as long as I did.  I think I do understand it now.  For me, understanding what I was getting from this relationship was the key to forgiving myself and moving forward. 

I only wish I did not have to move forward without him.  As you say, I've done a lot of pretzel twisting to try to keep him in my life.  In the past few years I've tried putting various boundaries in place, and each has worked for a while, but ultimately he finds a way around or over them.  It is exactly as you said, a waste.  My life has moved on from the time I loved him romantically,  but I still love him as a friend and I miss him.  I know he is very hurt too.  Like you, I regret putting him through that.  If there was any other way I'd take it.  I've had to choose loyalty to myself over loyalty to our relationship.

You mention that I never said what happened to make me end things... .I'm going to put that in another post.  Longish, weird story.

I hope so much that you find peace and thank you again for being in touch. 

[Palladio]

We have all been profoundly impacted

by our relationships with our SO.

Are we indeed giving up hope or at

last acknowledging reality for what it

is? Admittedly most of us would like

nothing more than having him or her

come back to us, acknowledging that

we were the best thing to ever happen

to them. The harsh reality is that even

if that were to happen, for how long

would they stay around until all their

familiar demons begin to rear their

heads again? I've had four recycle

attempts over the past 28 years, with

each ending the same each time.

The sad fact is that they will not

change. They will not acknowledge

their actions hurt us deeply. They will

not acknowledge the problems are

either totally or even partially their

fault. Pointing out their faults,

shortcomings or contributions to

the demise will be met with denial

and most likely either raging or

silent treatment or both. Our

magical thinking that if only they

will see the light,that things will be

different the next go round. I'm as

guilty of this delusional thinking as

anyone. After seven months post

BU, I'm still struggling with the

typical treatment we've all

experienced at the hands of the

person we've loved so dearly.

At what point do we decide to love

ourself even half as much as we've

professed to love our SO? I can only

pray for divine guidance daily, to

help me navigate these turbulent

days. It's not easy,nor is it being a

defeatist, it's trying to be a realist,

about a person who sadly is mentally

ill, and how their illness has impacted

our lives.

[steelwork]

It's really tough for me to give up, too, because it hurts him, it hurts me, and that formula suggests that there should be a different ending.  I haven't been able to find it though.

 

Wow, yeah.