Radical thought, already thought of or ludicrous?

[confusedbloke]

Ok so ive been visiting these forums getting as much information as I can about BPD in the last 12 months... .Ive recently walked away from my, I would say (Im no doctor), BPD girlfriend.  I literally could take no more... .Theres no point explaining what happened... .only those that have received it know exactly what its like... .  So anyway, I love to research and find things out... .this may have already been mentioned but I would say the key to a BPD heart is trust.  Ive been reading counsellor success stories that they "got through" to BPDs, it was a significant struggle, and they would often receive abuse. But once they were on board with a counsellor, they could let the guard down... .Now that's a struggle with a counsellor  but they got through... .it was trust... .but that's still a stranger... .I reckon its the whole good will hunting thing... .complete respect and That's all its about... .But imagine letting their guard down in front of someone they are so unbelievably in love with... .this person could destroy them within seconds... .I was so close to getting her... .at this moment she will be agonising... .not that I find any pleasure in that... .its something she has to fight... .she knows im a good un... .  The damage that's happened is seemingly irreparable... .nothings unfixable... .That's what they need to know... .just dont have such extreme reactions is like saying dont be afraid if a huge dog is near your child... .I know that "they" are amazing people... .Im gonna wait to see if she susses it out (I know she will) and if she doesn't my life will naturally progress to the next chapter... .  Anyway thanks needed to get that off my chest... .its funny cos I signed up to this tonight and it said username already exists... .I had to chuckle coz obv its done my head in months ago - I will have written a completely confused post... .ahhh any way... .all fun tho eh?... .and I guess that ive recently discovered that im a codependor completely attracted to this kind of women... .so knickers to it... .am gonna find out how to make it incredible coz I bet when the two intertwine completely and utterly it would be amazing... .everything is doo able if you want it ... .Anyway night all !.

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES This is a high level discussion board for solving ongoing, day-to-day relationship conflicts. Members may appear frustrated but they are here for constructive solutions to problems. This is not a place for relationship "stay" or "leave" discussions. Please read the specific guidelines for this group.

[waverider]

Gaining their trust is a huge step, but they dont give it easily, nor maintain it.

It is hard to get there and it is not achieved by appeasement, or simply trying to be nice.

To get there you have to be a strong independent, self assured person, who is not afraid of making harsh black and white decision and boundaries. A language which may rile them, but which they understand.

A pwBPW will never respect, nor trust a doormat, no matter how hard they try to make you one.

[confusedbloke]

Thanks for the response... .Perhaps Im idealizing... i cant work it out.  She fits 90% of the "textbook" BPD but there are differences... .  Its like im an obsession and if I dont adhere or say the right thing she goes into a rage, goes home, and sits in her room crying for 3 days... .she doesnt eat, doesnt sleep... and because shes not working, I just seem to be her focus of attention... .Then she comes around and starts being all loved up again... .but doesnt apologize... Its strange because after 3 days I feel the same... .I "dont care what happened", I just want her with me... .  When we are intimate and I touch her back, her whole body comes alive with goose bumps and she just flops as its that intense for her... .  The physical side never used to be like that... I had some, lets say, issues in that department when I first met her 6 months after my marriage breakdown... .and she helped me through all that and in the last 15 months have grown together sexually and it gets better all the time... .  I dont wish to be graphic but she climaxes within a few seconds... .and that never happened before... .  I guess maybe Im looking for reassurance that I wasnt just an object but someone who she was actually in love with.  She was married for 13 years and her last boyfriend was of 7 years, so I dont think she fits the bill of flitting from man to man... .and that to me is a difference to what Ive been reading about the condition... .  I stupidly the other night was upset and drunk and kissed a girl (we had already broken up), and one of her friends saw me... .A couple of days later I started to get paranoid that they had spoken and that she might do something to my house (she still has a key)... .so I texted her trying to "smooth" things over... .After a brief text discussion it kinda ended and she sent me a text saying that she wishes I hadnt contacted her as Ive set her right back to square one in her grieving process... She tells me she is grieving all the time... .and I do genuinely believe that... .I just dont know what to make of it all... .But what is for sure, I cant seem to get her out of my mind... .and its been that way since I met her... She says I never "hear her", and that Ive pulled her to bits... and to be fair thats completely true... .Im just wasnt used to this level of intensity and the need to be next to me every waking hour of the day... .Ive never been so attentive to a girl - it didnt help that I was kinda dismissive with my ex wife... .So this time I thought I would be more loving and attentive... .And that seems to have backfired... .And ive never been a dormat with her... ive been really strict and "not taking her nonsense"... .as soon as she starts I basically kick her out of the house... .Which back fires as she thinks I dont want her... .I dont know what Im trying to say... .Just trying to make sense of it all I guess and venting... .

Cheers

[waverider]

The confusion you are feeling is normal, without full knowledge of the disorder then you probably trigger her without intending. Despite similarities not all pwBPD are the same.

Seems as though she is the clingy type and puts all her eggs in the one basket. You are her everything, as she feels she is no one. She absorbs you.

It is most likely having come from a failed marriage you are carrying a bit of baggage of your own.

The mind is the greatest sex organ, consequently pwBPD dont always process arousal the same, it can be instant like their emotional swings, or it can be blocked. Which is more to what she is thinking than what you are doing.

Be careful of using the word grieving, that implies working through emotions until they subside. BPD often dont work through them, they hang on to them without the intensity declining. The emotion can be switched on and off with the same original intensity.

[confusedbloke]

Absolutely I trigger her... .I have no idea why or how... .It comes out of nowhere... .The episodes ive endured are ridiculous... .Happens mostly when she is drunk... .and she gets drunk a lot... Its a vicious circle. I ended up not being able to go out with her anywhere in fear of her snapping. When she ignores me for those days, I originally used to panic, wondering where she was, who she was with etc.  I literally went insane. But in the last few months I left her to it and went out with a friend. I basically built a new life.  Then she would have a go at me for always going out without her. It was like a broken record, trying to explain to her that I go out becuase she ignored me - i now realise it was pointless trying to explain. It just fell on deaf ears... .WOW its been so frustrating.

I think one of the problems is that Im a social butterfly. I love talking to people (male and female) and im quite extrovert... (i like being the centre of attention and making people laugh). Thats how I met her. I saw her in the pub quietly sat in a pub reading a book. I thought she looked gorgeous so I just went over and started talking to her... .and the rest is history. I dont think she thinks Im going to cheat on her (she says she knows i wouldnt) - i dont know what it is... I dont know why she got angry at me.

This statement you wrote "

Seems as though she is the clingy type and puts all her eggs in the one basket. You are her everything, as she feels she is no one. She absorbs you" - my god that describes the situation completely.  Thats how it feels and its suffocating. I have 3 beautiful kids, a very responsible job and have other comitments in life.  I have said to her on so many occasions that I cant give her what she needs, because of my comitments... .then all I get is that you care more about your ex wife than me (I get on well with my ex because we love our kids). Always felt like she was competing against the kids for my attention... .very bizarre.

And yes again you are correct. I definitely had baggage from my marriage when I first met this girl. Absolute fact. I was very cautious of women (even though I knew deep down it was the right thing to do, and in fact felt a bit of relief). So when she was accusing me of this or wanting to know who i am texting, (when I never bothered with who she was texting), it made me think she must be up to something.  And when we would go out, she never paid for anything... .so i used to think she was using me.  So I would have a go at her... .Then after some time I relaxed and just thought Id go for it with her and to not worry anymore, but she just kept getting worse and worse. If plans changed slightly, she would go insane. It was becoming too much... .and when I chatted to an ex gf from 20 years ago, whom i went out with for 5 weeks, was the first real explosion, it was crazy. I ended it that night with her (6 months in)... .But then went back. We have both finished the other, then gone back so many times, ive run out of digits.

This time is different though. I think realistically we cant go back after whats happened. Too much damage done.

Oh and "grieving" is not a word I used.  She used it. And keeps using it. I wont text her anymore as it does both of us no good.

This is kind of like therapy - thanks for listenning. As I type these words out, Im like "why have I put up with this", I guess you dont realise how bad a situation is until you see it written down.  Ive booked a holiday and am going in a weeks time to tenerife with a friend. I really need this holiday, need to get away and get my self together.

What do you think my best course of action is now?

[waverider]

It seems like you have realized you need space to absorb a dose of 'normality' to see if this really is for you. Lack of personal space is what causes many of us to operate on default rather than from a place of wizemind. Therefore your focus should be to work out your values, weaknesses and goals in life. ie ensuring your are not edging towards codependency by needing her approval.

You can't "fix" her but you can work with who she is, but it is important to do this out of an educated choice, not just because that is what is in front of you and you are just getting by as best you can.

Most of all make sure you haven't fallen for what is a mirror of your own hopes and wishes, as that mirror is not real and fades.

She probably suffers from a deep underlying anxiety and any outside interests you may have will be deemed a threat whether it be another person or a hobby. You are the center of her world, she expects you to be consumed by her. That is the"whole or nothing" thinking of BPD, compromise is a struggle for them. Appeasing this creates isolation and the loss of our benchmarks of reality.

[confusedbloke]

Wow - you really, really know your stuff. You have explained our relationship precisely.

I do need a dose of normality... at the present I don't know what that is. My normality is the craziness that's gone on in the last year or so. Perhaps I am verging on co-dependency, and always been needing her approval.  But the more I gave the more she wanted. It was never ending.  There would be a new issue every couple of days, then i would bend and a new one would come along.  And she says I've done nothing in the relationship and she's done all the changing. Wow - I'm so glad I vented on here.  Feel like im gaining some small amount of composure, and above all, a small amount of sanity.

I guess I did want to fix her as I genuinely believe she's a good person, and perhaps I felt sorry for her horrible childhood.  And I think that's what the problem is... All i have thought is "if only i can get her back to how she was"... But I suppose you've heard that a lot?

I do sadly think it will be time to say goodbye to her - and believe me, it hurts, and im struggling with it... .But my sanity is more important than trying to make sure she is happy... Which she never was.

Your closing statement is very insightful, and rings so true.  It got to the point that I felt I couldn't leave the couch to tidy the house etc if she was there... .I couldn't play with the kids if she was there... .I became a shell of a person, not daring to do anything in case she kicked off with me.  That's just not right.  She does suffer from anxiety.  You've jogged my memory. I remember her telling me when she was younger she couldn't go out of the house due to anxiety.

And yes that's what it feels like, Im the only thing in the world (in her eyes).  She always said that she felt like an after thought or second, third or fourth best if I invited her to come along to the pub or whatever if i was with my friends. I guess it got to the point that I only invited her so she wouldn't kick off, but in doing so, she did anyway. I actually created arguments sometimes, just so i could go out... .and stupidly i admitted that to her once, and boy did I regret it.  She brought it up all the time... .It was like reasoning with my 4 year old boy, in fact I could reason easier with him. Its all so crazy now, looking back.

I used to say that she needs to get a job, meet new people and have new focuses in life.  I just really didn't know about BPD, so in retrospect I might as well have been asking her to swim the English channel. 

"You are the centre of her world, she expects you to be consumed by her" - all i can say is wow.  I think I'm finally getting it.  That's exactly what she expects. To some extent its flattering, but as she is not thinking as I do, I guess its not real anyway (if that makes sense). If I didn't give her that or mentioned my exes name or stopped for a pint, she would just change within a microsecond and absolutely hate me... .

I went for a few drinks with another woman the other night, she was pretty and "normal", but wasn't exBPD. It felt kind of weird as it wasn't her.  Im not worried about finding another woman, never really had that issue. Although I am concerned that I attract the same kind of woman again.  I do seem to attract women that are "depressed". I think because Im a happy go lucky person who is fun to be around they latch on to me I guess so that their world becomes a little brighter, but in doing so it drags me down.  Out of the 6 serious gf's ive had, 5 of them were like that.  I do need to address this.

Anyway not ready for anything like that yet, I need to regroup and concentrate on myself for a bit. But I also dont want her to be in pain.  I guess I need to stop thinking like that, and really focus on me, as its been a very damaging and painful time.

Its really interesting as Ive never met anyone with mental health condition before... .At least I can maybe get some form of solace now, and put it down to the fact that I have knowledge about another subject in life...

Hey ho!

[confusedbloke]

Is there any literature anywhere on this type of BPD? I'd like to understand everything that she sees and feels before I make a decision as to what to do... .

And does this particular type of condition have an official name?

I suppose I ought to be educated

Thanks

[waverider]

We normally recommend you work your way through these links

LESSONS

They lay things out in an orderly manner for you. Only a professional clinician can give specific diagnosis, even then it is hard to be precise.

It is regarded as a 'cluster" disorder, that is a collection of traits of varying degrees. Not all will be present.  Despite all the stories sounding similar never loose sight that everyone is still an individual.

A lot of the tools will be common sense relationship interactions, so you will gain a lot of positives for yourself and interacting generally with others.

[confusedbloke]

Thanks for this and thank you for taking the time to chat... .  Its been a very welcome sanity check.

I had a look through the link and Ive realised I just cannot continue with this woman. She was an absolute head mess. I just feel enlightened now, knowing that I wasn't crazy (well, might have been!).

So I will remain separated.  What I need now is some advice on what to do after break up, as Ive heard horror stories.  I will start a new thread in the appropriate place.

Once again, thank you very much