Does Borderline revenge EVER end?

[letmeout]

I divorced my borderline spouse over 5 years ago and he swore to ruin my life for abandoning him. He tried parental alienation with our adult children and grandchildren, and only partly succeeded in that. He stole all our assets and has been on a smear campaign ever since.

His newest tactic is very devious; I can't believe he accomplished this so well.

My mother and I always spent holidays with my son and his mother-in-laws family.  Since ex husband is now dating our daughter-in-laws mother and has moved in with her, my mother and I are no longer invited to attend any family gatherings.

This poor woman thinks she has 'fixed him'. I was married to him for 3 decades, I know he can't be 'fixed'. I also know him well enough to know that he is just using her to get back at me. Should I talk with her to warn her?

What I find so astounding is that she knows his history of his abuse on me and our children; my son has been married to her daughter for 17 years!





  

[Dutched]

Letmeout

If I were in your shoes, no, do not warn, just keep your silence. How difficult it might be.
You will be seen as a revengeful person.
They must find it out by themselves, as you can see on this Board.
History will repeat itself, no doubt, as pwBPD have only 1 textbook which is played repeatedly.
Further, as you (like me) lived that long with ex partner the process to exposure might be slower
Until then, the ex is seen as a great, caring and joyful person…

Been there too for 30+ yrs, though exw was the one that blew it up.
A few yrs. before the end, exw for the 1st time shouted in one of that typical outbursts:
‘I shall destroy all that is precious to you, also your relationship with the kids!’
  Well, when exw left my house for the final time, exw repeated that at the door.

Kids, then in their late teen age, were her possessions, her love objects, so the process of parentification was already going on.
Daughter left with her mom and immediately the alienation started, resulting in NC for several yrs. now.
With son, who stayed with me, the pull by his mom started and not that long ago seems to be successful as he stabbed (metaphorically speaking) a knife in my back. 

[bunny4523]

Hi letmeout,

I'd have to agree, don't warn her.  If she happens to start figuring out something is off and reaches out to you, then if I were you I would validate her.  But be careful how much information you offer.  I remember hearing things my ex saying things his ex used to say to him or about him.  I was so confused because I couldn't see even a hint of it until... .it started happening to me.  So they hide it very well at first.  It might just look like you are trying to sabatoge the new relationship... .I'd wait if I were you.

Dutched - so sorry to hear that about your kids.  It's horrible.  I hope one day they are able to understand what is happening and re-establish a relationship with you.  They have got to be so confused... .I pray for all of you

Bunny

[Lucky Jim]

Hey letmeout, Agree w/bunny & Dutched: in my view you are likely to stir up a hornets' nest by trying to "warn" her; instead, let her figure it out on her own (she's an adult).

Dutched, So sorry to hear about your estrangement from your kids.  I can relate: my BPDxW has brainwashed our teenage boys by shifting her anger to them as her proxies.  The kids are in a bind because they will catch hell if they show or express affection towards me, so it's easier for them to avoid having me in their lives.  It's a daily sadness, yet I remain optimistic that the tide will turn at some point (it always does).  Plus, tyrants have a way of self-destructing so I try to be patient.

LuckyJim

[Mutt]

Hi letmeout,



I agree with everyone else here. I'd just like to add something else.

I was married to him for 3 decades, I know he can't be 'fixed'. I also know him well enough to know that he is just using her to get back at me.

I wouldn't make his relationship personal, it's speculating if he's getting back at you, but to answer your question in your thread title ":)oes borderline revenge ever end?" You're split black and his new partner will be split black and not you, so to answer your question in that context, yes revenge will end because the focus will be shifted away from you and the attention will be on his romantic partner. Being split black doesn't happen all at once, the same goes for being split white, the pendulum swings both ways, it happens over time, the animosity directed at you will dissipate over time. I hope that helps

[Dutched]

Really thanks to you all to show me this compassion and deep empathy! I really appreciate that! Thanks!

Same wishes to you Lucky Jim
Indeed maybe one day when they are free from the chain of mom and are trying and able to see the light.
Unfortunately the damage is done and a gap will remain.
Seen that with exw who dumped her parents too at age 18 and refused contact for a 10 yrs.

The black and white thinking: about a six months later exw emailed me that I was a good father and wished me a good relationship with the kids… that was shortly after exw collapsed one night as I was told…

Not to hijack.
As info for those who reacted on this post and who have the same of more or less experience or like you Mutt with young ones and shared custody.

The r/s of children with the primary caretaker (most cases the mother) will be transferred to the next generation. Having the example of mother (exw) who dumped her parents, and having mother as primary caretaker (and HFBPD) will have trans-generational consequences. My kids will most likely transfer it too, unless they deal with their past and with help of their partners.

Literature shows, among dr. Craig Childress and David Mallen MD, that PAS is common where a parent shows at least treats of Borderline or Narcissism.
 For those who are interested:
https://drcraigchildressblog.com/2015/03/06/understanding-the-childs-experience/

Literature also refers to it as a Medea Complex.
Medea, the Greek mother in the play of Euripides. A story of intense love turned into deep hate that she killed her kids in order get back at her husband for betraying her.
A dialogue go’s as:
Jason (husband): you loved them and killed them
Medea: to make you feel pain.
 
From: THE MEDEA COMPLEX AND THE PARENTAL ALIENATION SYNDROME:
When Mothers Damage their Daughter's Ability to Love a Man. Robert M. Gordon, Ph.D.

A psychodynamic model of severe divorce pathology views the Medea mother as "narcissistically scarred, embittered dependent woman... .(who) ... .attempts to severe father-child contact as a means of revenging the injury inflicted on her by the loss of a self-object, her hero-husband." The idea is that the Medea mother is so dependent that she cannot deal with the loss, and thus holds on with hate. Her love turned to hate is so passionate that she destroys that which intimacy between them produced. The hate goes beyond her instinctive need to protect her own children. Medea must make the father suffer more than she suffers for it to be a punishment with revenge and make him feel pain

Gardner (1987) stated that because of the separation these ex partners (mothers) can’t retaliate directly at their former partner they wreak vengeance to deprive the father from his most treasured possessions, the kids.   
The victory results in the psychological destruction of the kids. 

Enough.  Thanks again folks! 

[Dutched]

Letmeout  one other thing.
Being involved for many yrs. with ex inlaws, ex siblings and extended family you recognizes perfectly the dynamics in that family. From the superficial ones, the ‘don’t care ones’ up to the enablers.

Based on that too every ‘exposure’ is futile. 

Once in my anger, I copied a mail, in which I ‘exposed’ some of exw’s behaviour, to some of exw’s family. One of them, who once reached out to exw after exw dumped at age 18 her parents/family, reacted.
Moving fast forward, although standing on guard, I have occasional good contact with 2 of exw’s family members. 
And to tell you, exw repeats history holding the same text book.

Sit and wait, it was out of anger what I did, just by ‘fortune’ it turned out well, but it could have back fired as well.

[letmeout]

I won't bother to warn her, like I said, she knows what she is into because she knows his history of abuse. What is disturbing is that he got our children and grand children to stay away from me and keep this secret until he was able to convince her to get married.

He was always a mean father and grandfather, but now that his fortune has changed and they have a big fancy house, he invites the kids and grand-kids over there all the time.

Maybe he is trying to make it up to them for the horrible things he had done?

I guess what really bothers me is that he took pride in abusing me, then robbed me blind and left me without anything in the end. Yet my own sons do not condone his actions. How does a person come to terms with something like that?

Even though it has been wonderful having him out of my life, it angers me that he still persists trying to afflict damage at every turn. *sigh* I hope you are right, that someday he will just forget all about me and quit screwing with this kid's heads.

[Lucky Jim]

Thanks, Dutched.  You hit the nail on the head with the Medea Complex, which describes to a "T" why my BPDxW has brainwashed our children in order to cause them to become estranged from me.  You have articulated why she is using our kids to carry out her vindictive agenda.

Sorry to hijack, letmeout.

LuckyJim

[Herodias]

That's what having no boundaries does for them... .not sure if it it aimed at you or not. I am sure it is fun for him to throw it right in your face like that. She knows the truth, her ego is making her believe she has the power to "fix" him... .let it be, it is her lesson to learn. At least you will see when it falls apart and can say I told you so... .not that you would ever do that  ; )

[snowwhite]

If no one else is going to say it, I will. There must be something very insecure and warped about your daughter-in-law's mother. Who dates the ex-spouse in that situation? A normal person would have turned down any invitation.  How do you even know she thinks she "fixed" him? Who is handing you this hurtful information?  Is your ex triangulating you and her or you and your son or you and your daughter-in-law?  However he is doing it, the only purpose is to hurt you. Since you cannot fix him, you need to make it clear to everyone else involved that you are not taking abuse, even second hand, passed from him through them.
Do yourself a favor, plan the best vacation you can for yourself.
And talk with your son privately and point out the disfunction in all this. Ask him how he feels about the way you are being treated. Make clear to him and if appropriate, your daughter-in-law, that you ended his abuse toward you when you divorced him. He will not be starting it up again through this back alley manipulation. And the mother-in-law, obviously no friend of yours. Must be junior high silly and selfish to boot. Drop her from your life. The last thing you will need when he finally dumps her is her crying on your shoulder. She can get a dog to hug.

[letmeout]

Excellent response, snowwhite, thank you.  I recently told my son that whatever his crazy dad has convinced him of is nonsense, and I do not care to hear about him again.  My son usually repeats what his father beats into his brain (washing).

I almost feel sorry for her though. My ex is a very hard psycho to get rid of, just look how long it took me to escape. But I am free of it, as to where she is deep in the quicksand now; when the honeymoon phase is over and Dr Jekyll & Mr Hyde makes his full appearance, then she will realize that she is living in hell on earth.