She still won’t let the kids see my mother…

[thankful person]

I’ve discussed this on here before but I’m ashamed to say I’m no further forward.

Lesbian marriage, four young children, dbpdw (in denial) won’t let the kids see my mother under any circumstances, with or without her, in any location etc.

My mother has never done anything wrong. Dbpdw says Mum has never made her feel welcome and she feels uncomfortable in her presence etc and left out. They had a text relationship but Mum has stopped bothering as everything she says gets twisted. Mum has financially supported us in many ways but w says she just “throws money at the problem”.

I can’t just go against my wife’s wishes she would physically stop my Mum coming in and would physically snatch the children from me etc. it wouldn’t be right to go behind her back. Mum is six hours away from us.

I can’t get through to dbpdw in any way. I continue a video call relationship with Mum for the kids. I have told w of my intentions to visit Mum on my own this year, she also knows I wrote Mum a song about how much I value her as my mother.

Last night w was invited on holiday by a friend who had a spare ticket as she split from her boyfriend. It is at reduced price and 11 nights. I may have been wrong in my response which was, “I would really like the kids to see my mother this year. That’s all I’m going to say.” W wants to “respect our partnership” so is now (apparently) not going on the holiday, but is making me feel very guilty about it even though I’m also a bit smug and would like her to go away for a bit. But w is staying firm that my 81 year old mother is not to see the kids under any circumstances. The littlest one is 16 months and Mum has never met him.

I have been meaning to look into whether I have legal rights in the circumstances of w and I being “together” as opposed to if we separated in which case I would be granted rights it doesn’t feel like I currently have. I don’t want to give up the marriage. It is functioning much better these days and bearable and the kids mostly are protected from the bpd not manifesting as badly as it used to. I don’t want us to separate because I want to raise them with her much as it is hard. But I also know that it is so wrong what w is doing here and I’ve told her that. She’ll happily admit her parents have given her no moral guidance throughout life. Her Dad disowned both her sisters and his own mother, I’m surprised he’s still talking to bpdw tbh.

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[Pook075]

I'm sorry that you're still in the exact same place as earlier...I remember us having this conversation over a year ago and I don't have anything additional to add.  I will remind you though that you're a legal parent and have every right to do with the kids as you please.  Her saying, "You can't do that under any circumstances," are just words.  You are choosing to abide by those words to appease her.

She has an 11 day trip opportunity- tell her to go and have fun.  Go visit your mom with the kids during that time.  It's a win-win.

There's two paths here. 

1)  Tell her to take the almost free vacation, and take the kids to see mom without telling her.  Then talk to her about it once she returns.

2)  Tell her the kids are visiting your mom for the week, so she might as well take the almost free vacation.  Now you're fighting before the trip instead of after.

In either situation though, the key is standing your ground and making it very clear that she does not get to dictate some things in life.  If she doesn't want to see your mom, fine.  But you have every right to and so do the kids.  Why let her dictate that kind of rule in the first place?  If anything, it only hurts her mental illness condition since she's emboldened to make more ridiculous demands.

Stand your ground!  This is worth an argument over and potentially a separation.  I know you don't want that, but you should want your opinion heard and respected over something this serious.  If you did separate and got split custody, you'd be with your mom and the kids at least half the time.  Ask your partner if that's what she wants while you sort this out...it may help her to see reason.

[ForeverDad]

You could ponder whether you could make concessions.  You could assure her that you would always be with the children.  For whatever reason - probably dealing with her childhood FOO - she doesn't trust your family.

That is not uncommon.  My then-spouse feared abductors were lurking behind every bush and eventually cast my own elderly parents as abusers even though they too were in their 80's.  It kept getting worse until about a year or two later our marriage failed and then the court - the Real Authority - stepped in and set a schedule (boundary) where her parenting time was hers and my parenting time was mine.

It's an irrational fear but you're unlikely to fully convince her by reason and logic enough to totally set that perception aside.  But perhaps just enough...

[CC43]

Hi there,

I remember your story, and I'm pretty sure I would have replied to you that isolation from family is a red line for me.  I've noticed that pwBPD and BPD traits can try to isolate people from family and friends, in a misguided attempt to control and reclaim attention.  But my opinion is that this is abusive.  Sure, the pwBPD might concoct a narrative in support of isolation, such as describing a family member as toxic, or accusing you of being disloyal.  But you know that's not true.

If I were in your shoes, I'd take the kids to see grandma.  Maybe grandma stays in a hotel nearby, and the kids see her there.  Maybe you organize a long weekend away.  Your wife will probably have a hissy fit, but I'd say, let her have one.  In my opinion, enduring a hissy fit would be worth it to me, because I get to visit with family.

In the meantime, if your wife is passive-aggressive over missing out on the free trip, then let her.  Her choice, her consequences. 

[ForeverDad]

In the historical male/female marriage, both parents are legally equals.  Yet I'm sure many disordered mothers, my ex included, felt "but I'm the one who gave birth!"  Yet I recall what happened in my marriage and separation...

When the police were called they did not attempt very hard to decide what or who was right or wrong.  Their priority was to ensure the dispute was resolved sufficiently for them to consider the incident ended.  (The police can even decide to cart off one or both parents to be sure the incident is over.)  What my police would say during my separation was, "Fix this in court, get a court order if you don't have one or get the court to use the existing court order to resolve the issue."  My court viewed us as equally bickering - and issued decisions accordingly - since it had no interest whether one or both parents had mental health issues.

Since by that time we were already separated and had a court order, the court order specified our parenting schedule.  My ex was no longer The Authority.  Of course, neither of us was expected to "endanger or neglect" the child.

In your marriage it may be that she feels deep down, "But I'm the birth mother!"  Yet that is probably not a legal statement.  (You can research your status with lawyer who are experts in your local jurisdiction.)  Marriage provides both responsibilities and protections.

Likely your local police, if called during a dispute, as well as your local family court would handle incidents similar to how other cases, such as my experience above, occurred.

What we don't know... is how your spouse would react if/when you set a Boundary that your parenting - such as with visits in parks, restaurants, vacations or elsewhere - will not be obstructed.