Having a hard emotional day

[Depression = 72% of members]

Hello everyone,

Just need to post my feelings because what I have learned over the past couple months is I do have feelings and its ok to show them being a man. I have been going through a awakening and it has been a mind blowing road. Reading books going to therapy and seeing people and the world in a whole new light.

I thought I had a "normal childhood" in my standards of what normal was. I have now discovered my behavior and those I allow in my life is due to the unfulfilled of love and time my father spent with me. My mother was a severe co-dependent. I took on that role but never discovered it until my neighbor handed me a book one week after my exBPD left.

I have since read books on the magnetic drawl that a co-dependent and emotional manipulator (BPD, narcissist, antisocial, histrionic)  has depending on the severity of the co-dependent which I guess mine is at the scale end. 

I have allowed many of these personality disorders into my life, looking back now because I am aware I am able to look at myself, my childhood, and my role.

Today has been emotional for me I have not seriously cried in I could not tell you how long. I weep for others but never myself. I am alone and it hurts. I am suppose to meet someone for dinner tonight and I am scared. Not that I want my exBPD back. I just dont know if I am ready to let anyone in. I made myself vulnerable with my ex and I knew that she had BPD and top it all off I work in psych and I allowed her to hurt me deeply. I cry today because I feel alone and upset that I don't feel loved. Even though I am surrounded by others who love me. I dont feel that closeness we all want. I know I deserve better and I'm working on myself. I just needed to vent. Thanks

[Joe77]

Hello everyone,

Just need to post my feelings because what I have learned over the past couple months is I do have feelings and its ok to show them being a man. I have been going through a awakening and it has been a mind blowing road. Reading books going to therapy and seeing people and the world in a whole new light.

I thought I had a "normal childhood" in my standards of what normal was. I have now discovered my behavior and those I allow in my life is due to the unfulfilled of love and time my father spent with me. My mother was a severe co-dependent. I took on that role but never discovered it until my neighbor handed me a book one week after my exBPD left.

I have since read books on the magnetic drawl that a co-dependent and emotional manipulator (BPD, narcissist, antisocial, histrionic)  has depending on the severity of the co-dependent which I guess mine is at the scale end. 

I have allowed many of these personality disorders into my life, looking back now because I am aware I am able to look at myself, my childhood, and my role.

Today has been emotional for me I have not seriously cried in I could not tell you how long. I weep for others but never myself. I am alone and it hurts. I am suppose to meet someone for dinner tonight and I am scared. Not that I want my exBPD back. I just dont know if I am ready to let anyone in. I made myself vulnerable with my ex and I knew that she had BPD and top it all off I work in psych and I allowed her to hurt me deeply. I cry today because I feel alone and upset that I don't feel loved. Even though I am surrounded by others who love me. I dont feel that closeness we all want. I know I deserve better and I'm working on myself. I just needed to vent. Thanks

[Turkish]

Sounds like you've had a break through... .

I cry today because I feel alone and upset that I don't feel loved.

Do you think you deserved to be loved? I'm not talking to what you've done for your family or romantic partners, but at your core (digging deep)  do you think you are deserving of love apart from what you do for others?

[Lucky Jim]

Excellent question, Turkish.  I suspect that, on some core level, many of us Nons accept abuse from our BPD SO because we think that we deserve to be treated poorly, perhaps because of past wounds from our childhood.  LJ

[vanx]

Joe77,

Just wanted to congratulate you on the work you're doing. Take a minute to feel proud of yourself. Many of us supress or hide from our feelings. It's not always easy or pleasant to feel them, but it's how we heal, grow, and connect. You really are not alone--what you wrote really speaks to me. Just take it a day at a time, my friend.

[Joe77]

Thank you for the reply's,

Where to start that is the hardest part. I will answer the question "do I feel I deserved to be loved". Yes, Yes I do. The difference now is I might actually know what love is. So when I say yes, it has a whole new meaning.

Love is not idealizing, jealousy, controlling, texting and calling all day, isolating, threatening suicide, emotional and physical abuse, manipulating, lying and cheating. Love is not keeping your partner emotionally stable while the others emotions suffer and go unfulfilled. Love is not when one person in the relationship decides how the other persons day is going to go. Sorry all those sounds rough but it is what it is from which ever side you are on.

Love is being ok with who we are and allowing others to see our flaws and not being attached to the outcome. Love is living in the present not in the past or future and taking in the moment. Love is when two people accept each other for who they are and have trust. Love is something not just given but received. Love is a big word its a "EMOTION" that we all deserve to have that connects us with someone. 

Our childhood sets the stage for what type of person we are at the core. The hardest thing to realize is why I allow this type of dysfunctional behavior in my life, well the answer is I myself am dysfunctional also. I ask myself do I just enjoy these types of women or is it that I just don't know how to act with someone who isn't dysfunctional.

If you know anything about codependency you know that everything you do is for other people to fulfill your own void for love and acceptance. Where as someone with BPD relies on the emotions from someone else to fill that void for love and acceptance. What a perfect toxic combination. Two very unstable people trying to have a relationship with love and acceptance. One being the giver one being the taker. Its never enough on either side.

So yes I did have a breakthrough I am on a self discovering journey. I find myself reading more then watching tv. I never thought this would happen. The TV literally does not keep my attention anymore. The reading helps my brain focus on other things. Piece of advice though if you go on this journey be careful not to overload your self with too much your anxiety will be through the roof. I feel like I am seeing the world in a whole new light. And yes its scary but you feel alive and in-tuned to whats going on around you. We all deserve love and happiness but first we must love ourselves. Thanks everyone for your support.

[once removed]

I ask myself do I just enjoy these types of women or is it that I just don't know how to act with someone who isn't dysfunctional.

when i was in high school i thought i was the authority on love 

i described it much like you did. my thinking has changed a bit. i think the dichotomy you are outlining has to do with characteristics of healthy relationships vs characteristics of unhealthy relationships. you value the former. good. self awareness, discovering what we want in a healthy relationship is a catalyst for change.

i had my ideals for what characterized a healthy relationship. most of them pretty good. some of them naive, or perhaps not fully informed. for example, i dont believe theres anything inherently wrong with hitting it off with a perspective romantic partner right off the bat, feeling intense closeness. thats good chemistry at least initially. what it is not is the foundation for a healthy relationship. love, trust, intimacy, closeness, all of these things are built slowly and naturally over time. many of us and our partners read that immediate intensity as intimacy. we invested and so did they.

but for the most part i had a pretty good idea of healthy relationships on paper. problem was, like you, i wasnt living that. it was one string of unhealthy relationships after another. the most important place for me to start was where i was contributing to that and leading myself. what about me was drawing me in, and keeping me in, messy relationships. youre doing this now. its going to take you a long way.

you mention that you are dysfunctional and cant relate to someone who is not. elaborating here may help. do you find yourself ruling out, or pushing away people you deem as not dysfunctional? are you intimidated by them? are they intimidated by you?

[Emotions]

Thanks Joe, for your explanation of love... .I needed to be reminded of the soft, as my emotions were beginning to grow hard, or distant, to protect myself from them. I gave all to my ex, and now I stand alone, however I'm not alone if I remind myself what love is. It comes from within, and I will give it to myself and others that cross my path... .peace

[byfaith]

Thanks Joe for sharing,

I thought I had a "normal childhood" in my standards of what normal was. I have now discovered my behavior and those I allow in my life is due to the unfulfilled of love and time my father spent with me. My mother was a severe co-dependent.

I have since read books on the magnetic drawl that a co-dependent and emotional manipulator (BPD, narcissist, antisocial, histrionic)  has depending on the severity of the co-dependent which I guess mine is at the scale end. 

I have allowed many of these personality disorders into my life, looking back now because I am aware I am able to look at myself, my childhood, and my role.

I pretty much had the same type of childhood. Bottom line my divorced parents put me in the middle. I must have developed some type of coping mechanism when I heard or saw my dad beating on my mom ( they divorced when I was 5 years old) I am 53 now. But as a really young kid I had to deal with that. Then I went through dealing going to my dads once every three months and watching him and his 2nd wife fight. I would hear him beating her in the bedroom.

on the other hand I had my mom trashing my dad to me all my life always made to feel guilty from both sides if I was doing things for either side that they thought I shouldn't be doing.
My mom won't let it go even now. She still tells me all I ever did was kiss my dads ass, what she doesn't realize I did the same for her just in a different way.

I was made to feel like a total failure from my mom, when I was a teen and even as an adult. Called a dumb sh!T, stupid, you couldn't do such and such unless I do it for you.
Got basically the same thing from dad.

Glad you are getting enlightened to why you may do the things you do. I am enlightened I have just had a difficult time dealing with it at times. My personality traits have not served me well in the being manipulated department.

[Joe77]

I pretty much had the same type of childhood. Bottom line my divorced parents put me in the middle. I must have developed some type of coping mechanism when I heard or saw my dad beating on my mom

I am not sure how to do this quote function works so hope is displays correctly.

Byfaith,
I can relate to where you are coming from. I too had a similiar situation. My parents got a divorce when I was seven. I remember hearing them yelling as I was sleeping and I went downstairs to see what was going on and then I saw what has effected me all my life.

My father abusing my mother and telling her to get the $%#@ out. My mother was very hurt after the divorce so felt I needed to fix her and be the man of the house which created my codependency. I was to young for this responsibility but my mother was the victim and all I wanted to do was comfort her. I had no idea what I was doing at the time but now I can look back and see it. My father would bad talk my mother and make me guilty like almost wanting me to choose sides. He would take me to bar and close them taking home women when I was 10 and 11 years old. I heard similar abuse as he would fight with women after they consumed alcohol.

I'm sorry you had similar experiences it is traumatizing as a child to see those things. They follow us through our life and are implanted in our fight or flight response system in our brain. Using mindfulness practice teaches us to not go off the impulse of the fight or flight but to take in the information and process it then proceed because we use a totally different part of our brain and then to respond. This process makes us look at the big picture and how to react instead of acting on  faulty set programming.

Have I mastered these techniques, No, but I guess learning and understanding them is the first step and then applying them will slowing become the new norm if we make a conscious effort. We can literally re-train our minds.

I feel when we re-visit these past traumas it helps us understand that it wasn't our fault and we can process them and use them to set healthy boundaries in our lives.
I commend you for sharing such trauma it takes bravery and courage.

[Joe77]

i dont believe theres anything inherently wrong with hitting it off with a perspective romantic partner right off the bat, feeling intense closeness. thats good chemistry at least initially. what it is not is the foundation for a healthy relationship. love, trust, intimacy, closeness, all of these things are built slowly and naturally over time. many of us and our partners read that immediate intensity as intimacy. we invested and so did they.

but for the most part i had a pretty good idea of healthy relationships on paper. problem was, like you, i wasnt living that. it was one string of unhealthy relationships after another. the most important place for me to start was where i was contributing to that and leading myself. what about me was drawing me in, and keeping me in, messy relationships.  

you mention that you are dysfunctional and cant relate to someone who is not. elaborating here may help. do you find yourself ruling out, or pushing away people you deem as not dysfunctional? are you intimidated by them? are they intimidated by you?

once removed,
I can agree with you on there nothing wrong with " hitting it off quickly" because I feel in a healthy relationship this will happen also. Not one built on idealizing when your hardly know the person. I think the degree will be different and as you describe that things will build slowly for a healthy long lasting relationship.

As far as knowing what a healthy relationship is on paper, yes I am learning. Applying is totally different. I think we need to educate ourselves and speak what we want because law of attraction in what we want usually is exactly what we get.

I will speak honestly, these types of relationships are like a drug and they are addicting but they get ugly and the pain is real. It messes us up. I know what addicts me to these relationship but ultimately it turns into my dysfunction causes lots of pain, fear and anxiety.

I have pushed healthy relationships away or even people with BPD. One because maybe the healthy person was too boring and the other BPD person got very needy, abusive and sucking my emotions dry. I think on some level the healthy person does intimidate me and I feel I'm not worthy enough to be with them. I read something the other day that says we tend to choose people with the same maturity level as our own. Maybe I am that child still trying to find my way and my maturity level draws me to someone on that level. It's hard to look and judge ourselves but I feel it's the only way we can set ourselves free and open to new relationships that can be healthy and ever lasting.

[Joe77]

Thanks Joe, for your explanation of love... .I needed to be reminded of the soft, as my emotions were beginning to grow hard, or distant, to protect myself from them. I gave all to my ex, and now I stand alone, however I'm not alone if I remind myself what love is. It comes from within, and I will give it to myself and others that cross my path... .peace

Emotions,
Thanks for your response. I understand where you are coming from as far as feeling to grow hard, or distant, to protect yourself. In my past after these types of relationships I would find myself doing the same thing. Shutting out the world, ignoring my phone and those who called me. I just didnt want any interaction because of fear of rejection and I was high alert to protect my emotions. To be honest I think the biggest thing these relationships do is hurt our ego.

We kick ourselves after questioning ourselves how we allow someone to hurt us or make us look so bad. Two pieces of advice I can give you is one stop kicking yourself it is what it is and yes the pain is real. But if we didn't feel the pain we would be self centered and on the other side of the spectrum. I personally am glad I love others and have empathy. Its a gift.

Secondly, love is contagious. If you give it to everyone you will receive it back. I'm talking the cashier at the grocery store, the couple you hold the door for at the restaurant. The co-worker who you can't stand. It changes the way we feel also. It's therapy for ourselves because when we give it, it makes us feel good and changes our mood allowing us to lead a more positive life. Thank you for your kind words.

[Lucky Jim]

If you know anything about codependency you know that everything you do is for other people to fulfill your own void for love and acceptance. Where as someone with BPD relies on the emotions from someone else to fill that void for love and acceptance. What a perfect toxic combination. Two very unstable people trying to have a relationship with love and acceptance. One being the giver one being the taker. Its never enough on either side.

Hey Joe, Right, it's a perfect storm when a Non w/codependent traits links up with a pwBPD.  It's a powerful combination that feels wonderful at first, but destruction follows in the wake of a BPD tidal wave.  Now I don't miss the rough water.

byfaith, I'm sorry to hear what you went through in childhood.  These past traumas make us particularly susceptible to a BPD r/s, I suspect.  I was easily manipulated by my BPDxW.  I allowed the abuse and was a doormat for her turbulent emotions.  No more.  I care too much about myself to put up with abuse these days.

Great discussion!
LuckyJim

[once removed]

I read something the other day that says we tend to choose people with the same maturity level as our own.

specifically, according to bowens family systems theory, we choose people with the same emotional maturity as our own. this can get confusing and didnt make sense to me at first because, for example, i didnt have the same problems with impulse control or emotional regulation that my ex did. emotional maturity doesnt mean we are the same in every way as the other person or that our struggles necessarily manifest in the same ways. emotional maturity is about our level of differentiation. how do we define our level of differentiation? see more here: https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=279626.0

the good news is that we can raise our level of differentiation (emotional maturity) and go on to healthier relationships.

I have pushed healthy relationships away or even people with BPD. One because maybe the healthy person was too boring and the other BPD person got very needy, abusive and sucking my emotions dry. I think on some level the healthy person does intimidate me and I feel I'm not worthy enough to be with them.

i can relate Joe77. what i learned during my recovery is that this sort of dynamic tends to manifest out of an unconscious fear of intimacy. this wasnt intuitive for me either, because consciously i craved real intimacy. yet in many ways, i was blocking myself from it... .unconsciously i was also mistaking intensity for intimacy. often times, people with this unconscious fear of intimacy crave it the most.

does this ring any bells? low self esteem could be a factor too. where do those feelings of unworthiness of a healthy partner come from, do you know?