I've met him today and could use advice about how to go on

[FaithfulInLove]

Hello BPD-Family

I just have to share these news with you... .

I kind of got my happy ending today... .(if l can trust his words) cause he said we will stay friends - after all that happened and how he hated me after the time l took away.

I have just met my ex today for the first time since January. He's in a new relationship for a month now and l just found out he moved in with her already (that was not possible with me because l live in another country, but had been planned for the future).

I made his dream come true today by getting him a Meet and Greet ticket, that favour was his reason for seeing me again. It meant so much to him that he started talking to me again.

He didn't just grab the ticket and left but let me come along and spend some time with him, being super polite but also really distant.
I tried to look happy and confident around him - l was indeed happy to see him, still had to drop a few tears, especially because l felt reliefed that he was actually talking to me... .but also of the fear that this was the last time we have met and because things seem to go so well with that new girl... .

I asked if we could ever see each other again and he said yes, but I'm not sure if he isn't just trying to be polite and thankful because l really made an effort for him today.

I guess there was a lot of pulling from my side the past days, with apologising and doing things for him... .and today as l just had to hug him a few times... .
My question actually is: is there a way of communication l should follow that could help him getting more comfortable around me again? That person means the world to me still and although we're talking again, I'm scared I'll lose him.

I just wanna be sure that he stays my friend. Even if l can't win him back, l never wanna see him leave. He's important to me.
I'm both, really happy and really sad at the moment. Scared of being happy cause l don't know if he's lying and doesn't plan to ever see me again... .

And maybe you have some advice about handling the following days? I actually can't stop crying since he is out of sight

[PLEASE - NO RUN MESSAGES]

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[pearlsw]

Hi FaithfulInLove,

While I can definitely relate to wanting to stay friends with an ex…I must say for me it happened because of the length of quality of the friendships I had with the person. So, I want to ask a couple of things. Are you able to be “just friends” with him? Because it sounds like at least a part of you wants to win him back and that is a recipe for pain.

And how long were you involved with him? I actually stayed pretty friendly, and later even was a roommate of someone whom I dated for only about a month. But that was possible because I was never in love with him. He was attractive, sure, and a very supportive friend in the years to come, but it just never got super deep.

I don’t know. I wanna say that unless you are also dating again…being such good friends with him…especially if it is making you cry... .I don’t know. Are you dating anyone else? It is really important to protect your heart!

compassionately, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

Those were 2 beautiful years of having him really close, one of them in a relationship... we stayed really close until that new girl came, but all the time l was still hoping and fighting for his love and trust. That's something l know l gotta stop with now... .

I am sure l want him as my friend and in my life, l just see him being really distant. Our friendship was a promise - I'm happy we're talking again, but l don't see that friendship in his actions and that's what hurts me...

His family doesn't know that we've been seeing each other and he asked me several times to not tell them or share it on Facebook... .maybe that's a reason why he's distant, because he has been lying to them and doesn't know how to tell them that everything's okay between us now?
All l know is that he's not following me on social media - most likely so they don't see it?
He seemed really scared of getting in trouble at home and l understand it when he lives with her now as he doesn't have enough money for an own place in case things go wrong... .that must be much pressure on him...

I'm kind of "dating" someone at the moment, but it's nothing official because l don't have feelings for him. He's looking for something serious what l just can't give at the moment... .So he's seeing other women...

[pearlsw]

His family doesn't know that we've been seeing each other and he asked me several times to not tell them or share it on Facebook... .maybe that's a reason why he's distant, because he has been lying to them and doesn't know how to tell them that everything's okay between us now?
All l know is that he's not following me on social media - most likely so they don't see it?
He seemed really scared of getting in trouble at home and l understand it when he lives with her now as he doesn't have enough money for an own place in case things go wrong... .that must be much pressure on him...

I'm kind of "dating" someone at the moment, but it's nothing official because l don't have feelings for him. He's looking for something serious what l just can't give at the moment... .So he's seeing other women...

Hi FaithfulInLove,

Can you elaborate on this a bit, or point me to an older post if you've already discussed this, but why he is hiding his friendship with you from his family? Did his family have issues with you?  Also, it is important to really ask yourself, what kind of role will this friendship play in your life? May I also ask what is causing you to not feel ready to date? So you are "hanging out" with someone, but you haven't elevated to calling it dating yet?

May I ask a really big question here... .what do you want out of life? In terms of relationships I mean, but any answer is okay! I ask this because it is really important, in my opinion, to get a sense of this - both short term and long term. If you could have what you wanted in life what would it be?

warmly, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

I can only suppose his reasons myself:
I've always been on really good terms with his family and stayed in touch after the break up.
What I'm supposing is that he has told them and his girlfriend that we're not talking anymore when he's been angry with me and that we won't spend these holidays together - which has been the truth. I guess he doesn't know how to tell them now (especially his girlfriend) that things have changed? Maybe he made me look like a bad person (maybe he was even lying and said l did not wanna see him?) and doesn't know how to say we're friends again without things looking wrong to them after all he has said before... .

This friendship would mean a lot to me because he has always been like a best friend to me, listening, giving support. I care about him. I want to know if he's alright. I think you don't need to be in a relationship to keep some of the good things it has brought into your life.

I'm 24 and really still don't really know what l want.
Before he came l was happy on my own, didn't want a partner or children. I enjoyed being alone and living on my own. He has changed this a lot, with him l could think of living together and having children.
I have problems letting anyone else close.

The man I'm seeing lives near me, has a lot to offer and is really sweet to me. He knows about the whole story, takes care of me on bad days. Still l am the one who feels it won't work out with him or anyone else so soon. I'd still go for my ex who lives miles away, treats me badly and has nothing to offer.
I feel like jumping in a relationship with someone else wouldn't be fair to a new partner. Love has no logic, has it? My heart is still his

Thank you

[FaithfulInLove]

Update:

On Tuesday night l wished him much fun at the event he's been at. He didn't reply that night and also didn't reply at all yesterday, although he's been online a lot and he had much time while travelling back home... .it made me think he doesn't wanna talk to me and that he won't answer me as l did not ask a question. But today l surprisingly got a polite answer, saying he had fun and thank you.

I gave him 6 hours of space, then replied with a video from a special moment of his weekend that I've promised to share with him.

He is someone who quickly feels ignored and abandoned, that's why l fear being more distant and giving him more space as he knows I'm on that app daily and l guess he could see it as a punishment from my side when I'm taking days to answer him myself. I don't wanna look petty, l wanna make him feel that it's okay that he's taking the space he needs to build up new trust.

It has always been an unwritten rule in our relationship that we answer each other fast as possible and that we even reply if no question was asked. Same in the months after our break up. Taking space and not answering has been his reason to fall out with me in March.

His communication with me since we're back to talking is really polite but also really distant. Barely any questions from his side and taking so much time to answer.

Can someone give me an opinion? Am l handling this well? I want this friendship to work out and l want the chance of getting him back if things don't work out with that girl. Is there anything l could do better?

[pearlsw]

Hi FaithfulInLove,

Take it from someone who started dating in the 80’s and is still alive to talk about it…

You aren’t trying to be his friend…You are hanging on the edges trying to get him back.

My suggestion is if the guy you are hanging out with isn’t that appealing, move on. And if the guy you are most interested in has a girlfriend, move on.

If you don’t know what you want, then let’s sit down here and write out a list. What are you looking for in a partner at this time? What do you want? What makes you happy?

wishing you the best, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

Thank you

Yes, of course l want him back, that's why I'm posting on this board. As long as l can't be with him I'd still love to have him in my life more.
I wanna talk to him, l wanna feel that it's all good between us because that person means so damn much. l appreciate him so much.

Who could make me happy is someone who shares my hobbys and interests, someone with a great humour l can laugh with all day long, someone l can identify with, someone who understands me.
I don't believe there's someone out there who l can love like him. He's literally been the male version of myself.

I suffer anxieties and since things broke down between us l'm stuck in a heavy depressive phase. His messages popping up make me happy, but that's it. Things that once fulfilled me just don't do it anymore.

I'm in therapy to handle my personal issues and I'm in this forum to learn handling my BPDex. Moving on is just not an option for me because he's too important and my life makes no sense without him in it

[Radcliff]

FaithfulInLove, thanks for so clearly explaining where you are with all of this.  That bond that you feel with him sounds special.  You're on this board, so we honor your feelings on that.  One "big idea" for us here is that we control our actions, not anyone else's.  We can help you increase the chances of staying in touch with him, but he's the other half of this.  You seem pretty thoughtful about these things, so I imagine you may already appreciate that.  One liability of staying connected as friends when you are hoping for more is that the actions of someone else who you don't control will impact your happiness day to day, as you are already describing.  You've made your decision for where you want to be, and that is where you should be now.  Just notice that vulnerability that you're accepting, and keep an eye on it to see if your feelings evolve.

I'm happy to hear that you are in therapy for your own growth.  You're at a stage in life where an investment in yourself has massive payoffs -- decades down the road.  I also started dating in the 80's  and wish that I had the wisdom that you have demonstrated to look at personal background and growth in therapy before making big life decisions that often come in the 20's and early 30's.

As for staying in touch, the big idea is to not be the pursuer.  If he takes 24 hours to get back to you, you take 25 hours to get back to him.  Not enough to feel like punishment to him, and close enough to his response time that there's rough equality.  You're matching his pace, with a small margin to make sure it doesn't feel to either of you like you're pursuing him.  This can be a scary thing to do, but it works amazingly well.  Check out this thread of a member in a similar situation:
https://bpdfamily.com/message_board/index.php?topic=324264.0

WW

[FaithfulInLove]

Thank you so much, Wentworth

What I think about him is that he has lost his trust in me long ago and again when I asked him for space, because I wasn't there. I feel like he doesn't really want this friendship because he doesn't feel safe with me. But I see the good person he is under all his BPD pain and trust issues. He has seen what a big favour I've been ready to do for him, I think that's why he kept replying the past days although he might feel bad because of keeping this a secret from his girlfriend. I don't know how to keep that communication open... .I'm scared of seeing him slowly slipping away

Again, he didn't reply yet to the video I sent him yesterday, although it must be something he must be really happy about (it was him meeting his stars), nothing pressuring at all, but he just doesn't react... .It scares me so!

Wentworth, I'm following the thread you've shared with me for a while already and those tips are worth so much.

I really wanna react the best way possible. I wanna see him again one day, it is so hard, knowing there is a possibility that this will never happen again as he lives in another country. If we don't get to talking more, if I don't get the chance to win back his trust, I've lost my chance and that is my biggest fear. I just don't want to live my life without that special person in it.
I try to work on myself but to be honest, I'm feeling quite desperate, because without him seeing that I become a stronger person, it doesn't really make sense to me at all.
I found my soulmate in him. There's nothing more scary than watching him distancing himself more and more.

He has promised me to tell his family about us being friends, I just don't really believe he will do that soon.
Also he promised to pay me back the money I lent him this week within the next few months. That is kind of a promise of staying in touch with me for a while but also a thing I'd be afraid to remind him of as I know he has so little money, it might stress him out... So if he stayed no contact for a while this wouldn't be a thing I'd like to ask him for, although it would be a good reason.

All I want is giving him good feelings, being someone he can talk to no matter what after he really got a lot of drama from me in the past months... .

I see it makes sense to stay distant, but sometimes I need someone to remind me that this will help me achieving my goals.
Thanks to this forum

I'm happy about your feedback and support. I don't really have people I can talk to about all this, cause all I get to hear is "You gotta Forget him" and that's just not an option for me.

Thank you for being there

[pearlsw]

Thank you

Yes, of course l want him back, that's why I'm posting on this board. As long as l can't be with him I'd still love to have him in my life more.
I wanna talk to him, l wanna feel that it's all good between us because that person means so damn much. l appreciate him so much.

Who could make me happy is someone who shares my hobbys and interests, someone with a great humour l can laugh with all day long, someone l can identify with, someone who understands me.
I don't believe there's someone out there who l can love like him. He's literally been the male version of myself.

I suffer anxieties and since things broke down between us l'm stuck in a heavy depressive phase. His messages popping up make me happy, but that's it. Things that once fulfilled me just don't do it anymore.

I'm in therapy to handle my personal issues and I'm in this forum to learn handling my BPDex. Moving on is just not an option for me because he's too important and my life makes no sense without him in it

Hi FaithfulInLove,

Again, I understand being friends with ex's. I do - that's what pulled me to your post. I almost always stayed friends with all of them. But this was possible because we were not in love and trying to get each other back. We had been good friends and so the supportive/friendship/family part could carry on. I know I could pick up the phone or drop an email to any of them and get support and understanding today if I wanted to. And I know they all have new partners, as do I.

But I want to draw a distinction between friendship and what you are seeking and just put some attention on that. I encourage you to do as you please in life, but I think it is important to be mindful of one's intentions and the pitfalls of one's practices. It is okay to be friends, but if by doing so you put his new relationship in jeopardy, not so good. Ya know? It is okay to think highly of him, but if you think of him as the "it" guy of your life you are putting a lot of energy into this wanting something that is for now... .not  a possibility. I just wanted to circle back around to that.

I met a great guy once and he broke up with me very suddenly. I don't believe in the concept of "soulmates" but he sure seemed pretty great at the time and is someone I thought I might spend my life with. He suggested it many times.

He was the first BPD traits guy I met and I knew something was "off" but not what. This was a loong time ago before this site probably existed! So little information to go on! Just a lot of pain and confusion for me! I tried to stay friends with him like I am used to, but he couldn't do it. He needed me gone.

When I did try to get back to talking to him it was pretty humiliating and awful. Many years later I am not sad anymore that we did not stay friends. (It took me 3 years to completely get over this year long relationship. Ouch. So I respect that you are on your own journey with this and it will take time.) He's not built like that and it wouldn't have worked - a friendship. Why? Many reasons, but a main one was because I was still in love with him when it ended. I wanted him back. I wrote him gigantic letters to woo him back, to figure out what went wrong, to get answers, to no avail. I don't even want to think about how cold and different he was after it was over, but I saw him a few times. And you know what was the best thing after this sudden loss? Meeting another cool guy and having fun with him and starting a new relationship. Later when myself and this guy also broke up we were able to remain friends. Thank goodness. But meeting this new person in the first place helped very much in putting this painful episode behind me.

So again, mujer, do what you gotta do, it's gonna take time, but the odds are not in your favor here I'm gonna tell ya woman to woman. If you want to navigate being friends with him fine, we can try to help with that, but I don't think I can, at least, encourage you to do something that seems so on the face of it very painful for you and potentially not right for him. Ya know? Or not do it without at least laying this out here.

I think it is really important to bring the focus back to you and why you want to put so much energy into this "friendship" with a guy who has a girlfriend who might want his energies directed towards her rather than you. Ya know? If you were the new girlfriend how might it feel to have an old girlfriend trying to be this close with him and so hung up on him and interested in more than friendship? How would that feel if you put yourself into her shoes? How many months will you keep trying to win him back while his relationship with her is getting off the ground? And is your role to be a friend or to be standing there hoping his relationship with the person that might be the love of his life fails? Is that what a friend does? Do you want to be his confidante about his new relationship problems? How's that gonna work if you still are so into him? How might it feel to be in his shoes and wanting to move on, but you are still there hoping to get him back? Just some things to consider, if you are up for it. And if not that is okay too. Be where you are about this. I just strongly encourage you to love yourself enough to give yourself the best possible version of your own life.

What is this big favor you are using to keep him connected to/interested in you?

And if he lives in another country what are the odds this will have a chance for being more than friendship? Again, it's okay to be friends, I really mean that, but then the focus in my estimation is how can you truly develop yourself into being a neutral friend for him and not be on the edges of his relationship waiting for it to fail? 

How did you break the trust? Why did you ask him for space?

wishing you peace and happiness, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

Thank you!
A lot of this has already been said in my other threads, but to answer your questions, pearl, and help you helping me, let me sum it up:

Losing his trust in the first place
There was a thing we fought about for months: l made plans for myself on a day that was special and that he wanted to spend with me. I tried to make compromises, him coming along with me, paying for him, but he was not ready for any kind of compromise, has seen it as a prove that he's not the most important thing for me and broke up as soon as he was sure I gonna stick to my plans.
Before the break up we had big plans, he was ready to move over to me, we wanted to marry and so l do think we would have a realistic future. He has initiated a big engagement party with his family, has been really serious about all this.

I didn't know a lot about BPD back then, couldn't understand that I've really been hurting him with my behavior, have been so invalidating. Everything else has been perfect between us, that one thing just made us drift apart and him losing his trust in me.
No begging and pleading and no apology has helped of course because l didn't understand - l became really pushy and needy after the break up although he told me l should stop the pressure, that must've pushed him away so far!

New Relationship
You can call me a bad person, selfish or disrespectful, but although l care about him and his well-being a lot, l don't care about his new relationship.
Last time she has left him after a week and he has told me that he never loved her. Actually l think he's using her for the sake of getting away from home where he had to share a room with his younger brother and one bathroom with 5 other family members... .He doesn't have the money for his own place and l also think he'd struggle living on his own as he's used to living with his parents who clean and cook and care.

She left him and only a week later he's been back to saying l love you to me - that's why l can't take all this seriously. I think if he could sort out his trust issues, he could be the happiest man with me as we are so alike, always laugh so much together and because l really am motivated to learn everything about his illness to understand him more, using the tools, make things better, handle his emotions better and support him in getting help.
I do believe that I'm the most understanding person he could have around, l believe that I'm able to give a lot to him and I'm afraid he'll end up hurting badly for trusting the wrong and understanding people. His family, which l love a lot, just doesn't take his pain serious. I don't know about that girl - but she once left him for being "too sensitive" - that makes me think she won't be able to handle him in a way that's good for him... .

Why I've been asking for space
I have asked him for space when he told me that he's having a date, for me to let go a bit and start healing. I also didn't wanna overreact as our plan was meeting soon and seeing if we still have a chance and l was so immensely hurt when l heard he wanted to meet other people before meeting me... .Then l really took the space I've been asking for and that "ignoring" when he "need me" was the reason why he split me black and went no contact himself - although a day before he kind of told me he's still having feelings for me.

Why l won't let go
I miss him as my boyfriend but l also miss him as my best friend. When our relationship isn't savable, of course l wanna keep that friendship! It's a special thing for me! I wanna be able to plan fun stuff together because that person just is important to me. I never fell apart with an ex. Whoever once meant something to me, will be cared about forever. That's who l am, someone who doesn't wanna let go because l care, love and miss too much. And I'm serious about a friendship with him. I'd even love to come to their wedding in case that happend one day, just to see him again and wish him well.

The favour
The favour was getting him a meet and greet, getting up at 4am and waiting in the cold for him and helping him getting there on time to prove I'm serious about our friendship. He has seen it now and l reached my goal of being on speaking terms again - which is a bit depressing as he's not making an effort at all at the moment which l understand because sure l am able to put myself into his shoes, but I'm also expecting him to keep promises and our friendship was a big one.


As l said, my life is not on hold - I'm seeing someone else too, although it's nothing official. I just don't want a relationship less intense than my last one and just wanna be there to save that special one if there's a little chance left.
I'd also rather learn being happy on my own than replacing him by someone l don't feel so much love for. I didn't even want to be in a relationship before l met him, so getting back to that place would be ideal, enjoying myself again.

[Radcliff]

FaithfulInLove,

Thanks for continuing to share your thoughts with us!  You mentioned that you lost his trust when a special day did not go as he was hoping.  It sounds like that day was very important to you.  Can you tell us a little more about it?

WW

[FaithfulInLove]

And thank you for listening, Wentworth!

I'm always careful with sharing too much about our breakup story as it makes me recognisable in case he or his family ever finds this site. And l don't know if it helps us any further in this whole story. He hasn't replied yet, was all silent the whole Friday... .

To the trust breaking:
He got to know me as someone obsessing over a band and instead of spending our anniversary with him, l went to see them.  That was a heavy thing for him as that band was always something he's been jealous of although he likes them too and we wouldn't even know each other without them.
They have been my life before he came and l wanted to keep them in my life. We fought so much about that cause whenever l took time for fan activities he felt unimportant. And I still feel bad about being so stubborn that day... .l should've seen HOW much it really hurts him. I just felt controlled by him, offered compromises but still went there when he didn't accept them.

[pearlsw]

Thank you

I'm in therapy to handle my personal issues.

Hi again FaithfulInLove, 

What is your therapist advising about this so far, as things are developing in this transition?

take care, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

At the moment it's all about processing what my ex did to me, also finding distraction, reducing time of staring at my phone and waiting for his replies and getting back to myself and old hobbys.
I feel like therapy won't really work for me until I found a way to solve that one main issue that distracts me from my own life so much.

Actually I'm still spending most of my time just thinking about what l can do to make him feel more comfortable around me. I'm scared of making mistakes.
He is having a completely new life now for a month - and I'm here on my own with a giant hole in mine. I feel like I'm losing him more every day that we're not talking. I'm scared of texting him - it could annoy him - and I'm scared of not texting him - he could get used to his life without me and forget me, never talk to me again.
The main questions in my head are IF I should text him, WHEN I should text him and WHAT l should text him to make things better while l know l should put myself first.
I feel like l can't just do this until things are really okay between us again. Things don't feel okay when he's talking to me that little and when l feel like l can't reach out for his or offer him my support anytime.

[FaithfulInLove]

I guess you understand how much anxiety the past silent days have caused inside of me. I didn't think he'd get back to me anymore as he got from me what he wanted. As I haven't been asking anything that would've been a chance for him to stop communication, thought from now on he'd just try to be loyal to his girl.

This morning I thought it wouldn't be too risky to reach out to him for a reason, after being patient for two days, watching him openly interact with others but not getting back to my nice move of sending him a video of him meeting his faves.
So, I asked him nicely if he could send me something he had promised when we met - and he took some time because he was working, I guess, but then replied me, saying he "was about to message me".

Then he shared some of his lyrics with me. Since I got to know him he's writing songs and he always loved hearing my opinion on them, because I'm into music and singing.
I actually can't believe he's not just answering in a short manner but sharing stuff with me after how little he's been communicating with me the past days. But I also see the danger of being used again... .

I think I'll take a few hours and give him some nice feedback then. I always love reading his lyrics and actually I'm really touched he's trusting me enough to share them with me.

Any thoughts on the situation? The silent days scared me a bit, but I see this as a good sign of him actually appreciating being in touch in some way.

[Radcliff]

Yes, it's clear how much anxiety the past few days have caused you.  I'm sorry for all the difficult feelings you are having.  These kinds of situations can make us beyond miserable!

Thanks for the detail on the time when you "lost his trust."  Situations like this are common in a relationship with a pwBPD.  He felt very wounded and took it very personally.  He made you feel guilty, and laid all the blame on you.  Did you make efforts with him to figure out a compromise?  To do something like honoring your anniversary on a different day?  You did say that you invited him to go.  In a relationship with a pwBPD, it can be very difficult or impossible to work out win-win compromises in situations like this. 

Events like that happen on a big or a small scale all the time in a relationship with a pwBPD.  Things blow up, they blame us, and we rush to make amends doing anything we can to get them to feel better.  They learn that when they feel bad, they can blow up at us, and they will feel better.  The result is that they keep blowing up at us.  There are tools we can learn to reduce this cycling, but we can't fix it completely, and it requires immense strength and confidence from us.

Take a look at this page on what it takes to be in a relationship with a pwBPD.  We have to become the emotional caretakers of our pwBPD.  This is a risky endeavor, especially if we are on shaky emotional ground ourselves.  We are here to support you whatever you do.  This is your life, and you're making all the choices.  But oldsters like us, who have years and years of experience in these kinds of relationships, want to make sure you have eyes wide open and can benefit from our wisdom and pain, successes and failures.

Near term, let's see if we can help with that anxiety.  I find that my anxiety peaks when I need or want my pwBPD to do something.  When I am dependent on something I can't control, my anxiety can go off the charts.  When I feel that anxiety I try to think of what choice or choices I could make that would put me in a good place regardless of what my pwBPD does or doesn't do.  Can you think of an example of a time when your anxiety is high, and what you might be able to do to take control of the situation?

WW

[pearlsw]

At the moment it's all about processing what my ex did to me, also finding distraction, reducing time of staring at my phone and waiting for his replies and getting back to myself and old hobbys.
I feel like therapy won't really work for me until I found a way to solve that one main issue that distracts me from my own life so much.

Actually I'm still spending most of my time just thinking about what l can do to make him feel more comfortable around me. I'm scared of making mistakes.
He is having a completely new life now for a month - and I'm here on my own with a giant hole in mine. I feel like I'm losing him more every day that we're not talking. I'm scared of texting him - it could annoy him - and I'm scared of not texting him - he could get used to his life without me and forget me, never talk to me again.
The main questions in my head are IF I should text him, WHEN I should text him and WHAT l should text him to make things better while l know l should put myself first.
I feel like l can't just do this until things are really okay between us again. Things don't feel okay when he's talking to me that little and when l feel like l can't reach out for his or offer him my support anytime.

I'm going to have to echo your therapist here and suggest you may be obsessing on this to the point of it being unhealthy for you.

I really believe the focus needs to be on you and working on yourself and not primarily on how to get this person back. It is natural to do some of that, but if you take a look out ahead... .how long might you want to keep that up?

What do you think the most healthy thing you could do now is? How can you get yourself to a healthy place, especially if he wants a smaller role in your life?

So you want to lure him back with favors and presents, but it makes you feel used? Is there a better approach then?

take care, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

Yes, l tried to find another date to celebrate that special day, offered compromises. The whole situation was really complicated, he has been unbelievably hurt and so was l and both of us have been really stubborn, l guess.
But that's in the past - all l can do now is trying to understand this issue further - and l think l do understand his side much better now that l know more about BPD - and do better if in the future such a situation occured ever again.

I must say my own life is a mess since the break up - I honestly did nothing but crying for a few months, especially before therapy started.

I live in a city where l barely know anyone and suffer social anxieties which makes it difficult for me getting close to new people while people here really seem to like me and make an effort getting to know me - like the man l told you about, he really loves me and always wants to spend time.

I don't really know how to handle my anxieties. I often call old friends to talk or keep myself busy learning more about the tools, reading about BPD or l think about my next steps, what l could talk about when he's reaching out without setting him under pressure - it's all about him actually and l realise myself that this is addictive behaviour.

The thing is l don't want to imagine a life without him in it. It doesn't make sense to me - I've been happy before he came, but meanwhile l've kind of lost everything that was important to me.

I don't wanna make any more mistakes, he is that important.
I'm young and l see all the chances l have out there - but the truth is that I'm not enjoying anything anymore. I'm dragging myself out a lot compared to a few months ago, however I'm not feeling happy. He's missing.

So actually I'm ready to go on like this forever, cause nothing else makes sense to me. Sounds desperate, but that's how I'm feeling. It's 9 months since the break up and l can't find another source of happiness.

I'm not really feeling used at the moment as he kept his promise of staying in touch so far, although he isn't really doing a lot. Just what l don't want to happen is him getting the best of both worlds - from his girl who gives him a place to live and from me who has a lot to offer as well.
I want him to have a reason to come back actually, and when I'm putting him on that pedestal, giving him all he wants without asking for anything in return, why should he want to change this? But when l stop giving, why should he want to keep me in his life?

Thanks, you two, for still reading this, asking questions and caring, sharing links with me - it means a lot!

[pearlsw]

So actually I'm ready to go on like this forever, cause nothing else makes sense to me. Sounds desperate, but that's how I'm feeling. It's 9 months since the break up and l can't find another source of happiness.

Hi FaithfulInLove,

Sorry for your pain and anxiety. It is very painful to make such kinds of relationship transitions! I want you to feel supported with your breakup and hopes of establishing a friendship. I would encourage it only if it can be healthy for both of you though. Obsessing over an ex far after a breakup, and to the point where you’d call it an addiction and say what you said above, isn’t healthy and is a topic we need to keep open here.

Okay, so I’m getting the timeline better now! You broke up 9 months ago. It was about a 2 year relationship. He’s started seeing someone within the last month or so and now lives with her - you assume for financial reasons. You are seeing someone too, but not that into the guy. You want your ex to honor some commitments to maintaining a friendship. You are trying to get him interested in more than a friendship with you. How much actual contact has there been in these 9 months? Has ever given any indication whatsoever of wanting to get back with you?

Have you had a chance to read any of this information from the Detaching Board? Understand Your Situation]

I’ve pasted a section below. Does any of this speak to you? I see you are here on Bettering, but I think there is also some valuable insight for you on the Detaching board as well.

What do you think of #1 & #3?

10 Beliefs that can you get stuck

pdf with full text

1) Belief that this person holds the key to your happiness

We often believe that our BPD partner is the master of our joy and the keeper of our sorrow. You may feel that they have touched the very depths of your soul. As hard as this is to believe right now, your perspective on this is likely a bit off. Read more

2) Belief that your BPD partner feels the same way that you feel

If you believe that your BPD partner was experiencing the relationship in the same way that you were or that they are feeling the same way you do right now, don’t count on it. This will only serve to confuse you and make it harder to understand what is really happening. Read more

3) Belief that the relationship problems are caused by you or some circumstance

You concede that there are problems, and have pledged to do your part to resolve them. Because there have been periods of extreme openness, honesty, humanity and thoughtfulness during the relationship, and even during the break-ups, your BPD partners concerns are very credible in your eyes. But your BPD partner also has the rather unique ability to distort facts... .Read more

4) Belief that love can prevail

Once these relationships seriously rupture, they are harder to repair than most – so many wounds from the past have been opened. Of course you have much invested in the relationship and your partner has been an integral part of your dreams and hopes - but there are greater forces at play now.  For you, significant emotional wounds have been inflicted upon an already wounded soul... .Read more

5) Belief that things will return to "the way they used to be"

The idealization stages of a relationship with a BPD partner can be intoxicating and wonderful. But, as in any relationship, the "honeymoon" stage passes.

BPD mood swings and cycles may have you conditioned to think that, even after a bad period, you can return to the "idealization". Your BPD partner may believe this too... .Read more

6) Clinging to the words that were said

We often cling to the positive words and promises that were voiced and ignore or minimalize the negative actions.  “But she said she would love me forever”

Many wonderful and expressive things may have been said during the course of the relationship... .Read more

7) Belief that if you say it louder you will be heard

We often feel if we explain our point better, put it in writing, or find the right words... .

People with BPD hear and read very well. But when emotions are flared, the ability to understand diminishes greatly. This implies... .Read more

8) Belief that absence makes the heart grow fonder

We often think that by holding back or depriving our BPD partner of “our love” – that they will “see the light”. We base this on all the times our partner expressed a fear that we would leave and how they needed us. During an actual breakup it is different. Distancing triggers all kinds of abandonment... .Read more

9) Belief that you need to stay to help them

You might want to stay to help your partner. Possibly to disclose to them that they have borderline personality disorder and help them get into therapy. Maybe you want to help in other ways while still maintaining a “friendship”.  The fact is, you are no longer in a position to be the caretaker and support person for your BPD partner – no matter how well intentioned.  Understand that you have become the trigger for your BPD partner’s bad feelings and bad behavior... .Read more

10) Belief that they have seen the light

Your partner may suddenly be on their best behavior or appearing very needy and trying to entice you back into the relationship. You, hoping that they are finally seeing things your way or really needing you, may venture back in – or you may struggle mightily to stay away... .Read more


What do you think?

take care, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

Hey pearl!

It was a one year relationship and 9 months afterwards of us (mostly me) trying to fix what we've lost.

The seven months after our break up we were still talking every single day - apart from the week in January when he suddenly was with her which really upset me as I really believed in us. We had made plans of meeting up, talking and fixing things for only a week later - which he cancelled then because he had her. When she left him, he still met me for a day and treated me like his girlfriend in these hours, although he didn't trust me enough to call this a relationship again.

Actually my hopes were kept up all the time - he never said that he didn't love me anymore. We wanted to work things out together and built up new trust, he agreed on that although he seemed unsure all the time. That was my mean goal over all this time and detaching from something important like that is truly difficult for me - I don't want it, as you see.

Winning back trust is really difficult when you're long distance. We wanted to find out if we have a chance on the holidays we had planned for this month - which you know didn't really happen because now he's back with her.

Even recently, in March when he set up his date, he still said he had feelings for me but that things are "difficult" for him and I "don't understand".

I do know the information from the detaching board and I read a lot about BPD in general. I think I really am clear about where I'm standing and what happened to me and caused such an addiction. Still I'm not ready to give up because that person really does mean a lot to me. I am serious about that friendship and about everything that could develop from there.

I see that I need to become stronger myself to keep the contact we're having healthy. I also think I can't really find the motivation of working on myself as long as the contact between us is that unstable. I can't really do it for myself, I don't matter enough to myself and he's kind of my inducement to keep going at all.

[pearlsw]

Hi FaithfulInLove,

I definitely hear that you don’t want to detach and the reasons you express for that. It’s hard not to be concerned that you seem so attached to this person. I get being in love and really hoping something would work out with a very special person, but when we think one person is the only option in life and our only happiness rests with them, and when we are willing to spend our whole life chasing that person for any shred of contact, then there are other issues to stop and examine.

I’m just trying to get a handle on the state of the relationship. There’s different ways to approach different situations. For example, if this is entirely one-sided (on your part) that’s one thing, if he’s keeping you in a bit of a limbo place that’s another. Do you feel he is keeping you hooked on a bit? Or is, what exists of a relationship, mostly just you and your efforts?

What do you think he wants out of a friendship with you? Do you get the feeling he might want to rekindle things with you? Or keep you as a fall back option if it doesn’t work out with the other girl? Have you had any physical intimacy since the breakup may I ask? Do you have any idea how he thinks for feels about you or is it all pretty confusing?

sincerely, pearl.

[FaithfulInLove]

Hi Pearl,

you don't have to be concerned - I am in a much better place than I've been a few weeks or months ago.
I am extremely happy that he is talking to me again. I'm engaging on dating sites and I go out with other guys - not that often, but still I do. So, I am trying my best to go on living my life. That he is the only one I actually want is something that I can't influence any further, this is just how I feel, nothing I could change. Getting him back will stay my main purpose.

The chase for contact has been one sided the past month but at the moment, as I said, things slowly start to get better. He has met me and he has seen he is important to me and that I can handle the situation, he has seen I am serious about our friendship and that I'm not a thread to his relationship as I didn't tell anyone about our meet up like I promised him.

He kept me in a bit of a limbo place for seven moths, but contrary to what I've read on here about other persons with BPD, loyality is something really important to him and he didn't make me hope for anything since he is with her. And I didn't ask for anything more than a friendship with him as I know everything else is completely inacceptable and against our values.

I think he knows exactly how desperate I am about staying in touch with him and that he enjoys having that kind of control (Subconsciously! Since he stopped the punishing silent treatment, I don't think he's hurting anyone on purpose).
I am not sure if he'd keep up this friendship if I stopped making an effort - I think rather than being a good friend he's just extracting advantages from having my support. I also think he's watching his every word so I can't ruin his relationship by passing anthing on to her - he doesn't trust anyone.
I don't think I'm much more than a fall back option, maybe even less than that? I don't know. Maybe his trust is just too destroyed to fix anything. Maybe he just doesn't really want to move to another country like he promised me and doesn't wanna talk about those real reasons as he was the one pushing me to those big steps? I can't tell. I see myself as someone trustworthy but I understand how feeling put second has hurt him back then.
We were physical intimate when we met in January. Since the breakup that was the one last time we met (apart from last week).

I can't really tell how he's feeling about me, I think he wants to keep this friendship for selfish reasons but that it doesn't feel right for him because he is with someone else? I'm not sure how much he really cares about me. Since we broke up he wasn't really empathetic towards me most of the time. Still we stayed in daily touch.

[FaithfulInLove]

I'm slightly panicking at the moment:

I have been on Facebook and found a message from his mum from last week, asking if we've met... . 

I promised him not to tell her - do I wait for the right moment and then ask him what she knows and what I should reply?
Oh dear, I hate lying, but I guess he expects me to!
I wanted to keep communication light and positive, this will definitely trigger his anxieties... .

I wanna stay in positive contact with his parents - they are lovely people and one day I'd love to see them again - maybe they can even help me seeing him again one day.

[FaithfulInLove]

I thought of waiting a bit, then sending this:

"Hey, xxx
I thought it was better to ask you first before l react on this
Your mom was asking if l had a good time in (city) and if l met you
I would love to just tell her that l had a good time on my own and that we both are on good terms. Is that alright?"

Do you think that could stress him in any way so that he'd stop communicating with me? Is there a way to keep it shorter and less threatening?
I really don't know how much his parents know and as l promised that l won't tell them I'm scared to say something that could get back to him and make him angry at me

[FaithfulInLove]

Sorry for spamming my own thread, but I am so scared and so full of anxiety right now that I better just tell you - not him.

I'm scared of texting him. I'm scared of not texting him. I'm scared of texting his mom. I'm scared of not texting his mom, of letting her wait even longer.
I am scared of losing him fully.
I just wanna talk to him, but he takes so long for his responses and they are so short, that it really feels like he doesn't want me in his life and this is the worst thing for me, it hurts me more than anything else could.

I don't understand how he can let me call this a friendship when there comes nothing from his side. I just wanna make things better, want a closer friendship, want him back as someone I can talk to. I feel like every message I send him is needy. I don't know how long to wait until I text him again. Don't know if he needs some more space or if space just makes it easier for him to let go and never reply again... .
I don't believe he'd text me without me asking a question. Last thing I said to him was just "Thanks!" and of course there is nothing in return... .

Am I just forgotten or does he see me as such a threat to his new relationship?
He doesn't even follow me on Twitter although I've asked him to in person - in a funny way, but still, he knows I'm expecting him to... .cause that's what friends do... .I don't wanna ask again. How needy would that be?

Shouldn't I just let him know that his mom is talking to me? This must be such a scary thing for him, he told me several times not to tell her that he has met me. Isn't it good to be all honest to build up new trust? I'm not sure when it comes to him!

He is so far away already, I don't know what to do to not push him any further.

[Radcliff]

FaithfulInLove,

You said that you still wanted him 9 months after the breakup.  That doesn't seem to be so much an indication of the strength of the relationship as it is evidence that you never broke up with him -- you were talking every day.  So you did not do any work on detaching.  Detaching need not be goodbye forever, but you need to at least claim as much distance as he has claimed.  You need this to give yourself enough perspective to make an informed choice.  Your choice cannot be informed when you are still enmeshed with someone.  You are the decider in all of your life choices.  What we are pushing you so hard on is to get yourself some space to do your best, most clear-headed thinking on this.

Regarding the text, this is a boundaries thing.
- You and he own your relationship
- You have a right to own your relationship with his mom. You need to respect him, but your desire to preserve a cordial relationship with her is reasonable.
- His mom and he own their relationship.  You are not responsible for it.

You don't need his permission to respond.  Involving him in editing your message to his mom invites all kinds of trouble.  But you do need to observe boundaries and avoid any sort of drama triangle or other three-way communications catastophe.

I would be interested in knowing what other members think, but my thought is to message her and say the following:
- how much warmth, love, and respect you feel for her
- what a wonderful son she has
- that you still have feelings for him, but it's a sensitive situation, so you don't want to get in the way of his relationship with her, and ask that she ask him for any information.

You can then let him know that she contacted you, and you told her that she was wonderful, he was wonderful, and could she please ask him directly.

How does this approach sound to you?

WW

[babyducks]

I try to work on myself but to be honest, I'm feeling quite desperate, because without him seeing that I become a stronger person, it doesn't really make sense to me at all.

Hello Faithful,

I read this thread and noticed this in what you wrote, and it made me wonder.

'because without him seeing that you are becoming stronger it doesn't make sense'

I thought that was an interesting turn of phrase.    Can you say more about what you meant?

my first thought when I read it, was ahhh FiL you are a good person just the way you are.   You are loving and lovable.   you have self worth.    regardless if you are with him or not.    seriously.   I know that might sound odd to you.

I'm scared of texting him. I'm scared of not texting him. I'm scared of texting his mom. I'm scared of not texting his mom, of letting her wait even longer. I am scared of losing him fully.

I am sorry you are going through this level of fear.   I know its very hard.   I know it's hard to live with this level of fear and anxiety.   it has a way of eating at you.

I agree with Wentworth, you are the decider in all your life choices.  and you cannot be informed when you are still enmeshed.    Being enmeshed creates and fuels fear.   

this is what I learned about fear.   I have to face it and walk right into it.   I have to accept the thing I am afraid of and look it right in the eye.   calmly and with my best wise mind.    I learned if I keep backing away from the fear, I make it bigger.

there is no perfect set of text messages that will either impress him or chase him away.    I don't think it works like that.    I think relaxing and accepting where you are today will help.   

what do you think?

'ducks

[FaithfulInLove]

Thank you for being there to help!

About the text to his mom: it's true, letting him decide what to text her is giving him too much control over my actions. This is about my relationship to his mom. l decided to do nothing for now. I know that l can't tell her the truth as he'd hate me forever and a direct lie is nothing I'd like to do either.
Maybe l can just get back to her when things cooled off a little... .

With that phrase l meant that he's my only motivation to become a stronger person actually and l don't really believe in a happy life without him. Life doesn't really make sense without him cause he was centre of all l wanted to reach. I know, wrong way of thinking of course... .

I can accept where l am today - but the fear comes back strong as soon as I'm ignored. As soon as he's posting stuff without replying - cause that's something l have never been allowed to without him getting super upset. I think l just need some time to accept I'm really not that important anymore.
It calms me that the past days he always got back to me in the ending and even makes the effort to start a new conversation with me when l don't ask any questions. "Conversation" in terms of one or two messages a day... .but still. That we're talking makes me happy.

This morning he shared lyrics with me he wrote and left me all confused.
They were about two people belonging together, a failed relationship, giving up on each other too fast and... .it fits too our situation too well. Can't stop wondering if he meant me with all these beautiful words or if this is actually about the time he was apart from his other girl... .l can't tell cause l know too little about their story. And l don't wanna ask. All confused.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts with me, l really appreciate being listened to.